Republicans: laughable, but not funny

The TNT’s Niki Sullivan, live blogging from the state GOP convention in Spokane, reports on the latest attempts at Republican humor. First Rep. Cathy McMorris-Rodgers entertained the crowd with the “Top 10 reasons it’s good to be a Republican in 2008,” including such comic gems as:

3. We believe Al Gore deserves an ‘F’ in science and an ‘A’ in creative writing.

That’s a hard act to follow. But Dave Reichert tried, trotting out his now familiar Borscht Belt routine:

Right now, U.S. Rep. Dave Reichert is up. He repeated a joke I first heard him tell at the Pierce County Republicans’ Lincoln Day breakfast earlier this year. It involves an airplane that’s going to crash, one fewer parachute than passengers and, ultimately, Hillary Clinton dying.

Hillary Clinton dying… oh man, that’s a knee-slapper, isn’t it?

I’m actually well familiar with this joke. My 11-year-old daughter used to tell a variation of it, but involving President Bush instead of Hillary Clinton. And she found it absolutely hilarious… when she was nine.

In fact, the inappropriateness of a sitting congressman joking about the death of a sitting senator aside, this is a joke specifically designed to appeal to nine-year-olds. It goes something like this:

A grandfather, a grandson, a wealthy man and [Despised Public Figure] are flying on a plane, when the pilot comes out and announces that the plane is about to crash, but that there are only four parachutes for the five of them.

“I’ve trained for too many years to die like this,” the pilot says, so he straps on the first parachute and jumps out of the plane. Next the wealthy man says, “I’m much too rich to die this young,” so he grabs the second parachute and jumps out of the plane. Then [Despised Public Figure] stands up and says “I’m [Despised Public Figure], and I’m much too important to die,” so he grabs the third parachute and jumps out of the plane.

Finally, the grandfather turns to his grandson and says, “I’m old; I’ve lived a long life. Here, you take the last parachute.” To which the grandson replies, “That’s okay grandpa, there’s a parachute for both of us… [Despised Public Figure] took my backpack!”

There are two things to note in deconstructing this joke. The first is that the punchline partially owes its humorous impact to playing off a popular stereotype of the Despised Public Figure as stupid. Deserved or not, this works well with President Bush in the lead role (as it would for Dave Reichert himself), but whatever you think of Hillary Clinton, she certainly doesn’t have a reputation for being dumb, and as such, the joke comes off more mean spirited than funny. It’s just a poor vehicle for ridiculing her.

The second thing to note about this joke is that the humorous twist is primarily derived from the unexpected contrast between the cool intellect of the child versus the panicked stupidity of a powerful adult. The punchline is not dependent on the identity of the object of ridicule because the humor comes less from the act of stupidity than it does from the act of a mere child being both observant enough to recognize the error as it was happening, and calculating enough to allow it to play out uninterrupted.

Think about it. You could swap “President Bush” with “Dave Reichert,” and the humorous effect is virtually unchanged, as long as the audience is familiar with Reichert. But if you put the observation in the mouth of the grandfather instead of the grandson, the joke just doesn’t work.

This is, at its core, a joke about empowering children. Which is why it is a joke that primarily appeals to children.

That Reichert finds this kiddie joke so humorous that he repeats it to Republican audiences statewide… well… I’d say that’s funnier than the joke itself.

Comments

  1. 1

    spews:

    Goldy: maybe it was a different joke that Reichert told. You are so closed-minded. And even if you’re right that it was that joke, jeez, are your readers so stupid that they need you to deconstruct it?

    Also, Niki herself is hilarious: she writes lies about what happened at a 501(c)(3) in an attempt to smear Rossi for doing absolutely nothing wrong (even if her lies were true, he would have done nothing wrong!).

    All that said, yes, politicians are rarely funny (although I heard Dino tell a great joke at the Mike Hope kickoff, but I won’t spoil it, as he will likely use it later). But there’s always us amateurs for good humor!

  2. 2

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    I heard that joke 30 years ago. Back then, the guy who jumped with the backpack was Henry Kissinger.

  3. 3

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    I sure hope for Mr. Cynical’s sake that he bought Dynamic Materials like I told him to. It’s up $7 since then — including another $1.25 today.

  4. 5

    Richard Pope spews:

    Yeah, I heard it with Henry Kissinger too, about 35 years ago. And I think I was 11 at the time, not 9 :)

  5. 6

    Tlazolteotl spews:

    #3 I doubt it – that’s one of the right’s problems, you know. They won’t take advice from a leftie, even if that advice is in their own best interests. I hardly think I need to cite examples, the last 7 years provide plenty.

  6. 7

    demo kid spews:

    Pudge, Republicans are only *unintentionally* humourous. Any real attempt to be funny just demonstrates how mean-spirited and evil y’all are.

  7. 8

    spews:

    demo kid: um. Mean-spirited? Did you read Goldy’s post? Have you ever before in your life read Goldy or listened to him? He is far more mean-spirited than any Republican I know in this state.

  8. 10

    Steve spews:

    Republicans will be at their funniest in November when their heads start exploding after realizing how utterly complete was the American electorate’s rejection of their party. The troll meltdown will be hilarious and just to think – we have front row seats for the show!

  9. 11

    Steve spews:

    Now this is funny:

    “Early speakers made numerous references to President Reagan and God, but none to President George W. Bush, whose low approval ratings could be a drag on the GOP ticket in November.”

