Um… I was listening to President Bush’s speech this evening, and I’m not exactly sure that this is what the Iraq Study Group meant when they recommended that the US “actively engage Iran and Syria in its diplomatic dialogue, without preconditions.”
Succeeding in Iraq also requires defending its territorial integrity and stabilizing the region in the face of the extremist challenge.
This begins with addressing Iran and Syria. These two regimes are allowing terrorists and insurgents to use their territory to move in and out of Iraq. Iran is providing material support for attacks on American troops. We will disrupt the attacks on our forces. We will interrupt the flow of support from Iran and Syria. And we will seek out and destroy the networks providing advanced weaponry and training to our enemies in Iraq.
So… as long as we’re escalating the war in Iraq, I guess the only question regarding Iran and Syria is, which one is Cambodia and which one is Laos?
UPDATE:
Great minds think alike. The General has uncovered Our Leader’s visual aid:
Let’s look at this thing LOGICALLY, okay? Why does Bush want to increase troop level? So that the “sectarian violence” can be reduced. What is “sectarian violence”? “Sectarian violence” is Sunni Muslim and Shiite Muslim extremists killing each other. Who else do Sunni Muslim and Shiite Muslim extremists hate? Americans! So why should we put our troops in harm’s way, just so that people who wouldn’t mind killing us can stop killing each other? This Iraq situation would be EASY if we were fighting FOR a particular faction. But we aren’t. We could have WON in Vietnam, had we been willing to make a larger sacrifice (and also to invade the North). But we can’t even define a VICTORY in Iraq. We had a VICTORY four years ago, and accomplished a MISSION. However, the current MISSION is undefined. And almost everyone in the US is realizing that.
Mission accomplished!! Bush reveals his essential cluelessness.
“We could have WON in Vietnam, had we been willing to make a larger sacrifice (and also to invade the North).”
Richard,
It is nuttery like this that is the real heart of your repeated electoral setbacks. It reveals a mind that is essentially unhinged in a subtle, yet dangerous way. As if there is a hidden tear in your neural network causing massive detachment from reality. Harmless under most circumstances, it is utterly dangerous if it is an attribute of somebody in political power.
Most people recoil in horror once they realize this.
Get a grip, man.
So when are Republican leaders going to march into Bush’s office and give him the same news they gave Nixon? Something like “You gotta go”….. The only way for the GOP to ever have a chance of ever winning an election is by getting rid of the chain around their necks dragging them to the bottom.
Obstructing Democrats while they try to repair the damage the GOP has done will not win any hearts or minds, and that is for sure…..
Anyone supporting Republicans these days (and the investigations have not even started) needs to get professional help. And I mean now!
which one is Cambodia and which one is Laos?
NEITHER!
This not Viet Nam.
Goldy you are not a General nor a soldier who are capable to make military calls.
Debates don’t win wars but soldiers on the battle field have the ability to win wars.
Goldy when are your friends in Seattle going to support the troops by joining the military?
Yep I thought so, none.
“……….and accomplished a MISSION.”
Yes. The WMD’s were destroyed. I sleep more soundly now that I know there are no nukular tipped balsa wood planes heading for the good ol’ US of A.
“We had a VICTORY four years ago, and accomplished a MISSION.”
Yes, we delivered Iraq into the current state. (I’d hate to see defeat…) Idolatry always looks silly, especially when it worships an overstuffed codpiece in place of a graven idol.
“We could have WON in Vietnam, had we been willing to make a larger sacrifice (and also to invade the North).”
Yeah, we could have over-run an entire country which hated our occupation, instead of half of a country which hated our occupation. Nixon’s sadistic bombing of Hanoi cost us many B-52 bombers, which were supposed to be part of our nuclear deterrent against the real threat of Communism. Then as now, we ignored our real enemy to focus on a country which hadn’t threatened us in any way. Mission accomplished, indeed.
Let’s leave this mess before it kills any more innocent Americans or Iraqis.
“We could have WON in Vietnam, had we been willing to make a larger sacrifice (and also to invade the North).”
You mean if we dropped 20 nukes? Won? What kind of victory would that have been?
The sad thing is the Iraqis gave us a whole year to see if we could make their lives better, and all we did was thumb our noses at them, hire foreign workers for the tiny bit of rebuilding going on there, and raid their nations resources.
Here is the link. Read it and cry. This is why we failed.
“Baghdad Year Zero” Naomi Klein
http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0924-13.htm
The Iraqis figured out they didn’t want the same companies that run our government running theirs….
