by Carl, 09/25/2012, 8:03 AM

125 Responses to “Open Thread 9/25”

1. Serial Conservative spews:

The Lingerie Football League Announces That It Fired “A Couple Crews Which Apparently Are Now Officiating In The NFL” Because Of Incompetence

http://deadspin.com/5946112/

Because a little levity never hurt anyone.

2. Serial Conservative spews:

Republicans to Pollsters: Too Many Democrats In Your Surveys
Party composition has become a conservative flashpoint, but pollsters say it reflects reality.

http://nationaljournal.com/2012-presidential-campaign/republicans-to-pollsters-too-many-democrats-in-your-surveys-20120925

There’s plenty in here for both sides so rather than picking stuff to italicize here I’ll just post the link.

3. Robbie spews:

Good article. Any kind of analysis or forecast of this nature depends on the underlying assumptions. The first thing any reasonable thinking person using these polls ought to do is go right to the underlying assumptions and question the validity, no matter who is doing the polls. What are the assumptions based on and are they reasonable. Certainly some on both sides are tough to justify. Polls have really turned into a weak effort to sway public opinion rather than measure it. Look at how far Reagan was behind Carter with 1 week to go in 1980..something like 7 points behind and he won by 10. Seems like things have gotten slightly better, the week or so before the election.

4. Serial Conservative spews:

In an interview with ABC’s “The View,” Obama — who is in New York to address the United Nations General Assembly — was asked if the Benghazi assault was indeed terrorism.

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/251367-obama-no-doubt-attack-on-libya-consulate-was-terrorism

Meanwhile, Jake Tapper is being allowed nowhere near Obama.

5. No Time for Fascists spews:

Romney thinks he should be able to pull up to other Gulfstreams, roll down window and ask for Grey Poupon

6. No Time for Fascists spews:

NFL management is showing just how dedicated it is to stripping its longtime officials of their pensions by allowing game after game to be compromised by incompetent officials. In fact, the Lingerie Football League has now confirmed that it fired some of these officials for incompetence, only to have them land in the NFL. The NFL cares more about keeping the teeniest sliver of its revenues away from its officials than it does about keeping Lingerie Football League washouts off the field during Monday Night Football. That’s the story here. It’s simple greed, the sense that management and owners can get away with compromising the game on behalf of that greed, and the belief that stripping workers of their power is a worthwhile enough goal for that.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/09/25/1136147/-NFL-scab-refs-go-from-blowing-individual-calls-to-blowing-games?detail=hide

Daily Kos had an interesting take on this fiasco.
Once again, it’s the greed.

7. No Time for Fascists spews:

More greed

Hockey players locked out and NHL staff face layoffs and pay cuts as league owners make money grab
The players accepted a giant pay cut at the end of the 2004-2005 lockout, they’re willing to take a significant pay cut this time, but it’s not good enough for the owners. The owners have hugely valuable teams with huge revenues. But they want more. So screw the workers, screw the fans, they’re going to take more, one way or another.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/09/19/1134003/-Hockey-players-locked-out-and-NHL-staff-face-layoffs-and-pay-cuts-as-league-owners-make-money-grab

I don’t see the owners in financial dire straights being forced to get a side job a chickfillet to cover payroll. It’s just greed.

8. Robbie spews:

Regarding the Packer-Seahawk game last night, how many of you remember the Seahawk-Steeler Super Bowl game where there were 3 major questionable calls in the game and every one of them went against Seattle. Those 3 calls certainly determined the outcome of that game and the refs blew every single one of them. Were those replacement refs?

9. Robbie spews:

Regarding the Packer-Seahawk game last night, how many of you remember the Seahawk-Steeler Super Bowl game where there were 3 major questionable calls in the game and every one of them went against Seattle. Those 3 calls certainly determined the outcome of that game and the refs blew every single one of them. Were those replacement refs?

10. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

@1
Cap’n, are you in favor of bring back the competent UNION refs?

11. Serial Conservative spews:

Before we go all ‘Look for the Union Label’ on the NFL thing, a little perspective:

TAccording to ESPN.com’s Darren Rovell, the average pay for NFL game officials last season was $149,000. Under the NFL’s last proposal, that would increase to more than $189,000 by 2018. In addition, a game official in his first year in 2011 made an average of $78,000. Under the NFL’s last proposal, he would make more than $165,000 by the end of the new agreement.

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nfl/story/_/id/8314433/nfl-use-replacement-officials-start-regular-season

These guys work one day per week, for about 20 weeks per year, exclusive of meetings, CE, etc. We’ll call effort expended in keeping in good physical shape part of the cost of doing business.

Almost all of these guys have other, typically full-time jobs.

They might be union. They’re not what you want to hook your wagon to, tho.

12. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 10

I’m in favor of smaller cheerleading costumes. And more beer commercials like this, my personal favorite:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEVa2swtC10

“You’re takin’ one for the team, so your buddy can live the dream.”

I tear up every time I watch it. (sniff)

13. No Time for Fascists spews:

Just in case you forgot

GOP to Jobless Vets: Drop Dead
Inspired by President Obama’s State of the Union Address challenge to get veterans working, the Veterans Job Corps bill would have created a program to fast-track 20,000 former service members into federal jobs as law enforcement officers, first responders, and parks workers.
http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2012/09/gop-jobless-vets-drop-dead?google_editors_picks=true

Cause republicans have jobs as priority one and the republicans support the troops.

14. don spews:

@11

These guys work one day per week, for about 20 weeks per year

Oh, yea, more of that anti union class warfare bullshit where union workers are lazy and overpaid.

15. No Time for Fascists spews:

11. You know, they are paid well. How dare they ask for a share of any money? They should be grateful what ever the owners trickle on them. I bet you could get an illegal for less than minimum wage to do their work.
I bet we could get an illegal for less than minimum wage to do your job too.

16. Rael spews:

(Serial) conservative trolls:

Romney is doomed.

You know it.

Give up.

17. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

RE: The Avenging Uterus…

81. Serial Conservative spews:
@ 79

If penis size is shrinking maybe it’s because more and more women look like Janeane Garofalo.

83. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

If penis size is shrinking…

I was unaware that it was. It was Rush that was howling about this. Must be a Republican thingy.

Discuss.

18. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 17

If a woman is looking at the top of your head she probably doesn’t care if there’s hair covering it.

19. Rael spews:

How the hell does a major political party
nominate someone to be commander in chief
who doesn’t understand that airplanes at high altitude
have to be airtight?

I guess when creationists & climate change deniers
are your base, that kind of ignorance eventually gets
all the way to the top.

20. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

They might be union. They’re not what you want to hook your wagon to, tho.

Oh, noes! Of course not…no positive story about unions goes without that dire warning from Cap’n Crunch. Glad you’re looking out for us…
*rolls eyes*

These guys are a (now manifestly) essential part of a multi-billion dollar enterprise. And the owners of that enterprise are trying to give them the shaft, in order, as it ever is, to keep more dollars for themselves.

It’s always the same with the right-tards – those union thugs make too much money!!! They make WAY more than you – let’s knock them down to size!!!

Auto workers, longshoremen (and -women), NFL refs, it’s always the same – it’s class warfare that depends on pitting the pissed-off who’ve already had their wages decimated against the shrinking number of union workers with a decent compensation package – all to allow the people who already have too much to have MORE.

MORE. That’s what it’s all about.

MORE.

21. No Time for Fascists spews:

What is a person’s labor worth?
How much income is the right income?

22. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 20

Poor union workers vs. The Man.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/24/walk-out-by-chicago-symph_n_1909291.html?utm_hp_ref=arts

In this case, The Man has some issues:

The Tribune article also includes details about the CSO’s financial state that are less rosy than the orchestra’s official reports indicate:
In the meantime, the CSO has been feeling some financial pressure. According to CSO tax documents, expenses exceeded revenues by $15 million in 2008 and $8 million in 2010 — a significant shortfall for an organization with total annual expenses of about $70 million. In 2009, revenue exceeded expenses, but barely. Tax returns for 2011 were not immediately available, but internal accounting suggests they won’t bring good news. The CSO’s figures (which recorded small surpluses in 2008-10 because they do not include certain debt payments and use a different calendar than the Internal Revenue Service) show deficits of $927,000 for 2011 and $1.3 million for 2012, Rutter said.
Additional financial pressure comes from long-standing debt obligations. The CSO owes about $145 million in loans, money borrowed for the Symphony Center renovation that was completed in 1997. Rutter said the CSO has $16.4 million in pension liabilities.

http://chicagoist.com/2012/09/25/chicago_symphony_orchestra_strike_e.php

23. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 19

How does the nation elect a president who doesn’t know that there are 50 states and not 57?

It’s about the economy. Nothing else.

24. No Time for Fascists spews:

A person is hired because they can make money for someone, more than what is being paid to them.
Should the worker be allowed to maximize what he or she can make?

25. No Time for Fascists spews:

It’s about the economy. Nothing else.
And the republicans just voted down a job bill for vets. So much for the economy, stupid.

26. No Time for Fascists spews:

True, but obama had been given a 57 star flag lapel pin from a republican, so you can understand the error.
http://msgboard.snopes.com/politics/graphics/lapelpin.jpg

27. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 24

Should the worker be allowed to maximize what he or she can make?

Absolutely.

I only pointed out that there is a difference between, say, unions of teachers, communications workers, or the UAW or IAM, whose members typically work ONE job and do it full-time, and the union of NFL officials, who typically have another full-time job and do their work for the NFL on the weekends.

A full-throated defense of NFL referees on the same basis diminishes your arguments in defense of people who have more modest salaries and more basic needs.

Go ahead and demonstrate, scream, get arrested on behalf of the NFL zebras. Just don’t be surprised when you’re tuned out next time you protest on behalf of a local blue-collar union.

28. No Time for Fascists spews:

Should a company be allowed to fire or cut the pay of a person the instant they stop being a top producer like if they get sic, old or pregnant? They are still making the company a profit, just not as much?

29. Rael spews:

@23

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/57states.asp

Obama said 57 when he meant 47 … slip of the tongue.

Romney’s comment reveals that he doesn’t understand basic facts about science.

30. No Time for Fascists spews:

@27.
By your logic, if a teacher or firefighter has a part time job too, then they don’t need to be paid as much at school, since they have another income source.

31. No Time for Fascists spews:

@27, your argument is that we shouldn’t support the union refs because they already have jobs?

So it’s ok allowed to maximize what he or she can make…
unless they already have a job
or
unless they are already make a lot of money?

32. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 30

By my logic, a part-time actor who also works as a teacher doesn’t need to be paid as much by the acting company, because he/she has a day job.

33. No Time for Fascists spews:

A full-throated defense of NFL referees on the same basis diminishes your arguments in defense of people who have more modest salaries and more basic needs.

You do realize that your argument could be also used to limit CEO pay.
A full-throated defense of CEO Pay on the same basis diminishes your arguments in defense of people who have more modest salaries and more basic needs.

What’s the difference?

34. Rujax!..."bob", The Kornflake Klownservative...Dishonest Ideologue and Prevaricating Asshole... spews:

1. Serial Conservative spews:

The Lingerie Football League Announces That It Fired “A Couple Crews Which Apparently Are Now Officiating In The NFL” Because Of Incompetence

http://deadspin.com/5946112/

Because a little levity never hurt anyone.
09/25/2012 at 8:13 am

2. Serial Conservative spews:

Republicans to Pollsters: Too Many Democrats In Your Surveys
Party composition has become a conservative flashpoint, but pollsters say it reflects reality.

http://nationaljournal.com/2012-presidential-campaign/republicans-to-pollsters-too-many-democrats-in-your-surveys-20120925

There’s plenty in here for both sides so rather than picking stuff to italicize here I’ll just post the link.
09/25/2012 at 8:18 am

4. Serial Conservative spews:

In an interview with ABC’s “The View,” Obama — who is in New York to address the United Nations General Assembly — was asked if the Benghazi assault was indeed terrorism.

