Nazis preach fascism; Bush administration practices it

This is what makes America great:

ORLANDO, Fla. — Fistfights broke out and police made 17 arrests Saturday at a neo-Nazi rally and march through a predominantly black neighborhood.

In khaki uniforms, tall black boots and red arm patches bearing swastikas, about 30 members of the National Socialist Movement were barricaded on one side by SWAT team members at the rally.

Of course, it’s not the Nazis who make America great, but rather, the fact that even Nazis have the same right to free speech as any other American… you know… except for VA nurses.

Sen. Jeff Bingaman (D-N.M.) has asked Veterans Affairs Secretary James Nicholson for a thorough inquiry of his agency’s investigation into whether a V.A. nurse’s letter to the editor criticizing the Bush administration amounted to “sedition.”


Laura Berg, a clinical nurse specialist for 15 years, wrote a letter in September to a weekly Albuquerque newspaper criticizing how the administration handled Hurricane Katrina and the Iraq Wwr. She urged people to “act forcefully” by bringing criminal charges against top administration officials, including the president, to remove them from power because they played games of “vicious deceit.”


The agency seized her office computer and launched an investigation. Berg is not talking to the press, but reportedly fears losing her job.

That’s right… Nazis are permitted to march near Disney World, but when a VA employee criticizes the Bush administration, they’re actually investigated for sedition. Sedition!

V.A. human resources chief Mel Hooker had said in a Nov. 9 letter that his agency was obligated to investigate “any act which potentially represents sedition,” the ACLU said.

Peter Simonson, executive director of the ACLU of New Mexico, told The Progressive magazine: “We were shocked to see the word ‘sedition’ used. Sedition? That’s like something out of the history books.”

In a press release, Simonson also said: “Is this government so jealous of its power, so fearful of dissent, that it needs to threaten people who openly oppose its policies with charges of ‘sedition’?”

Um… yeah. Unless, apparently, you happen to be some harmless Nazi.


  1. 3

    Puddybud spews:

    In another thread Roger Very Stupid Bunny asked what I did for a living. Sorry Dumb Bunny I have stated many times what I do. But being a dumb bunny, I am sure the reason you forgot is because your little brain has one mode. Procreation – Eat – Shit – Sleep. Repeat. There is no time to process rational thought or remember what people wrote. I bet you forgot what JCH wrote in January about his lack of flight fortitude! You need peeps like GBS to ensure your pea-sized brain get refreshed every day!

  2. 4

    Puddybud spews:

    Roger Superior Stupid Bunny @17. I thought Theresa LaPore was donk! Since she is donk, are you admitting she didn’t do her job? Reasonable people agree, when you are donk only partially performing your duties passes as a job well done!

    BTW what does this have to do with Nazism? If she is donk, she must be Nazi!

  3. 5

    Puddybud spews:

    Response to #6: On a preceeding thread RR just can’t fathom that Madeline Half-Bright was asleep while the NK radioactive metals were being processed. What Roger Dumb Wabbit forgets is the time one needs to process the raw materials. What Roger Dumb Bunny forgets to acknowledge (oh… yes in a cryptic way) is if the Cigar Administration was doing it’s job it would have removed the raw materials from Yongbon in 1994 as part of the agreement. But to Roger Very Dumb Rabbit, the means is justified because to his claim the materials were finally completed early in the Bush years while the cake was being stirred and initially baked during the Cigar Administration years!

  4. 8

    DA WO spews:


  5. 9

    DA WO spews:


  6. 10

    TheDeadlyShoe spews:

    Torridjoe you are dumb as a fucking rock. Pretending not to understand is the last goddamn refuge for people who don’t have a goddamn argument. You fucking know better than what you’re typing here. God!

  7. 11

    Dr. E spews:

    “Dr. E. the INS wants to talk to about visiting certain countries without their permission.”

    Huh? You mean USCIS? They’ve all been renamed since the DHS took them over, klake.

  8. 12

    Michael spews:

    @58 i meant the Rethugs in D.C., because they’re the only ones suppressing free speech right now

    Buzz. Wrong!

    [Washington State] House orders news releases edited for forbidden phrases

    Among the forbidden phrases: “Shell game.” “Lack of honesty with taxpayers.” “Tax-and-spend liberal.” “It’s not truthful to say this money is being put into reserve.”

  9. 13


    ludicrus @ 67
    “But it is equally foolish for the SS to squander its resources investigating cases where the context clearly did not advocate use of force.”

    On what basis does the context clearly not advocate use of force? There’s nothing that declaims the use of force; all we have is a written call to “act forcefully.” Again, the sentence in question:
    “We need to wake up and get real here, and act forcefully to remove a government administration…”

    Can those of us not responsible for providing security reassure ourselves that she was not advocating physical means to remove the government, and leave it at that? Sure. But I maintain that is a cognitive leap wholly unsupported by the text itself. To reread her letter, the obvious answer to whether she means “by force” is…possibly.

