Open Thread 6/26

- This chart of Congressional wealth is one of those charts that shocks you with things you could have guessed.

– The Seattle Great Wheel looks like it will be pretty neat.

– This idea for filibuster reform is a bit overly complex. But in general it’s solid.

– WTF, SPD?

Clearly this is not Romney’s party – yet, anyway. Other Republicans’ willingness to buck and rebuke him signals not bracing political independence – party leaders haven’t had the guts to stand up to the birthers in their ranks – but insecurity about their November prospects. A lot of Republicans seem to have their eye on November – of 2016.

Spoke and Food

Comments

  1. 2

    Serial Conservative spews:

    I see it’s another Recovery Summer:

    WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) — U.S. consumer confidence has declined for a fourth month, with gloomier views in June on future business conditions and income, the Conference Board reported Tuesday.

    Didn’t Joe Biden promise us, like, 500,000 jobs per month?

    Why, yes, he did:


    “All in all we’re going to be creating somewhere between 100[,000] and 200,000 jobs next month, I predict,” Biden said, according to a pool report, adding that he “got in trouble” for a job growth prediction last month. “Even some in the White House said, ‘Hey, don’t get ahead of yourself.’ Well, I’m here to tell you, some time in the next couple of months, we’re going to be creating between 250,000 jobs a month and 500,000 jobs a month.”

    “We caught a lot of bad breaks on the way down,” Biden added. “We’re going to catch a few good breaks because of good planning on the way up.”

    http://voices.washingtonpost.c.....ll-cr.html

    Sorry, wrong Recovery Summer.

    Real good planning on the way up, Joe.

  2. 5

    rhp6033 spews:

    What was beyond believable exaggeration a decade ago now is now more believable, after a decade of experience. It’s taken the cartoonists, who’s medium is exageration for the sake of story-telling, to struggle to meet the new realities.

    Cartoon

  3. 6

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 5

    New realities.

    How apt.

    When do you think unions will begin to recognize them?

  4. 7

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @5 Don’t forget the part where working-class kids have to enlist in the military and fight the upper class’s oil wars to get a shot at attending college.

  5. 8

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    1-4, 6: Nice to see you made it through the morning traffic and showed up at work on time.

  6. 9

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 9

    I’m at work before there’s any traffic. Gotta create the wealth before it’s transferred to someone else.

  7. 10

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Rising income inequality and a political system that benefits the rich is hurting America’s economic growth, Nobel Prize-winning economist Joseph Stiglitz says.

    “The U.S. worked hard to create the American dream of opportunity. But today, that dream is a myth,” Stiglitz wrote in an opinion piece in the Financial Times Tuesday. “The U.S. used to think of itself as a middle-class country – but this is no longer true,” he said. “Today, a child’s life chances are more dependent on the income of his or her parents than in Europe, or any other of the advanced industrial countries for which there are data.”

    http://www.cnbc.com/id/47957186

  8. 11

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Barefoot Bob @9: When do you have time to create wealth? You spend all your time posting here.

  9. 12

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @2 Consumer confidence shouldn’t have anything to do with it. People shouldn’t consume, period. All that does is make them poorer and indebted to the “haves.” They should pay off their debts, then accumulate capital. That’s what I did. Now I don’t have to work, don’t owe any money, and live off the fat of the land like the rich do. Consuming keeps you down. Saving and investing makes you a capitalist like them — and me. Buying “stuff” is like eating junk food. It’s unhealthy and shortens your life.

  10. 14

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Uh, look folks, it’s a slow news day. Bob (aka Serial Asshole) can’t find anything to write about and neither can I. Anyway, I have to attend a business meeting this morning, so I’m out of here. We’ll have plenty to talk about Thursday when SCOTUS hands down its Romneycare ruling.

  11. 15

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 12

    Then I’ll be pleased to see you call for an end to those idiotic $250 checks sent as part of stimulus, as well as the payroll tax cut and the resultant eight bucks or whatever it is that ends up as additional net pay, since all people do with it is sock it away rather than spend it as intended.

    Handing out money as ‘stimulus’ when it doesn’t get spent is dumb. It further deepens the debt of our children and it does nothing to help the economy during current challenges.

  12. 16

    rhp6033 spews:

    Wow, northern Florida is getting hammered by that tropical storm which is stuck just offshore, north of Tampa, spinning off the occasional hurricane and severe flooding. I-10, which crosses northern Florida and connects Jacksonville in the East and heads west all the way through Talahassee and on to Mobile, has fifty miles closed due to flooding.

    Right at the beginning two-thirds of the high tourist season, cancelations at Disneyland are at all-time highs, and Lake City (home of the crystal-clear water and glass-bottomed boats, and where I took my scuba check-dive, is deluged. Most of the west coast of Florida is subject to Noah-like floods, and the east coast is suffering from restricted access due to the I-10 closure.

    No word yet on how this is affecting florida’s vast crops of citrus fruits.

