Writing in Vanity Fair, Michael Wolff describes White House press secretary Scott McClellan:
He’s Piggy in Lord of the Flies: a living victim, whose reason for being is, apparently, to shoulder public ridicule and pain (or, come to think of it, he’s Squealer from Animal Farm). He’s the person nobody would ever choose to be.
Great piece. Gosh, I love Vanity Fair.
QUESTION: Does the president stand by his pledge to fire anyone involved in a leak of the name of a CIA operative?
MCCLELLAN: I appreciate your question. I think your question is being asked related to some reports that are in reference to an ongoing criminal investigation. The criminal investigation that you reference is something that continues at this point.
And as I’ve previously stated, while that investigation is ongoing, the White House is not going to comment on it.
The president directed the White House to cooperate fully with the investigation. And as part of cooperating fully with the investigation, we made a decision that we weren’t going to comment on it while it is ongoing.
QUESTION: I actually wasn’t talking about any investigation.
But in June of 2004, the president said that he would fire anybody who was involved in this leak to the press about information. I just wanted to know: Is that still his position?
MCCLELLAN: Yes, but this question is coming up in the context of this ongoing investigation, and that’s why I said that our policy continues to be that we’re not going to get into commenting on an ongoing criminal investigation from this podium.
The prosecutors overseeing the investigation had expressed a preference to us that one way to help the investigation is not to be commenting on it from this podium.
MCCLELLAN: And so that’s why we are not going to get into commenting on it while it is an ongoing investigation — or questions related to it.
QUESTION: Scott, if I could point out: Contradictory to that statement, on September 29th of 2003, while the investigation was ongoing, you clearly commented on it. You were the first one to have said that if anybody from the White House was involved, they would be fired.
And then, on June 10th of 2004, at Sea Island Plantation, in the midst of this investigation, when the president made his comments that, yes, he would fire anybody from the White House who was involved, so why have you commented on this during the process of the investigation in the past, but now you’ve suddenly drawn a curtain around it under the statement of, We’re not going to comment on an ongoing investigation?
MCCLELLAN: Again, John, I appreciate the question. I know you want to get to the bottom of this. No one wants to get to the bottom of it more than the president of the United States.
And I think the way to be most helpful is to not get into commenting on it while it is an ongoing investigation. And that’s something that the people overseeing the investigation have expressed a preference that we follow.
And that’s why we’re continuing to follow that approach and that policy.
Now, I remember very well what was previously said. And, at some point, I will be glad to talk about it, but not until after the investigation is complete.
QUESTION: So could I just ask: When did you change your mind to say that it was OK to comment during the course of an investigation before, but now it’s not?
MCCLELLAN: Well, I think maybe you missed what I was saying in reference to Terry’s question at the beginning. There came a point, when the investigation got under way, when those overseeing the investigation asked that it would be — or said that it would be their preference that we not get into discussing it while it is ongoing.
I think that’s the way to be most helpful to help them advance the investigation and get to the bottom of it.
QUESTION: Scott, can I ask you this: Did Karl Rove commit a crime?
MCCLELLAN: Again, David, this is a question relating to a ongoing investigation, and you have my response related to the investigation. And I don’t think you should read anything into it other than: We’re going to continue not to comment on it while it’s ongoing.
QUESTION: Do you stand by your statement from the fall of 2003, when you were asked specifically about Karl and Elliot Abrams and Scooter Libby, and you said, I’ve gone to each of those gentlemen, and they have told me they are not involved in this ?
QUESTION: Do you stand by that statement?
MCCLELLAN: And if you will recall, I said that, as part of helping the investigators move forward on the investigation, we’re not going to get into commenting on it. That was something I stated back near that time as well.
QUESTION: Scott, this is ridiculous. The notion that you’re going to stand before us, after having commented with that level of detail, and tell people watching this that somehow you’ve decided not to talk.
You’ve got a public record out there. Do you stand by your remarks from that podium or not?
MCCLELLAN: I’m well aware, like you, of what was previously said. And I will be glad to talk about it at the appropriate time. The appropriate time is when the investigation…
QUESTION: (inaudible) when it’s appropriate and when it’s inappropriate?
MCCLELLAN: If you’ll let me finish.
QUESTION: No, you’re not finishing. You’re not saying anything.