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/251367-obama-no-doubt-attack-on-libya-consulate-was-terrorism

Meanwhile, Jake Tapper is being allowed nowhere near Obama.
09/25/2012 at 8:27 am

11. Serial Conservative spews:

Before we go all ‘Look for the Union Label’ on the NFL thing, a little perspective:

TAccording to ESPN.com’s Darren Rovell, the average pay for NFL game officials last season was $149,000. Under the NFL’s last proposal, that would increase to more than $189,000 by 2018. In addition, a game official in his first year in 2011 made an average of $78,000. Under the NFL’s last proposal, he would make more than $165,000 by the end of the new agreement.

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nfl/story/_/id/8314433/nfl-use-replacement-officials-start-regular-season

These guys work one day per week, for about 20 weeks per year, exclusive of meetings, CE, etc. We’ll call effort expended in keeping in good physical shape part of the cost of doing business.

Almost all of these guys have other, typically full-time jobs.

They might be union. They’re not what you want to hook your wagon to, tho.
09/25/2012 at 8:55 am

NOBODY relentlessly shills for failed ideology and failed policy without getting paid for it.

The puddypussypissypants is an unhinged just plain krazy buffoon…

…but this guy this “bob” is a dishonest crap peddler.

35. No Time for Fascists spews:

@30. Sounds like you are socialist. The worker doesn’t need as much pay because they already have enough to live on.

36. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

It’s about the economy. Nothing else.

Stamping your feet and perseverating is not a winning strategy.

This election could have been about the economy, had you guys not nominated a total dick.

Sucks to be you.

37. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 33

What’s the difference?

Well, since a lot of those guys are executives or otherwise are in pretty well-paying careers outside of football, in essence you’re expending energy and diluting your message on behalf of the 1%.

That’s my point @ 11.

38. czechsaaz spews:

When I first saw the bit about plane windows I kept imagining Mitt telling Gary Oldman to “Get off my Gulfstream.”

Mitt, “If only Payne Stewart could have cracked a window I’d have one more donor. And one more person’s clothing to ridicule.”

“Why, I’m so sorry your jet has knobs. Mine has power windows. You must be poor.” Mitt Romney

“I’m sorry Joan and Melissa, we’re going to make all these windows open so a person can fit through. It’s in case there’s a fire in the hotel room.” ( O.K., that one’s a little obscure)

Now whenever I see 1776 on TMC, I’ll be thinking of Willard. (That one’s REALLY obscure)

39. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

By my logic, a part-time actor who also works as a teacher doesn’t need to be paid as much by the acting company, because he/she has a day job.

Really?

So there’s some maximum amount that a worker receives, and even if this actor is doing the same job as the actor next to them on stage, they get paid less?

Should a woman who is married get paid less because she has a husband with an income?

40. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 38

It was a football game.

You win, Lib Despair. I have no time, nor interest. Next time you try to defend a union whose workers really need the pay or bennies they’re striking over and I roll my eyes and dismiss your angst, this conversation will be a big reason why.

41. czechsaaz spews:

“It’s about the economy and nothing else.”

Which is why in most polls over the last few months the public trust Obama and Democrats more than Willard and Republicans. The public has caught on. Trickle on does.nkt, has not, will not work to elevate the middle class. Austerity was tried in Spain and Britian and their economies shrank, not grew.

It is about the economy and the massive failure of Republican economic policies and no desire by voters to try them again.

42. Cornflake, the conservative cereal spews:

11. Bob spews:

These guys work one day per week, for about 20 weeks per year, exclusive of meetings, CE, etc.

That is quite a deal compared to “Fliper” RMoney who doesn’t work at all, except for occasional campaign appearances where he insults another demographic in order to impress his “base”.

43. No Time for Fascists spews:

I am enjoying pointing our your hypocrisy in slamming the refs for working to maximize income because you despise all things unions,

And I’m sure you enjoy pointing out what you see as hypocrisy of our support of the 1%.
But you are mistaken, we don’t hate the 1%, we hate greed and the problems for society that wild income disparity cause.

By the way, $165,000 is not in the 1%, it’s in the top 5%.

44. No Time for Fascists spews:

You fight to defend a CEO making 100 Mill, but then fight to tear down a union ref making 167 k. Why?

45. czechsaaz spews:

@39

It’s not a strike. It’s a lockout. And the owners’ position is, “We agreed to a contract that included a pension. We now feel that was a mistake. So we won’t allow you to work until you give us back a big chunk of what we agreed, signed a binding contract agreeing to, and now makes us sad. Give it back, give it back, give it back. You must now pay for our poor negotiating.”

46. Cornflake, the conservative cereal spews:

23. Serial Conservative Severely Desperate spews:
@ 19
How does the nation elect a president who doesn’t know that there are 50 states and not 57?

It’s about the economy. Nothing else.

Ah, good one Bob. Push that real hard.
I’m sure that will pull The Twitt out of the CRAPPER.

47. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 42

And I’m sure you enjoy pointing out what you see as hypocrisy of our support of the 1%.
But you are mistaken, we don’t hate the 1%, we hate greed and the problems for society that wild income disparity cause.

It’s not hypocrisy. I think it’s just misplaced.

By the way, $165,000 is not in the 1%, it’s in the top 5%.

Add it to the day job that most of them have @ 36 and you’re getting into the ballpark of 1% for a lot of them. I wasn’t speaking of the NFL salary alone.

48. No Time for Fascists spews:

Bwhaha.

Scott Walker discovers the value of union workers

This is simply a matter of an anti-union Republican, unimpressed by the results generated by the free market, preferring to see qualified, union workers return to the job so they can provide him with a level of skill, professionalism, and expertise to which he’s accustomed.

http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/2012/09/25/14094555-scott-walker-discovers-the-value-of-union-workers?lite

49. Politically Incorrect - free minds, free markets, free people spews:

Rael spews:

(Serial) conservative trolls:

Romney is doomed.

You know it.

Give up.

Yes, the Milk Choclate Messaih will win in 42 days, but the House and possibly the Senate will end up in the hands of the Reps. So, the next four years will be exactly like the last four years.