    The problem with Florida is that everything is low and flat – there’s little room for water to run off, once the ground becomes saturated. Right now parts of Florida are getting two feet of rain in a 48 hour period.

  13. 17

    rhp6033 spews:

    # 15: Are you referring to the “tax rebates” of a hundred bucks or so which were sent out under George W. Bush’s watch which weren’t stimulus or tax breaks at all, but were merely an advance loan against tax refunds which would be due a few months later?

    I’m no fan of “stimulus checks” either. It used to work – you could put money in the hands of consumers who would jump-start the economy by buying products, which would result in factory orders, which would result in re-hires of those who had recently been laid off. But it doesn’t work that way in an environment where most households are spending a majority of their paychecks to service mortgage, bank, and credit-card debt, or buying flat-screen TV’s made overseas.

    It especially doesn’t work if you are expecting these same people to cut back in order to fund the checks, while allowing those who can afford it (yes, the 1%’s) the best tax exemptions and rates possible for un-earned income.

    We need some meaningful reform, and that means folks like Romney and his “peeps” will have to shell out their far burden in taxes, so that REAL stimulous (infrastructure jobs) can begin.

  14. 18

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    When do you have time to create wealth? You spend all your time posting here.

    Bob, you’ve clearly decided that your life is best spent, at least for the next few months, incessantly posting shallow, truthy right-wing talking points here, rather like unwelcome and un-witty graffiti.

    Well, that’s your choice, or your boss’s choice, whatever.

    However, if you are really committed to this, then could you at least use a less grating, unctuous, supercilious voice? You come across as a poseur, a condescending twit intent on telling everyone their business on every topic. I imagine that this is a practiced pose – one runs into the ‘authoritative voice’ often in academics and medicine – almost always used as a bluff against self-perceived inadequacy.

    One hopes you can do better, as it appears we’re stuck with you until November, rather like a bad case of shingles.

  15. 19

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    Handing out money as ’stimulus’ when it doesn’t get spent is dumb.

    Thank you. You provide a concise, cogent argument against giving tax cuts to wealthy people.

  16. 20

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 17

    Raising taxes on the wealthy provides no stimulus. Creating public sector jobs provides no stimulus.

    Europe is a drag, certainly. It’s not as big a drag as uncertainty and fear of retribution if capital is deployed. At this point nothing is going to happen until November because we are so close to the election and decisions are different if there’s a President Obama in 2013 than they are if there is a President Romney instead. People are on the sidelines, waiting.

    It’s the result of a choice between holding cash so you aren’t accused of contributing to income equality @10 and lambasted by the left for your successes, or deploying the cash because the investment and risk-taking environment is more favorable.

    Pretty stark choice. I’d keep my powder dry if I were cash-rich.

    Funny thing is, every time Obama bashes the rich those pursestrings just get a little tighter. Class warfare, plain and simple.

  17. 21

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 17

    Referring to the Bush-era handouts you mention and also to the ARRA tax credit, which effectively was the same thing, although more insidious and therefore even less potentially useful:

    Conference- Tax Credit reduced to $400 per worker and $800 per couple in 2009 and 2010 and phaseout begins at $75,000 for individuals and $150,000 for joint filers.

    (wiki)

  18. 22

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    …since all people do with it is sock it away rather than spend it as intended.

    Interesting. I don’t think ‘bub’ even perceives people for whom $250 is a windfall.
    The people who get a couple of hundred bucks back from payroll taxes do not save, bub, they can’t. Those are the people on the edge, often behind a credit 8-ball or underwater, working multiple shitty jobs if they have a job at all. You know what they do with $250? They SPEND it.

    Roger’s comments notwithstanding, SPENDING is exactly what the economy needs at the moment. He makes an argument against consuming, which is indeed a big scam on which much of the economy is based and which is designed to make debt- and wage-slaves of as many people as possible.

    Now you run along and think about that – while you’re writing those ‘checks’ you big Job-Creator ™, you.

  19. 23

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 18

    Lib Sci, do I have you in despair?

    You’re trying to change my style? Really?

    It’s, like, 50-1 against me on HA and you want me to spot you three runs before the second inning?

    I believe the word ‘pussy’ seems an apt description of your whiny request. Apologies in advance if this injures your delicate constitution.

  20. 24

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    Creating public sector jobs provides no stimulus.

    Absolutely wrong, genius.
    Any job provides a stimulus.
    Dropping money from helicopters would provide a stimulus, as long as you didn’t drop it over Clyde Hill.
    Paying people to dig and fill ditches would provide a stimulus, just as would paying them to build bombs and then blowing the damn things up – which is an argument we’re going to hear more and more as mandatory defense cuts loom.

    No, the only question is what we get from the stimulus spending – do we, at the end of the process of putting many many people to work with government spending get a)filled-in ditches, or b)exploded ordinance, or c)repaired bridges and wind farms and high-speed rail an dnew libraries and schools and well educated kids and better fire protection?

