As I wrote last week in declaring my preference for John Edwards, I will enthusiastically support whoever ultimately wins the Democratic nomination for president. This really is a tremendous field of candidates who each bring different strengths to the table, and they each put the Democratic Party in a very good position to win the White House… even Hillary Clinton.
I know that Republicans have long drooled at the prospect of facing off against Clinton, believing she would be by far the easiest Democrat to beat, and I know that there is some polling to back up this conventional wisdom… but I’ve never believed it. In fact, I’ve rolled more than a few eyes in private conversation by suggesting that Americans would actually grow to like Clinton once they got to know her better during the course of a general election campaign. I know it defies what we’ve been told for years, but Hillary Clinton is likable.
This clip of Clinton going off on an emotional tangent, her voice breaking slightly as she explains her personal reasons for putting herself through such a grueling campaign, has elicited howls of derision from her critics. To some it is a show of weakness we cannot afford in a president. To others it is just an act; yet another crass political calculation. But me, I see a rare, unguarded moment in which Clinton reveals herself to be, well, a human being, as complex and nuanced as most any other human being.
No doubt it takes a great deal of narcissism to run for president (as it does to say, blog or do talk radio,) but that doesn’t inherently make one’s motives for running any less genuine. We all have a tendency to vilify the opposition, but as Clinton explains, it is possible to be wrong, but for all the right reasons:
“And we do it, each one of us because we care about our country, but some of us are right and some of us are wrong. Some us are ready and some us are not. Some of us know what we will do on day one, and some of us haven’t really thought that through enough.”
It is fair to disagree with Clinton on the issues, on her experience or on her agenda, but the “Hillary haters” in both parties who attack her motives add absolutely nothing to the debate, and those who expect their own knee-jerk dislike of Clinton to be shared by a majority of Americans are setting themselves up for disappointment should she win the nomination. Contrary to myth, Hillary Clinton is a real person with real emotions, and I have always believed that given the opportunity to know her better, voters would grow to appreciate Clinton and her incredibly broad grasp on the issues. And yes, perhaps, even like her.
Is this a guarded endorsement of Hillary? Or clever triangulation so that when the Hillary nomination comes through you can stand around with the rest of the cool kids? I am glad you posted this clip though, and can see the light with Hillary. In fact this clip shows something that is exactly the opposite of my impression of Edwards. This shows an unguarded moment of sincerity. While I might agree with some of Edwards politics I have never been able to stomach his “ahh shucks I am just a poor mill workers son” routine. It strikes me as phony. I mean obviously he is from humble origins but he spends too much time reminding us of that fact. It is just something I have felt for a long time, even from 2004. I would prefer a candidate whose public persona is 90% wonk 10% ahh shucks emotion (a Hillary candidate) as opposed to 90% ahh shucks 10% wonk (my impression of Edwards).
Of course Bill Clinton is the undisputed master here 100% wonk and a 100% ahh shucks.
Also a point about centrism and Obama. I heard someone recently describe Obama as running a similar campaign as George W Bush in 2000. He keeps up the appearance of a moderate and is cleverly ambiguous about policy. But just as Bush fooled the people into believing he was a compassionate conservative and then proceeded to govern from the far right, I suspect that Obama could fool the people and govern from the far left. Perhaps this is fine in the minds of many on the left, but after seeing the disaster an inexperienced president brings to the country I am ready to vote for a centrist moderate who is the experienced leader. That is why I want to see a Hillary presidency.
Of course Obama does impress me with his political skills and I would not be disappointed with an Obama presidency. I just think he needs a little more vintage. Stick around in the Senate for 8 years and then let’s talk.
David,
Great post!
The personality issues really seem to me to be bizar. Here is a lady who really did stand by her man, did the right thing, and got tarred and feathered by the right wing shit casting machine. Her appearance today and the bit we saw in Seattle seem to me far, far different from the Rovian tapestry. I wish she had made THAT an issue early on when she could have.
This is, to me, the hardest part of politics. Candidates have always been products. How many voters had any idea that Jefferson was tongue tied and morose? Would we have lost Kennedy if Marilyn had been two degrees F hotter in that great song?
As it was, the public images of JFK as well as of both TJ and JA were shaped, then, as now, by the media. Reading some of the swiftboating of Jefferson is somehow reassuring! OTOH, I resent the fact that many in the media must have known that GB II was/is an idiot.
Back at HRC, I too would like to see her as Prexy .. though I would feel better if I were sure she could keep Bill in her harem or maybe make him ambassador to some obscure place. I do worry abut the ego conflicts.
Her strongest suit, it seems to me, would be in the awful job of restructuring the govt in the first 6 months. This is going to be horrible. I supect only two of the candidates have the skills or machines needed .. Romney being th other one.
Her weakest suit, at least for me, is in a lack of sophisticate ideas about society. For someone who has been around so long, we have learned VERY little of her ideas. Rather she seems to equate process with ideas. I would REALLY like to hear her thoughts about what sort of relationship we should have with the corporatist states or how we should reform education. Is it possible she has no ideas, no policies, only procedures? Is the village book the best she can do?
I am also concerned with her record. Contrary to a lot of hype in 1990, she has a pretty meagre record as an attorney and les sof a record as a political thinker. Her role with the Children’s Defence Fund is likely her most impressive achievement until becoming a Senator. Clearly she made herself popular with Edelman and others, but I have never heard WHAT she achieved.
Her Senate record is good, but hardly outstanding. Has she been a leader on any major issue?
