by Goldy, 02/29/2008, 8:55 AM

I’m filling in for Dave Ross this week (and next week, March 4th through 6th) on News/Talk 710-KIRO. Here’s the show as it’s shaping up so far:

9AM: Are we becoming prisoners to the War on Drugs?
According to a new study by the Pew Center on the States, 1 in 100 Americans are now behind bars, the highest of any Western nation. Here in WA state, we now spend 55 cents on corrections for every dollar spent on higher education, compared to only 23 cents on the dollar only two decades ago. We’ll ask the question whether this dramatic shift in priority is really making us safer, and how much of this cost is due to our so-called War on Drugs? But first, we’ll chat with Seattle P-I political columnist Joel Connelly reemerging Democratic prospects in formerly one-party Republican states like Alaska, and what lesson this might hold for Democrats in their virtually one-party strongholds like Seattle.

10AM: Will Tim Eyman call in and defend his for-profit initiative business?
Once again efforts to impose transparency and accountability on professional signature gatherers were met with howls of outrage from professional initiative sponsor Tim Eyman and his enablers on our state’s editorial boards, and once again minor reform legislation died quickly in the legislature. Joining me for the hour will be Kristina Wilfore, Executive Director of the Ballot Initiative Strategy Center, an organization that seeks to reinvigorate the initiative process while safeguarding it from corruption and fraud. Eyman, who rarely turns down an opportunity to use the media for self-promotion has yet to respond to our calls and emails, but we’re still hoping he’ll have the balls to engage me. We’ll see. He never agreed to come on my show, so I don’t see why he’d talk to me when I’m subbing for Dave.

11AM: Budget crisis? Potential tax hikes? Then why are we still giving away billions in dubious tax breaks?
After the Seattle P-I’s Chris McGann exposed a $1 billion tax giveaway to Microsoft and Yahoo that was quietly making its way through the Legislature, the bill dropped dead in its tracks, but this is only one of the tens of billions of dollars of special interest tax breaks, loopholes and exemptions that drain state coffers, reducing services and shifting the cost of government to the rest of us. Some of these tax “preferences” might make economic sense, though there is currently no audit process to determine if they are delivering on their promises. Marilyn Watkins of the Economic Opportunity Institute joins me for the hour to discuss the extent of the problem, and what we can do to bring greater accountability and efficiency to our tax system.

Tune in this morning (or listen to the live stream) and give me a call: 1-877-710-KIRO (5476).

243 Responses to “Radio Goldy”

1. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Too bad Goldy. You could have had Angelina Jolie:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/27/AR2008022702217_pf.html

But you and her don’t agree.

This is from a hollyweird leftist: “As for the question of whether the surge is working, I can only state what I witnessed: U.N. staff and those of non-governmental organizations seem to feel they have the right set of circumstances to attempt to scale up their programs. And when I asked the troops if they wanted to go home as soon as possible, they said that they miss home but feel invested in Iraq. They have lost many friends and want to be a part of the humanitarian progress they now feel is possible.”

Wow her 16%er card is being revoked right now.

2. Jim, (a genuine musician) spews:

Why hasn’t Sharkanski-poo called in yet?

3. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Or damn, You could have had Dean Logan on:

http://www.bradblog.com/?p=5746

http://www.bradblog.com/?p=5707

More problems in a blue county with ballots and directions?

Goldy you need to investigate!

Hannah,

The only way you can see the other side is to venture into their lair and quietly navigate around looking for loonyism.

4. Drew spews:

Well here you have it liberals, waterboarding is not torture, it is a motivational technique:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,333877,00.html

5. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Goldy: Dean Logan strikes again in LA?

[Logan] acknowledged that many of the county’s 28,000 poll workers, who are paid $80 to $120, were not adequately taught about the bubble during their 90-minute training sessions and did not know enough to inform voters properly.

“We can look back now and say it should have been emphasized more,” he acknowledged.

6. Richard Pope spews:

Whether you like Eyman and his various causes, the so-called “minor reform” legislation proposed this year in HB 2601 would have been blatantly unconstitutional. Among other things, it would have required people circulating petitions to display photo identification, and made their names and residential addresses a matter of public records that would be available on the PDC website.

Back in 1993, a much less “in your face” requirement was declared to be unconstitutional by the 9th Circuit U.S. Court of Appeals in WIN v. Warheit. That state law merely required listing the names and addresses of paid signature gatherers on the campaign finance reports filed with the PDC. The 9th Circuit determined this requirement chilled freedom of speech, since people gathering signatures for unpopular causes could be subjected to harassement, if their names and addresses could be determined.

Given the decision in WIN v. Warheit, the much more onerous requirements of HB 2601 would have been obviously unconstitutional. Had HB 2601 gone been passed, it would have never gone into effect, since a federal judge would have probably immediately slapped a temporary restraining order against it, pending making a final ruling on the matter. Instead, HB 2601 would have cost Washington taxpayers a great deal of money — the attorney time that the AG’s office would have spent defending it, plus the attorney fees that would have been awarded to Eyman’s attorney (John Groen, remember him?), since federal law provides for attorney fees in “civil rights” cases — such as suing to declare a law in violation of the U.S. constitution.

7. michael spews:

Schwarzenegger, wants to fix California’s budget by plugging tax loopholes. Poor Republicans, the only Republican left in public office that anyone can stand wants rich folks and businesses to pay more taxes.

http://www.latimes.com/business/taxes/la-me-arnold29feb29,1,2687138.story
The governor says in Los Angeles that eliminating many breaks would raise $2.5 billion and forestall deep cuts to schools. Foes accuse him of breaking a ‘no new taxes’ pledge.
By Evan Halper and Molly Hennessy-Fiske, Los Angeles Times Staff Writers
February 29, 2008
Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger eased his long-held opposition to more taxes Thursday, saying some of California’s $16-billion budget gap could be erased by reducing or eliminating billions of dollars in state tax breaks for businesses and individuals.

Addressing a community forum at a breakfast in downtown Los Angeles, the governor said he would like to raise as much as $2.5 billion in new revenue by closing “tax loopholes.” Schwarzenegger said the money could be used to offset some of his proposed $4.4 billion in school cuts, which educators say would lead to teacher layoffs and larger classes.

Related Stories
- Governor gives volunteerism a boost to cabinet rank
- Schwarzenegger endorses McCain
- Republican Schwarzenegger, GOP don’t get along
- Pain of proposed state budget cuts is widely spread
- Budget analyst criticizes Schwarzenegger’s plan

The governor endorsed the framework of a spending plan put forward last week by the Legislature’s chief budget analyst as an alternative to Schwarzenegger’s fiscal blueprint, which addresses the state’s deficit mostly with cuts and borrowing.

Legislative Analyst Elizabeth G. Hill in her plan called on lawmakers to limit cuts to state programs by scaling back tax breaks for seniors, parents, yacht owners and companies that have research-and-development expenses, locate in blighted neighborhoods or lose money.

Schwarzenegger said he did not necessarily support eliminating the specific write-offs and credits that Hill proposed, but he would like to raise more than $2 billion by going after tax breaks.

“I am a big believer that when we have a financial crisis like this, we all should chip in,” he said. “This why I totally agree with the Legislative Analyst’s Office when she says we should look at tax loopholes. . . . We should go after those tax loopholes. We need the extra $2.5 billion. This is $2.5 billion we could give straight to education. I am totally for that. We should go for it, and we should do it because everyone has to give something in order to make this work.”

8. Arjifar spews:

You’ve got to know about this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eygv8qEkiFE

9. slingshot spews:

Lying to Planned Parenthood to prove IT’S immorality?
Did the asshole actually make the donation, or just use his manipulation to create this piece of genius?

10. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Hey Michael need some real data on California?

http://www.alec.org/fileadmin/newPDF/California.pdf

CA is 9th worst economic outlook of the 50 states. From the report Rich States, Poor States “Out of the 25,000 or so seven-figure-income families, more than 5,000 left in the early 2000s, and the loss of their tax payments accounted for about half the budget hole.”

Has the 2nd highest top marginal personal income tax rate
Has the 2nd highest mass migration out of the state rate

http://www.alec.org/ “”States are in direct competition with each other for human capital and business investment. State governments that think they can attract jobs and people, and grow their economies, by taxing their citizens at a higher rate than their neighbors are sadly mistaken,” said Democratic Arkansas state Sen. Steve Faris, ALEC’s 2008 national chairman. “Legislators should take a close look at where their state ranks in this book and use it as a tool to help them improve.””

Hannah, 16%ers throw up words from left-wing MSM, Puddy strikes with the facts.

11. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

For those 16%ers here is WA State:

http://www.alec.org/fileadmin/newPDF/Washington.pdf

12. JamesA spews:

The best political ad I’ve seen this year. Ha Ha! Viva Obama!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fd-MVU4vtU

13. BushLied spews:

Again – the right wingers must be hatin’ this Goldy. They HATE it when you get on the radio. They want to own the ball, the refs, the playing field and the announcers. It’s the only way they can win.