    The HR guy at the Albequerque VA is the one who dropped the word “sedition,” and the phrase “potentially represents” precedes it in his letter. Does her statement POTENTIALLY represent seditious intent? Absolutely.

    Charge her with sedition–or anything like it–and you’ve got a story. Until then, this is Much Ado.

  10. 14

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    DA WO @55

    Want to lick my marshmallow? For a good time, call 1-800-RRABBIT. Or, for a really exciting time, pick me up by my ears — who the hell needs a gun, I can do it with the razor sharp claws on my powerful hind feet! hee hee

  11. 15

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    We have our own Hitlers, Mussolinis, and Milosevichs right here in our own country, including the genocidal Ann Coulter.

  12. 17

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    “To ‘act forcefully’ means to use force.”

    Wrong, to act “forcibly” means to use force, to act “forcefully” means to act vigorously or energetically.

  13. 18

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    “To investigate this nurse for “sedition” – even if that is not the official charge – is absolutely ridiculous. Comment by Goldy— 2/27/06 @ 11:19 am”

    To put things in context, Republican militarists and ultra-nationalists have a long and sordid history of slapping the label “sedition” on any criticism of their warmongering.

  14. 19

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    dj — “forceful” is not the same thing as “forcible.” Advocating the latter is actionable, advocating the former is not. Besides, we’re already all under investigation as subversives; what more can they do to us? I’m sure Bush’s secret police monitor this web site. I’ve had low-flying helicopters circling over my house several times in the last two weeks … when they show up, I just step outside, flip ‘em the bird, and yell “fuck you, anti-American fascists!” I’m sure their cameras and microphones pick it up.

  15. 20

    Ludicrus Maximus spews:


    “many of the contextual definitions do not refer to action but to speech or expression”

    I think this is somewhat of a meaningless distinction. Speaking and writing are both forms of action, and that fact that I may do them “forcefully” doesn’t mean that they result in a use of force. If you are “a forceful speaker,” you are taking an action (speaking) but that doesn’t mean you beat the crap out of your listener.

    As for whether the SS would be foolish not to investigate, I agree that is would be foolish not to investigate a case where, taken in context, the use of “forceful” advocates a use of force. But it is equally foolish for the SS to squander its resources investigating cases where the context clearly did not advocate use of force.

    The point is that context matters a lot, especially given the different ways the term “forceful” can be used. In this case, I think it’s fairly clear the nurse was using the term “forceful” in the sense of “emphatic” or “assertive,” not in the sense of a call for the use of force.

  16. 22

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    Spin, spin, spin. Nazi Germany was a fascist country, not a socialist country. Buy a fucking dictionary.

  17. 23

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    I’m only a 10 1/2-lb. furry rodent who eats Stefan’s garden and shits on his lawn, and even I know the Nazis were fascists, not socialists.

  18. 24

    GBS spews:

    DA WO:

    Pronounced: “day-woo”

    Sounds like DA WO is a North Korean sympathizer & terrorist lover.

    He never served in our military. He’s like JCH, a tin soldier or bathtub sailor.

    What a pair of losers!

  19. 25

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    Since Bushco is throwing the Constitution out the window, let’s at least hope the people whose civil rights are being violated include the neo-Nazis.

  20. 26


    ludicrus @ 57
    actually, it DOES agree with me for the purpose of threshhold. First, note that many of the contextual definitions do not refer to action but to speech or expression. Secondly, if “acting forcefully” means “physically” even half the time (and that’s being generous to the term “often”), wouldn’t it be mighty foolish of the Secret Service NOT to investigate?

  21. 27

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    McDermott didn’t record the phone conversation, jackass. Someone else did, then gave the tape to McDermott. And it turns out the tape contained information that is very much of public interest.

  22. 28

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    “Roger and Gang did you say there was black helicopters flying over Green Lake … Comment by klake— 2/27/06 @ 7:44 am”

    So, klake — what I really want to know is — when the aliens kidnapped you and flew you to Alpha Centauri on a UFO, did they conduct sexual experiments on you? Just curious.

  23. 29

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    righton … i meant the Rethugs in D.C., because they’re the only ones suppressing free speech right now, except for the good folks in Florida who kicked the shit out of some neo-Nazis who had it coming.

  24. 30

    Ludicrus Maximus spews:

    TJ @52:

    Actually, it appears the English language disagrees with you, not Goldy:

    forceful — adj 1: characterized by or full of force or strength (often but not necessarily physical); “a forceful speaker”; “a forceful personality”; “forceful measures”; “a forceful plan for peace” [ant: forceless] 2: forceful and definite in expression or action; “the document contained a particularly emphatic guarantee of religious liberty” [syn: emphatic]

    Note the part that says “not necessarily physical.”