    Seattle Times article

    It appears that delusional memories of Ronnie cutting taxes and kicking commie ass, and prayer to a God who no doubt scorns them is about all these Republicans have going for them. If they weren’t such assholes it’d be kind of sad to witness. But they are, in fact, assholes so it’s fun to watch. Pass the popcorn, please.

  10. 12

    correctnotright spews:

    I think the “funny” republican has already started making jokes (by running for President):
    Check out McCain mistating the troop level in Iraq.

    http://blog.washingtonpost.com......html#more

    This is his supposed area of expertise and he is already having one of his many “McCain” moments.

    Of course all one needs to do is go back over his many quotes on the Iraq war to see that he consistently was a misinformed cheerleader:

    How would American troops be greeted?: “I believe that the Iraqi people will greet us as liberators.” (March 20, 2003)

    Did Saddam Hussein have a nuclear program that posed an imminent threat to the United States?: “Saddam Hussein is on a crash course to construct a nuclear weapon.” (October 10, 2002)

    Will a war with Iraq be long or short?: “This conflict is going to be relatively short.” (March 23, 2003)

    How is the war going?: “I would argue that the next three to six months will be critical.” (September 10, 2003)

    How is it going (almost two months later, from the war’s “greatest critic”)? “I think the initial phases of [the war] were so spectacularly successful that it took us all by surprise.” (October 31, 2003)

    Is this war really necessary?: “Only the most deluded of us could doubt the necessity of this war.” (August 30, 2004)

    How is it going? (Recurring question for the war’s “greatest critic”): “We will probably see significant progress in the next six months to a year.” (December 4, 2005)

    Will the President’s “surge” of troops into Baghdad and surrounding areas that the senator had been calling for finally make the difference?: “We can know fairly well [whether the surge is working] in a few months.” (February 4, 2007)

    Courtesy of Truthout:
    http://www.truthout.org/article/mccain-misspeaks

  11. 13

    correctnotright spews:

    @8: Poor deluded Pudge – I have read many of Goldy’s posts and most are humorous and thoughtful – maybe you need to get to know the idiot republicans in this state better!
    How about the BIAW (financiers: read lobbyists and contributors) for most of the republicans and Tim Eyeman) and their comparison of environmentalists with Hitler or maybe Luke Esser who thinks voting (and counting votes) for actual candidates isn’t democratic.

  12. 14

    spews:

    correctnotright: you apparently are unaware of the fact that whether Goldy is humorous and thoughtful is orthogonal to whether he is mean-spirited. It’s like saying, “The U.S.A. isn’t in North America, it’s big and has lots of cows in it!”

    And you’re lying about Luke Esser.

    Tlazolteotl: yawn. Is that the best you can do? Where’s the substance?

  13. 15

    Steve spews:

    My, I really do enjoy reading Troll posts whining about how mean-spirited leftie bloggers are in comparison to the kind and gentle Republicans.

  14. 16

    correctnotright spews:

    Pudge – gee I am “lying”. Gee, here is a republican site link to Esser’s “counting” techniques – seems like they didn’t think it was too fair either:

    http://thereaganwing.wordpress.....uke-esser/

    Looks like the facts are a bit difficult for you to handle, huh. Maybe you should go back to your two republican friends who “are not mean”. Guess playing with people who actually pay attention to facts is too tough for you, little boy.

    So Goldy is “mean-spirited” because…you say so. Maybe you just don’t understand his sense of humor. You know – you could ask Goldy to explain his jokes to you – maybe then you wouldn’t feel so “left” out.

  15. 17

    My Left Foot spews:

    Pudge, you ignorant, myopic moe-ron.

    Ann Cuntlter, Flush Rimbaugh, O’Liely, Sean Insanity, Malkin, etc….. not a mean spirit amongst them?

    Thanks for playing!

  16. 18

    michael spews:

    Yeah, joking about someone that’s running for president dying isn’t funny. Considering the threats and hate coming from the right (Lou Dobbs, Rush, Ann, Michelle…Those fun loving Militia boys that got locked up in the 90′s for building bombs and converting semi-autos to fully-auto’s) and that the other Dem running for president had to get secret service protection quite early on this isn’t funny at all.

    Hair Spray needs to retract that joke.

  17. 20

    rhp6033 spews:

    Well, Pudge, I think it was Thanksgiving weekend last year, when the lady was stabbed to death on capital hill in Seattle. The news reports included camera footage of the scene, including a shot of her tote bag lying on the sidewalk, which had some environmental logo on it.

    His reaction? “Good, another Enviro-Nazi is dead!’.

    He seemed to think that his comment was insightful and hilarious. And you accuse the Democrats of being mean-spirited?

  18. 21

    Tlazolteotl spews:

    @14 Given your comment @8, why would I have to ‘do any better?’ My comment has as much substance as yours. Yawn indeed!

    Typical rightie projection!

  19. 22

    michael spews:

    I take it McMorris doesn’t share her parties presidential candidates concern about global warming.

  20. 23

    spews:

    correctnotright: yes, you are lying. Nothing in there implies that Esser thinks counting voting, or counting votes, for candidates is not democratic.

    And wow, YOU are the most mean-spirited person here by a long shot. Well, along with My Left Foot.

    My Left Foot: you see, it is normally considered good form to actually describe what I said that makes me ignorant and such, if you’re going to call me such. And none of those people you mentioned are from *Washington State.* Read much?

    michael: Lou Dobbs is not on the right. He is a moderate populist. Just because he is anti-illegal immigrants doesn’t put him on the right, any more than his vehment anti-outsourcing views put him on the left.

    rhp6033: who is the antecedent of “he”? Esser? Me? No to both, so who are you talking about? And note that I am not saying that there’s no mean-spirited Republicans in Washington. I am just saying Goldy is far more mean-spirited than any I know.