  21. 25

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 22

    Yes, those on the edge do spend it. But those who have jobs, the majority of the country, Lib Sci, and are doing OK but are worried about what might happen if things worsen don’t spend it. They do the smart thing and put it away.

    See, Lib Sci, the vast majority of the country isn’t that ‘average Joe’ sitting next to the First Lady at the SOTU, who is referred to by the president when he’s trying to demagogue a talking point. The vast majority of the country is employed, doing OK but not great, and casting a wary eye on the future.

    There are 8 million unemployed and another 15 million who would like to be working more. But there are more than 100 million with stable jobs. The ones who pay the taxes, Lib Sci.

    Not everyone’s on the edge and the Left shouldn’t be focusing on those who are to the perpetual detriment of everyone else.

  22. 26

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    Lib Sci, do I have you in despair?

    No. You I care about not at all. I despair for a society capable of producing people (at an inordinate rate) with the toxic combination of callous greed and aggressive stupidity.

  23. 27

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    I believe the word ‘pussy’ seems an apt description of your whiny request. Apologies in advance if this injures your delicate constitution.

    I was merely offering helpful assistance with your sophomoric stylings. You will doubtless keep up the antics for which we’ve all come to love you.

  24. 28

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 24

    You have a point – I should have said no lasting stimulus.

    We’ve seen what happens when the government tries to throw money at a problem. Shovel-ready isn’t. Half the money is unspent a year later. Projects don’t get started because there’s not allocated funds to finish a job. Hiring a teacher for a year, or two, and then laying off that teacher because the tap ran dry does nothing to benefit the economy. It just creates one more homeowner or vehicle owner who can’t make a payment.

    Temporary stimulus handed out to favored public sector recipients was a disaster. We saw it. Administration reverted to ‘created or saved’ to justify their largesse. No one’s buying it any more.

    Paying someone to dig a hole, then fill it back up, is a waste. Everyone but a liberal understands that.

  25. 29

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    But those who have jobs, the majority of the country, Lib Sci, and are doing OK

    We’re you just attacking Obama for saying (out of context, of course) that the private sector was ‘doing OK’?

    See – you have no consistency – your trick is merely attack attack attack on whatever target is convenient.

    Over time you utter lack of principle is glaringly transparent.

  26. 30

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @15 Bush gave me a one-time $300 check that didn’t even cover a year’s inflation.

  27. 31

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    …the vast majority of the country isn’t that ‘average Joe’…

    That defies the laws of statistics.

    Will you now tutor us on statistics?

  28. 32

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    There are 8 million unemployed and another 15 million who would like to be working more. But there are more than 100 million with stable jobs. The ones who pay the taxes, Lib Sci.

    But…but…I thought that you guys were saying that only 47% of people pay taxes??

    Could you please get your story straight before you press ‘Submit’? Is that too much to ask?

  29. 33

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @20 “Raising taxes on the wealthy provides no stimulus.”

    It’s not supposed to. It’s intended to reduce deficits caused by things like raising defense spending by 80% in 8 years and spending trillions on two off-the-books wars.

  30. 34

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    Not everyone’s on the edge and the Left shouldn’t be focusing on those who are to the perpetual detriment of everyone else.

    Shorter bub: Fuck the poor.

  31. 35

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    This has been fun dismembering bub, but I gotta go….

  32. 36

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 29

    No, for saying ‘The private sector’s fine.’

    There’s a difference.

    OK infers so-so. Fine infers no help necessary. If your 16 year old was doing OK in school you’d be concerned. If you were told your child was doing fine you’d be happy and want to make sure that effort and result continued.

    Strive to be more accurate if you choose to criticize.

  33. 37

    Steve spews:

    @6 “New realities.”

    It’s OK for Bob, GOP lackey, to mock the demise of unions and the middle class as depicted in the cartoon linked to by RHP @5. There’s no class warfare here to see here, folks, move along.

    @20 “Class warfare, plain and simple.”

    Say anything at all about vulture capitalism, rising income disparity, or raising taxes on the wealthy a few percentage points? Class warfare, plain and simple.

    “New realities.”

    Yeah, so real. Like your vision of white militias roaming the streets of Detroit, shooting blacks on sight.

  34. 39

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 37

    I see you have reverted to your original mischaracterization of what I wrote, Doctor Steve.

    Have a nice day.

  35. 41

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @29 Actually, the upper end of the private sector is doing even better than “fine.” Obama grossly understated how well the 1% are doing. The rich haven’t suffered at all during the current economic turmoil. They’re richer than ever — depressions tend to concentrate wealth. CEO pay keeps rocketing upward. Corporations are making record profits (and we all know who owns most of the stock). “Fine” isn’t the right word; the top end of the private sector is doing spectacularly well. And they’ve never enjoyed lower tax rates, more lucrative deductions, broader tax shelters, and fatter government subsidies than right now.

