Sen. John McCain explained his energy policy yesterday at a town hall meeting in Denver:
“My friends, I will have an energy policy…which will eliminate our dependence on oil from Middle East, that will…then prevent us from having ever to send our young men and women into conflict again in the Middle East.”
Did you catch that? McCain is suggesting that the real reason we are in Iraq is their oil.
War for oil is not a surprise to many of us. The surprise is that the likely Republican nominee for President, in effect, admits it.
McCain apparently tried clarifying his statement but, as Keith Olbermann and Rachel Maddow point out, there were three different explanations by the end of the day.
Of course this war is about the oil. As was the Gulf War in 1991. Yeah…in that earlier war, Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait first. The Coalition liberated Kuwait under the authority of U.N. Resolution 660. But would the U.S. bother to fight a war over Iraq’s occupation of Kuwait if it didn’t involve “our” oil supply? I mean, if Iraq had invaded and occupied, say, Namibia, would the U.S. respond with military force? Not likely.
In fact, South Africa did occupy, oppress, and commit atrocities in Namibia—in violation of numerous U.N. mandates. For some twenty years beginning in 1966, the U.N. passed a series of resolutions that condemed and declared South Africa’s occupation of Namibia illegal:
The General Assembly […]
3. Demands once again that the apartheid regime of South Africa immediately and unconditionally withdraw its illegal administration, occupation army and police force from Namibia;
But Namibia isn’t an oil producing country. No oil…no rush on that illegal occupation. No dead Americans, no dead South Africans.
You may well believe that the coalition’s war against Iraq in 1991 was justified by Iraq’s hostile actions and illegal occupation. But don’t fool yourself…when it comes right down to it, the action was about oil. And every time we fill our gas tanks, we purchase a little bit of human blood on the side.
Likewise, the U.S. invasion of Iraq in 2003 was not about WMD, terrorism, or human rights. It was about the second largest oil reserves in the world. It’s shockingly refreshing to hear McCain, a powerful Republican, actually fess up to the reason behind our military actions.
At the same time, McCain doesn’t seem the least bit bothered by the fraudulent claims made by the Bush administration that misled the Senate and the American people. He doesn’t seem troubled by the heavy toll in human lives (on the order of hundreds of thousands dead) and the untold number of injuries wrought by those lies. Apparently, McCain is just fine with those lies.
For McCain, it would seem, political party is thicker than blood.
If everyone is so offended over the war for oil, stop using the oil. Teach those reps a lesson. Once they aren’t profiting off the war maybe they’ll stop it.
Oops, never mind. Ignorant me thought liberals/democrats would take a stand for what they believe.
Marvin Stamn,
Can’t we use petroleum products without killing people? That’s what we want.
Just an FYI, the Persian Gulf War WAS all about protecting oil. We only get 5% of our oil from Iraq and 1% from Kuwait. The majority of oil comes from Canada, Mexico and Saudi Arabia
@1 – We should get rid of oil, make the transit system so we don’t need cars. The only ones that would be able to drive cars would be the rich. Our dependence on oil is ridiculous! At least we are still much lower than most countries when it comes to gas prices. Imagine having gas at $10/gallon???
we can produce ethanol, IF they would make ethanol available at MANY more gas stations, granted the price of food will continue to rise but hey we will still be able to drive!
Marvin if you think sacrificing thousands of people and trillions of dollars is such a good idea – why don’t you go fight?
Evangelicals Confess They Were GOP’s ‘Useful Idiots’
“(May 3) – Conservative Christian leaders … plan to release a starkly self-critical document saying the movement has become too political and has diminished the Gospel through its approach to the culture wars.
“The statement, called ‘An Evangelical Manifesto,’ condemns Christians on the right … for ‘using faith’ to express political views without regard to the truth of the Bible, according to a draft of the document obtained Friday by The Associated Press. ‘That way faith loses its independence, Christians become `useful idiots’ for one political party …, and the Christian faith becomes an ideology,’ according to the draft.
“The declaration, scheduled to be released Wednesday in Washington, … say[s] evangelicals … help[ed] create a backlash against religion during a ‘generation of culture warring.’ ‘All too often …,’ they wrote, ‘ … we have condoned our own sins.’ They argue, ‘we must reform our own behavior.'”