    Tlazolteotl: um. I mentioned specific things. You did not. Shrug.

  21. 24

    Don Joe spews:

    I think there are two different definitions of “Mean Spirited” at operation here. To Democrats, suggesting that someone poison the creme brulé of a sitting Supreme Court Justice is mean-spirited. To Republicans, telling the truth is mean-spirited.

  22. 25

    correctnotright spews:

    Poor Pudgie – the fact that Esser called the vote for McCain BEFORE the votes were counted is not undemocratic?

    Pray tell – what kind of “democracy” do you support?

    Oh, and I am really sorry to be “mean” and actually question what you say. Of course, I usually don’t say someone is “lying” when they are not…I consider that just a bit on the “rude” side.

  23. 26

    spews:

    Don Joe:

    Calling Ann Coulter (whom I dislike, personally) “Ann Cuntlter” is mean-spirited. Lying about Luke Esser is mean-spirited. Ad hominems — as they are personal attacks that are beside the point — are, by definition, mean-spirited.

    None of those have to do with “truth.”

  24. 27

    Rick D. spews:

    It’s good to see that Goldy is indoctrinating his daughter into his own hate-filled philosophy….a future “tolerant” liberal in the making for sure from the sounds of it.

    Kind of reminds me of those twin 9 year blonde Nazi girls in the news a few years ago that would sing white supremacist songs at White supremacist rallies their parents attended…….grow up with hate, hate is all that grows.

    Liberal fascism is alive and kicking in the Goldstein house.

  25. 28

    spews:

    correctnotright:

    You are confused. Esser, in fact, did not call any vote for McCain. There was no vote to be called. No vote for candidates was held, let alone recorded, for the Republican caucuses in Washington State. Nowhere does there exist a list of candidates that were voted for in the caucuses. There is not even a list of which candidates the elected delegates preferred at the time of their election as delegates. No such vote was held or recorded.

    You are, in fact, lying. Continually.

    If you want to attack Esser for misleading or misstating what happened in the caucus, fine. But to say he “thinks voting (and counting votes) for actual candidates isn’t democratic” is a lie. To say he “called the vote for McCain BEFORE the votes were counted” is a lie, as there were, in fact, no votes representing any candidates to be counted.

    Perhaps you should understand what you’re talking about before spouting off about it.

    And yes, some people think I am rude. Better than being mean-spirited or a liar, though.

  26. 29

    My Left Foot spews:

    Pudge:

    You ignorant slut….

    OK, try reading (un)SP. Mean spirited is second nature over there and they are local. Sharkansky and the rest. OK.

    Kindly shove it up your ass.

  27. 30

    michael spews:

    @23

    Yeah, I see where you’re coming from on Dobb’s. But, I still think he’s a righty.

  28. 31

    correctnotright spews:

    @28: Pudgiepie:
    OK – so I am lying by saying that
    Esser was “undemocratic”, when in fact there was no democratic vote at all in a primary (where Esser called the vote for McCain)…I love it when you make soooo much sense!
    I am just awed by your incisive wit and writing.
    So Esser is not “undemocratic” for not bothering to count votes that apparently don’t count anyways…does that make esser republican?

    I never realized that the republican primary votes “do not count”. I thought the republicans also believed in democracy – guess I was wrong.

  29. 33

    GBS spews:

    C’mon! Really??

    Are we actually making an issue out of an old, tired joke!?!?

    Man, if you can’t laugh at yourself you’re way over the fucking top too serious.

    Besides, where in the joke does it say Hillary dies?? Or, is it just implied?

    Sure, smashing in to the earth at 120 mph usually ends up in fatality, but not always. There are documented cases where parachutists survive a failed chute deployment.

    Now, Huckabee’s failed attempt at humor saying someone took a shot at Obama, OK, that’s not funny. Well, a little bit it is, but making a joke about shooting a presidential candidate and mocking them for taking a backpack instead of the parachute are miles a part.

    It’s free speech people, let them exercise it.

  30. 34

    spews:

    Pudge @26,

    So, when Stefan repeatedly compared Ron Sims to brutal African dictator Robert Mugabe… was that mean-spirited? When EFF President Bob Williams repeatedly demanded that Dean Logan be jailed… was that mean-spirited? When your girlfriend Ann Coulter suggests poisoning a Supreme Court justice, or executing a few liberals, or insists that her biggest regret about Tim McVeigh is that he didn’t blow up the NY Times building instead… is that mean-spirited?

    Sure, I can be mean. But unlike your side, I can also be funny. And that’s what really gets you… not that I’m mean, but that I’m better at it than the (u)SP crowd.

  31. 35

    spews:

    Rick D @27,

    It’s good to see that Goldy is indoctrinating his daughter into his own hate-filled philosophy….a future “tolerant” liberal in the making for sure from the sounds of it.

    I was waiting for some dumb-ass troll to go after my daughter and my parenting skills. So then tell me, if that joke is “hate-filled” coming from the mouth of a nine-year-old, how do you characterize it when it comes from the mouth of US congressman, huh?

    Or are you ready to admit that Reichert is an intolerant hate-monger?

  32. 36

    YLB spews:

    grow up with hate, hate is all that grows.

    Judging from your comments, you HATE people who have concluded that Dino Rossi is not fit be Governor of this State.