  36. 42

    No Time for Fascists spews:

    Puddy, Smilin and Serial “Ridicule the looks an an African American girl as a joke” Conservative, are you are republicans who worships Jesus?
    Please tell me more about how you plan to cut programs that feed the hungry and heal the sick?

  37. 44

    No Time for Fascists spews:

    Creating public sector jobs provides no stimulus.
    That has been proven to be false. These people get pay check that they spend in the local economy.

    It’s important to understand that one person loosing a job doesn’t just affect that person. There is a knock-on effect throughout the economy, like ripples from a pebble dropped in a pond. As money circulates through the economy, it is subject to a multiplier effect. This means that each dollar spent potentially generates ($1 x multiplier) of economic activity. So if the multiplier is 2, than each $1 spent will ultimately generate $2 in downstream economic activity. Economists debate what the right multiplier should be for different economic circumstances, but there is a general consensus among mainstream economists that the multiplier effect is real. So what happened in Connecticut?

    The Connecticut Economic Resource Center said Friday that a multiplier of 1.39 would be applied to the pending state government job losses. This means that for every single job lost, another four-tenths of a job would be lost as well, said Alissa DeJonge, the center’s director of research.

    That works out to an additional 3,000 or more job losses that could hit the private sector hard, she said.

    http://bloggingblue.com/2012/0.....publicans/

  38. 45

    rhp6033 spews:

    I have to laugh whenever I hear the Republicans complain about Democrats practicing “class warfare”. The Republicans have been practicing class warfare for the past three decades or so. It’s only recently that the Democrats have started shooting back. But being the bullies that they are, they start whining whenever someone fights back, instead of taking their beatings “like a man”.

  39. 46

    rhp6033 spews:

    We really need to put together a new GOP dictionary. Some suggestions:

    “Job Creator” – so rich that he wouldn’t possible consider creating real jobs, just different ways to take money from those that already have them.

    “Class Warfare” – What happens when a victim dares to fight back against a bully.

    “New Reality” – We’ve already sold your jobs to China, now just shut up and shovel my shit for pennies on the dollar, and say “please” and “thank you”.

  40. 47

    No Time for Fascists spews:

    Raising taxes on the wealthy provides no stimulus.
    Not directly. But it does pay down debt and or provide funds to pay for programs.
    It also give stimulus for the wealthy to invest that money in their companies. Instead of taking 100 million out of the company in salary, take 3 mill in salary and still live well and invest that remaining 97 mill in R&D or better wages to keep good talent.

  41. 48

    Dorky Dorkman spews:

    re 9: “I’m at work before there’s any traffic. Gotta create the wealth before it’s transferred to someone else.”

    “Where else do you think it goes, my friend?” Mitt Romney

  42. 49

    Michael spews:

    The Great Wheel looks like fun. I’ll have to make a trip up to Seattle to check that out. I had no idea it was being built.

  43. 51

    Michael spews:

    @1
    Go here:
    http://www.realclearpolitics.c.....-1171.html

    Scroll down to the graph and click on Max in the lower right hand corner of the graph. Romney’s flat. All that money, all that TV air time, and the man can’t break 46%. Once the Republican convention’s over and his Veep’s been picked, Romney will probably bounce up to the low 50% range, and then he’ll slide back down to the low to mid 40’s.

  44. 53

    Steve spews:

    “I see you have reverted to your original mischaracterization of what I wrote”

    Oh, yeah, that’s right, Bob, you wrote that blacks were free to join your militias. Yeah, I’m sure joining up with these guys will have great appeal for Detroit’s black folk.

    http://www.michiganmilitia.com/

    So that’s your big plan for Detroit? Join those freaks or die? Good Gawd! You and your stupid fucking visions, Bob.

  45. 55

    rhp6033 spews:

    It’s pretty clear that Romney still isn’t the favorite of the majority of Repubicans. He may have stacked up enough delegates to win the nomination, but that’s only because the opposition to him in the primaries was so ridiculous and they scattered the opposition votes among themselves in the low percentages. The Tea Party folks didn’t really want to give the nomination to a Mormon wall-street shyster and con-man, but at this point they don’t have much choice. The only thing that unites them is a hatred of the President – not who he really is, but of the charicature of him fostered by Fox News and A.M. Talk Radio.

    The problem with that scenario is that it’s subject to being split apart by the slightest disagreements. We haven’t even got to the convention yet, and Ron Paul supporters are threatening to hijack the platform committee and hold hit hostage.

  46. 56

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 51

    During the primaries the knock on Romney is that he couldn’t break 25% amongst all of the other GOP candidates.

    You talk about all the money, all the TV time. It’s what Obama has had for 3 1/2 years and he’s below 50% on approval in most polls. If you have two guys neck and neck in the high 40s, and 5-10% of undecideds, going in to the final weekend, which way do those undecideds usually go?

    Check out Charlie Cook in National Journal, today.