  25. 31

    Jack Burton spews:

    To “act forcefully” means to use force. What was “really meant” by those words can only be determined by the Thought Controllers on the left. (Otherwise, ALL violent crimes are Hate Crimes.)

    Fascism is GENERALLY characterized by government CONTROL of EVERTHING. That’s not even close to what the Republicans are all about.

    In my life, the “PC Police” have been far more intrusive than the actual Police. So who are the fasicists really?

    BTW: Do I get extra credit if call someone here a name? Just Wondering…..

  26. 32

    Pepper spews:

    Is “sedition” illegal in this day and age? It shouldn’t be. It would violate the First Amendment.

  27. 33

    DA WO spews:


  28. 35


    goldy @ 48
    “Advocating the use of force and advocating that we “act forcefully” are not the same thing!”

    I disagree 100%. So does the English language. You have written equivalent statements by any definition.

  29. 37

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    righton @30

    “If you are looking for extreme political parties that silence free speech you could look closer to home;’

    … look no farther than the GOP.

  30. 38

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    “The correct name for the Nazi Party is “National Socialist German Workers Party.” Does that sound more like Republicans or Democrats? Comment by Michael— 2/27/06 @ 7:07 am”

    Definitely more Republican, inasmuch as the GOP has been taken over by neo-conservative Trotskyites. Neo-cons are a variant of Trotsykite communism, in case you didn’t know, Michael. No, you didn’t know the GOP has been taken over by ex-leftists and commies, did you, you ignorant fuck?

  31. 39

    Goldy spews:

    TJ @45,

    Advocating the use of force and advocating that we “act forcefully” are not the same thing! Everything we say and write, we say and write in context. She specifically stated the means she was advocating… and none of them included violence. If we permit the government to take our adverbs out of context, then hell, why not send me off to Gitmo?

    To investigate this nurse for “sedition” — even if that is not the official charge — is absolutely ridiculous.

  32. 40

    Rev. A.A. Tappman: Anababtist spews:

    re 45: If you say something forcefully does that mean you are going to bite the person you’re speaking to? You lost the argument, torrid, don’t be liuke a Republican and keep twisting the words until they mean what you want them to mean.

  33. 41

    Rev. A.A. Tappman: Anababtist spews:

    re 42: So what’s your point in bringing to everyone’s attention that the Nazis included the word “socialist” in their title if not to prove that these right wing beasts are in fact socialists, which they are not. The word “socialist” was used to get the support of the common man without which they could not rule.

    It is a historical and philosophical reality that the nazis and the neo-cons are right wing fascist movements. Does the fact that neo-cons describe themselves as “neo-liberals” make you think they have more in common with Howard Dean than Bennito Mussolino.

    Your whole game ,Michael, is obfuscation and pretentions to intellectuality. Your obfuscations will only succeed on people who are like-minded, in which case you’ve won nothing except the relief you feel at the expulsion of hot air.

  34. 43

    Rev. A.A. Tappman: Anababtist spews:

    re 28: Under a true Socialist system the government owns the means of production. The German Nazis did not own the means of production. The means of production were owned by American and German bankers and industrialists. American bankers and industrialists, among them Prescott Bush, Gerge W.’s grandfather, profited from Jewish slave labor during WWII. Part of the Bush family fortune is based on the ill gotten gains of Nazi slave labor.

    Now,the thing that I have to say to you that is the Only thing about Prescott Bush that I think you will find offensive is that: By your reasoning, Prescott Bush was a Socialist.

  35. 44

    Michael spews:

    @36 Something along the lines of recording a private phone conversation without the consent of the participants.

  36. 46

    Libertarian spews:

    Might be a good idea to keep an eye on these Neo-Nazis: they’re not just frustrated little white boys with small you-know-whats. They might learn a trick or two from the Islamo-terroists and pull of something nasty in this country.

  37. 47

    Voter Advocate spews:

    But, maybe we can stop them from filing specious charges against voters.

    [Lori] Sotelo, the Mercer Island woman who wrongly challenged hundreds of King County voter registrations just a few days before last November’s elections, has inspired two election-reform bills in Olympia. The lead sponsors of these bills are two Democratic senators from the Seattle area who have taken seriously last year’s promises by Republican officials that Sotelo’s challenges were just a taste of what’s to come this November.

  38. 48


    Idiotic Michael:

    N in Seattle @ 23
    What was Jim McDermott found civilly liable for in court?

    I don’t recall, other than to note that it sure as hell wasn’t sedition. So WTF is your point, you moron?