You stood at that podium and said that Karl Rove was not involved. And now we find out that he spoke about Joseph Wilson’s wife. So don’t you owe the American public a fuller explanation. Was he involved or was he not? Because contrary to what you told the American people, he did indeed talk about his wife, didn’t he?
MCCLELLAN: There will be a time to talk about this, but now is not the time to talk about it.
QUESTION: Do you think people will accept that, what you’re saying today?
MCCLELLAN: Again, I’ve responded to the question.
QUESTION: You’re in a bad spot here, Scott…
(LAUGHTER)
… because after the investigation began — after the criminal investigation was under way — you said, October 10th, 2003, I spoke with those individuals, Rove, Abrams and Libby. As I pointed out, those individuals assured me they were not involved in this, from that podium. That’s after the criminal investigation began.
Now that Rove has essentially been caught red-handed peddling this information, all of a sudden you have respect for the sanctity of the criminal investigation.
MCCLELLAN: No, that’s not a correct characterization. And I think you are well aware of that.
We know each other very well. And it was after that period that the investigators had requested that we not get into commenting on an ongoing criminal investigation.
And we want to be helpful so that they can get to the bottom of this. Because no one wants to get to the bottom of it more than the president of the United States.
I am well aware of what was said previously. I remember well what was said previously. And at some point I look forward to talking about it. But until the investigation is complete, I’m just not going to do that.
QUESTION: So you’re now saying that after you cleared Rove and the others from that podium, then the prosecutors asked you not to speak anymore and since then you haven’t.
MCCLELLAN: Again, you’re continuing to ask questions relating to an ongoing criminal investigation and I’m just not going to respond to them.
QUESTION: When did they ask you to stop commenting on it, Scott? Can you pin down a date?
MCCLELLAN: Back in that time period.
QUESTION: Well, then the president commented on it nine months later. So was he not following the White House plan?
MCCLELLAN: I appreciate your questions. You can keep asking them, but you have my response.
QUESTION: Well, we are going to keep asking them.
When did the president learn that Karl Rove had had a conversation with a news reporter about the involvement of Joseph Wilson’s wife in the decision to send him to Africa?
MCCLELLAN: I’ve responded to the questions.
QUESTION: When did the president learn that Karl Rove had been…
MCCLELLAN: I’ve responded to your questions.
Scotty McClellan is always talking about ‘another’ shake up in the GWB administration. It just might be his time to ‘fly’!
McCLELLAN: Well, Helen, the President recognizes that we are engaged in a global war on terrorism. And when you’re engaged in a war, it’s not always pleasant, and it’s certainly a last resort. But when you engage in a war, you take the fight to the enemy, you go on the offense. And that’s exactly what we are doing. We are fighting them there so that we don’t have to fight them here. September 11th taught us —
THOMAS: It has nothing to do with — Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11.
McCLELLAN: Well, you have a very different view of the war on terrorism, and I’m sure you’re opposed to the broader war on terrorism. The President recognizes this requires a comprehensive strategy, and that this is a broad war, that it is not a law enforcement matter. Terry.
TERRY MORAN: On what basis do you say Helen is opposed to the broader war on terrorism?
McCLELLAN: Well, she certainly expressed her concerns about Afghanistan and Iraq and going into those two countries. I think I can go back and pull up her comments over the course of the past couple of years.
MORAN: And speak for her, which is odd.
The various talking heads that the Bush regime rolls out to talk to the press remind me of that guy in Iraq who was on TV right before we “toppled” Saddam. “What troops? There are no troops! Everything is fine. Saddam is not worried. The Americans are not even in the area.”
Maybe Scottie has learned to lie from the best?
Scotty is quite good at what he does, which is saying a lot of nothing. However, he lacks Mohammed Saeed al-Sahaf’s (a.k.a. “Baghdad Bob”) remarkable talent for bombast (see #4 above).
At last report, Bob (a.k.a. “Comical Ali”) was living with his family in the U.A.E. According to Wikipedia, “When asked where he had gotten his ludicrous information he replied ‘authentic sources! Many authentic sources’.”
After Bush’s house of cards collapses in a heap of dust, I can just see Scotty McClellan responding to reporters’ questions about where he had gotten his ludicrous information:
“Authentic sources! Many authentic sources.”