    I thought you were out the door to (un)SP? A suppose in the inimitable fashion of pudge you’re a “liar” as well.

  33. 37

    michael spews:

    @33

    It’s a good point you’re making, but you have to look at the back drop against which the comment was made. If everything was happy and sunny back there I might agree with you, but it isn’t.

    See #34, #18 and David Neiwert’s blog for more on the backdrop/context.

  34. 38

    correctnotright spews:

    @32: Pudgie has a website?
    Is the website as obtuse as Pudgie?

    Does this mean that pudgie is a professional blogger, who does not say anything mean? That would be a first – I am very impressed pudgie.

    Did you cover McCain’s gaffe about how many troops are in Iraq – apparently, in all those trips in the flak jackets to the market – he forgot to pick up the groceries and to count the troops.
    I hope he counts the shia as sunnis too – because all dem people are ARABS especially if they come from Iran – oops, you mean the Iranians are shia and are NOT Arabs…my bad.

  35. 39

    YLB spews:

    34 – Goldy, pudge has an out for that. Pudge blogs at (un)SP but doesn’t “know” Stefan.

    That’s my best guess anyway.

  36. 40

    spews:

    My Left Foot: I post at Sound Politics. You’ll have to be more specific, such as providing a URL.

    michael: OK. I think he isn’t. Certainly he is on the right on some — maybe most? — issues, but he is no friend to Republicans, either. Unless they agree with him on everything.

    correctnotright: you are lying by saying he did things he didn’t do. How is this so hard for you to understand? You said that Esser thinks voting, and counting votes, isn’t democratic. You are lying.

    And now you are adding a new lie: that some votes were not counted. That never happened. You are lying.

    And another new lie, about the Republican primary … we are talking about the caucuses, first of all. But as to your lie: the Republican primary vote counts for 51 percent of delegates to the national convention. In fact, it is the DEMOCRATIC primary votes that do not count at all, for anything. So if that is the measure of believing in democracy, then you just asserted that the Democrats in WA do not care about democracy.

    Oops.

    But back to the caucuses, no, the votes count. But you do not vote for Presidential candidates in those caucuses. You vote for delegates. But we do not even know who the delegates favored for President upon being elected delegate, as this was never recorded.

    Your logic here is to the effect that if I vote for Joe Smith for city council, then there is something wrong with the system because it doesn’t count a vote for police chief.

    We do not vote for President in our caucuses, we vote for delegates, and those delegates may or may not ever tell us their Presidential preference, and we may or may not vote based on that preference, and that preference is never recorded at the time of election of that delegate.

    Some people think we should be voting for President in our caucuses. That’s fine. I think the Democrats should count the primary. But the fact is that they don’t count the primary, and we don’t vote for President in our caucuses.

  37. 41

    YLB spews:

    When your girlfriend Ann Coulter suggests

    Careful Goldy, he’s going to call you a “liar” next.

  38. 44

    spews:

    Goldy:

    I agree it is wrong to mention your daughter, FWIW. I never would do such a thing.

    As to Stefan comparing Sims to Mugabe, I’d have to see it to have an idea. As to what another poster said, I only met Stefan once, and only e-mailed with him a tiny number of times, but enough that I would not say I don’t know him. That said, I still think you are far more mean-spirited than Stefan; I never said Republicans in this state that I know are not mean-spirited, only that you are moreso. But I would also agree that Stefan is more mean-spirited than I would like.

    As to Bob Williams and Dean Logan … of course that isn’t mean-spirited. He believes, as I do, that Dean Logan deliberately committed election crimes. Nothing mean-spirited about saying he should pay his just penalty for that.

    As to Ann Coulter, I already stated in this discussion (and have stated many times over the years) that I dislike her. I also dislike Bill O’Reilly. And I am not a big fan of Rush or Hannity. I hate that sort of “discourse” (and I use the word loosely). Call me a prig if you must, but I watch NewsHour every night. That is the sort of discourse I prefer.

    Coulter, however, is not from WA. If she were, I would have said, “Goldy is more mean-spirited than any Republican I know in this state … except for Ann Coulter.”

    Sure, I can be mean. But unlike your side, I can also be funny.

    Oh please. I am funnier than you even on a bad day. And frankly, I don’t think you are any funnier than Ann Coulter. I know that will seem like an insult to you, but it is not intended as such. I only mean that neither of you is very funny except to people who already agree with you and share your mean-spiritedness.

  39. 45

    correctnotright spews:

    Poor Pudgie:
    Gee- the democratic party rules are very straightforward – the delegates are apportioned on the basis of votes. So the CRAP you are spewing is totally off base – but what are the republican rules – apparently there ARE NONE – and that “my friend” is what makes it undemocratic and what you are saying is a pile of shit.

  40. 46

    GBS spews:

    Pudge @ 44:

    Does our mean-spirited blog offend you?

    Get the fuck out. You are in no way compelled to come here. You do it by free choice.

    If you came here for honest debate, you’ll get it. But, you’ll also get your fair share of “FUCK YOU, ASS WIPE!!”

    Now that’s the unvarnished truth, not the “shading of truth” your party’s leader does and causes 4,100 Americans to lose their lives over it.

    Cindy Sheehan was right, all of you were fucking wrong.

    You moron.

    PS: Your WWE Capt. America look is weak. You’ll need an Islamic flag behind you because you look like bin Laden.