14. Richard Pope spews:

Puddybud @ 10

Actually, Washington ranks pretty highly with the right-wing American Legislative Exchange Council. ALEC gives Washington favorable ratings, because we have a highly regressive tax system, where rich people pay a far smaller percentage of their income in taxes, than do poor people.

15. michael spews:

@10

Just pointing out that the 1 Republican left that anyone likes is doing exactly what Republicans hate.

16. My Goldy Itches spews:

His Excellency, the Honorable Mr. Tim Eyeman…..will have my vote 100% of the time for his initiatives. He has saved me literally thousands of dollars over the past several years. Thank you Your Honor!

17. michael spews:

@16

Actually, he hasn’t saved you a dime.

18. Another TJ spews:

He has saved me literally thousands of dollars over the past several years.

You misspelled “cost”. You’re welcome for the correction.

19. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Michael: he’s driving out people left and right. I bet many of the 5000 Millionaires are Donkey. Why should they leave, he’s doing exactly what Donkey love…

20. devildog spews:

Goldy – I’m listening to you take on Tim Eyman. Bravo. when I first heard about your horse’s ass initiative, it was one of those moments in politics that made me chuckle – that kind of devilish chuckle (see Reuters picture today of Hillary in front of devil mascot) that politicians probably do in private because someone has gotten through to the truth.

Devildog

21. slingshot spews:

Itching Goldy, can we see the line item details of your savings? Or are you just day dreaming?

22. Upton spews:

So, Eyman won’t come on, but he will with Ross and Monson. That’s because Monson and Ross both kiss his butt. Maybe he’s afraid you might actually ask him a tough question or two, instead of giggling like a school girl with him as Ross is prone to do.

23. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Goldy: You missed an opportunity for Union Alerts:

http://www.seiuvoice.org/2008/02/sf-weekly-reports-once-secret-dispute.html

24. slingshot spews:

Why is Chelsea Clinton so ugly? Because her father is Janet Reno.”

– Sen. John McCain, speaking to a Republican dinner, June 1998.

Wouldn’t hanging by your arms for extended periods of time actually make them longer not shorter?

25. GBS spews:

I see the Drudge Report outed the combat position of Prince Henry in Afghanistan. Here’s a guy, born to riches and fame who is fighting on the front lines of war, unlike the Bush twins or the Mormon’s sons.

Since the conservative media outed him, the British had to remove him from the combat theater.

This is disgusting to report such sensitive military information during a time of war about our allies who are actually fighting the War on Terror with us, against the REAL terrorist who attacked America on 9/11. It also places our forces in more danger as the Taliban would have certainly ran suicide missions the get the prince at all costs.

Nary a peep the resident trolls who rail on and on about the Liberal MSM.

It just can’t be said enough; Conservatives are unpatriotic.

26. My Goldy Itches spews:

17 – Hasn’t saved me a dime. Hmmmmmm……$600 car tabs prior to 1999, $30 since then.

You’re right, he hasn’t saved me a dime.

27. slingshot spews:

Not surprisingly, you’ve missed the jist of the question.

28. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Upton, it’s the same for the fearful donkey candidates not going on Fox News. They are so scared to get tough questions from Brit Hume etc. The difference here is Goldy has made it one of his “personal crusades” to attack Tim Eyman. Why should someone make Goldy credible when all Goldy does is scream against Eyman initiatives?

29. Mr. Cynical spews:

I told y’all there were backroom dealings going on with Microsoft, Boeing & others to try & get a hunk of that phoney-baloney Rainy Day Fund!
More to come.
Gregoire has really bungled our State Finances.
The shell-games & promises will continue to unravel like this one.

30. Mr. Cynical spews:

BushLied says:
“Again – the right wingers must be hatin’ this Goldy. They HATE it when you get on the radio. They want to own the ball, the refs, the playing field and the announcers. It’s the only way they can win.”

You are 100% wrong as usual. We love it when Goldy is on the air hence the nickname from the Shark–
David OWNGOALstein!

Do you really think Goldy is converting people to the New Age Progressive Leftist Pinheaded Klown Kult??
Methinks not.
He is merely preaching to the pathetically small khoir composed of Oba-Morons like you.

31. michael spews:

@26

Your car tabs went down, but the gas tax went up, property taxes went up, sales taxes went up, commute times went up, the number of potholes and unsafe roadways went up. All that happened was a shift from car tabs to other sources of revenue and putting off needed work.

Net savings: zero.

I supported lowering the car tabs. The price of your car has nothing to do with how much damage you do to the roadways. Gas taxes and tolls (I commute over the Narrows bridge about once a week) are the way to go.

32. Roger Rabbit spews:

@1 “And when I asked the troops if they wanted to go home as soon as possible, they said that they miss home but feel invested in Iraq. They have lost many friends and want to be a part of the humanitarian progress they now feel is possible.”

Interesting that a warmonger like you quotes this, pudwhacker. This describes perfectly how warmongers keep wars going beyond all reason. The statement is exactly correct: Soldiers and their families — indeed, entire nations — feel “invested” in the sacrifices they have made, so they continue waging war long past the point where reason and facts should have brought the bloody process to a halt. This is what kept the Confederates fighting the fall of Vicksburg ended any chance of southern victory; this is what kept German soldiers at the front after the fatal reverses in Russia in 1941 and 1942; this is what motivates all soldiers in all wars to beat their heads bloody against brick walls even when their higher commanders know the situation is beyond retrieval. And behind it all is always a group of politicians egging the people on in the hopeless enterprise, and using the words “defeatists” and “unpatriotic” to suppress the voices of reason.

33. Roger Rabbit spews:

@1 What, exactly, are our troops dying for in Iraq, puddy? To get rid of Saddam? Isn’t he dead? Are you still looking for the WMDs he didn’t have? Or is the purpose of this bloody exercise to bring to Iraq the democracy you don’t want in your own country? What is the mission, puddy? Does anyone know what it is? Is there one? Or has this war become an end in itself — fighting merely for the sake of fighting because some people enjoy fighting?

34. Richard Pope spews:

Cynical @ 29

That could be, but not to worry. Dino Rossi will run like an extreme wingnut this time around, and Christine Gregoire will be re-elected by a significant margin. Perhaps not such a large margin by historical standards, but a landslide as compared with 2004.

35. Roger Rabbit spews:

@1 Huh. Wingnuts think it’s a great thing that all an Iraqi needs in order to vote is a thumbprint, but in our own country they want you to produce a birth certificate.

36. Roger Rabbit spews:

@6 “Among other things, it would have required people circulating petitions to display photo identification, and made their names and residential addresses a matter of public records that would be available on the PDC website.”

Oh my! We can’t make signature gatherers meet the same standards voters must, can we? That would be unconstitutional!

37. Roger Rabbit spews:

@7 So, in the end, it turns out that Ah-nold doesn’t have a magic wand he can wave to solve California’s problems, after all. He’s looking more like Gray Davis every day.

38. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer: You are showing your true colors to Hannah. Keep up the good work.

Now to answer your question. I seem to remember Jon Voight as a supporter of the Iraq War, while his daughter was against it earlier. Now that she’s been there and seen changes she changed her mind.

I thought this election was about “change baby”…………

39. Roger Rabbit spews:

@10 Puddinghead thinks that instead of making the people who have the most money pay the same tax rates as everyone else, we should bend over backwards to give them tax breaks so we can engage in a race to the bottom, the culmination of which will be that no one pays any taxes and there will be no public services of any description whatsoever.

40. Piper Scott spews:

The news reports are chock full these days of incidents of terrifyingly increasing gang violence. Much of takes place in parking lots, on the street, and in similar venues.

I propose that Goldy’s broadcasts be disseminated via loudspeakers (taped replays OK if necessary) in affected areas in order to deter any gatherings that might lead to violence or other unlawful behavior.

Just think…hordes of thugs, vandals, and other miscreants running down the street screaming and holding their ears…anything to avoid the pain and shear awfulness of the experience! Goldy…a public service!

Something similar was tried with old Lawrence Welk shows, Montovani, and 101 Strings, but with Goldy what you get is industrial strength irritation and near lethal audio annoyance.

Query: Would the same as an interrogation technique down at Gitmo be considered a violation of the Geneva Accords or other international compacts? Certainly, any public agency that uses this technique might find itself confronted by the ACLU contending that involuntary exposure to Goldy is per se cruel and unusual (an understatement) punishment.

Will the Sierra Club, in turn, file suit contending that such a spew of hot air has detrimental green house gas effect?

Isn’t it always the case that the good ideas entail so much risk?

Esthetically, though, is there much of a difference between Goldy’s Golden Growls and fingernails on a chalkboard?