McClellan may write a tell all book, but he can’t say anything until he’s certain you already know of anything he might reveal. Which could hurt sales…. But that’s the stance he’s going to take and that’s just all there is to it unless, of course, things change.
oh spare me. We endured all those liars under Clinton
Your turn now.
Typical right wing fuck – tries to excuse the lies of Bush by blaming Clinton. Do you teach your inbred kids that line of thinking asswipe?
By the way, great line from Wolf today!
“Wolf all the tough talk was reduced to, “I quit!” To borrow a phrase from Roberto Duran, ” No Mas.” Mr. Delay suddenly became another disgraced public servant who couldn’t take the heat.” He would strut around on capitol hill like a cocky little, bandy rooster, but today he slithered away from Congress…”
Roger And Gang this website needs some humor anfter all your rants and raves.
George Carlin’s 14 New Rules for 2006
New Rule: – Stop giving me that pop-up ad for Classmates. com! There’s a reason you don’t talk to people for 25 years. Because you don’t particularly like them! Besides, I already know what the captain of the football team is doing these days: mowing my lawn.
New Rule: – Don’t eat anything that’s served to you out a window unless you’re a seagull. People are ac! ting all shocked that a human finger was found in a bowl of Wendy’s chili. Hey, it cost less than a dollar. What did you expect it to contain? Trout?
New Rule: – Stop saying that teenage boys who have sex with their hot, blonde teachers are permanently damaged. I have a better description for these kids: – lucky bastards.
New Rule: – If you need to shave and you still collect baseball cards, you’re gay. If you’re a kid, the cards are keepsakes of your idols. If you’re a grown man, they’re pictures of men.
New Rule: – Ladies, leave your eyebrows alone. Here’s how much men care about your eyebrows: do you have two of them? Okay, we’re done.
New Rule: – There’s no such thing as flavored water. There’s a whole aisle of this crap at the supermarket? Water, but without that watery taste. Sorry, but flavored water is called a soft drink. You want flavored water? Pour some scotch over ice and let it melt. That’s your flavored water.
New Rule: – The more complicated the Starbucks order, the bigger the asshole. If you walk into a Starbucks and order a “decaf grande half-soy, half-low fat, iced vanilla, double-shot, gingerbread cappuccino, extra dry, light ice, with one Sweet-n’-Low and one NutraSweet,” ooh, you’re a huge asshole.
New Rule: – I’m not the cashier! By the time I look up from sliding my card, entering my PIN number, pressing “Enter,” verifying the amount, deciding, no, I don’t want cash back, and pressing “Enter” again, the kid who is supposed to be ringing me up is standing there eating myAlmond Joy.
New Rule: – Just because your tattoo has Chinese characters in it doesn’t make you spiritual. It’s right above the crack of your as! s. And it translates to “beef with broccoli.” The last time you did anything spiritual, you werepraying to God you weren’t pregnant. You’re not spiritual. You’re just high.
New Rule: – I don’t need a bigger mega M&M. If I’m extra hungry for M&Ms, I’ll go nuts and eat two.
New Rule: – If you’re going to insist on making movies based on crappy, old television shows, then you have to give everyone in the Cineplex a remote so we can see what’s playing on the other screens. Let’s remember the reason something was a television show in the first place is that the idea wasn’t good enough to be a movie.
New Rule: – No more gift registries. You know, it used to be just for weddings. Now it’s for babies and new homes and graduations from rehab. Picking out the stuff you want and having other people buy it for you isn’t gift giving, it’s the white people version of looting.
New Rule: – And this one is long overdue: – No more bathroom attendants. After I zip up, some guy is offering me a towel and a mint like I just had sex with George Michael. I can’t even tell if he’s supposed to be there, or just some freak with a fetish. I don’t want to be on your webcam, dude. I just want to wash my hands.
New Rule: – When I ask how old your toddler is, I don’t need to know in months. “27 Months.” “He’s two,” will do just fine. He’s not a cheese. And I didn’t really care in the first place.
Klake, what is your stand on using Nazi publications to support the absurd claim that “More Blacks and Indians owned slaves than white people did”?
Klake, how do you expect to ever be taken seriously when you did the above?
Let me answer that for you:
You feel like Scott McClellan does everyday. And like Scott McClellan, you do not have a clue how sad you are.
Klake is a sick little man who in any civilization should be shunned, when he is not spit upon.
