Waiting for Gore

Gov. Bill Richardson of New Mexico was in Seattle yesterday, making his case to various constituent groups and power brokers. In between a speech before WA State Democratic Party committee members and a series of meetings with labor officials, he squeezed in a half-hour to sit down with me and some of my fellow local bloggers… a much appreciated opportunity to speak face-to-face with one of the many qualified candidates seeking the Democratic nomination for President.

In fact, if you look at his resume and experience, Richardson is arguably the most qualified candidate running from either Party — a sitting governor, former UN Ambassador and Secretary of Energy, who also served seven terms in the US House of Representatives. He has the administrative experience required of our nation’s top executive, and the legislative know-how to work with the folks on Capitol Hill. And at a time when our nation’s global prestige has ebbed to an all time low, he has the diplomatic skills and track record to patch up relations at home and abroad.

If Richardson could successfully negotiate with the North Koreans, he can certainly deal with the homegrown variety of warmongering crazies who sit across the aisle.

I’ve admired Richardson for years, and would be proud to elect him our nation’s first President of color. (His mother is Mexican.) And after having the opportunity to talk with him about energy, transportation, immigration, habeas corpus, health care and the Iraq war with a specificity few other candidates seem willing to engage in these days, I came away from our meeting more impressed than ever.

But, I remain uncommitted.

And therein lies the rub for Richardson, John Edwards and other Democratic hopefuls trying to break the lock Senators Barack Obama and Hilary Clinton seem to have on frontrunner status. The very grassroots and netroots activists Richardson might rely upon to generate the kind of buzz and excitement necessary to shift the playing field, at least locally, seem frozen in indecision.

Partially this is due to an embarrassment of riches… a diverse field of qualified candidates who, from an electoral perspective, nearly all stack up well against any Republican nominee. And partially this is due to, well… Al Gore.

Perhaps spoiled by last November’s big blue wave, I, like many of my blogger friends, remain on the sidelines wishing and waiting for a Gore candidacy. As much as I admire Richardson and the rest of the Democratic field, a President Gore would be immensely more satisfying in so many ways: ideologically, intellectually, emotionally and symbolically. A President Gore would be a signal to the rest of the world that America regrets the previous eight years, and would be the ultimate redemption for the man who won the 2000 popular vote and was possibly cheated out of the White House.

There are only two problems: 1) Al Gore is not running for President; and 2) he refuses to say that he won’t.

The result is to freeze supporters like me, and in so doing freeze the status quo in the race for the Democratic nomination. Slowly, the Gore faithful are flowing in dribs and drabs to the other candidates, but his refusal to definitively say “No” prevents us from unreservedly investing our passion and enthusiasm elsewhere.

We all expect that if Gore were to suddenly enter the race, the current dynamics — essentially a showdown between Obama and Clinton — would instantly change. By if done soon enough, the dynamics could also change if Gore were to announce that he would absolutely not seek the nomination. Such an announcement would be an opportunity for one or more candidates to pick up the enthusiastic support of a wave of party insiders and grassroots activists who have thus far remained on the sidelines. If effectively exploited, it could be an opportunity to catapult a Richardson or Edwards into the top tier.

But as long as Gore remains publicly ambivalent about his own presidential ambitions, he makes it virtually impossible for the second and third tier challengers to dramatically move up the field.

This is a clever strategy if Gore in fact expects to seek the nomination, as it prevents other challengers from gaining traction. But if in his heart of hearts Gore really has no plans to run, then he owes it to his supporters, his party and his nation to make his intentions absolutely clear, so that this race can play out as it will. I cannot speak to the rumor that Gore’s interest in running is in part fueled by his discomfort with the notion of a Clinton nomination, but I do believe that the unfulfilled prospect of a Gore candidacy makes Clinton’s nomination more likely.

In the meanwhile the current dynamics of the race, and the nature of how our media covers it, leaves capable, qualified candidates like Richardson flying way too far below the radar. Yesterday Richardson, the half-Mexican governor of a border state, emphatically came out against the compromise immigration bill, much to the consternation of Democratic leaders in Congress. And yesterday Richardson, the candidate with by far the most extensive foreign policy credentials, came out strongly in opposition to the supplemental Iraq war funding bill, bluntly stating that Congress should simply de-authorize the war. If either Obama or Clinton had stated similar opposition with similar language and specificity, it would have made headlines. But because Richardson is not considered a top-tier candidate, and because he has no swarm of bloggers to echo and champion him, the average voter has little familiarity with the positions of the candidate who probably has the best resume for the job.

If the netroots really want this race to be about issues, rather than just about personalities, we’re eventually going to have to stop waiting for Gore.

Comments

  1. 1

    emily littela spews:

    Gore’s refusal to commit one way or the other keeps the Dems. from peaking too early.

  2. 2

    ivan spews:

    Bloggers who purport to speak for “the netroots,” whatever that is and whoever is to decide, and who pontificate about what “we” will “have to do” get tuned out quickly.