50. Cornflake, the conservative cereal spews:

By the way, $165,000 is not in the 1%, it’s in the top 5%.

And according to The Twitt that is lower middle class.

51. Serial Conservative spews:

Meanwhile, back in the real world where two guys fighting over a football seem rather silly:

“Mika, I didn’t say that,” Scarborough shot back. “If you’re going to jump in to try to defend a defenseless president, please get it right. What I’m talking about right here is what this New York Times is writing, he doesn’t build personal relationships. That’s hurt us in Washington. It’s why we have gridlock in Washington and it’s why we have a mess in the Middle East. Whether you’re talking about Bill Clinton, the guy who was the master — he was the master, Bill Clinton. George H.W. Bush. They weren’t afraid to talk to other politicians and leaders in the way that built relationships. So, when there was time of crisis, you know what?”

http://dailycaller.com/2012/09/25/joe-scarborough-unloads-on-mika-brzezinski-over-obama

52. Cornflake, the conservative cereal spews:

48. Politically Incorrect – free minds, free markets, free people (Somalia here we come!) spews:

Yes, the Milk Choclate Messaih will win in 42 days, but the House and possibly the Senate will end up in the hands of the Reps. So, the next four years will be exactly like the last four years.

Or not.

Beware the Mittens landslide.
Just like the Goldwater landslide.

53. Serial Conservative spews:

Landslide, now?

My, aren’t we feeling our oats.

54. No Time for Fascists spews:

@50. How is that related to the economy, stupid?
You yourself said the economy was the most important thing.

@23 It’s about the economy. Nothing else.

I don’t see any mention of American jobs.
So is this an attempt to change the subject to make Obama look bad or were you lying then?

55. ArtFart spews:

@25 Depends on whose “economy” you’re talking about.

56. No Time for Fascists spews:

@51. don’t celebrate till we win the election. I fear
1) Limitless republican Superpac Money
2) Republican voter suppression
3) Republican electronic vote tampering.

57. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 53

So is this an attempt to change the subject to make Obama look bad or were you lying then?

No, just to demonstrate our president’s multitasking capabilities.

He can flail away uselessly at multiple different challenges.

Don’t call me

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5IQnQhzMSI

stupid.

58. No Time for Fascists spews:

“Don’t eat the green ones, they are not ripe yet.”
“And stop calling me Shirley.”

59. Politically Incorrect - free minds, free markets, free people spews:

@51,

I’ll say it again – Obama will win the election, but the House and possibly the Senate will end us being run by the Republicans. Four more years of the same old shit will ensue.

We’re not really going to change things until we get more choices of political parties. Where is it written that Democrats and Republicans are the only parties for whom we can vote?

60. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 53

You left off a few things. I’ll start:

4) Two more months of increasingly bad unemployment numbers
5) More shoes dropping over the Benghazi incompetence demonstrated by State
6) Romney did learn a few things in his 20 primary debates
7) Biden lives up to expectations in his debate
8) Israel wasn’t kidding about Iran
9) China wasn’t kidding about those islands
10) PDK feels ignored lately
11) Khalidi tape somehow gets released

I’m sure I left off at least a few as well. Hey, that was fun, tho.

61. rhp6033 spews:

Roger Rabbit would know more about this than I would, but I’m becoming seriously dismayed at the quality of some law school graduates, who also manage to pass the bar. You would think that one or the other would week them out.

Just look at the past few years. Romney has a J.D. and an M.B.A. (I don’t think he ever took a Bar exam, but I could be wrong), and he doesn’t know the basic physics of atmosphere and pressurization. Didn’t he at least go on a scuba-diving holiday, where they make you take a class before you recieve the card which allows you to get your tank filled???? And then there’s Michelle Bachman, who practiced tax law (both for and against the I.R.S.) and yet doesn’t seem to know basic U.S. history. And let’s not forget Orley Taiz (sp?), the dentist/lawyer who is STILL trying to get a court to agree with her that the President isn’t a U.S. citizen.

Looking back further, we have the Regents University law school graduates who advised the Bush administration that torture didn’t violate either U.S. law or the Geneva Convention; and even Anne Coulter, who was on the legal team who’s sole accomplishment was to arrange the surreptitious release of videotapes of Clinton’s testimony in direct violation of a trial judge’s order that the tapes be sealed and the contents not be released publically without his prior authorization.

And don’t forget that Karl Rove gave his career a big boost when he organized a whispering campaign against an Alabama Supreme Court justice alleging that he was a child molester who used his children’s charity to troll for victims. His method of spreading the rumors? The Young Republican chapter of the University of Alabama Law School.

62. rhp6033 spews:

# 60: I don’t think Romney will be an automatic push-over in the debates. He has had a lot of practice lately, as you mentioned, he looks presidential (whatever that means), and he is adept at dodging questions and giving stock non-specific platitudes as answers.

But you have to admit that his performance in the primary debates was against, well, a minor-league team at best. And with all the other dwarfs on stage taking their turn as the front-runner, he really only had a few questions and didn’t have to defend himself until he and Gingrich were all that were left.

Whether or not he is allowed to get away with his non-specific and off-point answers will depend upon the debate format and how much those asking the questions allow him to get away with it.

63. rhp6033 spews:

Did you hear Romney’s comments about his “foreign aid” initiative? I heard only a bit on the radio, and cutting through the B.S. it seemed like he was saying “let the free market take care of it”.

Of course, if the free market solved all the world’s problems, then there wouldn’t be any problems, would there?

64. rhp6033 spews:

I heard a short blurb this morning during my commute which corroborated some other numbers I heard yesterday evening (as I was heading to the port to supervise an export).

According to the headlines last night, Romney’s “likeability” rating was dropping steadily. This is a slightly different measure than the “favorability” rating, in that some people might prefer a person as President on policy grounds even if they don’t like him personally, which shows up as “favorable” in those other polls. But this is a bit different – a fundamental determination of how well people like and trust a person. It seems that as the campaign continues, more people consider Romney to be arrogant and distrustful. I wish I had caught the name of the poll.