I am upset by a number of PC statements she has made. The worst was a comment on teacher’s salaries. She said she did NOT support raises based on evaluations because we do not know hoe to evaluate teachers and differences in salaries would create jealousy! Instead she proposed team based salaries where veryone on team would be paid on the basis if the team’s success! ..
This reminded me of her terible choice of Ira Magaziner to organize Hillary Healthcare. Magaziner was a disaster because he is know it all and ignored opinions of VERY smart people. Have you read about this gomer? Is he still involved in her coterie?
In both cases there is a question of her ability to listen and learn from others. As you know, I agree with her votes in Iraq, BUT, I would have liked before the campaign to have read some insightful ideas about the middle east.
So, the best I can do is guess. I guess she is a good person, though somewhat classist. I suspect as an attorney she has a facile way of learning what she needs to know, but maybe no more. I believe she would work her but off to make this as better country.
So, would I be happy if she is the candidate? yes.
But, I am more impressed with BHO. There are a lot of reasons for this, most pretty subjective and certainly open to criticism (though I have not washed my right hand since I last exchanged palmar DNA with BHO.) IF he is what he seesm to be, there are specifics he may bring to us all, achievements I do not tink she could equal:
1. a potential world brand/hero. I can imagine BHO being “used” by US prophaganda to influence the man in the Chinese/Russian/Venzuelan/ Cuban/ etc street. Having the European public oin his side could undeo a lot of damage the cowboy did.
2. An ability to finally draw the AA community into the mainstream “we” belong to. I see this a sboth a matte rof justice AND a huge opportunity to make better use of a talent pool we currently waste.
3. A moral force that can call on the US to do distasteful things. I think his chances at tax reform are a lot better than hers.
4. A first spouse whoi has great style! Michelle in 2016!
My ideal would be an Obama-Clinton ticket. He strikes me as a lot better commnicator and thinker .. like TJ with the ability to speak on TV. She would be an incredible administrator to clean up the pools of Reprican dreck.
See you tomorrow night, I’ll buy you a beer if she comes within five points of BHO.
May the O be with you.
3. Gordon
What in hell do you mean by the far left? Is there any fsr left in the US? What are yu worried about?
BHO is a centrist,. like most dems and most mericans.
@4
Ok maybe “far left” is a little bit off. But nobody in American politics is that far left (or right). Just like GWB != Hitler, OHB != Stalin (or Mao). But I think Obama will govern further to the left than Hillary even though he does a good job masking that fact. Just like GWB masked his militaristic neocon roots. The first real clue was picking Cheney, but by then it was too late because Gore ran such an ineffectual campaign.
And no I am not worried about it from a policy perspective. I am generally sympathetic to far left policy. But I just don’t want it to become a distraction with all the hell the opposition would raise. I think a lot things need to be fixed quickly in 2009, and like you said Hillary has the machine to do this restructuring. But I am also intrigued by the potential brand Obama can offer the rest of the world. But you know what, the rest of the world is fickle. And I would rather not base our politics on what the rest of the world thinks. And Hillary would work just as hard as Obama to repair our relationship with other nations.
I may not be backing Senator Clinton, but nowhere in the pictures or YouTube did I see anything remotely looking like “sobs” or even actual tears. She looked like a person with red rimmed eyes, like coming from complete exhaustion and previous night’s disappointment that things aren’t going as predictably as planned! My own eyes water sometimes when facing bright lights, like under the camera glares.
I’ve read many times that Bill Clinton required only 2-3 hours of sleep at night, but Senator Clinton always needed a full night’s sleep. I don’t fault her for that. This weeping business seems like a cheap shot by the press or the blogs. Not Kosher to me, frankly.
To tell you the truth, the ONE person I found totally UN-LIKABLE in that NH debate was Romney, even when I rewatched to see if I might have overreacted. His attitude seemed like he had already bought and paid a fortune for this position (out of his own pocket) – and he was fully entitled to be POTUS! Pretty scary & imperialistic dude, but that was my impression.
SeattleJew: In our circles, Obama is far left. He voted present on certain bills so he would not take a position. That’s weak.
But we all decided we’d swallow higher taxes, not the stuff Clueless Gooberfool drinks so a BLACK MAN can be in the white house.
FrackMan@6: The liberal press are trying to gin up sympathy for the woman. She is the “inevitable” candidate remember.
All the big dem supporters threw their money behind her. What ticks me off is all the black movie and comedy stars still in her “testicle” lock box! They haven’t contributed a cent to his campaign. WTF?
She is very scary & imperialistic FrackMan! “When I’m president, everyone will have a pot to piss in”. “When I’m president everyone will finally have their mule, I mean donkey, I mean horsesass”.
On the Clinton News Network last night the New Hampshire women discussed why they don’t like Hilary anymore.
What? No one was watching the Number One Clinton New Network last night? All of you were watching the LSU game?
John Edwards said this a real dig: “I think what we need in a commander-in-chief is strength and resolve, and presidential campaigns are tough business, but being president of the United States is also tough business.”
I have looked at the YouTube clip posted by Goldy, and also a couple of other versions I found in the newsfeeds, and I don’t see anything where Hillary Clinton is crying. However, most people will simply look at the headlines, and when they look at the clip, they will see what they expect to see, even though it isn’t there. If you fix in your mind that Clinton was crying, then you will see tears in her eyes. She certainly was emotional — nothing wrong with that. Still, this could be her “Howard Dean scream” moment …
All in all, I think it is time for change and hope. Barack Obama seems to be the best candidate (in either party) to provide this for our country. Some people say that Obama is too young to be President, but he will be one year and 15 days older when he takes office on January 20, 2009, than Bill Clinton was when he took office on January 20, 1993. And he will also have had almost as much experience — 12 years versus 14 years — in elected public office, as did Clinton at the time he took office.