    You speak for yourself and for no one else, Goldy. Report the news and don’t tell us what “we have to do.” Get to a fat farm and see if they can shrink your head a size or two.

  3. 3

    spews:

    goldy….”emotionally and symbolically. A President Gore would be a signal to the rest of the world that America regrets the previous eight years”
    it isn’t going to happen goldy. and it shouldn’t if the best you can say about him,and why you want him to run, is that it would be a big “I TOLD YOU SO” to the country and the rest of the world.
    ‘symbolically’…good grief!!!
    don’t you think it’s time to move on and perhaps, just perhaps, grow up?
    richardson really does have alot of credentials to his credit. he’s especially good at getting ex president’s mistresses ‘jobs’….oh, wait..he isn’t even good at that is he? the media found out.
    this is the kind of “honesty” you are looking for in a candidate?
    this just proves, once again, that you would vote for pinochet if he had a big “D” after his name.being dead wouldn’t stop you guys from voting for him…hell, it doesn’t even stop you guys from VOTING….

  4. 5

    Dave Gibney spews:

    Richardson is arguably more qualified than Gore. The Vice Presidency is’t all that much Executive experience.

  5. 6

    emily littela spews:

    UNICEF fell under attack this week when Syria formally protested the charity’s new Christmas card, which says, in ten different languages, “Let’s kill the Arabs and take their oil!”

  6. 7

    emily littela spews:

    re 3: You mean in front of his name don’t you. Are you really that unobservant?

  7. 8

    ArtFart spews:

    3 Hmph. Richardson must have a degree of potential credibility. Otherwise, why are you already trying to Swift Boat him?

  8. 9

    spews:

    Goldy, Clinton HAS stated that she’d like to ‘de-authorize’ the war.

    Which is a bullshit tactic anyway.

  9. 10

    emily littela spews:

    My prediction: Cheney will try to engineer a “Tonkin” incident this weekend and then attack Iran.

    But, as GWB once said as he was quoting Pete Townsend: Fool me once ………… uuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh…………………uuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh……….. Won’t git fooled agin!!!!”

  10. 11

    ArtFart spews:

    Did you read Goldy’s post, Ghost, or are you just in that great a degree of denial? Seven terms in Congress, ambassador (probably not just appointed because he did someone a favor, either), governor. Whaddaya want, lady?

  11. 12

    RightEqualsStupid spews:

    Why shouldn’t Gore run? He beat Bush – he can certainly beat the likes of womanizers Rompin Rudy or Newt the Hoot, or flip floppers like Romney and McCain. Walk in the park.

  12. 13

    Libertarian spews:

    ivan @2,

    Don’t be critical of Goldy. He doesn’t do journlism here. This blog, like most, is a place for online complaining and saying things that piss people off.

    No reporting goes on here. If you’re looking for news, just try any of the major newies’ websites.

  13. 14

    ivan spews:

    Libertarian @ 13:

    Goldy does plenty of reporting, and that’s when he is at his best, or would you rather forget Heck of a Job Brownie?

    But when he and other bloggers forget that they are just schmucks on the street like the rest of us, and go off about “the netroots,” which is about as meaningful as “white people,” well, I call bullshit on that and always will.

  14. 16

    vegan spews:

    a President Gore would be immensely more satisfying in so many ways: ideologically, intellectually, emotionally and symbolically. A President Gore would be a signal to the rest of the world that America regrets the previous eight years,and would be the ultimate redemption for the man who won the 2000 popular vote

    If the netroots really want this race to be about issues, rather than just about personalities, we’re eventually going to have to stop waiting for Gore.

    …bluntly stating that Congress should simply de-authorize the war.

    Amen!

  15. 17

    spews:

    art…..HONESTY.

    which is why many times even experienced people that have done that many terms in the senate or congress don’t get elected. people can look at their voting records.they know all the dirty secrets..or many of them.
    and ,often, that is like watching sausage being made.
    i think richardson is a fairly decent, smart guy.but his views on the war on terror are ridiculous to the extreme.perhaps, if it weren’t for that,and if i HAD to vote for one of the dems running he would be the top choice….but that isn’t saying much really.
    BUT…there is that whole dishonest doing favors that aren’t kosher thing…and that does bother me. do we want status quo? i keep hearing from democrats that “we” need a big change …which considering the animal we are talking about here…a politician…is unlikely anyway.
    frankly, i was hoping that the dems would put forth a candidate whose expiration date isn’t so OVER that he might be viable. and a good president.but, you guys just have such a lame “you’ve-had-to-listen-to-us-forever-already” pool of candidates….that i don’t think any of them stand a chance. certainly not anyone that is a clinton or has been “cootied-up” by a clinton.
    that’s clinton, gore, richardson right away…gone.
    i think if you are going to be honest, you and i both know that the american public is not voting for hillary. come on! who wants to listen to a women that sounds like every man’s worst nightmare or ex-wife? she’s shrill, not very savvy when it comes to people, and not very bright.
    ‘crass’ is the word i most often hear when i listen to democrats talking about hillary.
    edwards is an insensitive idiot. his wife is DYING, kids, and he has small children. he couldn’t get re elected in his own state to save his life and we are supposed to want to vote for a guy that puts his ego and vanity first…before his family???? yeah…all that self sacrifice would certainly make him presidential material. NOT.
    where are the great candidates you all promised?
    who are you going to run next? governor moonbeam? wouldn’t that make a great ticket with the “goracle”???
    and swiftboating??? come on art…i thought you knew better than that. isn’t that just code for someone being “shot out of the water” by the TRUTH???