Can you blame them?
Read the article before you answer.
The 9 billion that went un accounted for in Iraq was THEIRS!!!!
“which one is Cambodia and which one is Laos?”
Cambodia is the one that starts with a “C”.
The speech was vintage Bushit — laced with references to “Al Qaeda” and “terrorists” and “threats to our way of life” — and vintage conservative: The solution a losing war is a bigger and deadlier war.
@1 “This Iraq situation would be EASY if we were fighting FOR a particular faction. But we aren’t.”
Richard, you’re deluding yourself if you think Bush hasn’t taken sides in Iraq … we’re FOR the Shiites (the guys who take Americans hostage in Iran) and AGAINST the Sunnis (the guys who fought the commies in Afghanistan).
took not take
@1 As for whether we could have won in Vietnam by invading the North, you’re assuming (a) a U.S. occupation wouldn’t have turned into an Iraq-like quagmire, and (b) China wouldn’t have intervened — both highly improbable scenarios.
When Russia invaded Afghanistan, they invaded the whole country, and didn’t have a Ho Chi Minh Trail to contend with. Who won the Soviet – Afghan War, Richard?
@6 Geeeezuzzzz Chrisssmas — now klake is a general? and is going to tell us how it’s done? Hey dimbulb, half the armies that fight LOSE their fucking war! You know … 1 winner, 1 loser? Here’s another news flash for ya: You don’t win just because you put soldiers on the field. Tell us your plan to win an urban guerrilla war against an indigenous force fighting in their own cities and towns? General Paulus wants to know, too.
Bush’s references to Syria and Iran were deeply disturbing. He sounded for all the world like a man planning to expand the war in Iraq to two more countries. He talked about moving an aircraft carrier force within range. This is insane.
The General has a good visual aid for you here:
http://patriotboy.blogspot.com/
This is simply the Nixon playbook redux, and it won’t work this time either. I hate to be such a pessimist, but how many more American lives do we have to throw away to re-learn the same things my generation’s lives were thrown away to learn?
Keep dumpin’ that chum, troller.
Want to know what happens when you endlessly bash soldiers’ heads against stone walls? Read the history of World War 1.
Wow, MTR gets dumped pretty pronto.
Sally Quinn is right on:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....01417.html
Of the immoral choices we have, getting out now is the least immoral.
A mes amis, dans la Dien Bien Phu . . . .
Oooops, sorry. Friends, the French could have won in Viet Nam during 1954 had they committed more troops, invaded the North & launched an amphibious invasion at the Port of Haiphong & taken out . . . .
Ooooops, sorry. Now, when John O’Neill (king of the Swift Boat Liars) stated that Sen. Kerry could not possibly have spent Christmas in Cambodia, none of the Swift Boat Liars could have known that their king was on a Nixon Oval Office recording (kept away from Rosemary Wood) telling the Crook-in-Chief that the king of the Swift Boat Liars had been in Cambodia!!!!!!!!! And these dopes don’t even twitch as they try to peddle this bullshit.
Some have said that Bu$h xliii looked nervous & red-faced this evening. Whatever could be the problem? coke or jack?
klake @ 5: most readers here can tell that you’re an idiot & a sycophantic rethuglican, but just to drive a few silver stakes into the heart of your dumbass comments—-several generals have commented on Bu$h xliii’s plan & basically, in a “general” sort of a way, pointed out that it SUCKS; then the cheerleader-in-chief retired them & appointed some new guys, especially an airdale type admiral to begin what may look a lot like “interdiction” raids into Iran & Syria; the soldiers & marines on the ground in Iraq have told, what’s his name, that LtCol???, you know, Oliver North, that they don’t need no more stinking troops on the ground in the belly of the beast–they need Iraqis who want to take charge of their own country.
And now I, too, remember–we could have “won” (like maybe second prize, hunh?) in Viet Nam if the Arvin had just been a little more interested in their own country.
NOW, top secret this: the British have a Harrier group @ Kandahar Air Facility in Afghanistan–take a look at the map & tell me if Goldy or myself or anyone else needs to be a general or an admiral to see how the “backdoor” to Iran is soooooo closed.
Bugs Bunny would describe you as a maroon & that would be a complement.
Harry @19,
Yeah, I kinda-sorta accidentally deleted an MTR comment. My finger slipped. But it deserved to be deleted, as it was entirely and intentionally off-topic.
At some point I’m just going to deputize a couple regulars and give them the power to clean up deliberately destructive trolling.