Clinton is on the attack on ABC News from L-N:
STEPHANOPOULOS: She has taken charge of her campaign, Diane, running her war room out of her hotel suite, giving orders and I begin my interview by asking her what my orders are. Puddy asks: George who do you work for ABC or Hildabeast
STEPHANOPOULOS: You say you feel good about it. But Diane Sawyer asked Barack Obama about your campaign yesterday and he called it depressing.
CLINTON: I think that the — that is the kind of characterization that is, you know, made by candidates who are trying to avoid scrutiny of their own records. Let’s talk about somebody else, instead of answering questions about, you know, what I have or haven’t done. You know when you rail against lobbyists as he has, and talk about, you’re a different kind of politician, then you have a lobbyist running your campaign in New Hampshire. When you say that John Edwards isn’t electable because he changed positions between 2004 and 2008 and then you have a long record of changing positions. All of a sudden, you start to ask yourself, wait a minute, what is the substance here? What, as was famously was said years ago “where’s the beef?” You know, where is the reality? And I think that’s a fair question. And I believe that, you know, voters are beginning to focus on that. You know, I have a great deal of respect for Senator Obama. He is a very talented politician. But if he’s going to be competing for president, and especially to get the Democratic nomination to go against whomever the Republicans put up, I think it’s time to start comparing and contrasting him as I’ve been scrutinized for all of this year.
STEPHANOPOULOS: I want to take you back to that moment Saturday night when John Edwards seemed to join forces with Barack Obama. And he really seemed to push your button on that exchange. We want to show our viewers the response.
CLINTON: I want to make change, but I’ve already made change. I will continue to make change. I’m not running on a promise of change. I’m running on 35 years of change.
STEPHANOPOULOS: When I asked Senator Edwards about that yesterday. He said his teaming up with Barack Obama was an alliance of conviction. Do you buy that?
CLINTON: Well, I have no idea what’s behind it. But as you can tell from that, I am passionate about change. I mean, that’s what I’ve believed in ever since I was a young lawyer working for the Children’s Defense Fund. I believe in it as strongly as I possibly can today. It’s never been a political tactic or a matter of convenience for me. It is rooted in the work that I’ve done year after year after year. Now, you’ll have to ask them what they’re up to. I don’t have any idea.
STEPHANOPOULOS: So —
CLINTON: You know, when we finally put a nominee on the stage against whom the Republicans nominate, you know, there is no buddy system.
STEPHANOPOULOS: Senator Clinton, thanks very much.
CLINTON: Thanks, George, good to talk to you.
STEPHANOPOULOS: Diane, I also asked Senator Clinton about the rumors that there was going to be a shake-up in her campaign post New Hampshire. She didn’t exactly deny it. She says she’s happy with her campaign but said she’s always looking to bring people in.
Hildabeast went on Fox News to disparage Barack. She didn’t like the comparisons to Martin Luther King Jr. She is getting nasty now just as Puddy predicted last week!
http://bourbonroom.blogs.foxne.....ssessment/
Play the tape.
“Dr. King’s dream began to be realized when President Johnson passed the Civil Rights Act. It took a president to get it done.”
“You know, today Senator Obama used President John F. Kennedy and Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. to criticize me. He basically compared himself to our greatest heroes because they gave great speeches.
The Beast is going strong!
That “crying” incident is her way of “Bill Clinton Triangulation”. Maybe I seem fragile people will like me.
NOT!
Yes, Clueless Gooberfool I have stated over and over I don’t like the Hildabeast. You tried to take me to task for stating truths. Now it seem many in America are waking up to Puddy’s original sentiment.
BTW Clueless Gooberfool, your big sister Rosie O, has been strangely quiet lately!
In other presidential news:
Demoratic Presidential Candidate Mike Gravel Tells Teens Marijuana Better Choice Than Alcohol.
http://www.breitbart.tv/?p=25214
Who is the drug lover in Goldy’s Minions?
Contrary to myth, Hillary Clinton is a real person with real emotions, and I have always believed that given the opportunity to know her better, voters would grow to appreciate Clinton and her incredibly broad grasp on the issues. And yes, perhaps, even like her.
Agreed. The problem for her is that the political “journalists” hate her, and they do everything they can to stand between her and the American people. The problem for me is that I agree with a couple of other candidates on the issues more than I agree with her, so I’ll defend her from the unfair attacks, but I’ll only vote for her if she’s the last of my candidates standing.
She gets the worst of both worlds; she gets unfairly attacked, but she doesn’t get the votes of her defenders.
@7 Puddybud
I have no ida what you mean by left and I suspect you do not either,
Tellme is American support for Chinese state capitalism right or left?
Tellme is stem cell research right or left?
Tellme is mandatory education in the Quram right of r left?
GTellme is Darwin right or left?
or just make a list.?
http://www.thenation.com/blogs.....pid=267470
COLIN POWELL PRAISES OBAMA ON EVE OF NEW HAMPSHIRE PRIMARY…
Former Secretary of State Colin Powell praised Barack Obama on the eve of the New Hampshire primary, crediting the Illinois Senator for breaking barriers while running as “an American man” who can represent the entire nation.