  41. 47

    michael spews:

    3. We believe Al Gore deserves an ‘F’ in science and an ‘A’ in creative writing

    Hmm… Dino and McCain seem to be in agreement with Gore that global warming is a problem. Didn’t Hair Spray come out wishy-washy on global warming, get called on the carpet for it and change is position?

    I wonder how global warming deniers are going to feel about the Republican Party come November?

  42. 48

    spews:

    correctnotright: sigh. You have no idea what you are talking about. The GOP rules — I have a copy here — are very straightforward. Precincts elect delegates to county. Counties elect delegates to state. State elects two delegates per congressional district to national, with the rest apportioned by the primary vote.

    How can you think this is not straightforward? Note that nowhere did I say anything about Presidential candidates, because anyone’s preference for President is not an official part of the caucus/convention procedure. You can, if you wish to, vote for delegates based on Presidential preference. Just like you can also vote for delegates based on anything you like.

    It’s very simple, and very democratic. You vote for delegates to represent you, and YOU decide what that means to you when you cast your vote.

    I think even Goldy understands how it works! Why don’t you?

    Also, correctnotright, I am waiting for you to either admit that you were wrong, that not counting votes is NOT undemocratic, or to state that the WA Democratic Party is undemocratic. Which is it?

  43. 49

    Rick D. spews:

    Yes, I see where you’d think I was remarking about the Reichert joke there Goldy, but as is your life story, you’re off the mark (and ‘air’ for that matter).

    I used to listen to your short lived show on KIRO for awhile until I couldn’t stand the high-pitched squeal and had to turn it off or to another station (so yes, I’ll gladly take partial credit for your show getting kicked to the curb by KIRO radio). About the only worse radio hosts were that trollop Erin Hart and Hetero-hater (the late)Mike Webb – and both promptly found their walking papers out of Kiro as well.

    You spew nothing but hate and vitriol at any opposing opinion so yeah, I’d say you probably suck at parenting too. I said your daughter (with your careful sculpting hand of course) was likely to be a future “tolerant” liberal in the making…..is that offensive to an “unabashed liberal” like yourself?
    You’re now offended at the “liberal” tag?

    Clear up the confusion Goldy, you’re lips are flapping but no sounds are coming out.

  44. 50

    GBS spews:

    @ 48:

    Nobody but you gives a rat’s ass about the GOP anything.

    The GOP is about to become completely irrelevant in Jan 2009. It will last for many decades to come.

    So you know what? Cram your Koran GOP rule book up your ass. Really.

  45. 51

    spews:

    GBS:

    Does our mean-spirited blog offend you?

    Nope. Why do you ask?

    Get the fuck out.

    Only if I choose to. Your weak-ass smack surely won’t do the trick.

    If you came here for honest debate, you’ll get it.

    Unfortunately, no. correctnotright is almost entirely telling lies, and Goldy and others who addressed my point about mean-spiritedness missed my very explicit point, instead incorrectly implying I said that no one on the right is mean-spirited.

    I don’t care if you are mean-spirited. I was just pointing out the fact that you are, so it seems pretty damned stupid to attack others for that.

    Cindy Sheehan was right, all of you were fucking wrong.

    You moron.

    I hope you don’t really think it is a good idea to hold up Cindy Sheehan as an example of an anti-moron.

    PS: Your WWE Capt. America look is weak. You’ll need an Islamic flag behind you because you look like bin Laden.

    Yes, as I said: extremely lame, weak-ass, smack. Come on, step it up.

    First of all, the picture itself is intended as a joke. I think it is pretty funny. If you took it seriously, then all the funnier to me.

    And saying I look like a terrorist, for crying out loud, I made that joke about myself years ago (that is Mir Aimal Kasi on the left (where else?!), who killed two CIA agents in 1993 in Virginia, and was executed in 2002).

    Like I said: you gotta step it up.

  46. 52

    spews:

    GBS, wow. So you first say I can come here for honest debate, but then when I correct the misstatements of correctnotright, then I am supposed to leave?

    You’re not making any sense, you know.

  47. 53

    GBS spews:

    Pudge @ 51:

    Yes, you are whining. The mean-spirited question was a rhetorical question. Why do I have to spell out the nuances of a conversation to a conservative?

    Yeah, Cindy Sheehan is the best person to hold up to the likes of you after Scott McClellan’s revelations that Bush is a fucking liar and propagandist who’s done more harm to our military than al Qeada could ever dream of doing.

    When you’re really ready to run with me, I’ll let loose with a broadside. Until then, wait ’til ya get some muscle in that GOP brain of “urine.”

  48. 54

    GBS spews:

    Pudge,

    Jesus, do I need to break out the crayons?

    Stay for the debate, but leave if it’s too fucking mean spirited for you.

    OK, time for you to run along and play with the other conservatives kids in the corner.

    Goldy is going to read My Pet Goat for you kiddies later. Ought to be real good.

    Flunky.

  49. 56

    Rick D. spews:

    HA isn’t a debate site, it’s a waste treatment plant operated by a crew of adolescents in their 30′s thru 60′s (otherwise known as liberals) that can’t make their ideological paradigm fit into that inconvenient thing called , well, reality. The byproduct of that frustration is profanity, hate and intolerance of any opposing views put forth that runs counter to their little insecure mindset. What a sad and pathetic life it must be.

  50. 57

    GBS spews:

    Rick D.

    OK, you’re on:

    Was George W. Bush 100% honest with the American public regarding the reasons to go to war in Iraq knowing that such a decision would surely commit some of our fellow citizens to die?

  51. 58

    GBS spews:

    Here’s another topic for you Rick D.

