Comments

  1. 3

    Steve spews:

    And to think Klynical used to have game. He can’t even crack the top five anymore.

  2. 4

    Mark1 spews:

    Ah shucks Lee, I’m so flattered. Have an extra-special big ole toke with your morning coffee and neglecting your child, it’s going to be a busy week. :)

  3. 5

    spews:

    @4
    I had no idea that going to work every day was considered “neglecting your child”. That’s an interesting way to justify being a lazy ass.

  4. 9

    The Riddle of Steel spews:

    @7

    HAHAHHAHAHHAHA @ softball league….hahahaahh

    WTF? the queers need their own softball league now? for christs sake…….

    is gleeman the starting “catcher”?…or is he just the ball boy?

    oh man, the jokes could endless on this one….

  5. 12

    Mr. Cynical spews:

    Steve–
    I posted that old news about Pelosi’s jet just to get some votes.
    The Golden Goat is a Badge of Honor for us Constitutional Conservatives.
    Perhaps Joe Biden should be strongly considered?
    Or ObaMao?
    How about the kriminal Charlie Rangel??

  6. 14

    Steve spews:

    “for us Constitutional Conservatives.”

    heh- You must mean those Konstitutional Konservative Klowns. I’ve heard rumors about those guys. In fact, I started a few of them.

    Hey, you used to be a contender, Klynical! WTF happened? I suspect it’s that you lean on Rasmussen too much these days. Yeah, there’s simply just too much mindless cutting and pasting going on of late. For you, that’s just going through the motions. I haven’t lost faith in you, though. I’m expecting you to pick up your game as we get closer to November.

  7. 15

    SJ spews:

    Lee

    OH! I thought your Klingon buddy said the challenge was posted here. No wonder I did not see it.

    Anyhow …

    I suggest you talk to Darryl before you offer his services. I doubt Darryl would take on the role of referee for y0our 10K challenge. He might take that role on for a more rational challenge .. say a beer or a fiver. Even then I suspect he would want you and I to both state our reasoning.

    Somehow, I do not think you would be up to that. Have you ever had any stats classes?

    In the mean time, 1/3 of suggestions is still a lot less than 90% .. not that a poll done this way makes any sense in either case.

  8. 16

    spews:

    I suggest you talk to Darryl before you offer his services. I doubt Darryl would take on the role of referee for y0our 10K challenge. He might take that role on for a more rational challenge .. say a beer or a fiver.

    I emailed him but didn’t hear back yet. I will bet any amount of money you’d like, and if Darryl says that your comment makes sense, I’ll pay up. Otherwise, you owe me.

  9. 17

    Chuck spews:

    SMOKERS: THE COST TO SOCIETY?

    Lately, anti-smoking activists in pushing their controlling agenda, have become stuck on the cost of smoking and smokers on society. The anti-smoking industry, like parrots, now proports an “estimated” figure of $100 billion dollars annually in health care costs and worker lost productivity. This is a figure that is statistical guessing and cannot be proven in actual costs. There is another “estimated” figure of $65 billion, which comes from the Department of Health and Human Services (DHHS).

    Let’s take a closer look at some figures from the DHHS, 1990 statistics, and find out what is costing society money in health care.

    According to the DHHS (again, their statistics), tobacco use costs the health care system $65 billion; illicit drug use $66 billion; alcohol use $98 billion. According to those statistics, tobacco use is not the number one problem, not even number two!

    Looking at those figures, we’ll take the tax paid on the products used according to cost to the system overall.

    Tobacco use may cost $65 billion in health care, but it does not cause other problems. You can live, work, drive and play without impairment to your faculties. In fact, it has been proven that nicotine enhances performance. The figures in sick days and lost productivity costs of smokers is not provable. It may just be that nicotine being a stimulant that pushes smokers to really produce more, not less. Taking the tax base, cigarette smokers pay $16 billion dollars to the federal government. Going on to the state level, in California for example, smokers pay a 32% tax on each pack they buy. If we added all the states into the picture, smokers would far surpass paying in taxes what they cost society.