Colin knows the Clintons. He was “Americas Black Eisenhower”, Colin Powell, General, Joint Chief of Staffs under Clinton. I bet Colin remembers when Mr. Clinton tried to cut the Military budget in 1994 & 1995.
Recently didn’t incorrectneverright and others call Colin Powell a token? Didn’t headless lucy 24/7 call him a house n^@@&)? Puddy doesn’t forget racial slurs against my people.
So tell me headless, how will you deal with a BLACK man in the White House?
On Crying
The Book of Awe relates that when the Egyptians ies in the sea of Rushes, the Deity cried.
Guess we need anotherr one, hunh?
Err ahhh ..
WWJD?
When Jesus saw the suffering of the lepers, did he cry? No.
When Jesus body was scourged and his wounds wsahed with vinegar, did he cry, no.
When the Temple of God was burned to the ground by the evil Romans, di Jesus cry? No.
When the natives of America dies in the millions ofd smallpox, did Jesus cry? No?
Give me Hillary anyday!
SeattleJew:
Chinese – Don’t you mean no controlling legal authority?
If this works on Stem Cells I’m all for it: http://www.iht.com/articles/20.....24stem.php
“Biologists have developed a technique for establishing colonies of human embryonic stem cells from an early human embryo without destroying it. This method, if confirmed in other laboratories, would seem to remove the principal objection to the research”
mandatory Quran is leftist. Because we can’t teach the Bible without the ACLU going nuts like most whack-jobs here.
Evolution is a leftist science application. Christians believe in Divine Creation. Like Issac Newton and others. Did you miss the Puddygram on that one.
@19 Puudybud
Is BHO “Black???” Really, how can you tell? I met him once and he seemed kind of brownish, like a casual suit.
Is Colin Powell also Black? I asked my friend Harvey and he tells me the Colin’s back is Black.
Why do you give a damn?
BTW did you know my father was Black???
Oh ha .. You are awake! Puddy
Tx for the explanations, I wonder is there some way a poor ignorant Jew like me can tell what is right or left or do I need your guidance?
eerrr ahh
is sodomy right or left?
is art right or left or does it depend on the content?
Are there righ and left languages?. e,g, yiddish, latin, frenchg, german, and ugaritic?
You same that cells made by infecting adult cells with viruses ARE right, right? Hmm. but cell made by natural means are not?
How do you find all this out? Do you have book? is there a website?
SeattleJew asked WWJD?
That’s a powerful question. God and His Son’s thoughts are not my thoughts. He lives in the third heaven. How many leftist whackjobs know where that is in the Bible w/o Googling it?
Jesus reached out his hand and touched the leper. Would Hildabeast?
Where was Jesus’ wound washed with vinegar? Reference please.
When the Temple of God was burned to the ground by the evil Romans, di Jesus cry? I have no idea. Were you in heaven then SeattleJew?
When the natives of America dies in the millions ofdsmallpox, did Jesus cry? I have no idea. Were you in heaven then SeattleJew? But those nasty Europeans were to blame!
SeattleJew:
Sodomy: Everyone does it. Marriage too.
Good Art has no politics.
The other stuff is pablum.
SeattleJew: Yo daddy is black? Well so is mine.
Well welcome to the bruthahood.
@15 Puddy
I wonder just hw much you can take?
Have you ever had an opportunity for a psychiatric exam?
No, no I am not saying that all righties are crazy, but hell even Tony Soprano used a shrink! As you know, all Jews use shrinks! It is in our contract!
As for WWJD, as a nob neleiver I really do not care. If he was or is God, then I don’t likke God very much. Power does not impress me as much as $$ and I am sure Bill gates is as likely to do good deeds as any other lord of the universe.
Anyhoo .. I was just trying t find out from an expert WWJD about crying? Did he cry?
For that matter, since most cnceptins fail, does Jesus cry when the zygote fails? or does he get mad and slam the table?
SeattleJew asked me: “You same that cells made by infecting adult cells with viruses ARE right, right? Hmm. but cell made by natural means are not?”
Help me here. I have no idea what you are trying to say. I know you are trying to make a point unlike Clueless Gooberfool.
I know that my Dad is Black because that is his anme. How can you tell your Daddy is Black?
Are you sure he doesn’t just tan easily?
BTW, how do you feel about GWB’s plan to move to Bidet, UAE after Jan 20?
@29
The so called stem cells created in Japan were reprogrammed using four viral genes. OK by you?
Jesus Wept just before he raised Lazarus from the dead.
John 11:35.
When did Jesus exercize His Divine Power except to heal and create food for the masses? He showed it a couple of times to His disciples but He willingly went to the cross.
So again I ask, when was His wounds washed with vinegar?
When I saw the clip of her, tears and all, I actually found myself feeling sorry for her.
I agree with Goldy, it showed a human side to a woman who’s often presented by the media as cold and calculating.
Ohhh SeattleJew made a joke on Black.
The law said my daddy black. Dark skin, wide nose, curly hair, hung well (I inherited that too). When he joined the military they said he was black. When he worked for a specific detective agency, they told him he was black too. So I guess in the scheme of things my daddy was black cuz the democrat-led based guvmint told him so!
SeattleJew@31: Not sure about that. I need to read up. Got a URL for Puddy?
SeattleJew asked me: “BTW, how do you feel about GWB’s plan to move to Bidet, UAE after Jan 20?”
Source URL?
SeattleJew: Have you ever had an opportunity for a psychiatric exam?
No but I did pretty well on the Mensa exam. http://www.gnym.us.mensa.org/testing.html
SeattleJew asked: Why do I give a damn?