Quoted under fair use; for complete article and/or copyright info see http://tinyurl.com/6pj48z
Roger Rabbit Commentary: What took ’em so long to realize their political ideology, rhetoric, and behavior aren’t, um, Christian-like? Better late than never, though.
“My friends, I will have an energy policy…which will eliminate our dependence on oil from Middle East, that will…then prevent us from having ever to send our young men and women into conflict again in the Middle East.”
What? run his car on cooking oil? I mean, the Middle East has 2/3rds of the world’s oil reserves, so how the fuck does he figure we don’t need Middle East oil?
As a Navy flier, McCain helped strengthen our dependence on oil by using his military jet to knock down power lines to put streetcars out of business.
I’ll bet he wouldn’t have gotten away with knocking down those power lines if his daddy hadn’t been a Navy 4-star. Anyone else would have been grounded. Hell, anyone else with McCain’s Annapolis record wouldn’t have gotten into flight school in the first place. Do we really want a president who can’t even take off from an airport without flying into power lines? Two stupid, retarded, incompetent dolts in a row is too many. We need a real president to clean up some of the wreckage left by the Current Occupant before we give the job to another idiot who would’ve ended up in a hamburger-flipping career if his daddy wasn’t a big shot.
At least Obama understands the gas tax holiday plan is just like Hilary’s get troops out within 60 days of taking office plan!!! No true plan to accomodate loss of tax revenue! Seems like Hilary and McCain have alot of screwed up energy plans!
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITI.....index.html
At least Obama understands the gas tax holiday plan is just like Hilary’s get troops out within 60 days of taking office plan!!! No true plan to accomodate loss of tax revenue! Seems like Hilary and McCain have alot of screwed up energy plans!
cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/05/03/obama.gas.ap/index.html
When I was a little bunny, I was taught that America is a meritocracy, and competition ensures that the best performers will get ahead. What a crock that turned out to be!
By far the most important determinant of success in America is who your parents are.
The only sure wayto become wealthy is by inheriting a shitload of money — and, in fact, that’s how most wealthy people got that way.
The surest path to becoming chairman of the board is by being the majority shareholder when your daddy kicks the bucket.
No matter what you aspire to in life — owning a baseball team, getting into Navy flight school, becoming a movie star, etc. — it helps like hell to have parents who are rich, powerful, and famous. In fact, you have damned little chance if they aren’t.
That’s why I like Gov. Gregoire and wingnuts hate her. They can’t stand the idea of our governor being the daughter of a single mom who eked out a modest living as a fry cook. It isn’t supposed to happen that way in America. Nobodies, and children of nobodies, aren’t supposed to be able to compete against children of the privileged. That job supposedly was reserved for the playboy son of some rich guy. They don’t understand how a nobody daughter of a nobody fry cook got hired instead. That’s why they believe Gregoire stole the election — they can’t rationalize it any other way.
Using petroleum products kills people. Global warming anyone? Think of all those poor people living on the coasts when all the ice melts, the water rises and their homes are under water.
Roger Rabbit’s Plan To Lower Gas Prices
Use less gas.
Time to watch the Kentucky Derby! (Channel 5 locally.) I’ll deal with you trollfucks later. Watching the horse race is more important.
Are you using the oil america is killing for?
If you are, why don’t you go fight if it bothers you so much. Or you could just keep filling up your tank with oil that has blood on it. Your choice, just don’t preach to me if you don’t have the courage to stand up for your convictions.
Go Darryl! Great post, man.
@11
Same with the rights frothing at the mouth over B. Clinton.
Marvin you ducked my question so I assume like all GOP retards, you’re a coward. You see I don’t use any Iraqi oil. I use Biodiesel. So I don’t have to go fight.
You and your chickenhawk friends who’ve lied about the war for seven years should be MADE to fight. And your children and their children too.
You’re all con artists who would prefer profit to peace and I’m glad you’re on this board making it clear for all to see what the GOP stands for.
Too bad you hide behind that computer and won’t show yourself. I have the courage of my convictions. It’s punks and cowards like you who don’t.
And the winner is Big Brown by 5 lengths!