    The outing of Valerie Plame, an undercover CIA operative who worked for the CIA front company, Brewster-Jennings which tracked WMD’s around the world, was that in our nation’s best national security interests?

  52. 59

    Rick D. spews:

    GBS~ You may not have noticed, but it’s Friday at 5pm. I have no itention of wasting my weekend in this hole. Another time for sure.

  53. 60

    GBS spews:

    Rick D.

    Is the doubling of our national debt to nearly $10 Trillion dollars the best “responsible” use of taxpayers money now and up to 30 years from now when those T-Bills come due?

  54. 61

    GBS spews:

    Rick D @ 59:

    Yeah, that’s what I thought.

    This kitchen is too hot for conservatives.

    Now, get the FUCK out.

    The truthful answer to all three questions is a simple “no.”

    How hard was that?

  55. 62

    My Left Foot spews:

    59

    See Rick.

    See Rick run.

    See Rick run away.

    See Rick run away when confronted.

    See Rick run away when confronted with what he asked for.

    See Rick run away when confronted with what he asked for only he really did not want what he asked for because, well, Rick does not have an answer that won’t expose him for the shill he really is.

    Rick, thanks for playing the game. We have a nice parting gift for you…..

    Fuck you!!!

  56. 63

    michael spews:

    Hey Rick,

    Have you noticed any polling results lately? You know the ones that show an overwhelming number of American’s disgusted with the war and just about every other thing the Republicans have done over the last 7 years.

  57. 64

    spews:

    GBS:

    Whatever. You’re boring. You can’t debate an issue at all, and you can’t bring the smack with any force rising above “junior high nerd-bully.” And you can’t even admit to yourself that Cindy Sheehan has the IQ of a gnat. A liberal gnat, at that. (Decide for yourself whether that is better or worse than other gnats.)

    Goldy, I feel sorry for you, having such people as GBS, My Left Foot, and correctnotright over here, representin’ the librul homies.

  58. 65

    YLB spews:

    Cindy Sheehan has the IQ of a gnat.

    You pudge like so many others on the right wing have hardly any respect for this woman’s loss. You’re so locked into your ideological fortress, you have no perspective. You have almost no conception of what you’re doing when you belittle people like Cindy Sheehan.

    She has spoken out against Bush’s Folly. Maybe she could have articulated her agenda and her positions better, chosen her friends better perhaps a lot better but she has lost a child to this catastrophe of a misadventure in the middle east and for what?

    Sorry Pudge. The last words written about the role of Dubya fellow travelers like you aren’t going to be too flattering. (Those youtube videos will seal that!)

    History will shine much more kindly on Cindy Sheehan.

    By the way, your original statement is mean-spirited IMHO.

  59. 66

    spews:

    Small dick jokes are funny, too. You start out the joke by saying: “There was a guy with a really small dick. His name was Scott….”

    It only works when one of the people there is named Scott. Sometimes, I have to wait for months until there’s someone named Scott in the group.

  60. 67

    spews:

    YLB: nonsense. Just because I “respect her loss” doesn’t mean I have to respect her opinions, or think she is intelligent. I don’t, and she isn’t. I am perfectly capable of separating those things. I won’t even go into her statements and friends as you appear to have conceded it already.

    But I don’t go out of my way to attack Sheehan, and I find it distasteful when people do. I pity her, and while I don’t psychoanalyze people I don’t know, I consider it a distinct possibility that her family is correct that she lost her mind when she lost her son. It is a terrible situation.

    I was only pointing out that holding up Cindy Sheehan as some sort of anti-moron is obviously silly, because whether she is right or wrong, whether her anger is justified, whether Bush is as evil as she says, she is still an unintelligent and purely reactionary figure.

    As to history, if it does shine kindly on Sheehan, it will only be out of pity, not out of actual respect for any thought she’s ever had. Meanwhile, we’ll see how history treats the rest of us, but what is absolutely clear is that you’re committing the question-begging fallacy: you believe you’re right, so therefore history will treat you well and me poorly. That is not a compelling argument, of course.

    And I don’t know what about my post @1 was mean-spirited at all. I pointed out the fact that Niki Sullivan posted lies; is that what you found offensive? I can’t see how that could possibly be seen as mean-spirited, especially since SHE is the one unapologetically printing lies.

  61. 68

    YLB spews:

    67 – Excuse me, I meant your statement about Sheehan is mean-spirited.

    “An unintelligent and purely reactionary figure”

    She’s the grieving mother of a soldier who died in a tragic folly that has brought yet more dishonor upon this country as if Vietnam wasn’t enough.

  62. 69

    My Left Foot spews:

    Pudge:

    Learned all I need to know about you visiting your website. George was a nice dog, I am sure. But placing pictures of his tumors was nothing but exploitive and juvenile.

    Please, when you want to debate the issues let me know. Judging from what I saw at your website you have the intellect of a 7th grader and the emotional make-up of 6 year old girl.

  63. 70

    spews:

    YLB: no, my comment about Sheehan wasn’t mean-spirited. Again, I was just pointing out the disconnect between GBS calling me a moron, and using a really dumb woman as an example of the opposite of “moron.” That she is a grieving mother does not change anything.

    I suppose you think I shouldn’t say that because of her grief. Shrug. He brought her into this, not me. If you don’t want her intelligence examined, that tell that to GBS, who is the one who chose to bring her intelligence into the discussion.

    My Left Foot: posting interesting pictures of cancer is exploitive and juvenile? On what planet? A six-year-old girl would cry about the death of the dog, but I view the cancer itself dispassionately. You have it entirely backward.