Wordy blather about nothing. This writer gets paid by the word.
Scot is stupid, but earning a decent living.
America does not care.Would rather read about nose and ass picking at govt. state dinnes.
Or meeetings of Vanity Fair editors. Goldy, you are getting obsessive, there is real political news out there.
Lemme repeat for the dense…
Press secretaries are paid to hint/wink/deny etc. this guy no diff than his predecessors.
You douchebags are the ones crying wolf. Go back to those poor sob’s defending zipper Bill..
Speaking of sick, twisted, republican press secretary types…
here’s another shining example of the right…http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12159118/
Arrested for child porn. Can Steffy, Richard Pope, Mr. Cyn and their ilk be far behind?
re 13: “You douchebags are the ones crying wolf!”
Talk about mixed metaphors! An interesting visual, though — for a used plastic applicator like yourself crying “FOUL” at every opportunity!
General Roger Hindsight Rabbit here is some new weapons you can use against China to free Tibet. For a small price, they could help free all your friends and maybe neutralize the Iranians.
http://today.reuters.com/tv/vi.....84022b1f36
Apr. 4 – Iran’s war games took a twist when it showed a low-powered flying boat on state television.
Iran rarely gives enough details of its military hardware for analysts to determine whether Tehran is making genuine advances or simply producing defiant propaganda, while pressure ratchets up on its nuclear programme.
Benet Allen reports.
© Reuters 2006. All rights reserved.
Arrested for child porn. Can Steffy, Richard Pope, Mr. Cyn and their ilk be far behind?
Commentby LeftTurn— 4/4/06@ 8:42 pm
What Seffy,Richard Pope and Mr. Cyn are public school teachers…. Nah I dont believe it.
Saddam. “What troops? There are no troops! Everything is fine. Saddam is not worried. The Americans are not even in the area.”
Maybe Scottie has learned to lie from the best?
Commentby LauraBushKilledAGuy— 4/4/06@ 4:43 pm
WTF. Scott McClellan never worked for the Clinton adminstration.
Righton @ 13,it never ceases to amaze me how you idiotic trolls always compare every situation in your pathetic lives to Bill Clinton. Do you have such an inferiority complex that what ever happens in your lifetime is/was caused by President Clinton? What a pathetic immitation you are for a US Citizen.
RUFUS STATES A FACT
“WTF. Scott McClellan never worked for the Clinton adminstration.”
Correct!
For once.
Now go away and sin no more, RUFUS.
Wrongboy (aka Pro-ImpeachBush boy), mariawillwin and [Just another Chicken Hawk]:
Looks like another one of your Conservative Perv friends just got arrested:
Brian J. Doyle is the Deputy Press Secretary for the U.S. Department of Homeland Security’s Office of Public Affairs. On March 12 he thought met a 14-year-old girl online. At least that’s what her profile said.
Over the next two weeks Doyle, who turns 56 on Friday, engaged in several sexually explicit online chats from his computer at the DHS. He would tell her in detail all the things he hoped to do to and with her.
Doyle was so obsessed he gave her his DHS office and cell phone numbers, and his instant messaging address. When words failed him he would email her dirty video clips.
Like most conservatives, he is now going to jail.
http://www.wonkette.com/politi.....165147.php
22
That is terrible. More often than not this sort of thing involves a public school teacher who actually molests the child. They must not have a strong employee union at the Dept of Homeland security.
Saddam. “What troops? There are no troops! Everything is fine. Saddam is not worried. The Americans are not even in the area.”
Maybe Scottie has learned to lie from the best?
Commentby LauraBushKilledAGuy— 4/4/06@ 4:43 pm
WTF. Scott McClellan never worked for the Clinton adminstration.
Commentby RUFUS— 4/4/06@ 9:11 pm
WTF. Scott McClellan never worked for the Clinton adminstration.”
Correct!
For once.
Commentby Donnageddon— 4/4/06@ 9:29 pm
Hey me and Donna agree. Clinton was the best at lying. I am glad to see that Donna still has a little truth in em.
RUFUS lied : “Hey me and Donna agree. Clinton was the best at lying.”
Citation please?
Hey Donna since both you and me both agree that Clinton was the best at lying what was your favorite Clinton lie? Mine was “I never had sexual relations with that woman” which led to the great debate of what the meaning of “is” is.