  16. 20

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Forensic journalist Greg Palast dissed Richardson in his book “Armed Madhouse” for rolling over to the GOP vote fraudsters.

  17. 22

    ArtFart spews:

    Continuing our adventure in Iraq is accomplishing three things:

    (1.) Getting some of our soldiers killed.

    (2.) Having more of our soldiers kill other human beings, which they in the future will discover was to no legitimate purpuse, and which will haunt them for the rest of their lives.

    I sure as fuck hope we won’t be having this discussion another 15 years and 50,000 flag-draped coffins from now.

  18. 23

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Hey ghostie baby! Didja see me typing on HA last Sunday night while Goldy was talking on the ray-dee-oh? Are those black helicopters still hovering over your trailer?

    HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR

  19. 24

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    As a sure sign that gas prices will begin falling soon, Roger Rabbit has begun selling his oil stocks. Nobody knows the ground better than a rabbit with a pair of big feet!

  20. 25

    spews:

    Roger has so much fun coming up with his quizzes that I thought that I’d give it a try. Here’s a little quiz for the group.

    What do the following things have in common?

    christmasghost speaking of honesty.

    Republicans talking about election fraud.

    Neo-cons writing about religious faith.

    Right-wingers advocating personal responsibility.

    Enjoy.

  21. 27

    The blood of our soldiers is on the hands of the people who voted for Bush spews:

    HONESTY!!

    Is that what you really want christmasDEADSOLDIERSghost?

    Really? Are you, as a conservative, all about the honesty?

    You still get all giddy over Bill Clinton having extramarital affairs, but turn a complet blind eye to the truth of the DAY.

    Any of which, are far worse than Clinton lying to a Grand Jury about getting a fucking blow job!

    Grow the fuck up, you anti-American bitch.

  22. 28

    spews:

    art…..you seem like an intelligent thoughtful person. so i want to ask you something. how do you think world war two would have turned out if we had the same attitude of instant gratification back then, that we do now?
    soldiers and civilians being killed…that’s always horrible. war is horrible.there is no arguing that at all.
    BUT….we were attacked. more people died in that attack than in pearl harbor…and they were mostly civilians.my cousin’s husband would have been killed if he hadn’t been late to work in the towers that day.but, i digress.
    my point is bin laden and saddam were banking on the fact that america had become [bin laden's own words] a “paper tiger”. my family lived in the middle east so i understand fully how that statement alone means that we had ,and will have, a huge target on us until the terrorists are disposed of.period.
    the loss of life in this war is sad but name a war in the past that has had so few casualties?
    that’s war…it sucks, it’s bad but sometimes it’s really really necessary.
    vietnam was stupid…it was a waste. BUT, we had no right once we went in to fight “like a girl” by letting politicians with their foolish ears ever to the ground decide the battles and not the military leaders.
    alot of innocent people that were helping us were killed because we cut and ran.
    do you really think we should do that now?
    if you had your way art…would you pull out all the troops right now?

  23. 30

    ArtFart spews:

    28 You betcha. Compared to World War Two (or Vietnam, for that matter) Bush’s great attempt at being a “wartime preznit” is kind of like a Sunday ice cream social. One thing, though…we’ve now been engaged in this wonderful “war on terr’r” for considerably longer than it took to win WWII. There are a lot of reasons for this, but two stand out. One is that the rationale for the whole thing, aside from going into Afghanistan to get Osama (at which we failed) was based on false assumptions and a lot of outright lies. The other is that whatever the United States’ objective in this thing was, we’ve completely lost track of it. This definitely has a lot in common with that little party in southeast Asia. Beyond a certain point, we’re now fighting a war just for the sake of fighting a war. I don’t know if I can think of anything more stupid or evil.

  24. 31

    emily littela spews:

    Restricting the flow of Iraq’s oil and increasing our domestic “reserves” has certainly kept the price of a gallon of gas right up there, hasn’t it?

    But I guess that’s how free market capitalism works!

  25. 32

    emily littela spews:

    re 28: The only way we could have won the Vietnam war is by killing all the Vietnamese — North and South.

    The Viet-Cong WERE the people of S. Vietnam — if you count the peasant population as people.

    If you had been Elliot Ness, you’d have declared war on Chicago and attacked the city with full military force. You can’t kill flies with a sledgehammer. Learn it. Remember it.

  26. 33

    ArtFart spews:

    31 “Free market”????? WHAT “free market”? I don’t see any such thing. What decades of pandering (yes, by both parties) and “regulatory reform” have brought us is an economy in which oligopolies clamor at the shrine of politics for legislated artifices of advantage and monetary handouts.