And this morning, Zogby polls were reported to show Obama increasing his lead in Ohio and Pennsylvania, two important swing statges.

They also pointed out something rather surprising – more NASCAR fans support Obama than Romney. Perhaps it was the patronizing comments Romney made at a swing through a NASCAR race (I think it was the Indy 500?), where he ridiculed fans for wearing “cheap” clear plastic ponchos “Couldn’t you have bought a decent raincoat?”, and said he didn’t know much about NASCAR, but knew some NASCAR owners.

Of course, Serial will probably demand a link to the polls, which is pretty hard to do from a radio broadcast.

65. kim jong chillin spews:

@64

Irony..its what’s for dinner..
Rhp, the indy 500 has nothing to do with nascar..get a damn clue.

How someone could confuse the two is beyond me….

66. Herb Pease spews:

There is no free market. If you build a better mousetrap, Megalo Mousetrap Corp will buy the patent and try to keep it off the market.

67. Herb Pease spews:

re 65: I’m not surprised that you know a little bit more than the average bear about going around in circles.

68. Herb Pease spews:

re 65: Do you have a Git ‘r’ Done ball cap to wear to the races.

Are all oval track races clockwise on the track?

Do you remember the old Offenhauser four bangers? I put one in a VW bus in ’72.

Talk about a sleeper!!!

…and don’t rev on me, bro.

69. kim jong chillin spews:

@67

Please don’t fantasize about me while you and your boyfriends are doing your weekly circle jerk….

Thanks in advance.

70. kim jong chillin spews:

@68

I don’t have an interest in roundy round racing….but that doesn’t mean I’m clueless about its existance like rhpee seems to be

71. rhp6033 spews:

# 65: Yes, the Indy 500 has the open wheeled race cars, and NASCAR has (supposedly) stock cars. I don’t remember where Romney made his comments, but NASCAR fans watch the Indy 500 also, so my point still holds.

My old assistant scoutmaster was a dirt-track stock-car racer back in the day. He got his start as a mechanic making cars for moonshine runners – they had to have strong suspensions so the police wouldn’t see the weight they were carrying, and they had to be fast and rugged, of course, while still looking like a “stock” Detroit automobile. He went on to run moonshine himself (before he was old enough to get a driver’s license), and then into the dirt-track racing in the 1950′s. He taught me, and a few others, how to do a proper moonshiner’s U-turn (almost impossible in modern cars with anti-slip brakes, etc.).

72. Serial Conservative spews:

He did it in 2000.

But Once Is Not Enough.

Ralph Nader: Obama’s a ‘war criminal’

Don’t call him a spoiler, tho:

“That’s a politically bigoted words(sic), as if we’re second-class citizens,” said Nader. “Since we’re all trying to get votes from one another, either we’re all spoilers of one another or none of us are spoilers.”

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0912/81649.html#ixzz27VjmWiw1

73. Cornflake, the conservative cereal spews:

70. kim jong “I’m clueless” chillin spews:

@68,
I’m clueless

We know

74. Cornflake, the conservative cereal spews:

Mitt Romney is not impressed with the ‘fancy raincoats’ worn by NASCAR fans

By now, you’ve probably already heard about Mitt Romney’s tone-deaf comment that while he’s not a fan of NASCAR racing, he’s got “some great friends who are NASCAR team owners.”

And you might also have heard about him telling voters that he’s been “extraordinarily successful” and that if they “think that there is something wrong with being successful in America, then they better vote for the other guy.”

Twitt to NASCAR: Fuck You.

75. rhp6033 spews:

By the way, for all those who are crying “the sky is falling” because the Chinese just commissioned their first aircraft carrier:

The Chinese will, eventually, have at least one or more working aircraft carriers. Before yesterday’s commissioning of their first, they were the only nation in the Security Council not to have any. But the current carrier is little more than an experiment, and getting to the point of having an operational air wing stationed on the carrier may be years (or decades?) away. The current carrier was built from the hulk which the Soviet Union abandoned at Sevastopol when the USSR collapsed. After much re-work and installation of engines and navigation systems, it is finally capable of going to sea.

But that is a far cry from having fixed-wing aircraft operating off it’s decks. The Chinese don’t have the aircraft ready yet which are capable of the stresses of carrier landings, nor do they have instructors or air crews capable of making landings on a rolling deck, which sometimes have to be made at night, in high seas, and in stormy conditions. The aircraft being considered for modifications are ones which are at least a generation (or more) behind U.S. fighter aircraft.

It reminds me a little of the aircraft carrier which the Germans tried to build during WWII. The German Navy wanted an aircraft carrier, but the Luftwaffe insisted that only it could fly aircraft. The carrier was never completed, and even if it had been, there were never any aircraft capable of using it. It became just a target for bombing practice by Allied aircrews.

I suspect that the Chinese will try to make an interim show of having an operational carrier, perhaps by loading and parking a number of fixed-wing aircraft on the deck while at portside, and then while at sea conducting chopper operations off the deck which will be vidotaped taking off and landing.

76. Rael spews:

@59 –

Huff Po postulates that Democrats maintaining or expanding slightly on their position in a year when they should lose (based on the economy) would be a game changer in itself.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/25/election-2012-game-change_n_1903327.html

How popular is the Tea Party these days?
In 2010 all these idiot candidates were proudly saying they were “Tea Party” Repubs, not regular old Repubs.

Seen any of that in 2012?

77. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 76

Yeah, people aren’t so positive on the Tea Party this time around. It’s for primary season, mostly.

You know who else people aren’t proudly saying they support these days?