SJ: Apparently you either missed the Puddygram or you arrived late here.
I am from the Philadelphia inner city. I am not a burb boy like Lee or Goldy. I placed on this blog long ago where I grew up in Philly. I experienced the poor and inefficient school systems. Yet democraps promised it would get better. But it never did.
Now we have a real chance to see a black man rise to the top. Do I wish it was Colin Powell or JD Watts? You betcha. But me and my friends will take Obama. We know once in the House he’ll grow and modify his spending promises just like Clinton did.
What we do wonder is which of the whack-job lefties will try and off him. Someone from the left will chance it!
Upton: She was shown as cold and calculating cuz she was the “inevitable” candidate.
Goooooooooood Mooooooooooorning HAer’s
When I saw this post, I expected a slew of right wing hate.
So far all I see is the keyboard diarrhea of PLoony.
And that’s more about his own self-hatred than anything else.
“Contrary to myth, Hillary Clinton is a real person with real emotions, and I have always believed that given the opportunity to know her better, voters would grow to appreciate Clinton and her incredibly broad grasp on the issues. And yes, perhaps, even like her.”
ATJ & Goldy: Isn’t this the same woman and her broad grasp of issues who said on Dec. 28, 2007 “If President Musharraf wishes to stand for election, then he should abide by the same rules that every other candidate will have to follow.” That was her comments to Wolf Blitzer of CNN.
Dec 29, 2007, just two days later, she said “could be the only person on the ballot. I don’t think that’s a real election.” That was her comment to George Stephanopolous of ABC.
Yet as I remember Musharraf was elected October 2007.
Yes she’s a foreign genius!
Ahhh, one of the dull knifes’ woke up today, blogging from work I see.
Slew of right-wing hate or dislike for a triangulator?
Slew of right-wing hate or is the the vast right-wing conspiracy? Is your Pinocchio nose growing Clueless Gooberfool?
Do you give the man a real day’s work Clueless Gooberfool@40?
Error above December 30th is two days later.
Puddybud
FWIW I grew up in a poor part of Boston and lived in Roxbury for 3 years.
I have also had the establishment at more than one time assign me to the Black race .. though I do not have a black skin.
As dor Bush’s new hiome, just Google Bush Bidet UAE and you should get there.
So Stupes, you’re willing to pay higher taxes so an African American can take the White House.
That’s fucking weird. You guys are all over Huckabee for raising taxes in AK by what? 500 million?
And now you’re admitting that you morons aren’t hurting?
Someone’s got to pay off this stinking miserable war and it isn’t going to be my kids if I can help it.
SeattleJew I saw their use for the common Clueless Gooberfool ailments:
# Hemorrhoids
# Diarrhea
# Rashes
I saw your link, but I didn’t see much else.
Follow the link. It has details on Bush ranch.
Oh oh ,, gota go, my helicopter is early!
The Smartest Woman In The World is running on a “ready to lead” slogan. Tell me, what the fuck has she done? That is, other than sucking Bubba’s dick a few decades ago.
If that’s all it takes, wouldn’t Monica make a better candidate? At least her experience is more recent.
All the moonbat candidates are empty skirts. Can any of you name one thing they’ve ever accomplished? Or does that not matter?
48 – Fuck off loser. You lost a bet to Goldy and didn’t pay. You’re lower than scum.
sorry 47!
goldy:
I would vote for any Democrat over the republicans flawed candidates who buy into the war and the corruption of the republican party (the party of war profiteers and Big Pharma).
Hillary just doesn’t excite me – it is nice to see her let her guard down and become human. However, I seriously question her judgement – especially voting for the AUMF in the Iraq War.
She should have known not to give that power to Bush and the neocons as they ramped up the “case” for war by distorting the intelligence. then – not fessing up and saying it was a mistake – no courage of her “convictions”.
Gordon @2: sorry – it just doesn’t work for me when you try to compare Obama to Bush. First, Obama is intelligent and can actually speak in complete sentences (unlike bush who can’t communicate and is intellectually lazy and lack inquisitiveness).
Second, Obama has laid out his specific policies – go look at this web page.
Third, Bush ran as a “moderate” and compassionatte conservative only in the 2000 election (by 2004 he ran as a right winger on 9/11). Even then, if you examined his record in Texas, you could see he was a polarizing figure. Whereas Obama has a record of working with republicans in the Illinois legislature.
So Bush and Obama have very little in common – certainly not the pretend to be moderate and have no real policy but revert to the wingnut when in office….that is just pure Bush spin.
Leave Hillary Alone! She’s a human being! …
Man you are lame Goldy.
VOTE Republican
Clueless Gooberfool I think post #48 is correct.
Take your advice and do it NOW!
Molly does a good job with the sexism Hillary’s got to deal with:
http://whiskeyfire.typepad.com.....front.html
And yet another edition of What Digby Said:
http://digbysblog.blogspot.com.....molly.html
I’ll vote for the Democrat in November no matter who it is — even if it’s Roger Rabbit!!!
@5 “But nobody in American politics is that far … right.”
Only if you think the John Birchers who now run the GOP are “mainstream.” Me, I think they’re just as over the top today as they were in the ’50s.