    (and it’s under appeal, whatever it was)

  39. 49

    Rev. A.A. Tappman: Anababtist spews:

    “I have set this country going in a very different direction and it will be very hard to turn it back.” George W. Bush

  40. 50

    seadog spews:

    Goldy, I would like to see some analysis from your point of view on the recent UAE port deal. What do you think ? I think it would clarify a lot to your loyal followers.


  41. 51

    Voter Advocate spews:


    The Republicans have apparently given up on the federal investigation idea, now that we know it was Chris Vance who hid those 1600 ballots.

    Republicans are never prosecuted for their crimes.

  42. 52

    Donnageddon spews:

    “If you are looking for extreme political parties that silence free speech you could look closer to home; I think the commies have silenced more around the world than Nazis ever did. (how’s the chinese or cuban free speech movement doing?)”

    China? Cuba? Closer to home?

    righton, have you started drinking this early in the morning?

  43. 53

    klake spews:

    Oh, I’m not at all convinced that anything other than incompetance occurred in 2004, George.

    I just want to tweak the trolls who constantly accuse King County of being a political arm of the Democratic Party.

    It’s good to remind people that, had over 1600 ballots not been misplaced, the spin on that election would have been different.

    Comment by Voter Advocate— 2/27/06 @ 6:18 am
    Great report Dean Logan, but when did you say the Fed’s are showing up to complete that audit? Roger and Gang did you say there was black helicopters flying over Green Lake look for strange people that are hiding from Ron Sims. Dr. E. the INS wants to talk to about visiting certain countries without their permission.

  44. 55

    Righton spews:

    You could make a decent point of this without the Nazi allusion. If you are looking for extreme political parties that silence free speech you could look closer to home; I think the commies have silenced more around the world than Nazis ever did. (how’s the chinese or cuban free speech movement doing?)

  45. 56

    Michael spews:

    The correct name for the Nazi Party is “National Socialist German Workers Party.” Does that sound more like Republicans or Democrats?

  46. 57

    LeftTurn spews:

    The report on the Florida case failed to mention that all the Nazis involved were card-carrying republicans. All of them had “W” stickers on their cars. Nuff said.

  47. 59

    Cougar spews:

    Interesting Goldy, you wait until about 11PM to publish this thread and look at the %’s of neoCONS and trolls! What’s even weirder is that we are not even half way to the next full moon. Why are all of these Republicans and Vampires up so late? Sharkansky must have gotten worried about this past week’s number of comments here. During this past week HA has had an average of 162 posts per thread whereas unSP has had an average of 22! Looks like the wingNUT fringe is drying up even as we post, thank God!

  48. 60

    Anonymous spews:

    The first three comments on this thread show just how dumb Kevin Carns is. What a fuck up.

  49. 62


    Donnageddon notes:

    BushCo is investigating for “sedition” VA nurses that disagree with their policies, and Michael @ 3 goes immedeatly into “Clinton got a blow job” mode.

    And gets it all wrong besides. Tripp was investigated for wiretapping, because she didn’t inform Lewinsky that she was being taped. Not even in the same galaxy as sedition.

    Michael’s not only a neocon Bush-licker, but a moron to boot.

  50. 63

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Hey Mark the Redneck — do you enjoy paying taxes to encourage private companies to splash paint or diesel on coal so it qualifies for federal subsidies?

  51. 64

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    “A Magic Way To Make Billions
    “How lobbyists are pulling off a synfuel scheme with help from key lawmakers–and you’ll pay

    “Posted Sunday, Feb. 26, 2006

    “The wording is so bland and buried so deep within a 324-page budget document that almost no one would notice that a multibillion-dollar scam is going on. Not the members of Congress voting for it and certainly not the taxpayers who will get fleeced by it. And that is exactly the idea.

    “With Washington reeling from the Abramoff lobbying scandal and Republicans and Democrats alike pledging to crack down on influence peddling, with one lawmaker already gone from Capitol Hill because he traded favors for cash, you’re probably guessing this isn’t the best time for members of Congress to dispense a fortune in favors to their friends. Guess again.

    “Buried in the huge budget-reconciliation bill, on which House and Senate conferees are putting the final touches right now, are a few paragraphs that accomplish an extraordinary feat. They roll back the price of a barrel of crude oil to what it sold for two years ago. They create this pretend price for the benefit of a small group of the politically well connected … a select group of investors and companies will walk away with billions of dollars in tax subsidies, not from oil but from the marketing of a dubious concoction of synthetic fuel produced from coal and dependent on government tax credits tied to the price of oil.