Democratic Congressional Candidate Won’t Say He’s Voting For …
http://www.buzzfeed.com/…/democratic-congressional-candidate-wont-say…May 24, 2012 – Democratic Congressional Candidate Won’t Say He’s Voting For Obama: Ron Barber, running to fill the seat vacated in Arizona wh…
AZ Democrat candidate won’t say he’s voting for Obama » The Right …
http://www.therightscoop.com/az-democrat-candidate-wont-say-hes-voting…May 24, 2012 – This year is starting to look better and better as it goes along because more and more Democrats are finding themselves at odds with Obama, …
Democrat Congressional Candidate Ron Barber Refuses to Say …

► 0:28► 0:28
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRceZC-7kkoMay 24, 2012 – 28 sec – Uploaded by GOPICYMI
And this guy won’t even say he’s voting for his party’s candidate for … If he, a Democrat, has doubts …
More videos for candidate won’t say he’s voting for obama »
Video: Democratic congressional candidate won’t say he’ll vote for …
hotair.com/…/video-democratic-congressional-candidate-wont-say-he…May 24, 2012 – Video: Democratic congressional candidate won’t say he’ll vote for Obama … Not a damn thing, not that he’s not perjuring himself about it.

I could provide more. I just googled ‘candidate won’t say he’s voting for Obama‘.

78. rhp6033 spews:

Saw something interesting today.

Early voting starts in Ioway on Wednesday (Sept. 27th), and Ohio on October 2nd. These are before the first debates.

By the time of the third debate (two Presidential, one V-Presidential), North Carolina will also have started early voting. Nevada will start early voting on October 20th, two days before the final presidential debate.

So in those states, as much as 40% of those casting ballots may have voted before seeing any or all of the debates. Which makes a late comeback by Romney based on debate performance that much more unlikely.

79. Steve spews:

“I could provide more.

What, provide more mindless smarm born of acute narcissism and political desperation? Yes, of course you can, Bob.

80. rhp6033 spews:

Just wondering:

Romney is increasingly perceived by even many Republicans as “arrogant”, and at best the “lesser of two evils”.

Attempts to “humanize” him by having his sons talk about growing up under Romney have backfired. There was the Seamus debacle (which makes the prospect of a convertable Air Force One even more humerous). There were tales of cruel jokes he pulled on his sons. And more recently, there was the tale of how he tripped on of his son’s wife so she wouldn’t win a friendly foot-race.

So I’m guessing that the debate preparers are probably trying to coach Romney on how to be more “human” and “humble”. Somewhere in his memorized debate answers there will be a heart-touching story of sacrifice or love, I guess, but where it would come from only God knows. So lacking that, they would probably just try to get him to look “humble”.

Is it possible for Romney to look humble, even if the last chance for the Presidency depends upon it?

81. Steve spews:

By the way, thanks, my friends, for your very kind comments about the gift my friends and I created for Rachel Beckwith’s family. It means a lot to me that you like it.

I hope I have your correct email address, Roger. I’ve seen you support Rachel with both donations and your comments and I very much want you to see it too.

82. rhp6033 spews:

Remember a couple of things in the last few weeks of the campaign:

While Romney has managed to get MOST evangelicals to swing back to the Republican side based on the litmus-test of unquestioning support for anything Israel does, he still hasn’t got all of them. Lots of them still have doubts about voting for a Mormon.

The Republicans have pretty much ticked off the entire Libertarian group, taking away the credentials of the entire Ron Paul delegation and leading to their mass exedus from the Republican Convention. Expect most of them not to vote this time around, and try to form a minor third party shortly after this election.

If President Obama’s victory also brings on it’s coat-tails a continued Republican Senate and substantial in-roads in the House, the Republican party and the Tea Party may well decide to go their seperate ways. The traditional “Reagan” Republicans will argue that the party needs to move more towards the center, and the Tea Party would claim that the defeat was because they weren’t extremist enough.

So what would this mean in 2016? On the left we have (for the sake of discussion) the Green Party (5% or less), the Democratic Party (some 45%). On the right you would have the Reagan Republicans (35%), the Tea Party (5%), and the Libertarians (less than 5%).

That would make for an interesting dynamic, especially if any of the minor parties (old or new) managed to gain any seats in Congress. Would our elections look more like the Knessit, to be followed immediatly by bargaining with minor parties for control of the Congress?

83. Michael spews:

@81
Just got a chance to listen to it. Great stuff and a very cool thing to do. Good job Steve.

84. Gman spews:

Does anyone know if airplanes have spare tires on board?

85. Rujax!..."bob", The Kornflake Klownservative...Dishonest Ideologue and Prevaricating Asshole... spews:

53. Serial Conservative spews:

Landslide, now?

My, aren’t we feeling our oats.
09/25/2012 at 11:04 am

He still can’t read.

86. Rujax!..."bob", The Kornflake Klownservative...Dishonest Ideologue and Prevaricating Asshole... spews:

84. Gman spews:

Does anyone know if airplanes have spare tires on board?
09/25/2012 at 1:05 pm

The Kornflake Klownservative thinks you can start a 747 by putting it in second and popping the clutch, but I doubt that.

87. Rael spews:

Fair is fair:

Apparently the Romney-airplane-window thing was a joke:

http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2012/09/mitt-romney-joke-joking-airplane-windows.html

So Romney’s not stupid, just has a crappy sense of humor.

It’s only the creationist bible-thumper climate-change-deniers on whose backs he’s trying to ride into the White House – who he will be beholden to should he succeed – who are truly stupid.

88. Steve spews:

@83 Thank you very much, Michael. I’m glad that you liked it.

89. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

You know, I’ve had an epiphany – Cap’n and puddl are RIGHT!

It was an ACT OF WAAARRRR!!!!!!!

Let’s invade Nigeria.

90. czechsaaz spews:

@87

I get it. The screen door on the submarine really DOES keep the fish out.

91. kim jong chillin spews:

@73

Yes, the only thing we know is that you suck dicks…

Ewwww…just fucking ewwwwwww

92. kim jong chillin spews:

@73

Yes, the only thing we know is that you suck dicks…

Ewwww…just fucking ewwwwwww

93. Serial Conservative spews:

I know you HA lefties have been in masturbatory delight over the plane window thing.

Sorry to detumesce you:

Mitt Romney Was Joking About Airplane Windows
By Dan Amira

The Los Angeles Times story that relayed Romney’s airplane remark to the world was based off a pool report written by the New York Times’s Ashley Parker. When we asked Parker this morning whether it seemed as if Romney made the mark in jest, she left no doubt. “Romney was joking,” she e-mailed. Parker told us that while the pool report didn’t explicitly indicate that Romney was joking, it was self-evident that he was. “The pool report provided the full transcript of his comments on Ann’s plane scare,” she said, “and it was clear from the context that he was not being serious.”

http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2012/09/mitt-romney-joke-joking-airplane-windows.html

1,000 people heard it and no one thought to pass it on. Someone with an agenda sees it in print and it’s red meat for the HA crowd.

94. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 93

Missed that Rael @ 87 noted it first.

95. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

@93

He beat you to it by and hour and 45 minutes.

Tough. Damage done. It’s ‘out there’, see #RomneyPlaneFeatures.

96. Herb Pease spews:

“@73

Yes, the only thing we know is that you suck dicks…

Ewwww…just fucking ewwwwwww”

So does your mother. Think about that while you are all gathered ’round the Thanksgiving table

97. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 95

That’s what’s important to you, isn’t it, Lib Despair. Whether it passes the smell test matters not. What counts is that you can still use it as a smear device.

Imagine one of your kids saying something in jest, only to have it twisted and repeatedly used against them after being widely publicized amongst people who intend to do them harm.

Enjoy each and every use of the Romney plane thing in the future, Lib Despair.

98. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

What counts is that you can still use it as a smear device.

You are a sanctimonious shit. Your stock in trade is smear and innuendo, so spare me the hurt fee-fees.

Anyway, this kind of ridicule wouldn’t stick if people weren’t predisposed to thinking that he was an out of touch dick.

You and I both know Rmoney is going down because his message is wrong, his plan is wrong, he is the wrong person to be President. This is just icing on the cake.

Imagine one of your kids…

I’ve asked you multiple times to leave my kids out of your smarmy, unctuous wheedling. I can’t force you not to, but your continued behavior underscores what a dick you are.

99. don spews:

@93

Yea, well, we already know that the whole Romney campaign is one big joke.

100. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

Enjoy each and every use of the Romney plane thing in the future

I will!

101. rhp6033 spews:

84. Gman spews:

Does anyone know if airplanes have spare tires on board?

Sure. If an airplane tire blows out on takeoff, the co-pilot can just climb out and change it before landing.

(drum-riff).

But seriously –

there is a little island in the Marshalls known as Marjuro, where smaller airplanes (Boeing 737′s and Airbus A320′s and smaller) sometimes land on ferry flights to re-fuel. It’s an atol, and the only have room for on airplane on the runway, one airplane in the fueling dock, and one airplane waiting for takeoff. If there are two airplanes already landed, any others just have to circle. Because it is so hard to get spare aircraft tires to the island, ferry flights of new aircraft frequently carry a spare main gear and nose gear tire in their cargo hold, just in case the blow a tire on landing at Marjuro.

103. rhp6033 spews:

I can see the discussion group now.

Leader of Group: “Okay, Mitt’s blown it again with this airplane gaff. How do we do damage control?”

Politico # 1: “We deny he ever said it, and anybody who reports otherwise is obviously a leftist socialist weasil”.

Leader: “I agree that’s worked well in the past, but I don’t think it will work well now. Heck, everyon’s got a phone with a video camera these days, and their’s video of the incident”.

Politico # 2: “We release a tape of Osama Bin Laden threatening to strike the United States”.

Leader: “Yea, we have a few left in the vault we didn’t use in 2004, but perhaps you haven’t been keeping up with the news – Bin Laden is dead.

Politico # 3: “We claim that Romney has new, innovative ideas and that there is new technology which only Romney and a few others are aware which makes this possible – all because of the virtues of unleashed capitalism”.

Leader: “I like the way you think, but nobody is going to believe that one, either.”

Politico # 4: “We say it was just a mis-statement”.

Leader: “We’ve gone to that well too many times, but let’s keep that on the table unless we can’t come up with anything better”.

Politico # 5: “We say Romney was just making a joke”.

Leader: “Well, I’m not sure – nobody can argue if he claims he tried to tell a joke which just fell flat. It makes him seem human and a bit vulnerable. And supporters and independents aren’t going to take the time to look at the video if it’s just a question of whether he was telling a joke or not. But the real question is whether anybody would believe that Mitt Romney is capable of attempting to tell a joke.

Okay, let’s go with it. It’s not good, but it’s the best option available.”

104. Steve spews:

“Whether it passes the smell test matters not. What counts is that you can still use it as a smear device.”

That’s our Bob. Projects much, whines even more. Loser.

105. Don Joe spews:

@ 11

“Theses guys work…”

Yes, and you can stop there. Being an owner means that you don’t work. That’s the problem with Republican/right-wing ideology. It lionizes ownership, and vilifies work.

And that’s why Gov. Romney is trailing Pres. Obama despite everything else that would augur for a Republican cake walk.

106. Puddybud spews:

How the hell does a major political party
nominate someone to be commander in chief
who doesn’t understand that airplanes at high altitude
have to be airtight?

Because it shows how stupid the slobbering libtard heads up the Obummer ASS media can’t get a joke. The people around him did.

Stay stupid rael, reading the leftist slobbering libtard heads up the Obummer ASS media!

107. Serial Conservative spews:

@ 105

“Being an owner means that you don’t work. That’s the problem with Republican/right-wing ideology.”

WTF?

I’m an owner. I work every day. My staff just left. I have another hour and a half to go.

Being an owner means that you eventually will realize a nice return on the time you spent above and beyond what your employees do, and for the risk you took getting up and running.

Right now it means work AND return. In my world I don’t think it ever will be financial return without work.

108. Puddybud spews:

Being an owner means that you don’t work. That’s the problem with Republican/right-wing ideology.

How did they become an owner unless they worked?

109. czechsaaz spews:

@108

In Willard’s case, he was born into investment capital. In Tagg Romney’s case, dad’s “blind” trust invested the principal to start a hedge fund.

110. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

I have another hour and a half to go.

That’s only because you waste so much time posting the latest wingnut talking points around here.

111. Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

@109
Heh. Made money the old-fashioned way, he inherited it.

112. Serial conservative spews:

@ 110

A lot of my interaction with you is a waste of my time, you got that right, Lib Despair.