    I’m personally convinced the objective was never to “release the flow of Iraqi oil”. Rather, Saddam was shipping too much through loopholes in the sanctions, and the United States of Oilmen intervened to shut off the tap. The longer Iraq doesn’t produce, the higher the price gets, and the more money goes into the pockets of the Bush Family’s oh-so-dear friends in Texas, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates. Think of how much richer they’ll get if Iran gets shut down as well, and I’ll give you three guesses about what the saber rattling towards Tehran is really all about. I’ll even give you a hint: It doesn’t have anything to do with centrifuges.

  27. 34

    The blood of our soldiers is on the hands of the people who voted for Bush spews:

    @ 29:

    I do and I did read:

    Learn to be honest and learn your history then you comment — intelligently.

    cDSg wrote: “ how do you think world war two would have turned out if we had the same attitude of instant gratification back then, that we do now?” It’s taken longer for Bush to fail in Iraq than the Democrats to win WWII on two real fronts! It’s not that Americans don’t have the will or stomach to fight a protracted war; it’s just that we don’t accept failure and Bush is a failed president and commander-in-chief. Just because Bush and the Republicans / conservatives – like you – talk tough, doesn’t mean you are tough.

    cDSg wrote: “ my point is bin laden and saddam were banking on the fact that america had become [bin laden’s own words] a “paper tiger”.” There you go again, putting out the tired ol’ bullshit lie that Bush keeps spewing. Learn to read – then comment. You should read the 9/11 Commission report where they totally debunked that Saddam Hussein and Iraq had ANYTHING to do with 9/11. More talk tough from a culture of crime and corruption lying piece of shit.

    The next piece of diatribe cDGs wrote was, well, **YAAAWWWNNNN** same ol, same ol. . .

    cDGs wrote: “ if you had your way art…would you pull out all the troops right now” When we have it our way, we will assess the situation, REALLY listen to the military’s and CIA’s recommendations, withdraw our troops appropriately and then go after Osama bin Laden in Pakistan. You dumb cunt.

  28. 35

    The blood of our soldiers is on the hands of the people who voted for Bush spews:

    Bush and the anti-American conservatives are playing right into the hands of bin Laden.

    The US getting drawn into Iraq just parlayed bin Laden’s desire to “slow bleed” the US just like they did the Russians.

    See, stupid, dumb-shits like christmasDEADSOLDIERSghost don’t know their history very well and what she does know gets revised constantly to fit the Revisionist National Committee’s daily talking points.

  29. 36

    Mark The Redneck KENNEDY spews:

    Speaking of there NOT being a librul media bias…

    Bob Shrum, who ran Kerry’s losing campaign has a new book out, “No Excuses: Confessions of a Serial Campaigner.

    In the book he relates an incident where The Breck Girl was asked his position on butt fucking where TBG replied “I’m not comfortable around those people.”

    I know there are some big Edwards supporters here at HA. How can you support a guy who is clearly “homophobic” (to use your term). If he was a republican, he’d be headed for rehab, and “spending more time with his family”.

  30. 37

    Mark The Redneck KENNEDY spews:

    I have but one big request for you moonbats…

    Puuullllleeeeeze nominate Gore for president. Pleeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaassssssseeeeeeeee.

  31. 38

    ArtFart spews:

    36 There a bit of a difference between “not being comfortable” around someone (a matter of personal taste) and working to make them suffer in return. I think it’s called “tolerance”.

    Not that I expect you to admit to understanding that, Mark.

  32. 39

    ArtFart spews:

    37 Why? You must thing your chant of “Clinton blow jobs! Clinton blow jobs!” will still work the way you think it did in 2000. (Hint: It didn’t. Think “Florida”. Think “Republican Voter Fraud, the First Episode”. Think “John Scalia Appoints A President”.)

  33. 40

    ArtFart spews:

    Uh, excuse me. I was asking Mark to think. Doubt that he’s done that since he had to pass his PE exam.

  34. 41

    The blood of our soldiers is on the hands of the people who voted for Bush spews:

    @ 37:

    Remember those words butt fuck, they’ll come back to haunt you!

    Get used to President Al Gore, the 44th president of the United States of America and the 43rd legitimate preisident.

    Hey, dating any crach whores lately?

    Baaa haaa haaa haaa.

    What a fucking loser, you can’t even come up with a single Benjamin Franklin to pay his gambling debt. (that’s a $100 bill, MTR. I explain it to you because I know you’ve never seen one before.)

    Loser.

  35. 42

    ArtFart spews:

    41 Ah….but remember, Mark’s a PRODUCER!

    Kinda makes Springtime for Hitler run through your head, huh?

  36. 43

    The blood of our soldiers is on the hands of the people who voted for Bush spews:

    For all you anti-American conservatives out there:

    Fitzgerald wrote in the 18-page memo, “Particularly in a case such as this, where Mr. Libby was a high-ranking government official whose falsehoods were central to issues in a significant criminal investigation, it is important that this court impose a sentence that accurately reflects the value the judicial system places on truth-telling in criminal investigations.”