    “In 1980, Congress enacted tax incentives … to spur the development of a synthetic-fuel industry. … When oil prices fell, Washington lost interest in creating a real synfuel industry … [b]ut the synfuel credit remained on the books … entrepreneurs came across it in the 1990s and saw a way to transform coal into gold. The coal can look and burn like regular coal. The IRS rule for transforming coal into synfuel—-and getting the tax credit—-requires only that the substance be chemically altered in some way. The alchemy that satisfies the IRS is a simple process: some plants spray newly mined coal with diesel fuel, pine-tar resin, limestone, acid or other substances—-a practice that industry critics call ‘spray and pray.’ Other operators mix coal-mining waste with chemicals, coat it with latex and blend it with untreated coal to form briquettes. …

    “Once a few pioneers started reaping the tax credits, it wasn’t long before plants using various techniques sprouted next to coal-burning power plants, which buy the so-called synfuel and use it as they would any other coal. Those synfuel operations were a far cry from … [w]hat Congress had envisioned … they were flimsy facilities that could be easily dismantled and moved to other locations.

    “Today about 55 such plants around the U.S. process 125 million tons of coal or, in many cases, coal waste from an earlier mining era. For owners and operators, the whole point isn’t creating a profitable new energy resource for the U.S.; it’s about collecting the tax subsidy.

    “Progress Energy Inc. of Raleigh, N.C. … reported in a filing with the Securities and Exchange Commission that in 2002-04 its synfuel-production losses added up to $400 million. No problem: the company claimed $852 million in tax credits, magically transforming a money-losing operation into a money-making business with $452 million in profits–courtesy of the American taxpayer. And that’s not all. Like other synfuel producers, Progress Energy can’t immediately use all the tax credits it mines because of tax-law limitations. As of Dec. 31, 2004, it was sitting on $745 million in deferred credits that it can write off against future earnings for years to come. …

    “Tax experts differ on how high oil prices would have to go to wipe out the full value of the credit, but most agree that if oil were to remain at recent peak levels, or climb even higher, few synfuel operators could claim the full credit. … With so much at stake, the synfuelers have pumped money into a campaign to preserve their tax break. …

    “Overall, TIME estimates, the synfuel lobby has spent more than $5 million …. The effort has got results. In recent years, the lobby has successfully turned aside efforts to revoke the IRS rulings on which the tax credits are calculated. It beat back an effort in the House Ways and Means Committee last year to send a bill to the House floor that would have virtually eliminated the tax credit. The bill’s sponsor, Lloyd Doggett, a Texas Democrat, called the tax credit ‘one of the worst tax loopholes on the books’ and described the synfuel industry as ‘basically a sham.’ Nevertheless, because of industry lobbying, Doggett’s bill has never made it out of committee.

    “Last November the lobby scored a remarkable coup. Buried deep in a bill called the Tax Relief Act of 2005, passed by the Senate on Nov. 18, was Section 559, titled ‘Modification of Credit for Producing Fuel from a Nonconventional Source.’ Section 559 … is written in the obscure jargon of all special-interest tax breaks–almost impossible to decipher …. At first glance, it looks like nothing more than a technical amendment to clarify some arcane section of tax law. But one clause offers a clue. It says the synfuel credit will be based not on current oil prices–the yardstick used in the past–but on ‘the amount which was in effect for sales in calendar year 2004.’

    “In 2004 oil prices were safely below the line to allow synfuel producers to claim the maximum credit. The stealth amendment would roll back the calendar. … The backdating clause was in a larger bill introduced in the Senate by Charles Grassley, the Iowa Republican who heads the Senate Finance Committee. It was inserted in the Tax Relief Act, which provides aid for Hurricane Katrina victims and sets new policies for tax-exempt groups. With so many higher profile issues at stake, the clause on synfuels sailed right through with no discussion. Many lawmakers, if not most, don’t even know it’s there.

    “When asked about the provision’s origins, Senate Finance Committee aides at first said they did not know, only that it did not ‘originate’ with Grassley. … Asked again by TIME to identify the author, the Senate Finance aide later wrote in an e-mail, ‘the provision originated as an amendment from Sen. [Rick] Santorum [a Pennsylvania Republican]. … Chairman Grassley accepted the Santorum amendment ….’ When contacted by TIME, Santorum’s staff had no comment. … Another Senate supporter of the credit is Orrin Hatch of Utah, the ranking Republican on the Finance Committee. …

    “… the battle over the provision is little more than a warm-up for the legislative fight that will take place in 2007. That’s when the tax credit is set to expire and the industry will seek to make it permanent. …”,00.html

  52. 65

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    From Newsweek:

    “It’s hard to keep up with all the anti-George Bush books … how to choose among the Bush-haters?

    “… [I]t’s more interesting to consider the anti-Bush writings by Republicans, conservatives, and erstwhile Bush allies and employees … they usually try to be intellectually honest, since the Bush presidency has forced them to grapple with their own belief systems.