    It’s the economy. Nothing else.

  47. 57

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 55

    Tell me, how many GOP representatives have made the news by stating they won’t be attending the convention? How many hedge when asked if they support Romney?

    The Ron Paul coalition, largely, is now headless. Some of them plan to create problems, yes. A small number, which will be unsuccessful. Meanwhile, what do you think the Occupy cult will try to do at the DNC?

    You are making a late-April argument. It’s late June and the GOP is coalescing around its candidate.

  48. 58

    rhp6033 spews:

    In unrelated good news: the reports from ANA and JAL, the first operators of the Boeing 787, say that despite the early production aircraft being overweight, the new engine packages from Rolls-Royce and G.E. are still posting over 20% improvements in fuel efficiency over the old 767 variants. It’s still early (not that many planes in servic yet), but G.E. says it is seeing 22% fuel efficiency with JAL, and ANA (with more 787’s in service) is seeing about 21% improvements in fuel efficiency.

    We might see some new 787 orders announced at the Farnborogh air show next month, now that Boeing has settled down into a production stream with fewer surprises and delays. In the meantime EADS (Airbus) is still struggling to get the A350-XWB off the drawing pads.

    With both Boeing and Airbus trying to handle two new major airplane programs at the same time (787-8&9 vs. A350WWB & 737MAX vs. A320NEO, engineering resources are going to be quite strained worldwide. Time to dust off that old rocket-science degree and apply for a job!

  49. 59

    No Time for Fascists spews:

    “I see you have reverted to your original mischaracterization of what I wrote”

    I don’t think he mis-characterized at all. Don’t forget some of Serial Conservative other gems like where he ridiculed the looks of an African American girl and called it a joke and defined Trayvon Martin as a “Thug in Training”.

  50. 60

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 59

    Oh, yes, that’s right. It’s always been racist to crack jokes about the First Family:

    Lyndon, why did you name your daughter ‘Lynda Bird’? “Because Lynda Dog would be too cruel. You know if you pick ‘em up by their ears it doesn’t hurt ‘em as much.”

    http://www.robin-williams.net/vietnam.php

    I forgot about that rule.

  51. 62

    Steve spews:

    “and defined Trayvon Martin as a “Thug in Training””

    And as we saw, he was simply echoing right-wing smear machine lies about Martin. As for his ugly remarks about the president’s daughter, Bob went there twice that I know of. And then there’s that strange, fucked up vision involving white Republican Caesars, white Republican ruling councils, the National Guard and militias.

    Look underneath his smarmy, snide, narcissistic surface personality, and Bob just gets fucking uglier and uglier. Racism. Facism. Stupidity. He’s got the whole shit-bag of right-wing dumbfuckness going for him.

  52. 63

    Michael spews:

    @56

    During the primaries the knock on Romney is that he couldn’t break 25% amongst all of the other GOP candidates.

    Yep, he was pretty flat in the early primaries, just like he’s pretty flat now.

    All Obama has to do is stay on top, which he’s doing. When you look at the electoral college maps, Obama’s staying well on top.

  53. 64

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 62

    Hey Doctor Steve:

    How is the economy doing? Did we get our money back on GM yet? How’s consumer confidence? Are our energy needs being adequately met? How are our foreign relations? Is our deficit under control yet?

    Clearly the rantings of a racist, those are. ’cause no one ever criticized the president until a black man occupied the Oval Office.

  54. 65

    Steve spews:

    This is where right-wing hate such as Bob’s leads,

    http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_n.....exas?lite/

    I’m sure Bob would rather we discuss some 70 year-old failed, though reformed, terrorist from the middle of the last century. Yes, better that than to discuss something relevant, like today’s ever-increasing right-wing violence.

    Curb-stomping women. Shooting teen girls. Picking on girlscouts. You guys really know how to show us just how fucking tough you are.

  55. 67

    Steve spews:

    “How is the economy doing? Did we get our money back on GM yet? How’s consumer confidence? Are our energy needs being adequately met? How are our foreign relations? Is our deficit under control yet?”

    Get with the fucking program. You’re a goddamned racist and a fascist, Bob, so I really don’t give a flying fuck what you think about that stuff.

  56. 68

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 65

    You going all Loughner on that attack, Doctor Steve?

    When asked if police had been able to determine if the girls’ sexuality played any role in the shootings, Wright told msnbc.com on Monday: “That’s always something that we’re looking for, but as of this point, we have not been able to establish that that had anything to do with the attack.”

    What’s the curb-stomp? That Rand Paul event? If that’s a curb-stomp (that term makes me think of the scene in American HIstory X), then a face slap of a Gitmo detainee is torture.

  57. 69

    Dorky Dorkman spews:

    What Cereal’s corporate masters want:

    – More tax cuts for the rich and lower corporate taxes WITHOUT closing loopholes.

    – More bogus wars to enrich Halliburton, et al….