    The Special Counsel said that the “deliberate” outing of covert CIA agent Valerie Plame was a very serious breach, “The allegations underlying this investigation were serious: that high-ranking government officials, in the course of responding to political criticisms of the present administration by Ms. Wilson’s husband, had deliberately, recklessly or negligently compromised her identity as an intelligence agent, posing risks to intelligence assets and operations.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18868887/

    Of course, HONESTY, is so important to that lying, anti-American sack of shits like christmasDEADSOLDIERSghost, Mark The Troop Hater, and all the rest of you conervative punk ass bitches.

  37. 44

    The blood of our soldiers is on the hands of the people who voted for Bush spews:

    Learn to readh ghost, click on the link above and discover your leaders outed a undercover CIA operative and destroyed a 20 year old undercover operation that really tracked WMD’s.

    You piece of shit.

  38. 45

    michael spews:

    I thought Gore said he wasn’t running? I’m sure I heard him say he wasn’t running.

  39. 46

    spews:

    foolio @41…what are “crach whores”????
    there’s that whole reading thing again.
    it’s not like it’s a typo toots….are you going to tell me that c and k are right next to each other on the keyboard?LOL.
    TOO FUNNY FOR WORDS……..

  40. 47

    ArtFart spews:

    Well, “crash whores” might a good term for opportunists who’re maneuvering to profit from our impending economic meltdown. You know, like whoever it was who took out all those options on airline and hotel stocks right before 9/11.

  41. 48

    spews:

    art…..so you really didn’t answer my question.
    i am asking YOU not a cadre of pollsters what YOU would do with the troops right now.
    how hard is that to answer?
    geez…are you running on the dem ticket because you are starting to sound like them:
    “um..first i would evaluate the situation [do nothing] then i would talk to people [do nothing ] then i would get some ex generals on my side [CYA moment photo shoot]…” ad nauseum
    as far as how long it’s taking. there is that whole instant gratification thing again. and when you started out by saying there are a couple of reasons for that…..i thought, for a moment, that we were going to have a moment of clarity. but no…..sadly.so i will throw you a bone and give you a couple of reasons.
    islamo fascists come from alot of places…not just one country.
    they are nuts…think suicide bombing. think what we had to do to stop the japanese…..
    politicians are fighting the war after listening to pollsters not generals.
    and in this day and age the terrorists have access to alot of info they wouldn’t have 60 years ago. like what the american people [or crazy liberals posing as the american people...think mc dimwitt] are “thinking”….they have made no secret about it. they just keep saying “keep bombing and the “american people” will lose their stomach for it. it’s not the american people that have lost their stomach for WINNING it’s a few loud liberals that ,if they lived in any of these same countries they are always sucking up to, would have been shot for their opinions.
    and art, make NO MISTAKE about it. this IS about WINNING.
    we are in the war [and if you disagree fine...but hillary voted for it and she saw the intel where does that leave you?]and is there anything more stupid than to be in a war and not try to win?
    look…war is horrible. if i had my way i would have used the CIA up the wazoo and people like saddam and bin laden would have had “accidents”….but sadly, clinton did pull the teeth of the CIA during his tenure.he also turned down grabbing bin laden on several occasions and why???
    because it would have been “icky”? it wouldn’t have been that photo op moment? it would have pissed off his peeps the chinese?
    you pick…any of them are valid.
    you seem a reasonable man. and make no mistake…i don’t like war anymore than you do. no sane person does. but what if we hadn’t stopped hitler? how many more millions would have died? and the japanese death camps were as bad. once again…how many would have died?
    and if you think hitler was bad then why don’t you check out what the number one selling book is in the middle east? these people were on hitler’s side for a reason AND in case you haven’t noticed they have alot of time on their hands, not many brain cells and nothing to do with the few they have. but one thing they do have is a long long memory.
    they are still talking about the crusades for cripes sake….so why didn’t they bomb france and england instead of us? you have to ask yourself these questions! what do they want? why did they attack us? what will stop them?
    if you haven’t lived in the middle east [or done business there] i know it’s hard to comprehend this sort of thinking. the rationale behind 9/11.
    my opinion? they won’t stop. they attacked us because we have backed israel, and we are the big dogs on the block. their mindset is no different than the street gangs in LA…..they gain prestige by going after us.
    so what would you, art, do to stop them?
    that’s what i really want to know.
    i just made you president and you have complete control. what’s the first thing you would do?