    “With that in mind, here’s a brief guide to the Bush critics with pro-Bush backgrounds. … Here are three major themes in their work:

    “1. George Bush is no conservative. One new book worth a look is Impostor: ‘How George W. Bush Bankrupted America and Betrayed the Reagan Legacy,’ by Bruce Bartlett. Bartlett… is a conservative true believer. He served in the Reagan and George H.W. Bush administrations and is a respected conservative economist and policy analyst. … The central critique of Bartlett’s book is that George Bush has betrayed Reagan conservatism. …. [T]he book highlights the consensus conservative critique of the moment: … Bush has watered down the conservative movement beyond all recognition. The debate is no longer about what kind of government we’ll have but which brand we’ll choose: Republican big government vs. Democratic big government.

    “2. He’s a bad CEO. … Bush’s penchant for loyalty, political victory, and ideology got in the way of his appealing management theories. Ex-Bush officials from counterrorism adviser Richard Clarke to John DiIulio, the first head of Bush’s faith-based initiative, have made this case, but former Treasury Secretary Paul O’Neill did the most compelling job in Ron Suskind’s ‘The Price of Loyalty.’ … He claimed that Bush’s White House operation ignored the rigors of the business world it purported to emulate. … When Suskind’s book came out in 2004, Bush officials said they never listened to O’Neill when he was in the administration, so why should they listen to his critique now. In dismissing him so cavalierly, they made O’Neill’s point for him.

    “3. He was hellbent on war. Paul Pillar, the 28-year CIA veteran who most recently coordinated U.S. intelligence on the Middle East, argues in ‘Foreign Affairs’ that the president and his aides were so anxious to spread democracy in the Middle East they ignored intelligence that argued against an invasion or predicted a messy aftermath. Building on earlier criticisms by former Bush officials Richard Clarke and Rand Beers of the National Security Council and Larry Wilkerson of the State Department, Pillar … argues ‘[that] official intelligence was not relied on in making even the most significant national security decision, that intelligence was misused publicly to justify decisions already made, that damaging ill will developed between [Bush] policymakers and intelligence officers, and that the intelligence community’s own work was politicized.’ As for the postwar difficulties that many officials now argue could never have been predicted, Pillar writes that the intelligence community did assessments before the invasion that indicated a postwar Iraq … would rather erupt into a sectarian conflict between Sunnis and Shiites.”

  53. 66

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    From the New York Times:

    “The I.R.S. said yesterday that it saw a sharp increase in prohibited political activity by charities and churches in the last election cycle ….

    “The tax agency found problems at three-quarters of the 82 organizations it examined after having received complaints about their political activities …. The infractions included distributing materials that encouraged people to vote for particular candidates and giving cash to campaigns.

    “The agency said it was seeking to revoke the exemptions of three organizations but did not name them, pending an appeals process. Charities are generally prohibited from campaigning for candidates, although they can take stands on issues.

    “‘We’ve seen a staggering increase in money flowing into campaigns, and the question is whether all this money is encroaching upon and polluting the charitable sector,’ [IRS Commissioner] Everson said …. ‘We saw a disturbing amount of political intervention in charities in the last election cycle.’

    “‘You have the ever-increasing influence of money in politics and the fact that charities are subject to much less regulation than campaigns for parties,’ he said. ‘Those two things come together to create an opportunity that is at variance with what the statute limiting political activity by charities allows.’

    ” … Americans United for Separation of Church and State … has filed dozens of complaints about churches’ political activities …. The complaints by the group include one on July 15, 2004, against Jerry Falwell Ministries, saying had endorsed President Bush and urged readers to donate $5,000 to the Campaign for Working Families. Such activities are illegal, Mr. Lynn said ….

    “Almost half the tax-exempt groups under examination are churches. Churches played a pivotal role in the 2004 elections, and the Republican Party, in particular, harnessed their influence to register, educate and deliver voters. …

    “Of the 47 complaints against churches under investigation, 37 were found to have merit. ….

    “Last month, a group of religious leaders representing Christian and Jewish denominations filed a complaint against two large politically active churches in Ohio, Fairfield Christian Church and World Harvest Church, and their leaders, the Revs. Russell Johnson and Rod Parsley.

    … ”

  54. 67

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    Dozens Of Touch Screen Voting Machines Recorded Votes Prior To Election Day

    “The internal logs of at least 40 Sequoia touch-screen voting machines reveal that votes were time and date-stamped as cast two weeks before the election, sometimes in the middle of the night.

    “Black Box Voting successfully sued former Palm Beach County (FL) Supervisor of Elections Theresa LePore to get the audit records for the 2004 presidential election.

    ” … Black Box Voting discovered that the voting machine logs contained approximately 100,000 errors. According to voting machine assignment logs, Palm Beach County used 4,313 machines in the Nov. 2004 election. During election day, 1,475 voting system calibrations were performed while the polls were open, providing documentation to substantiate reports from citizens indicating the wrong candidate was selected when they tried to vote.