Let the Hillary haters have a field day with this clip! Let ’em! Let the whole nation see what the hard-right wingos are all about — hate. Their platform is hate — they don’t stand for anything else. Their attitude toward virtually all the candidates of both parties is hate — they don’t like anyone. Their arguments and postings are full of hate — their knowledge and intellect goes no deeper than knowing who they don’t like, which is basically everyone else. The word “Republican” has become identified with hate in the same way that “KKK” and “Nazis” became synonymous of hate. Modern-day Republicans are haters, and they will get the hate vote — but nothing else.
If the Democrats want to disenfranchise their left flank, then nominating Clinton is the way to go. Many progressives and labor still remember the sting of the Clinton years, of which she takes much credit. It was the cause of the growth of the Green Party in 2000. It’s too bad the heavy hitters in this state have already lined up behind her. A guy like McCain will hand it to her in November if she gets the nomination.
Rabbit, a national socialist, is chewing Hate Carpet again. It’s said that Hitler chewed and spewed invective that must have been as impressive to Eagle’s Nest guests as #58 was to me. (Anyone else need a towel to wipe off Roger’s spit?)
http://michellemalkin.com/2008.....f/?print=1
We were told for so long by democrats (and these people had perfectly straight faces, too) that Bill Clinton was “the first black president”. Will they now be saying that Obama could be “the second black president”?
..and I’m amazed that so many in the democrat party have stopped drinking the Klinton Koolaid. Simply amazed.
hillary just brought in the ragin’ cajun….carville.
now nothing says “CHANGE” [heh heh heh] more than bringing in the old retread. obama is about to get his ass handed to him, cause carville sure can dig up dirt. and rumor has it, there is alot of dirt to dig up……..
please please please nominate hillary. it would really make my year. but obama won’t be hard to get past either.
now if hillary will only pick gregoire the other super bitch as her running mate we could all spend the next four years cringing at the ballbuster sisters…………
whew…can you imagine that couple?
btw, michellemalkin.com has the perfect complement to the above Hillary crying game video. It’s that priceless video of Bill walking into the Ron Brown funeral laughing it up until he sees the cameras. Then he magically dips his head and comes up pretending to cry and–for full effect–even lifts his hand up to his eyes a couple times pretending to wipe away tears. An academy-award-winning performance for sure. Don’t miss it, folks. Simply priceless.
mickey@62……. GOOD ONE MICKEY.LOL.
no, obama won’t be the second black president…..how can he? he’s just as white as he is black, right?
i mean…which one do you choose?his mother is as white as you can get and his dad is black from kenya. maybe that makes him the KENYAN candidate?
isn’t he really both???
obama obviously chose the one that he thought would give him race card kryptonite.
won’t work though. and frankly, once again if people are choosing their candidate based on their sex or the color of their skin..that’s just beyond stupid. if you wouldn’t choose your heart surgeon that way then don’t pick the leader of the free world that way………
btw, michellemalkin.com has the perfect complement to the above Hillary crying game video. It’s that priceless video of Bill walking into the Ron Brown funeral laughing it up until he sees the cameras.
What does it have to do with Hillary Clinton?
#67–It has to do with the fact that (you may not have known this…but) Bill is married to Hill and he’s out there campaigning for her. You know–the co-presidents??? It’s hilarious to ask what Bill has to do with Hill. Just funny. She trots him out there regularly to remind people that he’s married to her. har har Matching crying videos is just precious.
christmasghost, can you believe the question @67??
62: Toni Morrison got it wrong. Warren G. (Harding, not Magnuson) was our first black president. Discussed at length on earlier iterations of HA.
So, you’re saying it has nothing to do with Hillary. It’s just a way to insult Bill and hit Hillary by association. Got it.
66: 2 or 3 weeks ago on Dave Ross Friday, Carl Jeffers went nuts. He took about five meth-or-caffeine seconds to describe the Clinton smear of Obama as a drug dealer, then went on a ten-minute meth/caffeine rant about Republican dirty tricks. Said the GOP “would” smear Obama as a black man dealing drugs, while refusing to refer again to the inconvenient truth that Clintonistas had already done the smear.
Question: Is Obama a black man, or is he a skinny dweeb with a really good tan and one drop of sun screen?
Question: Is Carl Jeffers an authentic black man, or is he nuts?
65: The clip (Rush showed it early and often) that made hypocrisy a White-House-hold word.
So Hillary dragged a dollar bill thru a trailer park and snagged Carville again. Can hardly wait for the Carville’s Politics of Personal Destruction to come crashing down on Osama Obama. Will for sure wipe the goofy grin off his face.
mickey….after posting here for so long….sadly,YES, i can believe that another tj is trying to float that lead balloon again.
what i can’t believe is that he really thinks it still works. yup, that’s right ATJ. hillary has nothing to do with bill[tic] and visa versa….we got that. and so,sadly, does the rest of the country.
oops…i guess that’s NOT what you meant, right?
ATJ….here’s what it has to do with hillary. she is just as insincere and full of it as bill…..but without the “charisma” which seems to have worn off the old creep anyway finally….. did you know that college students are walking out on “boring bill’s” speech’s now?
but don’t count the hildebeast out just yet. with carville coming in [you know…all that CHANGE…HA!]he will be ripping the newbie obama apart. and when the stories of obama’s drug DEALING come out, it’s all over baby.
the clinton machine still works even if they don’t……..
yes, christmasghost, that any democrat actually asks “what does anything Bill have to do with Hill” is very funny.
And I too have been waiting for the Clinton slime machine to come out sometime and not a minute too soon at this point. These people perfected the art of scorched-earth destroy-everyting-in-sight-don’t-they-know-who-we-are? politics. They will not go down without turning the guns on obama with every dirty trick they know how to play. It was Hillary who said “The purpose of politics is to pummel your opponent about the face.” well she said it–let’s see what she’s going to pound out of Obama.
hildebeast…lol
here’s what it has to do with hillary. she is just as insincere and full of it as bill
Prove it.