RUFUS “Hey Donna since both you and me both agree that Clinton was the best at lying what was your favorite Clinton lie? ”
No, I think you have me mistaken for PuddyBud and JCH.
But, if in your drunken stupor, you wish to point out that the Republican Party is now a euphamism for Satan, go ahead.
Other than that, you are not making any point at all.
27, Don, ‘what was your favorite Clinton lie?”…….Rape. “Better put some ice on that!” Yes, Bill loved to give a little rough sex to those dunb ass liberal blondes.
Com on Donna you agreed to my post on 18, admit it.
Donnagedon, You have got to love the stupidity and non-reasoning of our local Trolls. They still live in the days of the Clinton administration….dreaming about that blue dress and praying to THEIR god that someday they can be so LUCKY……and see no cause for thought over the way GWB and his band of inbred fanatics have pushed the USA into the land of ‘nunca jamas’. We are fast approaching the end of our road as we understand it to be, the only thing that might help save this once great nation is for a Democratic Senate and House…and impeach, arrest, confine, torture, degrade, shock, have dogs bite, shame, ridicule and ‘lose’ them in the dark history of our country. Come January 2006, the most embarassing 6 years of our young nations history will start to get ERASED.
“I never told her to lie in that deposition, I told her to lie in that position”
RUFASS, you should consider an online course in remedial English. Maybe you could start to understand what people actually write and say. (Extremely doubtful, in you case)
RUFASS, and whom might the quote @ 31 be ‘registered’ to? Another of RUFASS’ decrepit fantasies. Go to Aurora Ave and fix your sexual frustrations! Even in your decrepid state, some ‘walker’ might just let you get ‘close’ to her/him.
6
“McClellan may write a tell all book …” Commentby headless lucy— 4/4/06@ 5:35 pm
Hell, he’s already got a publisher and a title! It’s called, “The Lies I Told For George W. Bush.”
Cougar Your post on 30 was absolutely priceless. It is like you are one of founding donks for the democratic revolution of 2006. I am tearing up inside…. tearing up with laughter.
9
“Roger And Gang this website needs some humor … Commentby klake— 4/4/06@ 7:13 pm”
For once I agree with Flaky Klake!
SAINT BUSH
Scheming to reverse Bush’s declining approval ratings, Karl Rove arranged for Bush to attend Sunday services at a small Methodist Church outside Washington, D.C.
Rove called the minister and said, “As you know, Reverend, we’re getting bad publicity among Methodists because of the president’s position on stem cell research. We’ll arrange for Jack Abramoff’s friends to contribute $25,000 to your church if you’ll call the president a saint in your sermon.”
The minister thought about it, then replied, “We’re a small church and desperately need funds, so I’ll do it.”
That Sunday, Bush showed up or the photo op looking especially smug even while trying to appear pious. After making a few announcements, the minister launched into his sermon.
“George W. Bush is a petty, vindictive, sanctimonious hypocrite and a nitwit,” the minister said. “He is a liar, a cheat, and a low-intelligence weasel with the world’s largest chip on his shoulder. He used every dirty election trick in the book and still lost, but his toadies in the Supreme Court appointed him. He lied about his military record in which he used special privilege to avoid combat, and then had the gall to pose on an aircraft carrier under a banner stating ‘Mission Accomplished.’ He invaded a sovereign country for oil and war profiteering, turning Iraq into a training ground for terrorists who
would destroy our country. He continues to confuse the American people by insisting on a nonexistent connection between the horrors of 9/11 and his war in Iraq. He routinely appoints
incompetent and unqualified cronies to high-level federal government positions and as a result, hundreds of people died
in New Orleans. He lets corporate polluters despoil God’s
creation and wreck our planet. He uses fear-mongering to justify warrantless spying on American citizens, in clear violation of the Constitution. He is so psychotic and megalomaniacal that he believes he was chosen by God. He is the worst example of a Methodist I have ever heard of.”
The minister paused, then added, “But compared to Dick Cheney, George W. Bush is a saint.”
and what a surprise this one is:
The Cleveland Plain Dealer reports Ohio Secretary of State Ken Blackwell (R) “made an embarrassing announcement Monday: He accidentally bought stock in Diebold Inc., a voting machine maker that benefited from decisions made by his office.”