    “Another disturbing find was several dozen voting machines with votes for the Nov. 2, 2004 election cast on dates like Oct. 16, 15, 19, 13, 25, 28 2004 and one tape dated in 2010. These machines did not contain any votes date-stamped on Nov. 2, 2004. … The logs rule out the possibility that these were Logic & Accuracy (L&A) test results, and verified that these results did appear in the final totals. In addition to the date discrepancies, most had incorrect polling times, with votes appearing throughout the wee hours of the night. These machines were L&A tested, and the L&A test activities appeared in the logs with the correct date and time.

    “According to the voting machine assignment log, these machines were not assigned to early voting locations. The number of votes on each machine also corresponds with the numbers typical of polling place machines rather than early voting. Many of these machines showed unexplained log activity after the L&A test but before Election Day. In addition, many more machines without date anomalies showed this log activity, which revealed someone powering up the machine, opening the program, then powering it down again. …

    “Approximately 4,000 votes were cast on these machines. The vote pattern and activity pattern appears to be identical to typical patterns found on Election Day — All votes on the discrepant machines were spread over a 12-hour period, the length of time the Florida polls are open.”

  55. 68

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    THE DEMOCRATIC SENATOR DID NOT ASK FOR AN INVESTIGATION OF THE NURSE! HE ASKED FOR AN INVESTIGATION OF THE VA! Sheesh. How do you deal with these illiterate trollfucks with the IQ of a squash.

  56. 70

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Isn’t it interesting that shortly after Ann Coulter moves to Florida, neo-Nazis show up there?

  57. 71

    Rev. A.A. Tappman: Anababtist spews:

    I would have thought that the brains of the trolls would have exploded trying to justify turning over 6 American ports to the UAE, but they just rolled with it like it was the most commonplsce thing in the world.

    Gosharooney, was their attitude, anyone who opposes this must be a RACIST.


  58. 72

    Donnageddon spews:

    Roger Rabbit @ 6, and the nuclear weapons producing machinery went through U.A.E ports.

    My, oh my.

  59. 73

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Hey Goldy, the Constitution says government can’t suppress the neo-Nazis’ free speech, but it doesn’t say private citizens can’t kick the shit out of them! That’s merely simply assault, not a violation of their constitutional rights. It violates their constitutional rights only if the government does it.

  60. 74

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    You go, Florida rioters! Hell, we oughta take up a collection on HA for their bail.

  61. 75

    Roger Rabbit spews:


    “Did you miss the fact that the Senator from New Mexico who is requesting that the nurse be investigated is a Democrat, Goldy?”

    Are you really this illiterate, or just a liar? Sen. Bingaman didn’t ask for an investigation of the nurse, he asked the VA director to investigate the VA’s investigation of the nurse, dumbass.

  62. 76

    Donnageddon spews:

    BushCo is investigating for “sedition” VA nurses that disagree with their policies, and Michael @ 3 goes immedeatly into “Clinton got a blow job” mode.

    Typical NeoCon zombie who hasn’t received his talking points yet.

    Hang it up Michael. You, and the rest of the facists are going down!

  63. 77


    That bitch needs to shut up and support our leader. The “Bill Of Rights” they talk about isn’t even in the Constitution! Support Bush, or you are a coward whore.

    Nuff’ said

  64. 78

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    In the preceding thread, Puttybutt asked me when North Korea acquired nuclear weapons. The answer is no one knows if North Korea has nuclear weapons — just because they say they do doesn’t mean you should believe them — but it’s theoretically possible that the fuel rods they removed from locked storage and international inspection in October 2002 in response to Bush’s diplomatic blunders could have been processed into enough plutonium to make a bomb by the summer of 2003. In short, this shit happened on Bush’s watch, no one else’s, and North Korea certainly did not have a bomb in 1994 as Puddyliar asserts.

  65. 79

    cmahnken spews:


    Back to reading 101 with you. The Democratic senator asked for “a thorough inquiry of his [Veterans Affairs Secretary James Nicholson] agency’s investigation into whether a V.A. nurse’s letter to the editor criticizing the Bush administration amounted to ‘sedition.'”. He’s not asking them to investigate her. He’s asking them to explain what the heck they think they’re doing.

  66. 80


    You can email senator Bingaman here. ine was titled Sedition and the text was “seriously what the fuck?” So hopefully that’ll help. I know, I know, Don’t write Democrats in anger. On the other hand, I always do.

  67. 81

    Michael spews:

    If you are an undergraduate, graduate or professional student or a recent graduate with your own strong interest in crucial issues of our day, the Clinton Foundation Intern Program offers a unique opportunity for growth
    It isn’t clear whether the growth would be yours or his. At any rate, you could be sure to get some hands on experience.