Starting from the outside at the No. 20 pole position, Big Brown ran 4th on the outside for the first 1/2 mile, then accelerated into a powerful surge and cut in front of the 3 horses ahead of him to the rail at the turn, and ran with convincing power in front of the field to romp under the wire. Big Brown is the first horse since 1929 to win the Kentucky Derby from the outside pole positon.
When I was younger, I could’ve run circles around any of them. Nothing focuses your mind like an eagle circling overhead!
The second place finisher, Eight Belles, collapsed after the race. She broke both of her front ankles and was immediately euthanized due to the severity of the injury. So, one of the horses that ran this race 10 minutes ago is now dead. Very sad.
1 ms
The “everyone” who are so offended by war for oil are going to stop the war.
Like RR said @7, McCain’s main idiocy is not in admitting that the war is about oil (from which he’s been backpedaling with furiously stuttered “clarifications” ever since), as stupid as that is, but the real nub of his lunatic thought:
Yeah, let’s see that fucking plan, John. Uh-huh. Like you’re going to veto any bill with earmarks? Except for the earmarks for aid to Israel. And aid to Egypt. And veterans’ housing. and….and…and…
He simply cannot be believed, and apparently cannot say anything believable.
@15 Marvin, the question was why aren’t you fighting for the oil you use? Dude, nice try at deflection, but you lose. Thanks for playing.
@21 And this is the dolt that people who worry about whether Obama is wearing a flag pin are going to vote for …
It doesn’t do any good to fill our tanks with ethanol or processed canola oil if the production of the crops and the industrial processing into fuel consumes more petroleum than the biofuel replaces. Ethanol from corn is a big-time net loser in that department. It’s mainly a means of funnelling our great-grandchildren’s tax dollars (because that’s what the gubmint’s running on now) into the coffers of Archer Daniels Midland.
If a noble racehorse is euthanized for a broken leg, why don’t they euthanize a stupid dog for fraudulently registering to vote and voting Republican? It ain’t fair!!!
@24 Ethanol is a GOP plot to enrich red-state farmers at our expense.
There are quite a few resourceful folks around these parts running old Mercedes diesels converted to burn fryer grease. Good on ’em–but if many more people start doing that, there won’t be enough restaurants to keep them going. Furthermore, that supply may well dry up if people start eating healthier. Are you willing to volunteer to gum up your arteries so your neighbor can get around cheaper?
The real reason we cannot continue the war for oil is not because we don’t use oil. Incidentally, stopping the war would very likely have a net effect of lowering the price of oil, seeing how our continuing the Occupation has raised it.
But to my point. The real reason to stop the war is this:
http:// http://www.usatoday. com/news/world/iraq/2008-05-03-iraq-saturday_N.htm?loc=interstitialskip
Of course, the military claims it was was aiming at a building occupied by “a criminal element,” and by all accounts that building was destroyed. It turns out (of course) that the building is a chapel used by the hospital workers.
We are using air strikes to conduct urban warfare against an indigenous insurgency. It’s against every rule of counter-insurgency to use indiscriminate power of this sort, because it is guaranteed to maim and kill civilians on a daily basis. This turns the population against our troops, undermnes the trust needed to gain usable intelligence, increases the ranks of the insurgents, and destroys any possible claim to moral standing on our part, both in Iraq and around the world.
Our wars of adventure in the Middle East and elswehere are really about DOLLARS. Presently the only thing that keeps the value of our currency from falling below that of the paper it’s printed on is that most of the world’s major commodities markets (in particular, petroleum) use the dollar exclusively as a means of exchange. Before 9/11, Saddam was making noise about opening a new oil bourse in Iraq where trading would be done in Euros. Now Iran is threatening to do the same thing, and the United States Navy has two carriers in the Gulf ready to pull the trigger.
There’s probably also an imperative to maintain our “best-friends” status with the Saudis by making sure none of the oil producing nations cuts significantly into their profits, either by taking business away or causing the price of crude to drop. This, aside from the fact that we just plain don’t like him, explains the malevolent stance of the United Stated toward Hugo Chavez.
Marvin Stamn,
“Using petroleum products kills people. Global warming anyone? Think of all those poor people living on the coasts when all the ice melts, the water rises and their homes are under water.”