    Now we’ll take illicit drug use. Most people who use illegal drugs pay not a penny in taxes on those drugs. What they cost the system in health care is a total deficit, PERIOD. Not to mention the cost of the addict in social security benefits, unemployment, general assistance, etc. The burden here far outweighs anything a smoker may be perceived to cost society. It is also estimated that 25-50% of all the homeless have drug or alcohol problems. How much does that cost the system? To go one step farther, how much of the crime in our cities is caused by drug use and trafficking? How many homicides occur because of drug wars and profit making? If we “added” up all the costs of illegal drug use, the costs would make smoking look petty. The cost of illegal drugs to society should be the prime concern of our “health educators,” not smoking.

    Now we go on to alcohol. That costs the health care system $98 billion a year. The one positive is that there are alcohol taxes…but those taxes don’t even come near tobacco taxes. Yet the health care system must pay out more than tobacco, about 30% more (again, just basing it on health care according to the DHHS)! To go on, how much does it cost the health care system to treat abused and battered spouses, or children? How much does it cost the system not only in drunk driving deaths (which are around 30,000 per year) but the costs involved in all accidents caused by alcohol that each citizen must pay for? We must ask ourselves how much more in real lost work time and sick days does it cost the employer for the alcohol abuser (rather than the smoker)? Again, how much social security, unemployment insurance, etc., does the system have to pay for alcohol abuse? I think that the figures would make smoking look like a very minor wound, probably more like a scratch.

    The anti-smoking industry has done well to perpetrate a most effective hoax on the American public. The anti-smokers have fostered hate and lies to push their agenda. One also must realize that the anti-smoking industry must perpetuate itself to survive. The salaries of many thousands of people depend on this. How many controlists would be put out of work and burden the system? We all know that after the smoking issue, there is nothing worth attacking…except maybe alcohol. The sad thing is that they are probably taking away money best spent elsewhere for more important causes. Yes, we know, the smoking issue is the only problem America faces today. Tell that to the poor child whose stomach is empty, or the unemployed parent who can’t make ends meet.

    I have a perfect solution for those unemployed … we could steer them to the anti-smoking industry. There are plenty of jobs open to control Americans when it comes to smoking. It would seem that their pockets are bottomless thanks to government funding, not only by us all, but specifically in some states, by smokers themselves.

    When Americans realize that the smoking issue, as pushed by the anti-smoking industry, is nothing more than a mere boil on a body that is diseased, then we will start to provide solutions to the real issues that should concern us as Americans. On that same point, our elected officials should get off the anti-smoking bandwagon and deal with the problems that most affect our lives in a much more serious and immediate manner. Could it be that since smokers are a minority and are easy to beat down that so much attention is paid to this issue? One would think so, since the drug problem (which has nearly doubled since 1993) is not attacked as aggressively as it should be.

  10. 18

    Odie Cologne spews:

    re 12: So, Rangel got a few rent controlled apartments for cheap whereas President Cheney and his sidekick shrub are responsible for the deaths of hundreds of thousands of innocent people.

    Or, am I mistaken? Was it all Lyndie England’s fault?

  11. 20

    The Riddle of Steel spews:

    uh oh….looks like Maxine Waters will be the next one to go dooowwwnnnnn….

    The procession of political crooks continues….

  12. 21

    SJ spews:

    Lee …

    Hmm .. offering Darryl’s Holman’s service without his permission .. pretty cool that!

    In the meantime, my offer to debate you remains open.

    BTW, I am still curious .. have you ever taken a stats class?

  13. 23

    rhp6033 spews:

    # 12: “I posted that old news about Pelosi’s jet just to get some votes.”

    To get some votes for the Golden Goat award, or to secure some votes in the upcoming election?

    Or both?

  14. 24

    spews:

    @21
    In the meantime, my offer to debate you remains open.

    We debate all the time in the comment threads. What’s your point?

    I’ve put $10,000 on the table here, and all you need to do is have Darryl tell me that your comment makes sense. That’s all. But your comment was total nonsense and you know it. Just be a man and own up to it.

    BTW, I am still curious .. have you ever taken a stats class?