Please advise; there’s money riding on the outcome!

The Piper

41. Roger Rabbit spews:

@14 Isn’t Washington rated as the 5th best state for business?

42. Roger Rabbit spews:

@24 Hmmm. McCain’s resume not only includes crashing 3 Navy jets and signing a “confession” for enemy propaganda use, but also publicly making fun of children because of who their parents are. And some people think this guy should be president?!!

43. Politically Incorrect spews:

The War on Drugs is a waste of time. Time to come to the conclusion that folks like to alter their consciousness with drugs. Stop getting in the way of the exercise of personal freedom.

44. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Hannah:

You know I waited for 2.5 hours for some donkey to say wow the rich are paying their fair share. California has a $16 MMM (Billion) budget gap. Almost half that gap is due to 5000 rich millionaires leaving the state.

So employing simple PuddyMath let’s say $7.5 MMM is due to rich peeps leaving $7,500,000,000/5,000 is $1,500,000 per millionaire just in state taxes. $1 Million, 5 hundred thousand taxes paid per person.

Yet Hannah, the 16%ers say that’s not enough, and that’s just their state tax rate.

45. Roger Rabbit spews:

@25 Isn’t divulging military secrets considered treason?

46. Roger Rabbit spews:

Of course, these days it’s hard to find anything righties do that ISN’T treason.

47. Politically Incorrect spews:

Roger @ 42,

If Obama wins big on Tuesday, McCain will lose in November. Got to get Hillary out of the picture for that to happen, though. Hopefully, by this time next week, she will have withdrawn from the campaign.

48. Roger Rabbit spews:

@26 You can thank Gov. Locke and the legislature for that. Eyman’s initiative? It was thrown out by the courts, and never saved anyone a dime, because the guy’s too stupid to figure out how to write an initiative that contains only one subject.

49. Politically Incorrect spews:

Until we have a flat rate tax with no deductions, people will be constantly bitching about the rich.

50. Roger Rabbit spews:

He’s either stupid, or he’s very smart — as in, deliberately sabotaging his own initiatives so people will keep giving him money. After all, if his initiatives were successful, he’d put himself out of business, wouldn’t he?

51. Roger Rabbit spews:

@49 I would gladly accept a flat-rate state income tax with no exemptions to get rid of what we have now. Then, the poor would pay the same percentage of their income to the state as the rich, instead of 4 1/2 times as much.

52. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Hannah:

What about all those “illegals” out of a job because those 5000 millionaires left California?

All those:
gardening
house cleaning – doesn’t include windows so
window cleaning
nannying
painting
roofing
gutter maintenance
chauffering – wait a minute some donkey once said they can’t drive
car washing and waxing (personal detailers)
pool cleaning

jobs went poof due to overbearing taxes and regulations in California.

53. Roger Rabbit spews:

@38 “Pelletizer: You are showing your true colors to Hannah. Keep up the good work.”

Should I tell her that I’m a Democratic Party hack and a liberal propagandist, or do you think we should keep that as our little secret? hehehe

54. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer@53: I think she figgered you out as a 16%er yesterday or today.

55. Roger Rabbit spews:

@44 Talking to yourself, puddy? Just askin’.

56. Roger Rabbit spews:

@47 My position has always been that any Democrat can beat any Republican in ’08. Hell, Mickey Mouse could beat the GOP this year.

57. correctnotright spews:

the real news reports:

1. the highly touted political progress in Iraq – GONE – not approved by the Iraqi parliment (good-bye Patreus).

2. turkey invading the one peaceful area of Iraq – OUCH!

3. McCain – all his charity goes to his kids private school – way to walk the talk McCain!

4. Blood thinner form china tied to more deaths – so much for republicans and regulations for our health

5. Oil at a new high – dollar weaker than ever.

Yup – the bush 22%ers are really doing great things for our country – and for anyone dumb enough to think the surge is “working” – that it is anything more than a temporary lull and an al Sadr cease fire away from the country erupting…well I have swamp land in florida for you (that is after our president comes to grips with 4 dollar per gallon gas and that the economy stinks – the clueless fool thinks things are going great and that oil is cheap!).

58. michael spews:

49, 51

Yup!

Actually, the first 20K or so that everyone earns should be tax free. There’s no sense in people who make sub-livable wages paying taxes.

59. Roger Rabbit spews:

@54 Interesting that you keep talking to someone who isn’t here — unless you’re her? Just askin’, puddy. We already know “Hannah” is one of you trolls; the only question is, which one?

60. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer@55: No I have fully operational male equipment between my legs and my grandmothers are dead and I am older than 36.

You need to get that tinnitus checked as you hearing voices again.

61. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer since simple thread walking is a problem for you…

http://www.horsesass.org/?p=4384#comment-750169

This is what she wrote. And you can check with Lee or Darryl since the regularly out lefties by name or IP Address.

Hannah and Puddy are two distinct people.

But you Pelletizer are delirious.

See ya

62. Roger Rabbit spews:

@60 Gee, pudwhacker, of course I believe anything YOU say … (snicker)

63. Richard Pope spews:

Puddybud @ 52

So does that explain why we have so many California millionairies in Washington? They all left California’s progressive taxation to enjoy Washington’s regressive taxation?

64. Richard Pope spews:

On that same note, Stefan Sharkansky moved from California to Washington as well.

65. Roger Rabbit spews:

Wall Street reacted today to Chimpface’s announcement that we’re not in a recession by dropping 355 points on the Dow.

66. Roger Rabbit spews:

Looks like someone doesn’t believe the organ grinder monkey.

67. Richard Pope spews:

So who is Hannah? Perhaps a female person, but whoever Hannah might be, I don’t notice any of her (or his) posts on this thread. But everyone keeps talking to Hannah!

68. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer, Hannah comes and goes. I am helping her understand the 16%ers here.

I invited her to my house for Thanksgiving. She can see how a crazed (your terminology) individual such as Puddy treats his fellow man/woman. I’d invite you too but you’d probably keel over from the great food smells hitting your lungs and Puddy would rather you be his foil rather than a dead house guest!

69. Roger Rabbit spews:

$4 gas and 400 points off the Dow — that should get voters in the right mood to re-elect the incumbent party, ya think?!

(snicker)

(snort)

HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR

70. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer@62: Ask Darryl or Lee. I know they are at your beck and call. Even Darryl seldom ejects your out of topic threads.

71. Roger Rabbit spews:

John McCain’s solution for all this is 100 years of war and more tax breaks for gadzillionaires.

72. Roger Rabbit spews:

@70 I already have.

73. Roger Rabbit spews:

@70 (continued) I never really suspected you, puddy. “Hannah” looks more like the work of Doofus or klake.

74. Roger Rabbit spews:

@70 (continued) But, in any case, I’m sure Darryl will get to the bottom of it and clear up the mystery. The one thing I can say for certain right now is that “Hannah” isn’t who he claims to be.

75. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Richard Pope@63: I don’t know because I’m not sure the migratory habits of millionaires has been studied much. But we can ask Perfesser Darryl, who always has a comment or two on just about every topic. I’m sure he has some nascent work on this…

76. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Correctnotright:

Name the 7 largest consumers of oil in 1990 and their quantities?

Name the 7 largest consumers of oil in 1995 and their quantities?

Name the 7 largest consumers of oil in 2000 and their quantities?

Name the 7 largest consumers of oil in 2005 and their quantities?

Name the 7 largest consumers of oil in 2008 and their quantities?

77. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Is Correctnotright really that stupid?

78. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Richard Pope: Check back threads.

“Hannah” appeared a day or so ago. View the attack by your friends on her. See how we on the right treated her.

Big diff right?

80. Little Lord Fauntleroy spews:

Hannah:

“And you may find yourself living in a shotgun shack
And you may find yourself in another part of the world
And you may find yourself behind the wheel of a large automobile
And you may find yourself in a beautiful house, with a beautiful
wife
And you may ask yourself: Well…How did I get here?” Words by David Byrne

Feel better now?

81. rhp6033 spews:

This morning, they were replaying a clip on the radio:

Reporter:”Since several experts have said gas prices will reach $4.00 a gallon by April….”

Bush: “What was that?”

Reporter: “Several experts have reported gas prices will reach $4.00 a gallon by April….”

Bush: “Who said that?”

Reporter: “Well, there are several reports from different sources…”

Bush: “I hadn’t heard that…. Maybe I’ll have to check up on that….”

He seemed to be really surprised. Of course, a number of people in L.A. immediately called in to report that gas prices in their area were already at $4.00 per gallon.

Talk about being out of touch with reality…..

82. Politically Incorrect spews:

Well Roger, at least you and I agree on the income tax issue. Finally!

I still say you need to have Hillary out of the race to inusre the Dems win in 2008.

(BTW, I’ll be voting for any third party candidate that ain’t Hillary, McCain or Obama.)

83. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

rhp6033: Why do Californians pay almost $4 gallon?

It’s a couple of years old but you need a PuddyStudy!

84. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

rhp6033: This link – http://www.energy.ca.gov/gasoline/gasoline_q-and-a.html

85. GBS spews:

@ 81:

Remember when Bush’s “daddy” didn’t know the price of a gallon of milk?

Now, how can you help the middle class, or profess to, when you don’t even know the kitchen table issues?

Being rich is great and I applaud those who have done it by playing by the rules, but when a born-in-the-mouth-with-a-silver-spoon dumb ass is, or wants to be, the president they better God Damn well know what matters to the common people.

And that is exactly what Bush does not care about. Take the whole FISA dust up. He’s more concerned with protecting corporations from “possible” lawsuits in lieu of certainly protecting the American public.

All Bush needs is a judge to confirm the legality of a wire-tap and it’s done. With the proper protection for all parties involved. It’s why we’re a nation of laws and not men.

On the other hand, Bush may have been surprised by the $4 a gallon gasoline because his boys at Exxon probably told him more like $5 or $6 a gallon. You never know with the lying pricks. Always expect the worse.

86. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

@ 81, if that were not bad enough, four minutes later a reporter asked him if he would allow foriegners to contribute to his “presidential library fund”.

Bush replied that he wasn’t paying attention to that now, he was paying more attention to things like the price of gas. While he said this, he was nodding at the reporter who first asked about the price of gas.

Just Amazing.

87. Little Lord Fauntleroy spews:

The thing that constantly amazes me is that 50% of the voters voted for this duncible. You can see that he is brain damaged.

88. Richard Pope spews:

Puddybud @ 78

I read some thread from yesterday, I believe. I looked up “Hannah” on here, using the Google. From what I read, Hannah supports Obama and thinks that Bush sucks. So I am not exactly sure why some of the regulars on here are attacking her. Maybe they think she is fake, since she represents to be a 36 year old woman, and almost all of the people who post on blogs are men.

But how did you invite her to your house on Thanksgiving (a little over 3 months ago), when you just saw her on here for the first time a day or two ago?

89. Richard Pope spews:

Little Lord Fauntleroy @ 87

Maybe because they thought the opposition sucked even worse? They may have voted for Bush in 2000, not knowing him so well, because of a belief he was better than Gore. But in 2004, most of Bush’s support must have came from people who thought he didn’t suck as bad as Kerry.

90. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

GBS: We’re buds so let me break it down for you.

http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/dnav/pet/pet_pri_dfp1_k_a.htm

A 42 gallon barrel makes:
19½ gallons of gasoline
9 gallons of fuel oil
4 gallons of jet fuel
11 gallons of other products, including lubricants, kerosene, asphalt, and petrochemical feedstocks to make plastics.

$100/barrel – $2.38
refiner cost – 13c
marketing cost – 5c
transportation cost – 15c
retailer cost – 5c
refiner, marketer, transporter, retailer profit – 10c
WA State taxes 41.4c

$3.27

Now some gas stations make more profit than others

91. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Then GBS: As I was doing my PuddyFacts research I stumbled on this CA gas cost site.

http://www.energy.ca.gov/gasoline/margins/index.html

Enjoy…

The oil companies make their profits from the number of gallons sold.

92. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Richard Pope: I placed my invitation to Hannah for this year 2008.

93. Roger Rabbit spews:

@74 Darryl says “Hannah” is a liar and a fake.

94. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Richard Pope:

Little Lord Fauntleroy name #18 of is Headless Lucy. He lost it earlier this month when Marvin Stamn and I reminded him of earlier comments. He even called my PudWax in his harry poon name.

Do you need the 24/7 proof? Google it fine sir you have the skillz.

95. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Where does Darryl say this Pelletizer?

Is he breaking Goldy’s rule of outing?

Where is the link?

96. Roger Rabbit spews:

@75 I can describe the migratory habits of one millionaire — Tom Stewart, formerly the GOP’s largest contributor in Washington state.

Stewart lived in, and ran his business from, this state for decades because Washington doesn’t have a state income tax.

Then he retired to Arizona, which doesn’t have an inheritance tax.

In short, Republican millionaire freeloaders can be counted on to move to wherever they get the best tax breaks (at the expense of other citizens) at the moment.

Assholes.

97. Roger Rabbit spews:

Funny how people who bitch and whine about supporting schools and roads don’t mind throwing millions of dollars at political candidates.

98. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

So Pelletizer are you claiming the 5000 Millionaires who ran from California are only Republicans? With all those donkey hollyweird liberals there?

Good try at changing the topic since the CA budget shortfall proves the rich pay more than their fair share.

99. Roger Rabbit spews:

@78 “‘Hannah’ appeared a day or so ago.”

Actually, no. According to Darryl and Lee, “Hannah” appeared some time ago, and was lying when she (he?) said the other day that he (she?) had never posted here before.

Now that we know “Hannah” is a liar, you know what to do with the rest of what she says.

http://tinyurl.com/2zpclp

100. Roger Rabbit spews:

@78 “See how we on the right treated her.”

With the same gullibility with which you swallowed Bush whole without asking any questions. Next …

101. Roger Rabbit spews:

I’d love to watch a Marine recruiter work over pudbutt. He’d sign anything.

102. Roger Rabbit spews:

@79 Eat shit, wingnuts. You fuckers not only are going down in November, you’re going down to a black man. I think it’s delicious!

103. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

So Darryl if you are outing Republicans on this blog again, why not tell us how many names headless lucy really uses to pump up the blog visit stats?

Fair is fair. Either shut up on everyone or blab on both sides.

Oh wait a minute… Perfesser Darryl will tell me he’s not a donkey but a Republican so he can out a Republican. NOT!

Being a Republican means you have rules to live by: Reagan’s 11 Commandment: “Thou shalt not speak ill of a fellow Republican”

So this means you can spill the beans on headless lucy 24/7 now!

104. Variable 42 spews:

Is the War on Drugs overloading our prisons? I think drugs should be legal, but if you engage in criminal activity while on drugs, you go to jail. PERIOD. My family has been victimized too many times by meth-heads engaged in our revolving-door justice system. Whether legal or not, these morons will continue to commit crimes to support their habit, and the only way to stop them is put them in jail. They’re long past “education” because they were stupid enough to start meth in the first place. Mr. Goldstein, would you honestly rather live in a neighborhood with just a dozen meth or crack addicts, or would you rather they were in jail? Is 1% too high a percentage of our population to be in jail? Given the number of repeat drunk drivers still on our roads and the number of sexual predators released into society, I say 1% is TOO LOW.

105. Roger Rabbit spews:

@68 No, puddy, “Hannah” is here regularly but uses different screen names.

106. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Hmmm… Pelletizer Google doesn’t have any Hannah postings from way back…

107. Roger Rabbit spews:

@82 My position on income taxes hasn’t changed over the last 3 years. I’ve always been willing to accept a flat rate in exchange for the rich giving up their special exemptions and tax rates.

108. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

So Pelletizer as we say in networking you received out-of-band data no one else has access to?

Back channel or back draft?

109. Roger Rabbit spews:

@82 In particular, in case you didn’t notice, I have been saying rather loudly for months that wages should be taxed at the same rate as capital gains and dividends, instead of 3 times as much.

110. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer@100: No it’s called kindness something a 16%er is devoid of…

111. Roger Rabbit spews:

@83 “Why do Californians pay almost $4 gallon?”

Ummm … because oil companies have been closing “obsolete” refineries that “aren’t needed” anymore?

112. Roger Rabbit spews:

For several years now, the biggest bottleneck between consumers and oil wells has been U.S. refining capacity. Righties love to blame this on environmentalists. Somehow, though, the U.S. Energy Department’s official web site has escaped the notice of the Wingnut Central Propaganda Office, because that web site somehow has gotten away with posting the truth: U.S. refining capacity has been expanding since the early 1990s.

Yes, it’s true the number of refineries is less now, but that’s because oil companies have been closing older, smaller, less efficient, and therefore less profitable refineries and consolidating their refining operations at larger refineries where capacity is being expanded faster than old refineries are closed.

The closure of this old, small, inefficient, and less profitable refineries is driven by economics. Environmental laws had nothing to do with it.

Yet another wingnut myth goes down in flames.

113. Roger Rabbit spews:

Another Republican myth: Cutting or suspending gas taxes would result in lower pump prices.

The final pump price is a result of market forces of supply and demand. People buy more gasoline when it’s priced at $2.69 than when it’s priced at $3.29. If the industry can’t supply enough gas to satisfy demand at $2.69 they will raise the price until demand comes into balance with the amount of gas they can supply. If that price is $3.29, then that’s what gas is going to sell for, regardless of whether gas taxes are 5 cents, 50 cents, or $1.50.