  42. 50

    spews:

    art @47…oh you so disappointed me! really this???
    “Well, “crash whores” might a good term for opportunists who’re maneuvering to profit from our impending economic meltdown. You know, like whoever it was who took out all those options on airline and hotel stocks right before 9/11.”
    conspiracy theories? was it “the jews” art? that’s what the islamo fascists want us to believe.
    what economic meltdown? the economy is better than ever, unemployment is way down…what are you talking about?
    and art…IF there were a change in the market in the future…that would be different from anytime in the past how? i didn’t realize that the economy and market were set in stone and unchanging.you mean all this time the market was over 12,000 and i didn’t even know? since when?
    are you going to link it to global warming next? gawd…that damn sun of ours sure does cause alot of trouble!
    good grief!
    fear mongering is an ugly thing ,art,especially when it is based on no facts at all.
    we know who wants to kill us ALL…that’s no mystery. but instead of staying focused on that…you are now looking into your crystal ball because “the economy is gonna crash,man”
    number one…where on earth do you get this stuff?
    and number two…don’t you think a nuke landing here in the states would be alot worse than a bad economy????
    perspective is a very good thing………

  43. 51

    spews:

    right…i would be happy to. i have thought all along that the military would be alot better off using middle aged crabby women to hunt down terrorists.
    for many reasons.
    but…i am too old …they won’t take me!
    did you ever read that funny thing floating around the web that said why? i’ll try and find it….even you will laugh.
    and that’s saying something!

  44. 52

    ArtFart spews:

    48 You really can’t read, can you? Look at the first two words of post number 30. Isn’t that clear enough. In case it isn’t:

    YES, GOD FUCKING DAMMIT, YES, YES, YES. I WANT TO SEE THE TROOPS BROUGHT HOME NOW AND THIS DISGUSTING CHARADE BROUGHT TO AN END. THE WAR IS ALREADY LOST. GET IT?

    You’re an idiot. Have a nice weekend.

  45. 53

    spews:

    art…before you take your toys and run home [like a wet smack i might add]….why don’t you really answer the question? the whole question?
    you know what they say about people that scream and yell obscenities when asked a question?
    they are WRONG …and they know it.
    try answering thoughtfully, logically and sensibly.
    what would you really do? just bring the troops home and then what art? let the kurds be murdered like they were before?
    how about israel? shall we just nuke them ourselves so we can try and make friends with the terrorists?
    do you think that would be enough,art?
    you don’t like the war [here's a hint for you....NO ONE DOES] but we are in it NOW. you can whine and stamp your feet all you want…..but we are in it. and you have to deal with that.
    and art…the war is hardly lost. you need to read a little history and maybe even think about those old sayings ‘it’s always darkest before the dawn” and “the harder you work the luckier you get”
    you guys like bumper stickers…..i thought maybe you could grok the fullness if i spelled it out for you in simple language even you could understand.
    and here i thought that perhaps, just perhaps, you could actually think for yourself.
    wrong again….
    but if i ever need a guy to scream obscenities like a screaming nellie…i will definitely pick you.
    gawd….how simple can someone be????
    BTW…unless the dems come up with better answers…real solutions instead of tattling and finger pointing….if you think ANY of them will be elected president…you are sadly mistaken.
    americans have proven over and over that they don’t trust democrats when it comes to national security for a reason…..YOU just happen to be today’s poster child for that sentiment.

  46. 55

    spews:

    whew…i can’t believe i missed this GEM before…
    art said “Think “John Scalia Appoints A President”

    i didn’t realize that we had a judge on the US supreme court that was named john scalia!!!
    who knew!
    if you don’t even know who the judges are on the supreme court why should anyone listen to your inane opinion on anything?
    if you don’t even know their names how do you know they “appointed” anyone?
    good god…”another mindless drone for gore”.
    hey…that would make a swell bumper sticker for your subaru don’t ya think????

  47. 56

    WHERE THERE IS SHIT YOU FIND THE REPUBLICANS spews:

    CHRISTMAS SPOOK! YOU RANTING AGAIN? IT MUST BE FRUSTRATING TO BE YOU :)

    YOU SOUND ANGRY, BITTER, FRUSTRATED AND POLITICALLY WRONG AS USUAL, JUST LIKE MOST ANGRY REPUBLICANS SOUND THESE DAYS. 72 PERCENT OF AMERICANS BELIEVE THAT AMERICA IS HEADED IN THE WRONG DIRECTION WITH THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION ‘LEADERSHIP’

    IF YOU REMOVE YOUR GHOSTLY HEAD FROM YOUR SPHINCTER YOU MIGHT SEE THE LIGHT. IT IS NOT SO SPOOKY ONCE YOU BECOME ENLIGHTENED.

  48. 57

    spews:

    “Senate Democrats are backing a bill that would grant new rights to terror suspects held at Guantanamo Bay, ”

    oh…need i say more, really?
    this is what the dems are doing. helping the enemy.
    gee…and i thought they were FOR the troops.
    HA!

  49. 58

    RightEqualsStupid spews:

    Monkeyface Bush says the war in Iraq is the “most important war of our time.” Yet none of the 30 or so Bush relatives who are of combat age are going to Iraq. Typical right wing chickenhawks.

  50. 59

    K spews:

    Rights are a bad thing, Ghost? John Adams defended the British soldiers who shot at the colonists in the Boston Massacre. Rights of the innocent and guilty are at the foundation of this nation.