Yep…that is certainly a consideration, which is why many of us are working for a carbon-neutral future.
But…this post is about going out and killing people with bombs and guns for oil. I do accept that when I use gasoline, it is paid for, in part, by the violent death of others less fortunate than me. That is something else I am working to change. Essentially, I want the murderous Neocons stopped, and I want them tried for their crimes.
Sen. McCain has done us all a great service by admitting that the deaths of thousands of Americans and hundreds of thousands of Iraqis was, at the heart of it, about controlling oil reserves. Unfortunately, he doesn’t have the moral compass to be outraged by it.
So I missed the word “that” after everyone, sorry mr grammar nanny. It’s good to see that it didn’t take you too long to figure out the gist of the message.
Hey, did I miss your exzplanation of why you changed your name to daddy love? Looking forward to reading about it.
p.s. I spelled another word wrong, make yourself feel good and correct me.
Forgot to ask… The change that the democrats preached before they gained control of the congress in the last election, is that still on the table or did they decide to put it off for the next president? Which would explain why obama keeps repeating change over and over.
Over the age they would allow me to enlist.
For a minute I thought you were talking about when clinton allowed wesley clark to “accidently” blow up the chinese embassy during the kosovo days.
I think this a little unfair. It’s not binary.
A perfectly defensible foreign policy would specify that America goes to war when
(1) It is in our interest to do so (oil, or whatever), and
(2) There is a moral imperative to do so.
That’s why we didn’t do anything about Namibia: it didn’t matter to us. The fact that oil was an important calculation doesn’t make the whole enterprise immoral, although the fact that invading Iraq pretty clearly wasn’t in our interest is a whole ‘nother issue.
@33 Have you talked to your local Army recruiter lately? They’ve lowered the standards recently to fill their quotes. They’re even taking retards, felons, and sex offenders now! Hell, they might even take you. Besides, lots of people have lied about their age to get in. If you don’t know how to doctor your birth certificate, let us know and we’ll get someone to help you.
@#1 – Leave it to a Conservative Republican (or an Independent, or a Liberatarian, or anyone who wants to distance themselves from a Liberal, but yet doesn’t want to be labeled a Conservative Republican) to be the first one to make an ignorant comment. Very Smart Marvy.
The Tommy
So Marvin I guess you have all your kids down there at the induction center right? And your grandkids? Or are you like that AWOL coward Bush who has 37 combat-aged relatives who are NO FUCKING WHERE near Iraq?
You right wing chickenhawks are all the same. All for a war that you don’t have to fight.
I put a curse on you Marvin and your family. For every Iraq death I curse you to find three months of pain and agony in your own family.
Whose idea was it to start producing ethanol? Global warming advocates? Al Gore? I thought the whole reason behind producing ethanol was to rid ourselves of oil dependency. Look up Gore and ethanol, he has been one of the biggest pushers of ethanol production and use yet people here say, to quote RR “Ethanol is a GOP plot to enrich red-state farmers at our expense”
If Gore has been president on 2004…he would have “Our administration’s goal is to triple the use of biomass technologies, ethanol, gasoline additives, plant-based textiles and other environmentally friendly products by 2010. This is just one of the exciting ways our efforts to protect the environment will begin to help America’s ailing farming economy.”
MHD @ 35,
“The fact that oil was an important calculation doesn’t make the whole enterprise immoral…”
No…but lying about the reasons WAS immoral. The Bush administration told us that (1) Iraq was part of the War on Terror™, (2) Iraq had, and was further developing, WMD.
Neither claim was true in any substantive way. Those lies constitute fraud, conspiracy, and misappropriation of, perhaps, a trillion dollars. Enron was a purse-snatching in comparison.
Hannah – The Bush Administration has been an advocate of the use of ethanol as an alternative fuel – as a matter of fact he has been pushing for it hard. I personally, since the last two years, have seen and read reports that ethanol is not a good alternative fuel…Why are we still going down this path with this knowledge, is that Al Gore’s fault too? The Democrats have been pushing for energy independence/conservation since the 70’s, why now are Republicans finally getting it? You can be happy though with the thought that you too can own a hummer.