So, when Republicans oppose gas taxes to pay for road and bridge repairs, what they’re really doing is taking money away from needed infrastructure projects and giving it to oil companies as increased profit. If gas taxes are reduced, the consumer won’t get a penny of it. Every cent of the tax reduction will be taken by the oil industry as profit. That’s because if you try to reduce the pump price by cutting gas taxes, the temporarily lower price will create a demand-supply imbalance that will immediately push pump prices right back up to where they were before.

Yet another wingnut myth explodes.

114. Roger Rabbit spews:

Another thing: When gas taxes are spent on road and bridge repairs, the money is spent in this country and goes to American workers. But because North America was thoroughly explored for oil decades ago, most oil exploration is taking place abroad, and if the oil companies get that money and spend it on finding new supplies, little or none of it will be spent in the U.S. and very little of it will go to American workers. So, by cutting gas taxes, Republicans are exporting American money and jobs to foreign countries. As if they haven’t done enough of that already …

115. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

How do wingnut theories explode without the links to prove it Pelletizer?

116. Marvin Stamn spews:

#111 Roger Rabbit says:

@83 “Why do Californians pay almost $4 gallon?”
Ummm … because oil companies have been closing “obsolete” refineries that “aren’t needed” anymore?

  
Would you agree that demand for gasoline has gone up in the last 25 years?
  
When was the last time a refinery was built in california?

117. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer BULLSHITTIUM Alert

“Every cent of the tax reduction will be taken by the oil industry as profit. ”

http://www.energy.ca.gov/gasoline/margins/index.html – So you are saying the CA state government is in cahoots with the oil companies and providing erroneous data?

End of Pelletizer BULLSHITTIUM Alert

118. Roger Rabbit spews:

@88 “Maybe they think she is fake”

No maybe about it, Richard. Darryl and Lee have both been tracking this poster, and Darryl told me in an e-mail this morning that “Hannah” was “a liar” when she (he?) posted a few threads back that he (she?) was posting here for the first time.

We know “Hannah” was lying when she (he?) said that, so why should we believe he (she?) isn’t lying about everything else, too? She (he?) wouldn’t be the first troll to come on here pretending to be an independent (or even a Democrat) and pretending to support Obama.

“Hannah” is a fake and a liar, and it’s very likely his (her?) professed support for Obama is fake, too. If you followed what she (he?) said about religion last night, there’s very little chance this poster will vote for Obama or any other Democrat. “Hannah”‘s remarks about religion were straight out of the Jerry Falwell – Mike Huckabee – Roy Moore playbook.

119. Roger Rabbit spews:

@89 Richard, I believe Bush’s margin of victory in 2004 came from the combined effects of (a) Republican black boxes and (b) the Republican voter suppression campaign.

120. Roger Rabbit spews:

Bush didn’t win in 2004 any more than he won in 2000.

121. Roger Rabbit spews:

@90 You forgot the federal fuel tax, pudnuts, which is 18.4c gasoline and 24.4c on diesel. After you add that in, it’s clear all the oil companies lost money last year and are now filing for bankruptcy.

122. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

GBS add 13c to the taxes value I forgot to add all the tax increases so Gallon of gas in WA State is really around

$3.40

123. Little Lord Fauntleroy spews:

Any troll that uses the word ‘donk’ is PudWax™. I am going to start keeping track. Jane Ballough’s Dog is Wax™ fer sure.

124. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer@119: MIT and CALTech continue to say you are wrong.

But keep hope alive.

125. Roger Rabbit spews:

In 2006, Exxon reported EBITDA of $39.5 billion on revenues of $377.6 billion, which according to my Handy Dandy Roger Rabbit Calculator is 21.1%. So maybe you can explain how Exxon extracts a 21.1% profit rate from a 10-cent-a-gallon profit that they split with refiners, transporters, and retailers? There must be a hell of a markup on the donuts and coffee they sell in their gas stations.

126. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Wrong oh headless_lucy@123:

Darryl please explain to the 24/7 racist that JBD and I are two different people. I know you did this before but the racism is so rampant in his head facts have no room to live there.

127. Roger Rabbit spews:

Pudnuts may not be “Hannah,” but they have something in common: They’re both liars.

128. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer I explained this weeks ago. Go back and search this blog archive as I went through how much the WA State makes and the Feds make from a years worth of imports.

I realize the little tiny brain can’t keep up, but you’ll have to keep the PuddyFacts on your desktop from now on.

Or, maybe Clueless Idiot can search for you.

129. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

In 2007 Exxon made $40.7 MMM Profits. I know this because this was my basis point.

130. Melvin 'Skittlededoo' Gainsborough spews:

Pud — you are paranoid.

131. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer and you are the king of BULLSHITTIUM.

It used to be a rare earth element but your butt makes so much the price keeps dropping. And as I see there is not end in sight.

132. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Melvin ‘Skittlededoo’ Gainsborough is this name #19?

133. Roger Rabbit spews:

@92 “Where does Darryl say this Pelletizer?”

In a private e-mail to me about 1 hour ago.

“Is he breaking Goldy’s rule of outing?”

No, because he didn’t tell me who “Hannah” is.

“Where is the link?”

Here and here and here.

http://www.horsesass.org/?p=4376#comment-749010
http://www.horsesass.org/?p=4316#comment-743531
http://www.horsesass.org/?p=4316#comment-743664

These links will take you to a total of 5 comments posted by the same person under 3 different screen names, the latest of which is “Hannah.”

134. Roger Rabbit spews:

@133 is in reply to @95 not @92

135. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer I pay $3.29 a gallon.

If my figgers are so wrong how come the AAA

http://www.fuelgaugereport.com/WAavg.asp

basically says I am spot on?

136. Roger Rabbit spews:

@98 I don’t care a fig about California, pudnuts. That’s because I live in Washington, where the poorest households pay 4 1/2 times the tax rate as the richest households for state and local taxes.

137. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

So Darryl, we want due diligence on the 24/7 racist.

Post all his recent names. Or you really don’t own a set after all.

138. Roger Rabbit spews:

@103 Why don’t you ask him? Just find Darryl’s name on a thread, click on his name, that’ll bring up his e-mail address, type your request, and click on “Send.” If you need help, ask a kid to show you how.

139. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer@136 catch up see #135

140. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Here Pelletizer:

http://www.washingtongasprices.com/

Sure looks like PuddyFacts are right again. Take the high and low and average them out.

$3.40/gallon

141. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

I think “Hannah” is the same clown here: Wondering why I am a Democrat

http://www.horsesass.org/?p=4316#comment-743489

Who later posted as: Reel in the newbie!!! here

http://www.horsesass.org/?p=4316#comment-743561

And got caught by Lee here

http://www.horsesass.org/?p=4316#comment-743664

Sounds like the same MO for “Hannah”

142. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Yes BO, and Lee broke Goldy’s rules when he displayed an IP Address. Did he whack his pee-pee?

143. Hannah spews:

Wow…everyone missing the lying troll I am? Damn!
How these LIES get spread are sickening! You can research my whole freaking life and will find I have been nothing but 100% honest! I log on from work and home…actually one of my republican follower bosses told me about this site, in hopes of convincing me to walk away from Obama. RR and BO are pushing me.

And yes the first time I, myself, posted anything on this sick, psycho site was a couple days ago.

RR and whoever else who seem to think you can’t slander and lie about others? Whatever makes you feel better! I will just be sure to bypass your comments as they will give me no true insight to my questions on politics, just dishonesty, hatred and anger…the whole reason it took me over a month to ever even post.

Puddy…thanks for the defense. I will just ignore the childish behaving ones because there has been quite a few people on here, both dems and reps that have been very respectful and helpful! :)

144. Roger Rabbit spews:

@104 Are you the latest reincarnation of “Hannah” a/k/a “Reel in the newbie!!!” a/k/a “Wondering why I am a Democrat,” or just another run-of-the-mill troll?

The discussion here is about whether people should be imprisoned for possession or use, dummy. Nobody is saying meth lab operators, dealers, or people who commit theft or other crimes to support their drug use should run loose in society. The issue is whether people whose only infraction is using illegal drugs should be sent to prison or drug treatment. For years and years, the King County Bar Association has supported the latter. We are squandering billions of dollars on incarcerating people who haven’t hurt anyone except themselves. And guess what, drugs are as available in prison as they are on the streets, so locking them up doesn’t even stop them from using drugs.

145. Roger Rabbit spews:

@106 Noooo, you wouldn’t find posts under other screen names by googling “Hannah,” woooould you?

146. Hannah spews:

How you can trace IP addresses, and get away with it….hmmm maybe I work in an office with others? I may not be the only one at work posting (I can say i KNOW I’m not)

But I will not rat out a republican, especially since he’s one of my bosses. And his opinions are his opinions, I don’t slander him for those!

FREAKS!

147. Roger Rabbit spews:

Are wingnuts like you born this stupid, puddy, or do you have to work out every day to maintain this low level of intellectual performance?