    No, I haven’t. Yet my job requires me to have a very good understanding of statistics (I often have to work with PhD’s in mathematics in order to verify that analytics software works properly). I taught myself algebra in elementary school. I aced the math SAT’s and I finished two years of college-level calculus in high school. Understanding how to interpret an online survey isn’t that fucking hard.

    Well, not for me it isn’t.

  15. 25

    The Riddle of Steel spews:

    cmon you two…we all know neither of you can afford to unload $10k….

    that is, unless you are TEH EVUL RICH!! YOU NEED TO BE TAXED NOWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!!!!

  16. 26

    SJ spews:

    Gee Lee

    I am glas you “aced” your SATs.

    As for Darryl, YOU offered his services. I suggest you ask him if he wants to do this before you swallow all that foam.

    State are funny things .. I have been relearning them from a Bayes POV. What a difference.!

  17. 27

    spews:

    @26
    As for Darryl, YOU offered his services. I suggest you ask him if he wants to do this before you swallow all that foam.

    I suggest you make sure your comments make sense before you back them up with bravado.

    Are you willing to bet me or not?

  18. 28

    spews:

    @26
    If you’re so worried about Darryl being involved, let’s try something else. You can choose any person in the world with a college degree in the sciences, math, or engineering and see if they think that your comment makes sense.

  19. 29

    SJ spews:

    Lee …

    You will let me choose and then, based on that choice you will up for 10k dollars?

    Hmmm ….

    Why do I doubt your commitment?

    BTW,

    I am not worried about Darryl, I just think you are a bit silly to offer his services.

    More importantly, why not just tell us .. given you high grades on AP exams and grade school success with algebra, how you would calculate the percent of users supporting MJ vs the percent supporting other ideas?

  20. 31

    The Riddle of Steel spews:

    yes, this little lovers quarrel is indeed boring.

    Instead of betting the $10k that we all know neither of you can afford. Why not make the wager 3 hours with a skanky hooker – to be paid for by the loser.

  21. 32

    spews:

    @29
    You will let me choose and then, based on that choice you will up for 10k dollars?

    Yes, and that person has to explain your comment to me and admit it makes sense. And I will give you $10,000.

    I am not worried about Darryl, I just think you are a bit silly to offer his services.

    I offer his services because he’s someone who you and I both trust. That’s why.

    More importantly, why not just tell us .. given you high grades on AP exams and grade school success with algebra, how you would calculate the percent of users supporting MJ vs the percent supporting other ideas?

    You can’t from that website. There’s not enough data. The only thing you can calculate is the margin of people voting for something rather than against it. And legalizing marijuana had the highest margin. If the website admins chose to expose more of the internal data, you could calculate more (including a percentage), but it’s not possible with what’s available there.

    You claimed to be able to calculate percentages. When I asked you to show your work, your explanation was absurd, you made it possible for an idea to have well over 100% support. That’s why I’m confident that you can’t find someone with expertise in statistics who thinks that what you wrote made any sense. And I’m confident enough that I’m putting up $10,000.

  22. 33

    Michael spews:

    @20

    Gotta love those law and order Democrats. Republican’s don’t seem to mind white collar crime.

  23. 34

    Zotz sez: Puddybud is just another word for arschloch spews:

    @33: Quoting the report on the Delay / “Wrecking Crew” matter:

    “…a criminal syndicate run out of the leader’s office…

    Rangel was perhaps lax and a bit sleazy (we shall see), but no where close to the criminal antics of the Bushies, Hastert, Delay, et al.

    http://tcfrank.com/books/the-wrecking-crew/

  24. 35

    Michael spews:

    @34

    While it’s correct to say that Rangel’s no neo-con criminal, I think that goes a little light on him. I would note that this is getting taken care of while Democrats hold all the power.

  25. 36

    Odie Cologne spews:

    The cant and the rant from the right never ends and it is so predictable and repetitive.

  26. 37

    Zotz sez: Puddybud is just another word for arschloch spews:

    @35: The D’s standards are not in question. They are drianing the swamp.

    I’m just a little sensitive since the Rs and their trolls’ latest meme is equivalency. There is none. And we shouldn’t contribute in any way.