  51. 60

    Mark The Redneck KENNEDY spews:

    Ya know what would be great.

    You moonbats nominate The Inventor of the Internet. Kick all the empty skirts to the curb.

    We nominate Newt, and tell the RINOS to go fuck themselves.

    Newt would win all 50 states.

  52. 61

    K spews:

    You keep on that internet thing, MTR. Then tell me what a good man Newt is. His past wives will no doubt agree.

    Why should he run the government he once tried to shut down?

  53. 62

    Broadway Joe spews:

    Goldy, I have one issue with this post: it’s not really going to matter who our next President will be (it most certainly will be a Democrat), ‘redemption’ will begin on Nov. 4, 2008, when America will speak with one voice and repudiate BushCo and the evil of neoconservatism once and for all. And shortly thereafter, the Chimp-who-used-to-be-in-charge will probably flee the country for the ranch he was reportedly looking into buying down in Paraguay.

    The irony (when it arises) of the Shrub exiling himself to a country notorious for harboring Nazi war criminals after WWII is almost too delicious. But I’ll also wager that Poppy himself will go down south and bring his dipstick son home to face justice for his crimes.

  54. 63

    Broadway Joe spews:

    Oh, Redneck. Uncle Newtie, the ultimate hypocrite, wouldn’t win 50 electoral votes, let alone 50 states. Anyone who would prosecute a President for lying about having an affair while having one himself isn’t worthy of being elected head looney at Western State, let alone lead a nation.

    Face it, you and your party are facing extinction.

  55. 64

    David spews:

    welcher@60;

    Newt Gingrich is an ethically and morally bankrupt serial adulterer. If this wasn’t enough of a credibility problem, he has already broken the ethics rules while in an elected position. Add to that his trying to work out a closed door deal so he could avoid punishment.

    So, of course you look up to him.

  56. 65

    spews:

    Mr. Redneck would like us to nominate Vice President Gore.

    One of the first requests he’s made that I can happily agree with. Especially as he seems to want the Republicans to nominate Speaker Gingrich.

    Oh, yes. Let’s all do Mr. Redneck a favor and nominate Vice President Gore. We could even see if Sen. Obama would be his running mate.

    Yes, we’d get to hear about how Mr. Redneck thought that Newt really won all fifty states, and the election results that were posted declaring Mr. Gore to be the winner were all because of a half dozen felons that voted illegally.

    Remember, the shiny side goes out when making your tinfoil hat, Mr. Redneck. Can’t let those space aliens suck out your brains now, can we?

    (Someone else take the next line, please.)

  57. 66

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @28 Hey ghost — how do you think World War II would have turned out if Dubya had been president instead of FDR, and America had reacted to Pearl Harbor by attacking Brazil?

  58. 67

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    ROGER RABBIT HISTORY QUIZ

    Here’s a little quiz for you wingfuck history buffs. No cheating now.

    Question 1: Who attacked America on 9/11/2001?

    [ ] 1. Al Qaeda
    [ ] 2. Iraq
    [ ] 3. Brazil
    [ ] 4. Walt Disney

    Question 2: Where were Al Qaeda’s bases?

    [ ] 1. Afghanistan
    [ ] 2. Iraq
    [ ] 3. Brazil
    [ ] 4. Disneyland

    Question 3: Where was Osama hiding?

    [ ] 1. Afghanistan
    [ ] 2. Iraq
    [ ] 3. Brazil
    [ ] 4. Disneyland

    Question 4: To destroy Al Qaeda and capture Osama, where should Bush have sent U.S. troops?

    [ ] 1. Afghanistan
    [ ] 2. Iraq
    [ ] 3. Brazil
    [ ] 4. Disneyland

  59. 68

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    It’s a damn good thing Dubya wasn’t president in 1941 or we’d all be speaking Japanese.

  60. 69

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @2 “You speak for yourself and for no one else, Goldy.”

    That’s not true. He speaks for me and 3.1 trillion other rabbits, too.

  61. 70

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @28 “my point is bin laden and saddam were banking on the fact that america had become [bin laden’s own words] a “paper tiger”.”

    And MY point is, if you think Saddam and bin Laden were working together, you don’t know your ass from a hole in the ground much less know anything about the Middle East.

  62. 71

    Cougar spews:

    RR, I doubt very much if anyone in the world would argue with you concerning CG’s intelligence. She/he/it has yet to post anything but wingnut drivel. I imagine her/his/its ‘life’ in the middle east was when he/she/it lived in Ellensburg.

  63. 72

    YOS LIB BRO spews:

    Newt would win all 50 states.

    LMAO!!!!

    THAT LOSER CAN’T RUN A LEMONADE STAND.

    JUST PAY YOUR FUCKING GAMBLING DEBT, WELSHER!