148. Roger Rabbit spews:

@146 Send your complaint to the site administrator.

149. Roger Rabbit spews:

Funny how “Hannah” suddenly shows up right after we’ve been talking about “her” … which makes it look like “she” was here all along, eh puddy?

150. Roger Rabbit spews:

Pretty good bet that “Hannah” is one of our resident trolls.

151. Roger Rabbit spews:

I’m not saying it’s you, pudnuts. It just looks suspicious, that’s all. I’m not sayin’, only wonderin’.

152. Richard Pope spews:

133 & 141

The evidence about Hannah presented so far is still not conclusive. I can’t tell from the postings by “Hannah” (and the other postings referenced by you folks) whether this person is fake or whether this person is using multiple names. And Puddybud isn’t going to see her for Thanksgiving (or at least he wishes!) for another nine months.

I can trust Darryl, if he says Hannah and some other username are coming from the same computer. On the other hand, I haven’t seen the actual post by Darryl where he says this. If this is true, it MIGHT mean that Hannah is the same person as another username. Or it might mean that Hannah has a husband/boyfriend/relative/roommate with somewhat different political views than hers.

153. Richard Pope spews:

143

Or Hannah could be posting on HA from her place of employment. She says her boss is a Republican, and the boss could be posting comments that piss off a lot of people.

154. Roger Rabbit spews:

Well, we don’t need to have any secrets around here. The e-mail I got from Darryl 3 minutes ago says,

“The Hannah’s IP address matches the one Lee mentions in his comment. But, Hannah is not a regular troll. He/she has occasionally shown up as a bit player–nobody noteworthy.”

You’re a bit player, too, puddy but inasmuch as you’re also a “regular troll,” you’re off the hook.

155. Hannah spews:

RR The A typical paranoid schitzo….keep dreaming babe. But thanks for turning me away from going too far left. I have also let others in the office know you have been hacking and not to post again as I keep getting the blame. Fortunately for us, we are a tech company and know hacking is illegal. Personally I find it hilarious you are so delusional and also must just access HA from home? Normal people like me work FT and then I take care of my grandmother FT also, so I do access this thread from a few diffent locations, ALL of which are shared PC’s…keep blaming Puddy…although when I first decided to get involved he did warn me.

156. Melvin 'Skittlededoo' Gainsborough spews:

“Hannah Montana”. They are not too original.

I just started posting here a few minutes ago. My friends call me ‘Skittlededoo’.

157. Roger Rabbit spews:

Apart from our resident wingnut idiots like puddy, flake, and dumb dog, we do get a few transients from Wingnuttia who decide to dip into HA to show those liberals a thing or three … yawn.

158. Hannah spews:

You want pics to prove I’m a 36 YO female? I wish I was male, then I could understand your RR!

No I am not a 40′s some sicko man lusting for a young girl with and “attractive” name….ewwww just gross!

159. Roger Rabbit spews:

Our resident wingnut idiots at least deserve credit for subjecting themselves to what they get on this board and coming back for more. They have more balls than brains, although not a whole lot of either. You can’t say even that much for the wingnut cowards who pop in here to lob a couple of the same old hackneyed talking points and then run back to the wingnut web site they crawled out of the first time they take some minor return fire. Those trolls are merely “targets of opportunity.” Fire at will, guys.

160. Hannah spews:

Richard – seems alot of people on here have reason to lie and hide, but once again I can 100% say I am honest, I have to live with myself so I lead a very honest life.

Seems RR and Darryl can’t believe anyone here actually works for a living and may access from other places, I was even recommended to see this site from a boss. Now I know why!

161. Roger Rabbit spews:

@158 By all means, and feel free to take your clothes off. We liberals are not above drooling over Republican porn.

162. Roger Rabbit spews:

@160 You’ve been outed, you lying asshole. See #133.

163. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

@ 155 “you have been hacking … Fortunately for us, we are a tech company and know hacking is illegal”

Now That Is Rich!!!

A tech company that doesn’t know that when you post to a blog it captures your IP address??

I wonder if the Tech Company has that guy who does the payroll, “M”, but didn’t know that SS tax rate hasn’t been raised since Reagan did it in 1983??

In fact I would bet “M” is just another “Hannah”

http://www.horsesass.org/?p=4373#comment-748586

This is too funny!

164. Roger Rabbit spews:

@135 Because the $100 crude price you’re quoting is a spot market price, and the big refiners don’t pay spot prices, they get their oil under long-term contracts at prices well below the spot market price. That’s why, pudnuts.

165. Hannah spews:

160 mr no nothing anout IP address and the fact people in work places share pc’s

What about it?

166. Richard Pope spews:

Hannah @ 160

Neither your hypothesis nor Darryl’s hypothesis can be disproven with the facts presented. I assume that the IP address is available to a site administrator, without any “hacking” being required. I would trust Darryl if he said that your posts have the same IP address as posts under a different user name. And I would trust Roger Rabbit, when he says that Darryl said that.

I don’t think IP addresses reveal that much, other than the ISP that they are going through. (but I don’t claim to be an expert on this!) I think they do tend to be unique, and could reveal a given computer or even work location, at least on the same day. I haven’t seen anything to prove or disprove that you are or aren’t the same person using other screen names.

167. Roger Rabbit spews:

@135 (continued) Another reason why Exxon can make a 21.1% profit from a 10-cent margin is because

(a) most oil reserves are owned by governments now,
(b) therefore the oil majors make most of their money by providing services, and
(c) payment for these services (and the profit margin thereon) comes out of what the producers are paid for their crude, and
(d) to the extent oil majors still own some reserves, they are also making huge profits on the crude they sell from their own reserves.

In short, pudnuts, there’s a hell of a lot of oil company profit buried in the raw price of crude.

168. Richard Pope spews:

Roger Rabbit @ 164

Don’t refiners buy contracts for future delivery of oil? And aren’t the prices quoted on the market prices for future delivery next month?

169. Roger Rabbit spews:

@141 No maybe about it. I got an e-mail from Darryl a few minutes ago confirming the ISP addresses are the same.

170. Hannah spews:

Richard- I guess Roger and Darryl don’t want me to be accessing HA from more than one PC and definatly not from a shared PC. If I could keep everyone else off of the PCs here at the office I would.

Funny thing is BO says someone named “M” posted? There are quite a few people here that have names that start with M. Coincidence?

171. Roger Rabbit spews:

@142 Send your complaint to the site administrator.

172. Roger Rabbit spews:

141, 142 – Notice how poudnuts always tries to change the subject whenever another lying wingnut gets caught?

173. Roger Rabbit spews:

@170 Shut up. We’ve having a conversation here. Nobody has time for you right now.

174. Hannah spews:

oh roger are your feelings hurt?

175. correctnotright spews:

Puddy is probably a nice guy (I think I might actually like him after he is done insulting me) – it is his lack of big picture vision in his opinions that is the problem.

For instance – Puddy details all the costs that go into the price of oil but negelects to mention that in the last 4 years Exxon has made more money (twice) then any other company on the face of the earth has ever earned in one year. And so on with the other oil companies…(by the way – invest in energy and alternative energy stocks for recession proof investing).

Thanks for all the details on oil prices Puddy – but NET profits don’t lie. We are paying higher prices for oil than ever before and the oil companies are making out like bandits. The price goes up way before the actual crude oil price would hit market and then comes down ever so slowly after the crude price drops. In the meantime – there are the usual “refinery” maintenance (usually on the west coast) and refinery off-line and shortage problems.

You see – with a monopoly there really is no need for a so-called free market – it just doesn’t exist. And if California tries to increase the requirements for gas mileage in cars and trucks – then the Bush administration lackeys in the EPA can just shoot it down and ignore states rights….and ignore their own EPA advise.

Yeah – Puddy’s little picture really gives the big picture ….

176. Hannah spews:

Now you just down right pissed me off, making false accusations and claiming to be a true democrat!

177. Roger Rabbit spews:

@146 It’s easy, sweetheart.

178. Roger Rabbit spews:

Which is why I don’t post on Stefan’s sucky little blog.

179. Hannah spews:

Who the hell is Stefan?!?

180. Roger Rabbit spews:

That and other reasons, not the least of which is that it’s a complete waste of time to try conversing with the blockheads who read his blog.

181. Hannah spews:

Ahh I am guessing a repucblican blog site?

182. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

“Hannah”… just stop… my sides are hurting from laughter…

Every post you make it becomes more and more ridiculous.

Imagine a small “high tech” office, Hannah posts on HA, then she gets some coffee. The boss walks over uses Hannah’s computer and posts on HA.

Then the boss leaves to.. copy a memo or something. Then the payroll guy “M” comes over to Hannah’s computer, and posts to HA. Then he leaves.

Then Hannah comes back with a steaming cup of coffee… and can’t believe people are calling her a troll!!!