  27. 38

    Michael spews:

    Rs and their trolls’ latest meme is equivalency. There is none. And we shouldn’t contribute in any way.

    Yep! It’s law and order Democrats V. apologist for white collar crime Republican’s these days.

  28. 39

    Contemplate this, on the Tree of Woe spews:

    cliff notes: its OK for D’s to be crooked, because they are D’s.

  29. 40

    SJ spews:

    Lee

    You can’t from that website.

    Exactly. So why did you claim that MJ got the most votes?

    Or are you now seeing that as the data are presented one can not tell how many votes anything got?

    The only thing you can calculate is the margin of people voting for something rather than against it. And legalizing marijuana had the highest margin.

    No, this is only true is the categories are summed. Since there were only three MJ categories and over twenty welfare categories, the margin then your claim is impossible to verify.

  30. 41

    spews:

    @40
    Exactly. So why did you claim that MJ got the most votes?

    Or are you now seeing that as the data are presented one can not tell how many votes anything got?

    I was referring to the vote margin, which was their metric.

    No, this is only true is the categories are summed. Since there were only three MJ categories and over twenty welfare categories, the margin then your claim is impossible to verify.

    No, there were over 40 marijuana categories and redundant votes were added across the website.

    Have you found anyone willing to agree that your comment makes sense yet?

  31. 43

    SJ spews:

    No, there were over 40 marijuana categories and redundant votes were added across the website.

    When I was on the site there were three legalize MJ cats and 20 for welfare reform. What may have happened before that and even if the subjective lumping of categories was accurate is impossible to know.

    I was referring to the vote margin, which was their metric.

    First, I do not see a “metric” here at all. What I do see is a categorical ranking based on net votes. That ranking is obviopusly incorrect, as I said before.

    Have you found anyone willing to agree that your comment makes sense yet?

    As I said before,l it was your intent to get DH to do this. I would guess you volunteered him w/o his permission … a no/no for a professional.

    Then too, it was your challenge, not mine. I can reverse the offer .. why not ask Darrel what he thinks of your claim that MJ got the most votes?

    As for offering me $10,000 ….you want me to ask the other Darrel? One of my students??? My wife ??? My college roomate? Since your proposal would have given me the freedom to choose anyone I want, it was patently absurd ..

    So if Darrel or my wife says they agree with me, is it Ok by you if he and I split your 10,000?

    BTW, I think you have just one another LEGO award! Congratulations.

  32. 44

    worf spews:

    ob·tuse
       /əbˈtus, -ˈtyus/ Show Spelled[uhb-toos, -tyoos] –adjective
    1. not quick or alert in perception, feeling, or intellect; not sensitive or observant; dull.

    2. not sharp, acute, or pointed; blunt in form.

    3. (of a leaf, petal, etc.) rounded at the extremity.

    4. indistinctly felt or perceived, as pain or sound.

  33. 45

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    The Golden Goat is a tough one. For sheer stupidity, Delbert. For sheer incoherence, Puddy. For sheer obtuseness, Cynical. But I vote for “Lost,” because he’s smart enough to know better.

  34. 46

    spews:

    @43
    As for offering me $10,000 ….you want me to ask the other Darrel? One of my students??? My wife ??? My college roomate? Since your proposal would have given me the freedom to choose anyone I want, it was patently absurd ..

    So if Darrel or my wife says they agree with me, is it Ok by you if he and I split your 10,000?

    But they can’t just say they agree, they have to explain it as well.

    @44
    LOL

  35. 47

    spews:

    @43
    I can reverse the offer .. why not ask Darrel what he thinks of your claim that MJ got the most votes?

    I claim that it had the highest vote margin and I stand by that statement.

    And by the way, he spells his name Darryl, moron. How long have you known him?

  36. 50

    spews:

    @49
    The have to reproduce the calculations and claim that they make sense.

    Are you still trying to claim that your comment makes sense? Do you still really believe that 96% of the users on that site had voted for welfare reform?