    And at worst, how is that any more juvenile and stupid than your post @17, which proves you couldn’t care less about debating issues? Please, tell us all how calling Ann Coulter a “cunt” is mature. I’d like to see you try to do that.

    I don’t think you’re even fooling your fellow liberals here, and you sure aren’t fooling any of the normals.

  64. 71

    YLB spews:

    70 – No. I’ve re-read GBS’ post. He was making no judgment of Cindy Sheehan’s intelligence.

    He merely said she was “right”. I’ll leave it to him to be more specific.

    He then called you a moron. You have little to no logical basis to conclude that he was comparing her intelligence to yours.

    My reading is that he was comparing moral character. The choices she made to speak out against the Bush policies versus yours to support them.

    GBS’s judgement call of “moron” is aimed at your choices. That’s my reading of it anyway.

  65. 72

    delbert spews:

    I like the Clinton joke better…

    Why is Chelsea Clinton so ugly?

    Because Janet Reno is her father.

    Thank you, I’ll be here all week, try the veal.

  66. 74

    Rick D. spews:

    I’ve been to the planet HorsesAss and have determined with 100% certainty that there is no intelligent life there….luckily, I didn’t have many expectations to begin with so I wasn’t disappointed.

    Cheers!

  67. 75

    proud leftist spews:

    Rick D.
    Farewell, enjoy your ride, wherever you might go. Trust that nobody here will miss you. I do, indeed. wish you the best, though you failed to post a single phrase that indicated you were capable of nonideological thought. If you can find one,
    Rick D., go hug a Republican.

  68. 76

    YLB spews:

    74 – How many times are you going to leave? Make up your mind already. Ooops. You can’t have a mind without a brain.

    Don’t let the door hit your ass on the way out.

  69. 77

    spews:

    YLB @ 71: he was contrasting Sheehan to a “moron.” That necessarily means he is speaking to her intelligence, since what marks a “moron” is a lack of intelligence.

    The only other way to read it is that his sentences, one after the other, were completely disconnected. Maybe you’re right, but I chose to give him more credit than that. I think GBS should be offended that you don’t hold his linguistic skills in higher regard.

  70. 78

    Daddy Love spews:

    It seems totally backwards for you all here to try to engage the shit-flinger Rick D. in a debate on the issues when he obviously never has and never will do so, but choose to hurl vitriol at pudge who does at least show an interest in reasoned discussion. Better the other way around, I think.

  71. 79

    Daddy Love spews:

    BTW, I went over to USP for a bit and it is a really slow Web site, which makes for a frustratng posting experience. And the threads there have very few comments. It just seems not much fun over there.

  72. 80

    correctnotright spews:

    Gee Rick D. – no one will miss you or your close minded sycophantic republican party line missives. Really – if you had anything intelligent to bring to the table – you did not show it. All you can do is insult and presume you are right – all the while supporting the worst President in history who has almost ruined our country – you got nothin’/

    Pudge: I know exacly what the rules are for the republican “Presidential” caucus. I looked them up after Esser declared McCain the winner without even getting a good portion of the delegate counts in…

    Yes – in the “process” that the republicans use for Presidential preference for their caucus there is no mandatory vote allotement for delegates and the precinct officer has to much control over who is slected to eventually be a delegate.

    It seems to me that it is very similar to Stalinist Russia where the party appratchiks already know who should get the “votes” before the election is held.

    I would be embarassed to have a system like that and I would be even more embarassed to have the head of the incompetent and corrupt republican party “calling” the election before getting a large part of the results.

    There is a reason the republican party in Washington state is losing – they will be lucky to hang on to McMorris and the corrupt Doc Hastings this cycle – Reichert is gone.

  73. 81

    YLB spews:

    77 – No, no, no! Again, GBS was saying Cindy Sheehan is right and you are wrong. I believe you are wrong if you think he intended to say she was smarter than you.

    And I believe you are wrong in your assessment that GBS would be offended at my interpretation of his words. I have the utmost respect for GBS. GBS is a combat veteran and a staunch advocate for liberal progressive values. You’ve had a small taste in this thread of what he thinks of conservatives. I believe he is aware of my respect.

    And by the way, I believe you are lying when you claim Cindy Sheehan has the intelligence of a gnat. It is absolutely impossible for even the most dim-witted human being to have the intelligence of a gnat. This should be patently obvious to anyone who claims the mantle of truth as you do.

  74. 82

    Marvin Stamn spews:

    35. Goldy spews:
    I was waiting for some dumb-ass troll to go after my daughter and my parenting skills. So then tell me, if that joke is “hate-filled” coming from the mouth of a nine-year-old, how do you characterize it when it comes from the mouth of US congressman, huh?

      
    If it’s a joke, then it all depends on the delivery. Got any youtube links?

  75. 83

    spews:

    “Daddy Love”: Sound Politics is intentionally slow, to prevent people from overwhelming it with comments. I agree it is not the best user experience, but then again, it’s not the worst in the world either, for a relatively small web site like HA or SP. I know about web commenting systems about as well as anyone, having been the primary developer of Slashdot’s new commenting system, and it doesn’t bother me too much.

    YLB: nope, you’re wrong about what GBS said. Simply repeating “no” over and over doesn’t change what he actually said. Your interpretation only makes sense if his sentences do not carry any context over from sentence to sentence. I admit that is a distinct possibility, but not an assumption I am willing to make.