#76: Hillary—“I was the last one on earth to believe that my husband was having an affair with Monica Lewinsky.” (even though TJ figured it out sooner than I did…)
okay ATJ….here it is. she tells us all that she could run the US, better, cleaner and more perfectly than any of her opponents, right?
i think we can agree on that, right?
okay…..how can she possibly do that if she is so damn stupid that she didn’t know her husband was cheating on her CONSTANTLY.
here’s the kicker….we all KNOW she isn’t that stupid. she chose to look the other way because then she could ride his “charisma” into the white house [she thought…]
OR….is she really that stupid in which case she is not the person we want dealing with even bigger liars than her husband…oh, you know, people like the north koreans, the iranians or hey, even the french.
if she is that stupid EVEN the french could put one over on her……..
need more?
So, by your own admission, there are two theories that even a Hillary hater like you believes are plausible. I would contend that there are more, but for our purposes, they aren’t necessary. You’ve admited that you can’t prove your claim.
Now, just accept that you’re projecting your own insecurities onto Senator Clinton, and you’ll feel much better.
” … EVEN the French …” But while the French took a right turn to the right, we are taking a left turn into the sewer. Whether or not Hillary leads the charge, we’ll still be in the sewer, and the French will be looking down at us, shaking their wise French heads in sorrow.
Um … is there a lab test for insincerity so we can settle for all time the question in question?
another TJ simply can’t face the truth. That’s okay, another. We know you’re not going to acknowledge any of this. We get that you can’t or else you would have to admit to yourself that we’re right about Hillary–“I really was the last person on earth to know that Bill was cheating. No, really!”
Pelletizer@58: Yes we hate vast left-wing conspiracies…
Oh wait… nevermind!
ChristmasGhost & Mickey: Dismissed ATJ with Prejudice!
Mickey,
Logic’s not your strong suit, is it?
ATJ….and how, exactly, did i not prove it?
can you even answer a straight question?
how could i possibly HATE hillary? i have never met her and i don’t go around randomly hating ANYONE [i could make a snarky comment here about some of the far left and their love to hate mentality……..]
instead of you playing dr. phil here why don’t you give me some scenarios on why you think she is the right person for the job?
“projecting your own insecurities”…now that IS amusing!
come on! how about instead of yelling “hey, look over there….” you actually addressed a question for once? would that be so difficult?
thanks puddy…one hand tied behind my back……..
mickey……i would say that ATJ is running scared. he can’t even answer a single question without getting his knickers in a knot ………
cg,
I answered your comment directly in #79. Perhaps you’ve read it?
Oh, and if you would be so kind as to inform me when you’ve proven you can read Hillary Clinton’s mind and judge her sincerity, I would appreciate it. Thx.
ATJ…can you make some sense please? i read it and it said absolutely nothing.
here it is: “So, by your own admission, there are two theories that even a Hillary hater like you believes are plausible. I would contend that there are more, but for our purposes, they aren’t necessary. You’ve admited that you can’t prove your claim.
Now, just accept that you’re projecting your own insecurities onto Senator Clinton, and you’ll feel much better. ”
and you said WHAT? exactly? and i admitted what exactly how? gawd…does talking in circles just to hear yourself talk ever get tiring for you?
per your answer at 67……what does it have to do with hillary? have you heard the expression that you are known by who you associate with? i think it counts even more if you are married to IT. come on! people aren’t stupid. try this:
pretend hillary is a big nasty republican. what would you be saying about her motives for everything she does now?
see how that works?
cg,
You may not have heard, but Bill and Hillary Clinton are actually two different people. Shocking, I know, but there it is.
ATJ….no, i can’t read her mind. but does anyone need to? aren’t you living in the real world where people are judged on their accomplishments or lack of them? and do you have no intuition at all? you can’t tell when someone is being insincere? well, no wonder you are a liberal…..JUST KIDDING. that last part was a joke.
okay…i’ll bite. why don’t you actually tell me [what? can you read her mind?] why she threw other people ‘under the bus’ rather than deal upfront with her cheating lying husband?
i would respect her for that…if she had dealt with him. i mean, think about it, as i said before he won’t be the biggest liar and cheat she would be dealing with as president would he? so…is it such a big stretch, especially when almost everyone can see for themselves that there is no love lost between the two of them, to wonder why she didn’t and perhaps think her motives are not exactly pure?
The fact that it never occurred to you that she might actually love him says a lot more about you than it does about her.
‘Night.
ATJ…..another dodge on answering from you. i’m shocked i tell you!! heh heh heh
but, seriously, can you answer the question?
and they may be different people but once again i have to come back to “you are known by who you associate with” and also let’s not forget that BILL would be in the white house AGAIN.and he fooled her[she says…so how smart is the smartest woman in the world anyway?] ….please. he couldn’t have gotten the crap he was passing out past 99% of american wives for one frickin’ second. period. and don’t forget…there are more women to vote……..
so once again……
“try this:
pretend hillary is a big nasty republican. what would you be saying about her motives for everything she does now?
see how that works?”
answer????
ATJ…run, little man, run…
she might actually LOVE him??? are you serious? who is reading minds [and imaginations…wild ones at that…now?]then she really isn’t capable of running the country…not for a second. if she is that self-defeating and delusional and thinks so little of herself that she would allow an idiot like bill to make a fool of her….tell me again why we would want her as president?
but please…..do nominate her.