  68. 82

    AnalogKid spews:

    Did you miss the fact that the Senator from New Mexico who is requesting that the nurse be investigated is a Democrat, Goldy?

    Doesn’t sound like an administration official to me.

    But hey, whatever you can do to imply the administration is friendly to Nazis must be good, right?

  69. 83

    Michael spews:

    Heh, Clinton investigated Linda Tripp for sedition about a bl0w job. This seems slightly more serious.

  70. 84


    Goldy, there ARE no legal means to remove Bush forcefully from office. The impeachment process is not a forceful removal; it is what we have INSTEAD OF force.

    I’m sorry, I don’t think the Secret Service should have the liberty to say, “Well, of COURSE she didn’t mean she was advocating the use of force.” They have to check it out, and it’s not harrassment to do so. Next time she should choose her words more carefully.

  71. 85


    Goldy, I’m as fervent a supporter of the First Amendment as anyone–but the fact remains, when you advocate a “forceful” action against the US government, the Secret Service is going to investigate you. And that’s a good thing, frankly. Note that the charge of sedition was never made by the authorities in control; apparently that was something the people at the VA tossed out there.

    Advocate for change all you like. Scream to the heavens about the criminality of this administration, and ask for the President to be tried, convicted and jailed. I may even back you. But once you toss in the use of force, you’ve left the realm of protected speech IMO. Whether she meant it that way or not, it needs to be taken seriously.

  72. 86

    Goldy spews:

    TJ @43,

    Of course she didn’t mean it that way, and any attempt by the government to try to interpret her letter to the editor as a call for violence is nothing short of harrassment. She instructed people to “act forcefully” by bringing criminal charges against the administration to remove them from office.

    We’re allowed to advocate removing people from office. In fact I’ll do so right now: I advocate acting forcefully to remove President Bush from office… by any legal means available

    (However, if Bush attempts to cling to power after the end of his term through some emergency declaration postponing elections, I reserve the right to advocate for the use of physical force.)

  73. 87

    GBS spews:

    You can read with your own EYES that JCH is a FUCKING LIAR.

    I don’t believe he was a SWO. He was obviously a Supply Officer, AT BEST.

    However, now that we know him to be a certifiable LIAR, even his military service is suspect, again, at BEST.

    So a big giant FUCK YOU to you.


    Good day.

  74. 89

    GBS spews:

    Wait, Kim Jong-il DA WO

    Let me post JCH’s lie so you can read it for yourself.

    108, Libertarian, I never attended flight school. Hence, I never “washed out”. All a figment of GBS’s vivid “imagination”. All my training was done in Newport, RI and Coronado, Ca, as well as the old Philadelphia Ship Yard. Then, three WESTPACs of 6 monthe each , one ten month IO cruise, and a tour in Coronado at the NAB. Four years at sea, and two ashore.

    Comment by Myron [JCH] Silverstein, ESQ— 2/24/06 @ 3:04 pm

  75. 90

    GBS spews:

    Kim Jong-il DA WO @ 80.

    What? Are you aiming to be my next BLOG BITCH?

    JCH is an LIAR without qualifiers.

    Just in case you missed it, I’ll repost where I BUSTED him in his fucking lie:

    @ 123

    JCH: Are you saying GWB served in combat then? Just askin’
    Comment by windie — 1/24/06 @ 3:59 pm [No, but, Windie, have YOU ever “buckled up” in a Mach 2 F-106? Not for pussies. I washed out of Naval Air [bad GI] and served Surface Line [1110]. Flying [and training] in military jets are not for the Bill Clintons of the world.]
    Comment by JCH — 1/24/06 @ 4:37 pm

    @ 125

    DA WO

    Comment by YO — 1/24/06 @ 3:59 pm [YO, I’m sure you are correct and I was mistaken. Thanks for the help. Anyone who flies has my respect. I was not up to the stress. Not many are. JCH, LT, USN [1110, 76-84]]

    Comment by JCH — 1/24/06 @ 4:44 pm

    @ 152


    I served a short stint on the “mini-twat” USS Manitowoc County LST 1180. Hated the Marines, they seemed to have nothing to do but PT and wait in line for chow. The bastards.

    Comment by GBS — 1/24/06 @ 5:43 pm [True, but once ashore, they are the best. I couldn’t do what they do. Did you know Hillary said she tried to join the Marines? Roger Rabbit believes her!! He believes anyone who will ensure his “guvment” check comes every month.]

    Comment by JCH — 1/24/06 @ 6:10 pm

    So, Kim Jong-il, what part of him being a LIAR don’t you understand?

    You know what the ULTIMATE irony is? You helped in his demise.

    You stupid DICK SUCK.