    – Economically stress the middle class, because that’s where opposition to this agenda will come from.

    The lesson of the 60’s in America to Republicans was that the stronger the middle class grew, the MORE they opposed Republicsn priorities. Their solution: Destroy the middle class.

    Ralph Nader got in the 2000 race with the expectation that things in this country had to get much worse before they would get better.

  58. 70

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 69

    The 60s. Back when cars were huge with big fins, gas was 20 cents a gallon, and foreign competition was nonexistent.

    You want what no longer exists. You want freedom from competition and continued domestic expansion driven by population growth and new technology without computerization.

    Grow up, dude.

    Oh, and Thanks, Mr. Nader!! Couldn’t have won without ya.

  59. 71

    Steve spews:

    Your slack ass must be used to picking on Girl Scouts or something. I don’t cotton to commies or fascists, and I definitely don’t like racists and narcissists. You’ve got some fucked up personal issues, Bob, and I’m going to continue to talk about them.

  60. 72

    Michael spews:

    @66
    Yep, actually it does. For starters, Romney’s total has about 10% more leans in it than Obama’s does. Of the toss up states Obama has a better chance of winning what he needs to get him over the top.

    Things change over time and maybe things will change so that Romney’s got a shot at winning this thing, but so far I’m not seeing it.

  61. 73

    Dorky Dorkman spews:

    When I mentioned to Cereal that Ted Bundy was a Republican, he said that that was OK because the BTK murderer was a Democrat.

  62. 74

    spews:

    Rich right wingers just wanna buy elections and not be bothered. Mum’s ALWAYS the word:

    During their long campaign to loosen rules on campaign money, conservatives argued that there was a simpler way to prevent corruption: transparency. Get rid of limits on contributions and spending, they said, but make sure voters know where the money is coming from….

    Bradley A. Smith, a Republican and former chairman of the Federal Election Commission, is among those whose views have changed on disclosure. In 2003, he endorsed disclosing donors as a way to discourage corruption by “exposing potential or actual conflicts of interest.”

    But later, he said, he concluded that disclosure requirements could be burdensome for [rich, right wing] citizen groups. And now that campaign reports are posted online, he added, people can easily identify and target their opponents.

    http://www.latimes.com/news/na.....full.story

    Awwwww. Karl Rove and Mitch McConnell are afraid the rich right wingers who want to buy elections will be “bullied” if their buying isn’t kept secret.

    Nice world the wrong wing is building for us.

  63. 75

    Dorky Dorkman spews:

    re 70: “You want what no longer exists. You want freedom from competition and continued domestic expansion driven by population growth and new technology without computerization.”

    You have no idea what I want. You don’t know anything about me.

    I want an Arab Spring type movement in the U.S.

  64. 76

    Dorky Dorkman spews:

    re 70: — and your side is helping us get there. 2 years of Romney, and the house and senate go back to Democrats.

  65. 77

    Michael spews:

    @66

    Look at your map again. Obama’s got a lock on the whole west coast. That’s 74 electoral votes that he doesn’t have to worry about or spend money on. He can pull all sorts of money out of the left coast and spend it else where. CA’s got a huge media market and huge reach. Obama’s also got a lock on 20 electoral votes in IL and IL’s huge media market, he’s going to be pulling money out of there and using Chicago’s media market’s reach to get his message out in the mid-west. Obama also has a lock on NY, 29 electoral college votes and the grand daddy of them all in terms of media markets.

    Other than Texas there’s not much money and no reach in the states that Romney has a lock on.

    But, like I said before, things change over time, Romney could win this thing. I’m just not seeing that yet.

  66. 78

    Steve spews:

    “The 60s. Back when cars were huge with big fins”

    As with everything out of you, this is written with such narcissistic authority. But you know about as much about car fins as you do everything else you talk about – absolutely fucking nothing.

  67. 79

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 72

    Only if you truly believe that AZ, NC, MO, and IN are leaners.

    C’mon……….

    CW holds that Indiana’s already toast for The One – he won’t even try to turn that around. Obama lost MO in 2008. You really think he’ll carry it this year? NC’s Dem reps are the ones who won’t be showing at the convention. Why do you think that is? I don’t have a specific comment on AZ that wouldn’t be spun into another ‘He’s racist’ screed from Doctor Steve. But expect not much boost in AZ from the Latino electorate and a big pushback from the white electorate due to the Supreme Court decision and Napolitano’s response this week. The state passed that law and state sentiment is not much changed from when they did.

    I disagree that ANY of those red leaners are really leaners.

  68. 80

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 77

    You really think money will be an issue for Romney this year?

    Careful on OR. WA, CA – yeah, they’re blue.

  69. 81

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 75

    Lessee:

    Egypt – Non-secular domestic rule with the real strings pulled by the military.

    Libya – Head of state shot in the head while being sodomized at the hands of an unruly mob.

    Syria – Civil war.

    That’s what you want?