This should be a sitcom… it just writes itself!

183. Richard Pope spews:

Hannah @ 179

http://www.soundpolitics.com

184. Hannah spews:

BO- so are you saying all these posts have been happening within minutes of each other? If so I’d like to see these posts.

185. Hannah spews:

Richard- that piper guy runs that blog? No kidding! hahahaha I gotta go check that one out for some giggles. Thank you! :)

186. Roger Rabbit spews:

@152 Richard, my suggestion is that you communicate with Darryl yourself. That way, you can ask him the precise questions you’d like answered. Darryl and Lee have ID’s “Hannah,” “Reel in the newbie!!!,” and “Wondering why I am a Democrat,” based not only on the same IP address but also based on similarities of writing style, and that’s good enough for me. She’s been tried and convicted of lying on this board, and if she wants to appeal, she should take it up with the site administrator.

187. Richard Pope spews:

TBO @ 182

Would the IP address that this site gets be different, if different computers in the same office were being used? I would have to agree that it would be unusual, especially in a “high tech” office, if several people were actually using the same computer.

188. Richard Pope spews:

Hannah @ 185

Piper ruins blogs (as opposed to “runs”).

189. Hannah spews:

RR Have I been tried and convicted by the same justice system you complained about last night?

Keep making yourself feel better…I work around others and YES we all share the same back office PC since we are typically in the field and don’t have our own desks.

190. Hannah spews:

Richard, thats why I was asking RR and Darrl to give me the posts and time stamps “proving” I was playing multiple personality disporder.

Because most the time I am not in the office on the PC all day.

191. Roger Rabbit spews:

@155 I have been hacking? I don’t even know how, sweetcheeks. Nor do I have a clue where you work — if you work. Note, things are at the point where I don’t believe anything you say. Your IP address and multiple screen names were ID’d by the site administrator, not me. It’s true Lee posted your ISP and maybe some people here know how to use that collection of numbers seperated by periods to get more information about you, but I’m not one of them. I’m a lawyer, not an IT person. My knowledge of computers and the internet is let’s say very basic. What is clear is that you were lying when you posted that you had never posted before. Hurts to get caught, doesn’t it? You could have avoided this embarrassment by not lying in the first place.

192. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

“Hannah/Wonder/Reel/M” Yes, the posts between “Wonder” and “Reel” were within a few minutes of each other.

This is just getting hilarious!

193. Richard Pope spews:

Hannah @ 189

That could be possible. You have only apparently appeared in this thread since 3:25 p.m. today.

194. Roger Rabbit spews:

sp correction

separated

195. Roger Rabbit spews:

@189 This is a court of public opinion, babe, which is still considerably better than the Busheviks would give you in Gitmo.

196. Richard Pope spews:

On the other hand, Hannah could be just as phony as all of the supposed scantily clad and attractive young women who keep sending friend requests to myself and every other male user on MySpace.

197. Roger Rabbit spews:

We don’t have to waterboard the truth out of you here. Our site moderators can do it with a keyboard.

198. correctnotright spews:

@183: Richard
I like to visit whackynation and leave little messages there. Lou guzzo is a hoot – every once in while he has a really good idea – and then he writes about 10 absolutely ridiculous things.

Mark Gardner is a global warming denier who thinks that he has disproved global warming because:

a. It is cold in the winter
b. Ice cubes float

and then there is the “perfessor” who writes in an erudite style about how bipartisanship is lacking – only he thinks bipartisanship is democrats blindly follwowing republicans on the war in Iraq.

The intellectual bankruptcy there makes the S and L scandal look like chump change.

On a lighter note – I showed up at Drinking liberally last tuesday and met Goldy and a couple of candidates for office. the beer was good and the conversations fine. Also met Will and Darryl..

199. Roger Rabbit spews:

One thing we don’t like around here, “Hannah,” is people pretending to be something they’re not and hiding what they are by cowering behind a smokescreen of lies, poses, and ever-changing screen names. Puddybutt, for example, even though he’s a slimy fascist traitor, doesn’t make any secret of the fact he’s a troll. I, for my part, freely and frequently admit that I’m a Democratic Party hack and liberal propagandist. Puddy makes no pretense of being unbiased and neither do I. Now that you’ve been outed as a wingnut troll, sweetie, you can come out of the closet now and stop pretending to be otherwise.

200. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Richard I’ll speak to you since Pelletizer is stupid when it comes to technology.

A company can install a proxy server to access the Internet. This one server will host all web communication. usually this is placed in a DMZ (where Pelletizer’s brain lives one most days) where the incoming packets are scrubbed for bad things. If a company has installed this, that means all systems communicating to a web site will display the same IP Address, the company external web address assigned by the web dudes.

But don’t let the facts hit Darryl or Lee or Pelletizer in the head.

201. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

I have multiple computers in my house, with networks galore for me bidness. They will all display the same address to Goldy and the other HorsesASSHoles!

202. Roger Rabbit spews:

@189 So you want us believe that 3 of you use exactly the same computer, think exactly alike, and have exactly the same writing style?

HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR

Give it up, my little chocolate easter bunny. Your credibility went down the toilet about 150 posts ago.

203. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer@154: This I’ve know since I’ve verbally jousted with you.

You R an IDIOT!

204. Richard Pope spews:

Puddy @ 200

True enough. But Hannah has come up with an interesting explanation as to how several people are using the same computer to post comments on HA from her place of employment. If she had used the explanation you just gave — i.e. every computer at her work place will show the same IP address — then that would have been more believable.

205. Roger Rabbit spews:

My suggestion to you, sweetie pie, is that if you wish to continue on your present course of smokescreens and lies you should get yourself yet another new screen name (this one is worn out), a new ISP address, a new online pesonality, and a writing coach who specializes in helping fugitives evade recognition. That’s the minimum you need to do if you hope to get away with your bullshit.

206. Roger Rabbit spews:

In short, you’ve been compromised and need to go underground again.

207. correctnotright spews:

Hannah – I don’t care if you are real or not. Just have an open mind and don’t take everything you read here as fact.

the bottom line for me is that we are wasting 3 billion/year on an unnecessary war in Iraq. In the meantime, we don’t do a good job of taking care of our vets and our economy is going down the drain.

healthcare is a joke – and with 50 million uninsured and countless others underinsured – the system is a mess. Those “socialized” medicine countries are outperforming us and they pay less for health care and get more.

I am tired of the corruption and lobbyist running things in Washington and the huge budget deficits the republicans create. Only clinton has had a budget surplus – despite all the chirping by the republicans.

The K street project (sponsored by Rove and Abramoff) was a republican corruption scheme to link all the lobbying through republicans.

I don’t trust what republicans say – they have been corrupt and profligate spenders when in charge.

I don’t trust republicans on security either. Why haven’t we gone after Bin Laden and Iraq has lowered our ability to go after terrorists and killed our reputation in the world.

208. Roger Rabbit spews:

@200 “Richard I’ll speak to you since Pelletizer is stupid when it comes to technology.”

Untrained, which is not the same thing as “stupid.”

209. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

Buddypud, you moron, “Hannah/Wondering/Reel/M”” already gave up that excuse @ 170.

S/he claims they all use a “shared” PC.

210. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

“Hannah, is it OK if we just call you Sybil from now on?

211. Roger Rabbit spews:

@203 Opinions are like assholes, pudnuts — everybody’s got one.

212. Roger Rabbit spews:

@204 Don’t forget, Richard, for her story to hold water the other two alleged users of her computer would have to think exactly as she thinks and write exactly the way she writes. What are the odds against that?

213. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Richard: Exactly right. The DMZ’d computer is the only real access to the Internet and all company communication comes through it. This will show just how ignorant people here are when you are discussing networking with someone who has done it successfully for 16 years.

For example: I test different IP Addresses at home to simulate activities.

Class A Address 10.X.Y.Z
Class B Address 172.144.A.B
Class C Address 199.137.32.A

But all communication will be from my single well known address supplied by the Internet facing system. In fact you must navigate through three internal firewalls I have at home.

I know you get it Richard. Pelletizer is as dense ans spent uranium.

I do this for a living.

214. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

BO Oh you mean how Pelletizer claimed Truth Teller used the same PC long ago?

215. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

Buddypud, the hoax is over. She already said it is a “shared” computer.

You, on the other hand, are a moron.

216. Roger Rabbit spews:

@204 PLUS … they would also have to (a) know about HA and (b) feel motivated to post here.

I repeat, what are the odds of 3 people working in a hi-tech office

a) sharing 1 computer,
b) having exactly the same political orientation,
c) writing in exactly the same style,
d) all 3 know about HorsesAss,
e) and all 3 are motivated to post on HorsesAss?