ATJ@ 93…it would be faster for you to simply say “i’m rubber and you’re glue….blah blah blah……”
no answers? and you are going to bed. geez…is it true? you are a kid?
and you are going to bed. geez…is it true? you are a kid?
cg,
This too may come as a surprise to you, but there are things called time zones. You see, the planet is roughly spherical, and, combined with its rotation and its relationship to the sun, this means that it can be one time in one part of the globe and a different time in another at the same time. Weird, I know, but true.
she might actually LOVE him??? are you serious?
Yes, I’m serious. My theory goes much farther in explaining Hillary’s actions than yours does, and if we’re going to speculate about what’s in her heart and mind, why not entertain ALL theories, unless you are just so overcome by Clinton Derangement Syndrome that you can’t think straight?
“try this:
pretend hillary is a big nasty republican. what would you be saying about her motives for everything she does now?
see how that works?”
That’s the point. I don’t speculate about the motives of presidential candidates. I judge them based on their policy proposals and the consistency of their statements, not my ability to read their mind. That way lies madness. You’re a case in point here; your fixation on The Clenis is getting in the way of your ability to reason.
To more directly answer your question, I don’t consider Mitt Romney a phony because he cried on television (twice) at a time when he was being accused of being too robotic; I consider Romney a fool because he’s disavowing good policies he once claimed to believe in and embracing foolish policies he should be calling foolish policies. I don’t consider John McCain a phony because he’s kissed up to the people he once claimed to despise; I consider McCain a bad choice as president because he’s arguing for policies that make little sense in the real world.
And I certainly don’t consider Mike Huckabee unfit for the presidency because his son appears to be a disgusting human being; I consider Mike Huckabee unfit for the presidency because he has shown he has absolutely no grasp of foreign affairs.
The point, if you haven’t grasped it by now, is that a) we don’t know what’s in their hearts and heads, b) even if we did, it’s a stupid way to think about presidential candidates, and c) they should be judged by their *own* actions, not those of people in their family.
I’m disappointed in you to see that you couldn’t get to this point on your own, but The Clenis has prevented the entire political press corps from engaging their brains, why should I expect anything else from its consumers…
As a self confessed “petty guy”, Senator Clinton hits the sweet spot of policies I can support and bring pain and annoyance to the people I loathe.
Rethuglicans* need to experience the level of suffering the rest of us experienced for the last six years.
*since the Rethuglicans have taken the liberty of renaming the Democratic Party, we return the favor.
ATJ…….. the clenis? wow, that’s so clever. and here i thought * snicker, snicker* that you actually occasionally thought for yourself.
i guess i was wrong about that……..
sweetie, we were talking about the clintons. that hardly makes anyone on here fixated but you…..and now i find out that you are fixated on a part of bill that no one else is. interesting. i’m sure that you thought you were terribly clever coming up with that…even though “YOU” didn’t. hanging around loser sites that twist words and phrases into something that a naughty kid in grade school would think up… why am i not surprised?
only children and silly liberals [i guess] think rhyming or twisting words, or making fun of someone’s name ad nauseum is funny or acceptable…….sorry, but the adults don’t.
what next? “if the glove *don’t* fit, you must acquit”????
BTW….would your time zone happen to be eastern, say around new york by any chance? uh huh…thought so.
Honey pie,
I notice you’ve forgotten that you are the one who brought up Bill Clinton’s sex life. And I also notice that you’ve conveniently ignored the rest of my comment, which directly refutes your entire line of “thought” in this thread. I’m sure it’s just a coincidence that you didn’t bring that up.
Finally, pumpkin, I’m not anywhere near New York, but I’m glad to see you’re starting to embrace the concept of time zones. Good on ya!
Dismissed… with prejudice.
ATJ……okay sweetpea. “good on ya,huh?” so i guess you want me to think you are in australia which would really make one wonder about your fascination with the clintons wouldn’t it? and the american elections…..
you MUST be a king county absentee voter! hah.
but, in reality you are probably just living in a small smoky apartment in tacoma enjoying the smell…err, i mean the VIEW.
the only thing that is easily dismissed around here is your brain pan…….
Steeeeerike threeee!!!! Yer OUT!!!
And still no response on substance.
G’night, my Ramblin’ (and ramblin’ and ramblin’ and ramblin’) Rose.
I’m not sure if there is a big difference between Obama and Clinton. Check their voting records…identical.
Both favor Health Care for all. Both favor bringing our troops home. Both favor to take back the tax cuts for the rich…on and on.
The big difference is Clinton has been around, and knows how to stand up to Republicans. Not sure what Obama will do if he’s the nominee, and they start ‘swift boating’ him. Will he be another Kerry and say “thank you sir, may I have another”? We don’t know, in fact we don’t know much of anything about Obama, but he doesn’t seem to me like he’s a fighter in the same mold as Clinton. He seems like a nice guy, who you’d want to have a beer with (Sound familiar)?
For me, the choice is easy. Clinton can win, the Right knows that, and it’s the reason they attack, and fear her. What isn’t clear is why fellow Democrats attack her.
I would hope Democrats would come together, support your candidate, but PLEASE stop attacking your own family. If it’s one thing we can learn from the right wing…they stick together, why oh why can’t we?
Thanks, Regards,
Larry (who will vote for Hillary Clinton, but will support the Democrat candidate, whoever that will be.)
Will you pledge the same?