  70. 83

    Serial Conservative spews:

    Somebody should keep a list of the number of Democrats who have announced in the past month that they won’t be attending the DNC convention this year.

    I think it would be instructive.

    Door prize for the best weasel-ly excuse for not going.

  71. 84

    Michael spews:

    @82

    Actually, I think Obama’s going to lose MO. But, the cities in MO are liberal territory (even freaking Springfield has a bunch of liberals in it), so Romney’s going to have to have lots of boots on the ground and going to have to spend a bunch of money to get the job done. The trick is, where can Romney get more money than he needs to spend and I don’t think MO’s that place.

  72. 85

    Michael spews:

    @83
    We could do the same for Republicans. Except with Republicans there’s a greater expectation that they attend. In the end, I don’t think it means much for either side.

  73. 86

    Serial Conservative spews:

    @ 85

    I think it tells you where the trouble spots are.

    Manchin, Tester, Matheson, Tomblin, Rahall, Critz

    If I recall, NC, PA, WV, VA, MT, now MO. Ignore the guy from SLC, UT.

    You’ll see more Dems in coal and oil territories running like hell away from Obama this Fall. It’s already begun. Of course, fewer now since so many of them were already purged in 2010.

  74. 89

    No Time for Fascists spews:

    @60 Wow, Serial “Ridicule the looks an an African American girl as a joke” Conservative. You feel entitled to be an racist on this board, because an actor read those lines in 1987 in a movie from 25 years ago? Why not pull up some Jefferson Davis quotes. I bet he told some knee slappers!

    Why do you keep trying to explain away your racism with more and more tortured justifications?

  75. 90

    No Time for Fascists spews:

    Somebody should keep a list of the number of Democrats who have announced in the past month that they won’t be attending the DNC convention this year.

    What? You cannot ask around your GOP staffer office? You would think one of your co worker trolls would already have that. Why should we do your work?

  76. 91

    No Time for Fascists spews:

    According to the report, officials conducting the test asked Zimmerman these two questions:

    Tester: “Did you confront the guy you shot?” Zimmerman: “No.”
    >> Maybe He doesn’t think lurking behind the kids in the dark with a gun as confronting
    Tester: “Were you in fear for your life, when you shot the guy?”
    Zimmerman: “Yes.”
    >> Maybe the kid feared for his life too and was asking the guy to leave him alone!

    that’s it?

    Those answers are inconclusive.

    What was Trayvon’s interview?

    Tester: “Did you confront the guy that shot you?”
    Travyon: “No. I was minding my business walking back to my home. He started to scare me, I went to ask him to stop.”
    Tester: “Were you in fear for your life?”
    Travyon: “Duh! Yes. He had a gun!”

    Oh wait, we can’t. He’s dead and cannot speak for himself.

    Serial “Ridicule the looks an an African American girl as a joke” Conservative, maybe there is a movie from the 1940s you can reference to justify Zimmerman’s actions. Maybe a tweet by Paris Hilton? How about a telegram by Lincoln?

  77. 92

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    Serialfool’s posting history on this thread, below:

    06/26/2012 at 8:11 am
    06/26/2012 at 8:14 am
    06/26/2012 at 8:14 am
    06/26/2012 at 8:29 am
    06/26/2012 at 8:42 am
    06/26/2012 at 8:46 am
    06/26/2012 at 9:08 am
    06/26/2012 at 9:37 am
    06/26/2012 at 9:39 am
    06/26/2012 at 9:42 am
    06/26/2012 at 9:46 am
    06/26/2012 at 9:51 am
    06/26/2012 at 9:56 am
    06/26/2012 at 9:58 am
    06/26/2012 at 11:36 am
    06/26/2012 at 11:42 am
    06/26/2012 at 12:12 pm
    06/26/2012 at 12:19 pm
    06/26/2012 at 12:29 pm
    06/26/2012 at 12:34 pm
    06/26/2012 at 12:37 pm
    06/26/2012 at 12:46 pm
    06/26/2012 at 1:01 pm
    06/26/2012 at 1:03 pm
    06/26/2012 at 1:06 pm
    06/26/2012 at 1:12 pm
    06/26/2012 at 1:14 pm
    06/26/2012 at 1:27 pm
    06/26/2012 at 1:37 pm
    06/26/2012 at 2:05 pm

    He either:
    a) has no life and derives meaning from posting truth-y political comments on a venue where everyone knows he’s full of shit;
    b) is egregiously stealing time from his employer (the woman who pays him to ‘write checks’ and ‘create jobs’) to be posting truth-y political comments etc etc;
    (‘a’ and ‘b’ are not mutually contradictory)
    or
    c) this is his job and he’s a low-level political operative, a buzzing mosquito, a Segretti wannabe who is here simply to annoy honest liberals with obnoxious and sophomoric commentary. He’s likely the nephew of some middle level Republican operative, and was likely assigned this to keep him busy and to keep him from fucking up something important over at Wing-Nut High Command.