“House Passes Minimum Wage Increase
By DAVID ESPO, AP
WASHINGTON (Jan. 10) – The House voted to raise the federal minimum wage … to $7.25 an hour, as … Democrats marched briskly through their 100-hour agenda ….
“‘For 10 years the lowest-paid Americans have been frozen out,’ said Rep. George Miller of California, berating Republicans who had refused for years to allow a vote on a stand-alone minimum wage increase. …
“‘The small businessmen we are trying to help for the most part are little guys,’ countered Rep. Howard McKeon, R-Calif. ….
“All 233 Democrats voted for the minimum wage measure, along with 82 Republicans. All 116 votes in opposition came from Republicans. …
“Inflation has eroded the minimum wage’s buying power to the lowest level in about 50 years …. ”
Quoted under Fair Use; for complete story and/or copyright info see http://tinyurl.com/y926dl
Roger Rabbit Commentary: If small business owners are “little people,” as Rep. McKeown asserts, then they wouldn’t owe any inheritance taxes, would they? Hey, if being worth over $2.5 million qualifies as a “little people,” then I want to be a “little people” too.
On second thought … after thinking about it … I don’t think I really want to be a “people.” I prefer to stay a rabbit. People are fucked up.
You’ve got it all wrong Goldy. Iran and Syria are in the Middle East and Cambodia and Laos are in Southeast Asia.
There is nothing similar about them!
Apparently Rep. McKeown thinks 479,000 workers should try to live on the 1992 minimum wage because they’re so much better off than the small business owners who employ them …
This fucker Bush is insane.
He and his pals want to BLOW UP THE FUCKING WORLD.
Been nice knowing you all…
…EXCEPT…
…klake, MtR, anti-lib, theevilfuckingchristianistbitch, puddybutt, et al.
Am I being banned? Great ! ! !
LMAO…
Mark @ 23:
But, but, but . . . all 4 of those nations are right next door to countries that the USA invaded. And they are inhabited by people who speak exotic languages that most Americans can’t even spell. And most of those people have really weird names, and all of them think that their, shall we say 6,000 year old cultures may have a few more merit badges than the occupants of the USA may possess (if I wrote 10,000 year then the Grand Christian Conservative Coalition would have to attack this post, in force, since the whole universe is only like maybe 6,100 years old). And they also have the bad luck to prefer forms of government that may not venerate corporations. They also have the foul penchant to place their faith in religious beliefs that do not even resemble Christianity and, in fact, may actually view the dominant religion(s) of the USA as heretical, pagan & heathenish. And the foods they eat, blecchhh, it is not even printable to describe their daily fare–lambs, goats & vermin are the high points.
Actually, Laos & Cambodia viewed in the context of Iran & Syria have a great deal in common. But the main thing they have in common is that George W. Bush XLIII can’t point to a fucking one of them on a goddamned globe.
Look, GWB’s strategy has to pass muster with Statesman Dimbulb. Nuthin’ gets by the rigid analysis of her fertile mind. So you guys will be heard…
Well, finally MTR got it right where he deserves it…a firm boot in the ass! (see post 21).
I watched Bush tonight. I agree with Howard Fineman of Newsweek, he looked scared.
“Jan. 10, 2007 – George W. Bush spoke with all the confidence of a perp in a police lineup. I first interviewed the guy in 1987 and began covering his political rise in 1993, and I have never seen him, in public or private, look less convincing, less sure of himself, less cocky. With his knitted brow and stricken features, he looked, well, scared. Not surprising since what he was doing in the White House library was announcing the escalation of an unpopular war.”
You can find the article here.
As for MTR getting the boot, how about the same for auntieliberal/JCH?
Frightening.
This is beyond belief. In anything other than our system or a dictatorship, someone would have removed this man. Even the Soviet System provided baby sitters for Breshnev and we brough Howard baker in to baby sit Reagan.
The issue is NOT whether to withdraw or strengthn the forces, the issue is that our l;eader is obviously inco0mpetent. He can do a lot of damage in 2 years.
What are the alternatoves”
1. Muddle through
Really? With the metally diabled president holding the red button? This is not just a issue of iraq, he could screw up the whole world.
2. Impeachment
Slow. is the nation ready? can you impeach someone for being too stupid?
3. Caretaker
Where in hell is the responsible leadership of the Republican party? Surely, there must be some adult who could quietly step in and run the White House.
I got news for ya goldy. This is my blog. I can hijack any conversation any time and usually do. My posts generate far more traffic than the shit you write.
