Open Thread

- Oh my:

Pajamas Media’s resident fashion-plate and bow-tie adorned dildo brings us his latest installment in the wingnut myth that Obama Is a Muslim intent on imposing sharia law in the United States. Kimball’s editors — no doubt concerned that the typical Pajamas Media lip-moving reader rarely makes it past the headline — pack everything into the post title: “Why It’s OK for the U.S. Govt. to Burn Bibles But Condemn Burning the Koran.”

– The tunnel is a stupid project (also Pete Holems is a coward).

Procession of the species!

– What Booman said.

Update [Darryl]

– I was going to write about Rick Perlstein’s feature in this month’s Mother Jones titled “Inside the GOP’s Fact-Free Nation. From Nixon’s plumbers to James O’Keefe’s video smears: How political lying became normal”, but will offer it as a link here instead. The article is an interesting history of the modern political lie in American politics.

Comments

  1. 1

    Deathfrogg spews:

    Mother Jones has an excellent piece on how our corporate mass media has taken nearly total control of what information is permitted to be disseminated to the public, controlling perceptions and creating “controversies” where the only thing needed is facts. Independent thought, reporting and dissemination of truth is now considered subversive, and dangerous to those who would attain and keep political power for themselves.

    Facts are apparently only for Liberals to use, where there is deliberate intent to deceive, there is only corruption. Lying and direct obfuscation is now the considered the norm in Government and the Press.

  2. 2

    Michael spews:

    The Vancouver Observer has a great 9 part series on the folly that is the Alberta Tar Sands.

    http://www.vancouverobserver.c.....play-dirty
    The Alberta oil sands are grabbing huge chunks of Canada’s limited CO2 allotment away from other businesses and families, forcing these Canadians to make much bigger and more costly cuts in the next few years. Not only are oil sands corporations forcing other Canadians to cut far more than they would otherwise need to, but they are refusing to pay the extra costs — and are sticking the rest of us with the bill.

    Neither the federal government nor the Alberta government has done anything to protect the other 99 per cent of Canadians from the oil sands industry grabbing more than its fair share. This lack of rules is pitting one group of Canadians against another. The rest of us outside the oil sands bubble are losing. And it is about to get much worse.

  3. 4

    John425 spews:

    Speaking of leftwingnuts: This from the Red State blog:

    “Andrew Sullivan is now working for the Daily Beast and Newsweek after spending a great deal of time at the Atlantic. No one in the media cares to note that Andrew Sullivan is obsessed with Sarah Palin’s uterus and whether Trig Palin once resided there. His obsession amounts to Tourettes on a keyboard coupled with some form of mental illness.”

  4. 5

    spews:

    4. John425 spews:

    Speaking of leftwingnuts: This from the Red State blog:

    “Andrew Sullivan is now working for the Daily Beast and Newsweek after spending a great deal of time at the Atlantic. No one in the media cares to note that Andrew Sullivan is obsessed with Sarah Palin’s uterus and whether Trig Palin once resided there. His obsession amounts to Tourettes on a keyboard coupled with some form of mental illness.”

    04/25/2011 at 10:55 am

    We are taliking about RIGHTWING nuts, assholes like you, and morons who lie to get elercted like Scott Walker then wonder why why why they are getting recalled.

    Is there ONE member of the Republican Party in this or any other state who can open their mouth without lying?

    ONE???

    Maybe the dipshit @4 can enlighten us (this ought to be good…).

  5. 7

    NPR keeps getting PWN3D spews:

    Just the facts:

    Gas was $1.84 when Obama was elected.
    Gas is now $4, just two years later.

    just…..wow.

  6. 8

    proud leftist spews:

    7
    You make the point of the thread, that wingnuts are incapable of telling the truth, perfectly. Suggesting that Obama is to blame for the rising cost of gas is just delusional. You wouldn’t recognize a fact if it was fucking you in the ass.

  7. 9

    NPR keeps getting PWN3D spews:

    @8

    you were all so quick to blame bush when gas prices went nuts when he was prez.

    why the double standard?

    how many times did we hear that “bush is making his oil friends rich!” with the high gas prices?

    answer: lots.

    double………………..standard.

  8. 12

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Here out west, it was $2.76 on Election Day 2008, and over $3 the previous week, so where the fuck did you get $1.84?? Did you pull it out of your ass?