This is a clear example of politicians playing politics and making wrong decisions at the expense of the idiot like you who want to debate it.
The Tommy
@41 – I agree ethanol is a joke and waste of $$ and in turn makes food prices skyrocket, but what I was pointing out, is it was Gore and friends who initially started the ethanol production push.
http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=26275
“The former Vice President has been a leading ethanol supporter since the 1970s. In 1994 he cast the tie-breaking vote in the Senate that stopped a cut in ethanol subsidies. In 1999 he called ethanol “environmentally friendly” when boasting of the Clinton/Gore administration’s plans to triple its use by 2010.
Recently, as corn ethanol’s problems have become apparent, Gore has switched to promoting cellulosic ethanol, which would make ethanol from switchgrass and the like, rather than corn, but he cannot escape responsibility for promoting corn ethanol to the point where it became the favorite fuel of politicians chasing the support of farm interests.”
If your party would get off its dead duff and start drilling in this country, and allowing refineries to be built, we’d get a hell of alot of the oil we need right here.
Reading from your side’s play book maybe we can all just strap on beenie caps with wind powered propellers on top to get where we are going.
We’re one hell of a way from having a replacement for oil, so until you have a major brain fart of an idea about moving american food and goods, you better start drilling…
There’s two ways to make ethanol, the old-school subsidize the corn growers way and cellulosic ethanol which actually works and can be done using waste products like wheat straw.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cellulosic_ethanol
Too bad most of the govnmt’ money is going to the corn belt.
Roger the fuckhead said:
“As a Navy flier, McCain helped strengthen our dependence on oil by using his military jet to knock down power lines to put streetcars out of business.”
Yeah right, and I suppose Roger’s got documented evidence of what he declares, too. No wait! Maybe Roger was McCain’s back-seater in the A-4 Skyraider. Nah, that can’t be. The A-4 that McCain flew was a single-seat aircraft.
I think Roger is pissed because he’s a wannabe pilot. What’s the matter, Roger? Do you wear coke bottle glasses or something? Are you jealous of fly boys? Dick head!
GS – a plan for the future would be nice too – your thinking kind of got us to where we are now and just procrastinates a plan for the future. Maybe if Republicans thought about alternative energy in the 70’s like the Democrats pushed for, maybe we would already be a lot closer to independence of foreign oil. Maybe even some conservation wouldn’t hurt or alternative means such as solar, wind, etc.. could do some good. How about more fuel efficient vehicles? Why does it take 10 years to increase the present minimum MPG standards? We suck down 20 million barrels of oil a day, far from any other nation. But as other nations develop and start to use more – we want to blame the problem on their increased use, not on or daily waste, something that we have been wasting for over 60 years. I doubt if we started drilling in this country the price of Oil would drastically change.
Maybe we should start a war with Iran – that might help lower the price of Oil.
Hannah – get past Al Gore’s mistakes and blunders and worry about the future. With the knowledge that we have today, why are we still going down this road?
Yeah right, and I suppose Roger’s got documented evidence of what he declares, too.
That won’t be hard to get. I have a typewriter from the 1960’s now. Courage, courage.
I’ve heard he wasn’t such a great pilot. If there are accidents, then there is a document trail. The navy gets really picky about aviation accidents.
Methanol is a stop gap. Hydrogen and a supporting infastructure is a ways off. I look to various fuel cells to plug the gap. Geothermal seems to be as green as you can get. There’s ample quantities of it too.
Oh Pelletizer Pelletizer Pelletizer.
Your comment @26 is stupid and moronic. Apparently you forgot, well it’s past 24 hours my PuddyFact, of Al Gore and the 1994 Senate tie breaking vote for mandatory Ethanol use. Look it up Pelletizer, since it is in your field of study.
Tommy No Brains Thompson: How many Al Gore Carbon Credits did you buy last week?
Another thing. When the Bush Administration was anti-Ethanol (need the URLs) your side and the libtard MSM beat up the administration as being out of touch with reality.
Hannah, your use of facts are improving everyday.
Puddy, why thank you! I have been learning from the best! FACTS speak volumes! People think we, Americans, have short term memory, then how is it we remember the Pelosi promise from 2 whole years ago? ;-) It’s all about facts!