    Thus, any logical analysis of serialbob’s performances here leads inevitably to an overwhelming sense of shallow futility spiced with a compensating frat-boy bravado and amoral, clawing desperation for relevance.

    Sad, really.

  78. 94

    Liberal Scientist is a a dirty fucking hippie spews:

    So, serial, tell us all what Mittens is going to do for the country. Give us 10 – no, make it 5 – 5 positive things Mitt is going to do for us to make the US a better place for all its citizens.

    I’d love to hear something positive about your side from you. You’re very adept at bomb throwing and slippery word smithing and changing subjects when a particular point is lost.

    I want you to articulate a positive argument for Mitt Romney and a Republican government.

  79. 95

    Michael spews:

    @86

    I think it tells you where the trouble spots are.

    To some extent that’s probably true, for both sides. But, it’s also true that the national conventions aren’t as important as they used to be and in the Dem’s case there’s nothing much to be decided at the convention this time around.

  80. 96

    Dorky Dorkman spews:

    re 75: I take it you would prefer the top-down dictatorships to the unruliness of change.

    That’s what you want.

  81. 97

    Steve spews:

    @92 Combine both “a” and “c” and it fits the fucktard to a “T”. All that talk of being of the 1%, owning companies, writing paychecks – so much bullshit. The fascism, racism and narcissim, though, that’s real. Yup, that’s the real Bob. And you know something else? He’s one chickenshit motherfucker. He could be slapped around all fucking day long and he wouldn’t do anything about it.

  82. 98

    Steve spews:

    “I take it you would prefer the top-down dictatorships”

    He loves those Michigan Emergency Managers and how they target and then steal public assets from impoverished black communities. He loves how they pulled the plug on local government and centralized control. Of course, then they try to suppress the vote of the citizens of those towns and cities so that they have no fucking say about anything at all. What a game plan! What’s there for a racist and fascist like Bob not to love?

  83. 99

    polls spews:

    51. Michael spews:

    @1
    Go here:
    http://www.realclearpolitics.c.....-1171.html

    Scroll down to the graph and click on Max in the lower right hand corner of the graph. Romney’s flat. All that money, all that TV air time, and the man can’t break 46%. Once the Republican convention’s over and his Veep’s been picked, Romney will probably bounce up to the low 50% range, and then he’ll slide back down to the low to mid 40’s.

    Michael, you ought to look closely at Obama’s approval, not Romney’s. Obama has been under 50% in virtually every credible poll and seems stuck between 46-50. The Bloomberg Poll shows extraordinary, outside the norm approval for Obama. Pull that sucker out and take another look. Anyone who has been in politics knows that Incumbents with a long record under 50% approval with credible polls will not win.
    Undecideds break against the incumbent.
    Do some research and get back to us.

  84. 100

    Steve spews:

    Darn. I left out Bob’s three-year residency out of the list of his narcissism-feeding bullshit posted @97.

    We keep asking for better trolls and they keep sending us mental cases like Bob. What’s up with that? Is that all they’ve got?

  85. 101

    Steve spews:

    “Incumbents with a long record under 50% approval with credible polls will not win.”

    But we’ve never tested that scenario with a “Milk Chocolate Commie-facsist-jihadist Messiah” incumbant running against a sociopathic, dog-hating, vulture capitalist cult leader whose party’s failed ideology only four years ago caused the biggest recession since the Great Depression after starting and nearly losing two wars and not putting them on the books, all while falling asleep on your watch and allowing Bin Laden to attack America. Who knows? Maybe your reward for such abject fucking failure will be to get another shot at it. But we’ll have to just wait and see what happens now, won’t we?

  86. 102

    polls spews:

    @101–
    wow, lots of smoke. you forgot about obama’s promise of cutting debt in half to $5 TRILLION and he raised it to $16 TRILLION plus much lower unemployment and lots of other failed promises.
    Seems like obama’s lies and unfulfilled promises probably offset the spin you are putting on it.

    Let’s see, i’ll put up $100 @ 99.7-.3 odds.
    That’s 332.3-1
    $100 gets me $33,230.

    Are you game?
    I didn’t think so.

  87. 103

    Steve spews:

    “you forgot about obama’s promise of cutting debt in half to $5 TRILLION”

    Um, that promise was made before the abject failure of 30 years of Reaganomics resulted in the Great Recession. While we knew you guys had royally fucked things up, we didn’t know that you had fucked things up that bad.

  88. 104

    polls spews:

    103. Steve spews:

    “you forgot about obama’s promise of cutting debt in half to $5 TRILLION”

    Um, that promise was made before the abject failure of 30 years of Reaganomics resulted in the Great Recession. While we knew you guys had royally fucked things up, we didn’t know that you had fucked things up that bad.

    For a lot of people a promise is a promise Steve. Obama making this PROMISE he can’t keep means he is either disingenous or incompetent. Neither one is good, is it?