  64. 73

    klake spews:

    1. Roger Rabbit says:
    ROGER RABBIT HISTORY QUIZ REVIZED
    Here’s a little quiz for you Left Wing history buffs. No cheating now.
    Question 1: Who attacked America on 9/11/2001?
    [ ] 1. Al Qaeda
    [ ] 2. Al Goreaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
    [ ] 3. Dick Chenny
    [ ] 4. Gorge Bush
    Question 2: Where were Al Qaeda’s bases?
    [ ] 1. Afghanistan
    [ ] 2. USA
    [ ] 3. Mexico
    [ ] 4. Republic of Seattle
    Question 3: Where was Osama hiding?
    [ ] 1. Afghanistan
    [ ] 2. Iraq
    [ ] 3. Jim McDermott House
    [ ] 4. Canada
    Question 4: To destroy Al Qaeda and capture Osama, where should Bush have sent U.S. troops?
    [ ] 1. Afghanistan
    [ ] 2. Iraq
    [ ] 3. Republic of Seattle
    [ ] 4. Roger’s Burrow

  65. 74

    klake spews:

    Cougar says:

    RR, I doubt very much if anyone in the world would argue with you concerning CG’s intelligence. She/he/it has yet to post anything but wingnut drivel. I imagine her/his/its ‘life’ in the middle east was when he/she/it lived in Ellensburg.

    And your post don’t come off MOVE ON DOT ORG WEBSITE?

  66. 75

    spews:

    Sometime yesterday, I tried to post an answer to Ms. Ghost’s question:

    “how do you think world war two would have turned out if we had the same attitude of instant gratification back then, that we do now?”

    My answer got lost in cyberspace, but GBS (at least I think it was GBS) gave a good answer, which Ms. Ghost promptly ignored. It’s lost in the bunch up above, so I thought I’d repeat his answer.

    “It’s taken longer for Bush to fail in Iraq than the Democrats to win WWII on two real fronts! It’s not that Americans don’t have the will or stomach to fight a protracted war; it’s just that we don’t accept failure and Bush is a failed president and commander-in-chief.”

    Essentially, by the time we had been involved in World War Two for as long as we’ve been fighting this round in Iraq, the war had been over for months. We’d won, the parades were finished and the country was trying to figure out what to do next.

  67. 76

    spews:

    The election is 17 months away — why do we need to back one candidate now? I don’t want to settle to someone whose poll-driven political / image consultant has packaged up to sell to me. I want the best person to be our leader and I believe Al Gore is that leader.

  68. 77

    spews:

    “people of color”

    Goldy

    I want to object to this term as applied to Mr. Richardson.
    Is it something in his blood line? That smacks of Nuremberg and should NEVER be permitted. For that matter would you like to bet that none of the US prexies of southern persuasion had some slave or amerind ancestry? Why would I be skeptical of such a claim?

    If the criterion has something to do with socioeconomics or class background, then Bill Clinton, John Edwards, Richard Nixon, all seem to continue the American tradition of origins from the bottom side of society. AFIK Mr. Richardson has solidly middle class roots.

    What about Mexicans in general? Are they “colored?” I am not sure I care any more than I care about Thai or Korean or Iranians or Italians. The unfortunate fact is that our country owes a special and unique debt to two groups of people against who “we” have committed communal acts as horrible as those of the Germans against the Jews. Those two people are the African Americans and the Native Americans.

    This is NOT to say that Chicanos have not had to deal with prejudice … but there barriers are far more like the barriers faced by previous generations of folks who largely look like other Euros ..The “dirty” Jews and “dirty” Irish became modern members of the American bourgeoisie.

    Ifa nyone in our history has personified this distinction is is Seantor Obama. Many African Americans see Barack as a chocolate flavored piece of white cake. What distinguishes him from being just that, is the commitment he made to Chicago’s social work. Barack’s Kenyon genetics is less importnat than his marriage to Michelle, joining a Black church, and living the life. A very valuable example comed from South Africa where Jo Slovo, a Jew, was accepted fully as a member of the ANC. Bottom line skin color does matter here. Barack, unlike Jo, could not pass for Black if his dad had not been Kenyan.

    So can we TRY to keep away form code words like this?

  69. 78

    spews:

    klake

    Answers to questions

    Question 1: Who attacked America on 9/11/2001?
    [ ] 1. Al Qaeda
    [ ] 2. Al Goreaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
    [ ] 3. Dick Chenny
    [ ] 4. Gorge Bush

    El Qaeda
    Question 2: Where were Al Qaeda’s bases?
    [ ] 1. Afghanistan
    [ ] 2. USA
    [ ] 3. Mexico
    [ ] 4. Republic of Seattle

    Afghanistan, Germany, Saudi Arabia and the US

    next?

    Question 3: Where was Osama hiding?
    [ ] 1. Afghanistan
    [ ] 2. Iraq
    [ ] 3. Jim McDermott House
    [ ] 4. Canada

    Afghanistan

    Question 4: To destroy Al Qaeda and capture Osama, where should Bush have sent U.S. troops?
    [ ] 1. Afghanistan
    [ ] 2. Iraq
    [ ] 3. Republic of Seattle

    Afghanistan, Pakistan, Germany, Saudia Arabia