War about oil?
SHOCKED. SHOCKED!
45, I don’t generally disagree with you, but even after a real energy solution is found, this issue will not be solved. Why?
A good portion of America has to then be able to afford changing out their vehicles, boats, airplanes, mowers, tractors, 18 wheelers, cultivators, farm machinery, generators, etc etc etc (no small amount of money) to get on board. This will likely not happen in 5 to 15 years depending on cost and lifespan of the vehicle.
Ethenol seemed to be one brightspot, but now it getting beat up for causing alot of grief to the world food supply.
Wind Power and Solar are making reasonable headway, but not spectacular.
I am always amazed that the Hyrids, however were never built with a solar roof? Why Not? So while they are sitting at either end of a trip they could be recharging. Seems like a big Duh? Go figure? But the only downfall of a Hybrid is what to do with the battery when it is all used up. Large cost and Disposal etc. Otherwise it does basically is a great design in reducing fuel consumption.
My main point is Oil and its production will have to be a part, and I hope a continuingly diminishing part, of any strategy to get off foreign oil. To do so we still need to allow drilling for it and building refineries.
I don’t know how you think of your children, I don’t consider minemy property. They have the right to make their own decisions in life. You should let your children try it.
What a nice and caring person you are. My best wishes for your children to overcome the shit you are no doubt putting them through.
Marvin: If a woman actually “spawned” with bybygoober, the world is definitely a worse off place.
He’s a misogynist of the first order.
PuddyBrain – you live in the past, so why don’t you re-dig the hole you came out of and bury yourself back in. Seems like you like all the facts only when they work in your favor, and ignore the facts when they don’t. And you have nothing to offer the future.
McCain as a pilot may or may not have had the requisite flying skills, but he sure had some lousy luck. To have your aircraft shot out from under you by a mis-handled missile while you’re sitting on the deck of a carrier is pretty freaky.
You nimrods still don’t seem to get it. The Bush administration, and the energy cartel to which they are beholden, took us to war in Iraq to gain control of its oil supply and keep it out of production.
They (and it’ll be exactly the same “they” with McCain) intend to do the same thing to Iran and Venezuela if necessary to enable Big Oil to charge more and more to deliver the same or less product.
We’ve been triply robbed: of our (and our next three generations of offspring’s) tax dollars to fund this mess; of the blood of our best and bravest; and of the contents of our bank accounts when we go to the pump. Regardless of whatever else happens, we’ll keep paying this much and far more for gas as long as we’re stupid enough to keep buying it.
GreenStar is a Starwars II!
Hillary and Barack, talk like Ronnie .. we will solve the energy crisis by sending money on science. Dollars in miracles out!
Isn’t this StarWars II?
The Gipper’s fantasy wasted huge resources and helped lay the basis for the Fantasy War . aka Bush II.
The idea that we can escape from the petroleum trap by a Green Star Wars is equally dangerous. We could spend trillions in a new Manhattan project and never find a replacement for Petrol.
Two centuries ago, Malthus predicted these times. We are now in the era where resources have become truly limiting. While liberals may not like it, this almost certainly means someone will use WAR as a tool to control resources. The chance that such wars will not involve the US is zero!
The choices have to be made. Our life style, including the bill of Rights, depends on our prosperity. Democracy does not have a good record of surviving economic stress. Many of these choices will be antithetical to liberal orthodoxy. What then?
Simple answer.
Party before the country.
Hopefully someone with the courage to be a real leader will be President and will do what no one since Carter has been willing to do … tell the truth.
This awful season has led to a shit load of pandering. To bad because I do like McCain. What worries me about hi s whether he is tough enough to take on the dinosaurs from Bush era.
As for party before country, I am afraid that for Mrs. C it is L’erat est moi, so party is not a big deal. She is an awful pander bear. The odd thing is she is closer on p;icy to GWB than ether McCain or Obama.
Our best hope is Obama.
Tommy Thompson: This blog brings “DonkeyFacts” (TM). I bring PuddyFacts to refute “DonkeyFacts” (TM). If you don’t like it crawl into Pelletizer’s burrow and sulk with him…