C’mon, Richard, you’re a lawyer trained to evaluate the credibility of witness statements, and you know as well as I do this defies belief. The best lawyer in the world couldn’t sell this scenario to any jury. It’s not believable, and you shouldn’t believe a word of it. Her story smells like a feedlot.

217. Roger Rabbit spews:

@207 You’re wasting your time trying to persuade that troll of anything. “Hannah” is just another troll who came here looking for a fight. She’s no more open to your arguments than pudnuts, flakey klake, Doofus the dumb mutt, or any of the other wingnuts who are here only to pick fights. the difference between here and them is she’s one of those transient trolls who comes here posing as a Democrat or an independent in hopes of sucking you into a question-and-answer exchange so she can sucker punch you.

218. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

Sybil’s whole “War on Christmas” thing last night sealed the deal.

Phony as a Buddybuck.

219. YLB spews:

In this thread:

http://www.horsesass.org/?p=4316

A troll pretended to be under 30 and over 70.

Is this really Hannah?

220. Roger Rabbit spews:

@214 Okay Mr. Computer Expert, let’s see if you can understand this. It’s simple, so it should be a piece of cake for an expert like you.

Step 1: As you type your spew in the box under where it says “Spew your opinion,” you may wish to notice there’s 3 more boxes under it, respectively labeled “Name (required),” “Mail (will not be published)(required),” and “Website.”

Step 2: If Mrs. Rabbit wishes to post on HA, she will change “Roger Rabbit” in the “Name (required)” to her screen name. At one time, she was using the screen name “Truth Teller,” although she abandoned that screen name some time ago, and since then a wingnut liar has picked it up and used it (any time a wingnut uses the word “truth” for any purpose, watch out!!).

Step 3: After Mrs. Rabbit has posted on HA, the next time I open any HA thread, the “Name (required)” box will default to the last screen name used, i.e., Mrs. Rabbit’s.

Step 4: If I don’t notice the different screen name, I will accidentally post under her screen name. This has happened a number of times, but when I did, I always posted a follow-on comment identifying myself as Roger Rabbit and identifying the comments posted under Mrs. Rabbit’s screen name as being by me.

Now, to answer your implicit question, Mrs. Rabbit and I have only 1 computer, and only 1 phone line into this fucking hole in the ground. So, naturally, we use the same computer to post on HA. After all, our burrow is a burrow, not a “hi-tech office” like the one “Hannah” claims to work in. Now, for all I know, she could be posting from a trailer park; she lied about not posting before, so why should anyone believe she actually works in a “hi-tech office”? But, I digress. A Computer Expert like you ought to be able to understand that 2 retired bunnies living together in 1 burrow who own only 1 computer and pay for only 1 phone line would post on HA from the same computer. There, now that wasn’t too hard, was it?

You may be an Information Processing Technology Expert, pudnuts, but you’re a complete fucking idiot when it comes to processing and understanding information itself.

221. Roger Rabbit spews:

Which explains why your politics is so fucked up. My guess is your love life probably isn’t much better.

222. Roger Rabbit spews:

@218 Yep, we’ve definitely seen this troll before.

223. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

BO: She said she posted from multiple and shared one.

Since technology and you are diametrically opposed particles, who is the IDIOT?

224. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Ummm… Pelletizer@220 Not the first time. After I outed you in 2006, you then admitted it afterwards.

225. Roger Rabbit spews:

I think we’ve whipped this horse enough. There are 3 new threads ahead of this one, so I’m moving on. Phony Hannah can stay here or follow me, whichever suits his (her?) fancy.

226. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

Pelletizer when it comes to networking technology, if someone trained you, you’d still be stupid.

227. Roger Rabbit spews:

@224 If I didn’t know I was posting under Mrs. Rabbit’s screen name, doesn’t it seem plausible that you might catch it before I did, pudnuts? Thanks for your assistance.

But how is that relevant to the topic under discussion here, which is that Hannah’s story is as phony as a 3-dollar bill? The fact I’m computer-illiterate doesn’t make her (him?) an honest woman. It has nothing to do with anything.

228. Roger Rabbit spews:

Typical poundpounder tactic: When he’s getting his ass kicked, he tries to change the topic. He also seems strangely eager to defend an obvious troll.

229. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

Buddypud @ 223. Completely Utterly False.

Contrary to the drugs you are taking, you can’t change reality just because you say so.

230. PuddyPrick, The Fact Finding Prognosticator... spews:

BO breath@229: Here let me assist your reading skillz:

“I guess Roger and Darryl don’t want me to be accessing HA from more than one PC and definatly not from a shared PC.”

I hear that great sucking sound… when you open your mouth and the vacuum between the ears fills with the in-rushing air…

231. Richard Pope spews:

Hmmm — okay, it is 5:00 p.m. So does that mean Hannah has gone home for the day, and we won’t see her again until at least Monday? She doesn’t have a PC at home?

232. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

Buddypud @ 230

@ 155 “I do access this thread from a few diffent locations, ALL of which are shared PC’s

That sucking sound is Buddypud’s mind imploding and settling like dust in his empty cranium.

233. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

Buddypud, both you and Sybil seem extremely interested in keeping this hoax up.

Sorry Buddypud, don’t set an extra plate for Sybil this Thanksgiving. Unless you already had one set for her/im last Thanksgiving.

234. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

@ 231, Richard, Sybil posted last night till the wee hours.

235. Richard Pope spews:

TBO @ 234

I would still like to see her picture. If she is impossibly young and attractive, then I will know for sure that Hannah is a fake.

236. Hannah spews:

Ok guys, I am officially home so you wanna tell me I have the same Ip address as all these other posters you claim I am?

And BTW I found out through out Tech support dept we have a “proxy” server and it displays the IP address from the server on ALL our PC’s in the officce, but yes 3 others use the same PC I use at work. Once again, show me posts within minutes of each other? I tried to search the poster names you gave me but those posts all seem to be days apart.

237. The Blatantly Obvious spews:

Sybil when you were posting as Wondering why I am a Democrat, and then Reel in The Newbie!!!, your posts were minutes apart.

But who cares anymore, Sybil? You ain’t worth the time dealing with. You’re old wingnut troll news.

238. Hannah spews:

Once again BO…can you PROVE to me where these posts were minutes apart…show me some links please! And besides the guys at work got me good….convinced me to get on here, in hopes of changing my outlook…well THEY didn’t change my outlook but this site is sure making question my devotion to the dem party. I come from a long line of dems and NONE of them are as rude, self centered, angry, hypocritical as the majority here. Puddy has made A LOT of good points and your actions have proven him correct.

All the questions I ask about OUR state government when I ask about tax dollar waste….absolutely not ONE single answer from you people, but people like Puddy and even YLB have been more than helpful. When I see how screwed up OUR state government is it has made me question, do I want dems running the country if they can’t even run our state? Our state is in financial distress, and the explaination now is slowing economy? But the gov has been touting her whole term how strong the economy is here? So which is it? No one can answer that question, or the question about property tax breakdowns. Why? Is that because if I knew where my tax dollar went, I’d fly right?

Thanks for turning me closer to walking away from the dem party. Well Obama that is…Hilary is more your dem type, blame everyone else, point out their mistakes, but then make those SAME mistakes and say oh i’m sorry or turn on the tears.
Amazing how negative this group of dems is compared to all the NORMAL dems I have known. Republicans have their points, not all good, but they can argue and prove some of their points. On here, it’s all about slander. I hope this site is your outlet from your life, since your anger and hatred towards anyone, including other dems, is so blatantly obvious…hahaha I just made a pun!

239. Roger Rabbit spews:

@231 Richard Pope says: Hmmm — okay, it is 5:00 p.m. So does that mean Hannah has gone home for the day, and we won’t see her again until at least Monday? She doesn’t have a PC at home? 02/29/2008 at 5:03 pm

See #236 et seq.

240. Roger Rabbit spews:

@238 “Thanks for turning me closer to walking away from the dem party.”

Oh, PLEASE!!! Your little charade is so OVER, hun! Give it up.

241. Hannah spews:

Um RR when did I ever say I don’t have a PC at home? I only get to come home very few nights a week, and usually very late, as I take care of my grandmother most the time…so usually I am online at work or via internet cafes. Sorry to disapoint you, but I do have a PC at my home, soon I will have one at Grandma’s too.

242. Hannah spews:

Hmmm I definately didn’t vote for Bush EITHER term, I vited for Gregoire….those are just over the past big elections. So believe what you want, I am just not so far left that I can’t see straight.

243. Marvin Stamn spews:

#136 Roger Rabbit says:

I don’t care a fig about California, pudnuts.

  
Of course, with it’s liberal democrats running the state into ruin why should you care. Now if it was a conservative republican you would no doubt find lots of hateful words.
  

That’s because I live in Washington, where the poorest households pay 4 1/2 times the tax rate as the richest households for state and local taxes.

  
Vote the republicans out of office. With a state controlled by republicans what do you expect, taxes to be fair?