    Just admit that your comment doesn’t make sense. Everyone knows it. And no one who you dig up will be able to explain the math that you used to come up with those numbers. You just pulled shit out of your ass and pretended it was true. Just own up to it.

  37. 51

    Steve spews:

    @43 “three legalize MJ cats and 20 for welfare reform”

    I’ve been puzzled by this oft repeated statement. I saw one list posted a few days ago and in it I saw the three MJ categories. I recall seeing only one welfare reform category. Is there another list somewhere, a longer one perhaps? After all, the list that was posted wasn’t very long. It’d have been hard for me to miss nineteen welfare categories, although I’ve been known to slice one into the woods now and then. Or is this some broader definition of welfare you’re using?

  38. 52

    spews:

    @51
    The site administrators have been consolidating multiple versions of the same idea into single ideas, although SJ was using a very broad definition of welfare reform in order to lump a few different ideas together.

    But beyond that, his math is completely wrong. He was adding up the vote margins for all of those different ideas and then dividing it by the total number of users. That’s not an accurate way of getting a percentage because the same person could have voted for multiple ideas (not to mention that the totals are margins and not actual vote totals). He could have easily ended up showing that welfare reform had over 100% support that way. All I’ve been asking is that he simply acknowledge that he got the math wrong.

    But he won’t, he can’t bear to accept the fact that he was wrong about this. And his continued attempts to deflect and pretend it never happened are hilarious – and pathetic.

  39. 53

    worf spews:

    @ 51 SJ is very confused on this point. On one hand, he claims that there are twenty categories about welfare reform one can vote on, although he has refused thus far to show that to be true. He then posted a list of forty key words to support his claim that welfare reform ranked higher than marijuana in the key words on the survey. his list showed welfare reform coming in two spots behind marijuana. He then seemed to conflate his list and the categories one can vote on.

  40. 54

    SJ spews:

    53 Worf Kingon

    No, I am not confused. At the time I looked there were three categories called Marijuana plus some other word indicating legalization.

    There were 20 categories that could be read as welfare reform.

    I summed the votes for both the 3 MJ and the three WR.

    Given the way the poll is being run, Lee is correct that the both of these sums could total more than 100% since unless the votes are merged there is no way to know whether any voter voted for more than one of the synonymous categories.

    Of course this concern is true for the MJ category as well.

    Bottom line, until someone merges ALL the ideas into what stats types call “bins” the poll is effin meaningless … like a lot of the “data” that Lee cites over and over again about the efficacy of medical MJ, lack of carcinogenicity of benzpyrene when administered as MJ, abuse of rights of terminal patients in Catholic hospitals …. yada yada.

  41. 55

    worf spews:

    Fine, SJ, you’re not confused, everybody else is. Which means you should have absolutely no problem making Lee 10,000 dollars poorer. So, since it is so patently obvious that you are right and we in the ignorant, unschooled hordes so terribly mistaken, TAKE LEE’S CHALLENGE. Unless you’re a chickenshit little weasel. Lee is willing to stand behind his assertions to the tune of $10,000. Man up, or shut up.

  42. 56

    spews:

    @55
    He won’t. He’s a delusional retard who doesn’t have the ability to admit his own errors – and he reacts to being corrected by accusing people of believing and saying things other than what they actually believe and say.

  43. 57

    spews:

    @54
    Given the way the poll is being run, Lee is correct that the both of these sums could total more than 100% since unless the votes are merged there is no way to know whether any voter voted for more than one of the synonymous categories.

    So then your comment (where you attempted to attribute specific percentages to various ideas) didn’t make sense, and I was correct for saying so. Wow, that wasn’t so hard, was it?

  44. 59

    spews:

    @58
    Finally! You now agree with me that claiming MJ was the most popular idea.

    This comment makes as little sense as the very first one. Maybe even less.

  45. 60

    SJ spews:

    Tk you alfonse :

    Finally! You now agree with me that claiming MJ was the most popular idea … makes as little sense .

    I am still impressed

  46. 61

    SJ spews:

    Didja check your poll today:

    1933 Proof of legal residency (to get welfare)

    1890 Put inmates to work

    1465 Legalize Marijuana