In 2004, Diebold “drew the ire of critics” after the company’s CEO “sent a fund-raising letter in which he committed to deliver Ohio’s electoral votes to President Bush.”
Imagine that, a RepubliCON taking a personal financial decision on ‘inside’ information.
Looks like the entire Bush cabal might go to prison. Maybe we should send them to Gitmo along with everyone in this country who put them there. Are you righties worried? When we get the Congress back in the fall, we’re going to hunt you all down!
Some “progressives” that Goldy would love to beat with his baseball bat……
“expressing exasperation with Cantwell’s critics, caused a flood of e-mail but a landslide for neither side.
“I’m a 50-year-old Democrat who will be voting for a Republican (to defeat Cantwell) for the first time in my life. Call me crazy, but I want a Democratic Party purged of its pro-Iraq war voices, (and) maybe then the party can start to rebuild into a real political party again,” wrote Tom Barnes.
Charles Rawson of Everett endorsed the column’s viewpoint, writing: “Those of us who recognize Senator Cantwell’s contribution to intelligent energy and environmental policy can forgive her mistake on the war.
“She had an awful lot of company including most of the last crop of Democratic presidential candidates. So why single her out when the time is ripe to regain control of one or both congressional houses and get back into the driver’s seat in setting the national agenda?
“Do they remember Ralph Nader and what we got thanks to him?”
A Seattle reader, Charles Redmond, argued that Iraq dwarfs all other issues in this fall’s election, writing:.
“I don’t disagree one iota with your positive assessment of Cantwell’s many good qualities. The issue, and the point being raised, is her steadfast refusal to get out of Iraq. That, as you might know, is the number ONE issue here in America.
“She can do all she wants that’s good for the environment, but if she still supports our insane continued invasion of Iraq, she’s gotta go.””
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/.....oel05.html
Donnageddon: RUFUS, did not mix me up with you. Everyone knows you are one of the dull knives here on ASSes and part of the four dumb monkeys: one sees no truth, one hears no truth, one speaks no truth, and the other one who has their finger up their ASS looking for truth. I think you are the last monkey!
He invaded a sovereign country for oil and war profiteering, turning Iraq into a training ground for terrorists who
would destroy our country. He continues to confuse the American people by insisting on a nonexistent connection between the horrors of 9/11 and his war in Iraq. He routinely appoints
Commentby Roger Rabbit— 4/4/06@ 10:46 pm
Funny little Rabbit you are streching the truth a lot here Roger. Revisit your sources and try again, and please quite reading move on dot org it demeans your intelligence.
Cougar: Ken Blackwell probably received a tip from the California Democrats who certified them.
“A month ago, Secretary of State Bruce McPherson certified Diebold Election System’s TSX and Optical Scan products for use in this year’s elections after a review of their security. An earlier, slightly modified version of the TSX was used in California’s November 2005 special election.”
“Jennifer Kerns, a spokeswoman for McPherson, said her office had not seen the lawsuit, but she said the Diebold systems were safe and reliable.
“The Diebold systems that we have certified have passed the most stringent requirements really in the nation,” she said. “In fact we’ve actually been criticized about how stringent our process has been.”
http://www.blackboxvoting.com/
But cougar, since other Californians are suing to stop their use, could it be the 2004 California blue state totals for Donks be in question? Look at the blue city counties where this suit is filed!
http://www.newsfactor.com/news.....200A4Z5LCW
re 43: RED HERRING!!
‘NUFF SAID!!!!!
re 41: klake, please. Only an idiot like yourself could ever consider this twisted and unsubstantiated load of swill to be a representation of any reality that ever existed on this planet!
WMD’s, klake. That was the lie that got us into this war: WMD’s!!! And every spin you jamokes have tried ( sure they’re in Syria ! ) has failed.
Maybe they are in Iran? I’m surprised you guys have’nt spun the WMD thing in that direction. At least it would be plausible…
Looselips@44: Tasty huh?
Roger and Gang move to Massachusetts and get your free Health Care. Hell all you have to do is vote for Teddy Kennedy.
“It is not a typical Massachusetts-Taxachusetts, oh just crazy liberal plan.”
– STUART H. ALTMAN, dean of the Heller Graduate School for Social Policy and
Management at Brandeis University, on a health-care bill
that strives for universal coverage.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/04.....038;emc=th