Richard Pope had the audacity to say
“the current MISSION is undefined. And almost everyone in the US is realizing that.”
TRAITOR!!!!!!!!
This mission of the GREATEST.PRESIDENT.EVER is so well defined, your pinko-loving ass cannot see the VICTORY from the IEDs!!
GOD’s President has drawn a line in the sand NO MORE SHALL YOU KILL!!
And he is going to send more troops to be killed to back that up!
SUPPORT OUR TROOPS!!!! SIR!!!!!
With more troops, GOD’s President has wisely DECIDED that the ratio of dead troops to active troops will decrease!
Why are you a TROOP HATER MR. POPE!
Thank the CHRISTIAN GOD that GEORGE W BUSH is the DECIDER! And communists and pathetic annual candidates like MR POPE are not in control of GOD’s AMERICA!
FAITH! UNQUESTIONING FAITH is the answer! In Republicans we TRUST!
GOD BLESS AMERICA, WHEREVER GWB LEADS US!!!
MTR, LSoS, Pussybud @ 31:
What are you smoking? What drugs has your psychologist got you on?
What a fucking jerk. This is the last time I will address you. Pay your debt and find somewhere else to leave your shit.
What a fucking moe-ron.
32:
Wow. Nice piece of parody.
ROFLMAO.
36:
No parody. I am neither liberal nor conservative. I believe there were good reasons to invade Iraq. I did not believe the silly claims Bush made about WMDs, etc, but there were other, more important strategic goals described will by Ken Pollack in The Gathering Storm. I was stupid enough to assume SOMEONE, hopefully Bush, had better reasns for the invasion and a real strategic vision.
I was wrong.
Bush did invade because he was convinced that Saddam had nukes, super cannons, the ultimate virus, and .. I guess death rays. His perspicacity rivals that of Jerry Falwell.
Like John McCain, I am frightened of the loss to the US and the world of a defeat in Iraq.
BUT … this simple minded guy is simply, clearly and frightingly way over his head. I have no more confidence in his ability to function as Commander in Chief than I would in having him perform brain surgery,
WHO is in this group he claims to consult with? WHAT have they really told him? CAN they speak freely in the Oval Office? HOW can the wisdom be so different from that of every other source I can find???
The issues are much worse than JUST Iraq, HAARETZ, the Israeli newspaper, has been running panic filled, depressing pieces on Rice’s failure as a diplomat. She seems ot have no ideas, no leadership skills. Clearly she did not read or understand the Study groups’ recommendations about the US providing leadership OR she is follwoign the orfers of an incompetent.
This is no longer a partisan issue. We are all, together in deep do-do. Bush is simply and clearly unfit for office. If you are a Republican the issues are even more clear. Nixon did great harm to his party. Bush’s legacy to his party may be the best dream of the liberals. For the liberal side, it does no good to agenda for social welfare if Bush leaves us all with a debt and heritage that is dismal.
Now is the time for all loyal Americans to band together behind what we all treasure. Someone needs to babysit the teenager before he does something really bad.
Steven @ 37:
I am so sorry. In my post at 36 I meant to reference post 34 by Conservativesfirst. Again, I am very sorry.
Your posts were well written.
I think the leftest scum ‘My Left Foot” meant me.
I was @ 32.
Now I am @ 34
I hate change.
God Hates change!
GWB hates change!
And I really HATE you more coherent message!
Especially the “I am neither liberal nor conservative” Blah.
RepublicansFirst!!!!
Remember that.
Only way you can keep GOD in your heart.
Klake at 5: “Goldy when are your friends in Seattle going to support the troops by joining the military?”
Gee, I’m a bit too old now to be kicking in doors in Iraq. I have trouble just getting out of bed in the morning and sitting up straight.
But I do have two children, ages 23 and 21. I will advise them to join the military and go to Iraq the minute the Bush twins do.
Hint: never buy stock in a company while the CEO is selling, and never join the military when the current Administration’s children are being kept far away from any possibility of becoming involved in actual fighting.
Why are the secretaries so violent in Iraq? Are their bosses mean?
32
2. Impeachment
Slow. is the nation ready? can you impeach someone for being too stupid?
In this case, yes. If someone drives stupidly and kills someone, they’re guilty of vehicular manslaughter. Saint King Dumbfuck has by virtue of his incompetence (at the very least) caused the senseless death of thousands of Americans and hundreds of thousands of Iraqis. Should he be allowed to continue to do so for the next two years?