    And even the dumbest gnat knows what hyperbole looks like, YLB.

    correctnotright: Pudge: I know exacly what the rules are for the republican “Presidential” caucus.

    Well, we have two choices then. Either you are lying now when you say you know exactly what the rules are, or you were lying before when you talked about votes for candidates not being counted (since you would know no such votes existed).

    in the “process” that the republicans use for Presidential preference for their caucus there is no mandatory vote allotement for delegates

    Do you mean that each caucus does not have to fill its allowed number of delegates? Yes, that’s true, if no one in the precinct wishes to fill those available delegate spots. So what?

    and the precinct officer has to much control over who is slected to eventually be a delegate.

    Incorrect, the PCO has absolutely no control over that, except that he himself is an automatic delegate (if he attends the caucus). The PCO simply chairs the caucus (unless the caucus elects someone else), and has no control over who is elected delegate at all.

    Again, you are either lying about knowing the rules, or lying about what those rules are.

    It seems to me that it is very similar to Stalinist Russia where the party appratchiks already know who should get the “votes” before the election is held.

    Again, nope. Nothing like that ever happens, nor is in the rules.

    So which is it? Are you lying about the rules, or lying about KNOWING the rules?

  76. 84

    YLB spews:

    And even the dumbest gnat knows what hyperbole looks like, YLB.

    It’s just the shiest bit more than impossible for the dumbest gnat to know what hyperbole looks like pudge. You almost certainly know that and therefore you are lying.

  77. 85

    spews:

    Most of your posts are great, a few are dumb, this one is just plain dumb.

    You sound like a foxnews talking head grasping at straws. Who cares about this joke, who told it and who it was directed at. this is a non issue, dont waste you time trying to make it one.

  78. 86

    spews:

    /me shakes head at YLB

    It is quite obvious that you are pretending to not understand my use of hyperbole to point out the hyperbole, in order to sidestep the simple question of whether you are lying about knowing the rules, or lying about what the rules say.

    But it’d still be nice if you actually answered the question.

  79. 87

    YLB spews:

    86 – Pudge you are lying about me lying about knowing the “rules”. But I’ll be charitable and conclude that you seem to be mistaking me for correctnotright.

  80. 88

    Don Joe spews:

    @ 87

    No. Pudge doesn’t grok the difference between a statement of fact and a conclusion based on facts. So, instead of pointing out how the conclusion is flawed, he just calls it a lie.

  81. 89

    spews:

    So…

    If it’s now inevitable that Barack Obama is the Democratic nominee, why does Hillary Clinton continue to win primaries? What message is there in these explicit rejections of his candidacy?

    Today it’s Puerto Rico…Tuesday will it be Montana and South Dakota?

    With DNC proportional representation – how stupid is that rule anyway? – a series of second place finishes will give BHO more popular delegates, but not enough. So he’ll have to rely upon the super delegates.

    But who can credibly contend that, among Democrats, there’s a groundswell of support seething towards Obama?

    If the Dem grassroots really find either candidate acceptable, then wouldn’t you think that they’d crunch the numbers in his favor…a long time ago???

    There’s some serious disunity here that the HA Happy Hooligans are ignoring…But then again, they always ignore the obvious and realities they wish were otherwise.

    The Piper

  82. 90

    ByeByeGOP spews:

    So let’s see – by last count – I found 10 different right wing talk show hosts who consider themselves “influencers.” And they ALL – every one – came out BIG TIME against Flip Flop McCain and in favor of Huckabee and this was AFTER McCain was going to be the obvious winner. So by Pooper’s oh so predictable double standards, the right is in trouble with McCain – which they are.

  83. 91

    spews:

    YLB: I’ll make this simple, so you can understand. I hope.

    You said, “the precinct officer has to [sic] much control over who is slected to eventually be a delegate.”

    But in fact, the PCO has no control over that, except as chair, which is no different from every other body that elects delegates: they all have a chair. And the body could — like every other body — elect a different chair if it wishes to.

    So, you were wrong. So you either don’t know the rules, or you are misrepresenting the rules.

    Again, which is it? A third option is to try to defend your erroneous statement.

    Don Joe: no, I am specifically talking about facts here. Yes, I realize “too much control” is a conclusion, but unless the fact that he makes it specifically about Republican Precinct Caucuses necessarily means that he is contrasting it to other similar bodies, and — necessarily — that means he is implying something as fact, which is not: that the PCO has more control over who is elected delegate in the GOP precinct caucuses than in similar bodies.

    I’ll accept your apology in advance.

  84. 92

    spews:

    @90…BBGOP…

    You really go out of your way to betray your ignorance, don’t you?

    I know a couple conservative talk radio hosts who’ve expressed severe reservations about John McCain, yet they were just elected as McCain delegates to the Republican National Convention from Washington State.

    Heck, even the Ron Paul supporters got on board the effort to elect the Unity Slate by acclamation.

    In the meantime, the Dems continue to foam at the mouth and sling mud at each other.

    Sucks to be you.

    The Piper

  85. 93

    YLB spews:

    87 – Pudge, again I’ll be charitable:

    You have mistaken me for correctnotright. Correctnotright has jousted with you over the Republican caucus rules.

    Get a grip man.

  86. 95

    YLB spews:

    94 – You’re a treat. You’re lying again. I never expressed an opinion on the Republican caucus rules in this thread or anywhere else that I can recall at the moment.

  87. 97

    YLB spews:

    No. I did not say that. Please stop lying about what I said.

    I said he was “correctnotright” not “correct, not right”.

    His last comment in the thread is at 80.