113. Don Joe spews:

@ 107

I’m an owner. I work every day.

Pardon me for being overly brief–a brevity that was driven largely by the fact that the context of my remarks involves the current NFL referee lockout. If you want to step out of that context, then I’d say that being an owner certainly doesn’t prevent one from working. Nevertheless, nothing about ownership entails work. Ownership is merely a legal title to some real property.

In so far as the NFL is concerned, the vast majority of owners “work” by hiring someone else to actually manage the team. The most obvious counter-example would be Jerry Jones, and quite a few folks believe that the Dallas Cowboys would be a better football organization if Jerry Jones hired someone else to actually manage football operations.

Moreover, “effort” is not “work.” If we define “work” as “contributing value to a product or service,” then the effort exerted by owners like Jerry Jones actually constitutes negative “work.”

And, to take this full circle in the current political milieu, we can extend these thoughts to the whole “you didn’t build that” hullaballoo. Even according to the standard right-wing interpretation of President Obama’s words, the only “owners” who actually did built “that” are sole owners of firms that have never had any employees.

Lastly, I notice you’ve completely ignored the rest of my comment, and this in particular:

That’s the problem with Republican/right-wing ideology. It lionizes ownership, and vilifies work.

That statement remains true. Republican/right-wing ideology lionizes ownership, and vilifies work. If you actually do work for a living, you can count on Republicans to screw you over and over again.

114. Don Joe spews:

@ 108

How did they become an owner unless they worked?

You become an owner by buying something. You can buy something by getting someone else to pay for it. There are firms that do this, and they often have “Capital Management” in their names.

115. Roger Rabbit spews:

@106 Gee, how original (not!). When rightards get caught in a slobbering lie they claim it’s “just a joke.” My wingnut brother pulls that one all the time.

116. Roger Rabbit spews:

@112 It wastes our time, too.

117. Roger Rabbit spews:

@93 We can never tell when you guys are joking because your serious comments are indistinguishable from the jokes.

118. YLB spews:

Doncha just love the Lonestar State?

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2091398/

Watch the trailer.. Next time they threaten secession, please just let them go..

119. Piltdown Man spews:

105. Don Joe spews:
@ 11

“Theses guys work…”

Yes, and you can stop there. Being an owner means that you don’t work.

you are fucking clueless.

my how the times have changed in America: if you are successful, then that means you dont work and are lazy. And if you are a lazy fuckup loser who never made it past a shitty menial job, then you should be looked up to and praised.

welcome to progressive America.

120. Piltdown Man spews:

114. Don Joe spews:
@ 108

How did they become an owner unless they worked?

You become an owner by buying something. You can buy something by getting someone else to pay for it. There are firms that do this, and they often have “Capital Management” in their names.

09/25/2012 AT 10:16 PM

yet another dumbass post.

ya dude, every person that owns a business just “bought it” from someone else…none of us ever actually started it or worked to get it off the ground

asshole…..fuck you, and keep your lazy hands off my hard earned money.

121. Gman spews:

hahahahahaha lol hahahaha – I just got Romney’s plane joke. Took me a couple of days, but I just go it…. hahaha hahah funny joke.

122. Don Joe spews:

@ 119

And if you are a lazy fuckup loser who never made it past a shitty menial job, then you should be looked up to and praised.

Thank you. You just made my point. In your mind, the people who do actually work for a menial living are “lazy fuckups”.

The rest of America thinks you’re the asshole. So, fuck you.

123. rhp6033 spews:

Serial @ # 47: You are confusing ownership with self-employment. It’s a common mistake – especially in the restaurant industry.

For example, the proper way to account for whether or not a restaurant is making money is for the owner to put up the idea and the money, and provide only top-level supervision of the staff on a regular (but not daily) basis. He should have:

(a) a bookkeeper who knows that type of business, which may be combined with a purchasing position;

(b) a general manager who hires and fires and is on-site constantly while the doors are open supervising the entire staff,

(c) a kitchen manager/head chef who is responsible for the other cooks, the equipment and cleanliness of the kitchen, and everything that comes out from the kitchen;

(d) a “front of house” supervisor or head waiter/waitress who supervises the rest of the wait staff under oversight of the general manager;

(e) a bar manager/head bartender who is responsible for all other bartenders, cleanliness of the bar, and legal compliance in the bar, subject to oversight of the general manager.

Now, the smaller the restaurant gets, the more these jobs get combined, and the owner sometimes becomes the cook, bookeeper, janitor, substitute hostess/waiter, etc. Unless the restaurant is rapidly growing in customer base and revenue, this soon becomes a problem as other duties become neglected. It’s okay in the initial start-up phase, but it shouldn’t last more than a couple of months.

Where this is a problem from an accounting perspective is that the owner often confuses “profits” with “self-employment wages”. They are bringing home a paycheck, but they don’t realize it is becuase they are getting paid for one job when they may be doing two or three jobs, except that much of what needs to be done in the other jobs is being neglected.

124. Piltdown Man spews:

122. Don Joe spews:
@ 119

And if you are a lazy fuckup loser who never made it past a shitty menial job, then you should be looked up to and praised.

Thank you. You just made my point. In your mind, the people who do actually work for a menial living are “lazy fuckups”.

The rest of America thinks you’re the asshole. So, fuck you.

09/26/2012 AT 1:48 PM

no, go fuck yourself asshole.

why dont you open up your own business and tell us all how fucking easy it is.

go ahead fuckface, put a 2nd or 3rd mortgage on your house, take out a loan, and tell us all how “owners dont do any work”. Its so easy, why dont you try it?

I bet your the kind of lazy fuck up loser that couldnt make a dick sucking business on Capitol Hill profitable.

Its always $12/hour losers like Don Blow that think they have all the answers….and their answer is always “give me free stuff” and “to hell with the guy who signs my check”.

go occupy something, asshole.

125. Michael spews:

@107

When you drop that last sentence and take the comment out of context, you’re right it doesn’t make any sense. When you actually read it in context with “It lionizes ownership, and vilifies work” in place it suddenly makes sense. You might not agree with it, but it makes sense.