  9. 16

    NPR keeps getting PWN3D spews:

    @12

    where did I get 41.84?

    gee asswhipe, the same consumer reports website you got your info…I just had the CORRECT date.

    god, you really look stupid.

  10. 18

    NPR keeps getting PWN3D spews:

    time for magoo rabbit to go back and hide again.

    damn, how many times do I have to bust you for giving out false info?

    I think a smart lawyer would open back up any cases that you presided over….I smell lots of judgements being overturned.

  11. 19

    NPR keeps getting PWN3D spews:

    wow…I bet you feel really stupid about now.

    You came strutting into this thread trying to be the man – popping off and throwing out data in order to chump me.

    and what did you get? OWNED!

    who is kicking who around? ya, thats what I thought.

  12. 20

    rhp6033 spews:

    NPR @ 7: You said “elected”, not “inaugerated”. So yes, you were wrong in your facts, by your own measurement. If you had meant to say “inaugerated”, or “when he became President”, you should have said so, and apologized for the mis-statement. I note that you didnt’ do wo.

    And you forgot to mention that gas WAS at $4.00 per gallon just five months before the election, and only started dropping when (a) it was clear the economiy was crashing fast (which usually results in a drop in demand for gasoline and other oil products), and (b) it was clear that Obama was going to be President if McCain didn’t get outside help. Of course, the magnitude of the economic collapse was beyond the oil companies could do to help McCain.

    Since I have become a voting adult, which has been quite some time now, I’ve noticed that the price of gas ALWAYS goes DOWN in the five months before the presidential election – assuming a Republican is in the White House. I noticed this started with Reagan’s second campaign.

  13. 22

    Ekim spews:

    NPR is a sock puppet. One of the paid Koch Suckers.

    Hey NPR (AKA Koch Sucker), how much are you getting paid for posting inaccurate information.

    Note to HA:
    When are we going to get a better grade of trolls? This Koch Sucker really sucks.

  14. 23

    NPR keeps getting PWN3D spews:

    @20

    oh for christs sake RHP, you know damn well what I meant….dont be stupid.

    of course neither you or magoo rabbit mention that gas prices KEPT GOING DOWN even after the election and into 2009…they started going back up after obama started implenting his economic policies.

    try and spin it any way you want. the facts are the facts, and gas has more than doubled in price since obama took the big chair.

    you all blamed bush when gas went to $4 a gallon when he was in office…but now, you will find any excuse you can so teh Big O doesnt take the heat.

  15. 25

    NPR keeps getting PWN3D spews:

    @22

    what info have I posted that is false? it all comes straight from the consumer reports website – the SAME webiste magoo rabbit pulled his info from..

    so tell me big guy, which info is innacurate?

  16. 27

    NPR keeps getting PWN3D spews:

    Yep Ekim, thats what I thought – you cant find any “inaccurate information” that I posted, can you?

    of course, your next response will be “but TEH CONZOOMUR REEPURTZ IS TEH RITE WINGE!”

    poor ekim…yet another chump who gets owned.

  17. 28

    NPR keeps getting PWN3D spews:

    @26

    OK Joey, post where my info was innacurate.

    Its not like I posted that FLorida was the #1 beef producer or anything…..

  18. 30

    Billy Pulpit (identifying stuff) spews:

    re 9: What I remember was also factual discussions by democrats of, for example, the fact that at a time when gas prices were rising, Bush INCREASED the strategic gas reserve — thereby exacerbating the problem and, at the same time ENRICHING HIS BUDDIES IN THE OIL AND GAS BUSINESS.

    So, our criticism of the Bushistas was based on facts — a thing you seem to not comprehend.

  19. 32

    Billy Pulpit (identifying stuff) spews:

    re 25: What’s untrue about what you do is that you deliberately look for factoids that support your preconceived views.

    If you want to compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges, why not compare the cost of gas at its highest in the Bush administration and its highest in the Obama administration — and vice versa.

    Just plopping a factoid like the gas price at the end of Bush’s administration as opposed to what it is at this point in Obama’s administration is pointless.

    The price of gas at the end of the Bush administration and the beginning of Obama’s were preceisely and exactly the same.

    I guess that proves that Bush and Obama were both born in Kenya.

  20. 33

    Billy Pulpit (identifying stuff) spews:

    C’mon NPR, you should have a self-aggrandizing, twisted little comment by now.

    I’m predicting you can’t just shut your trap. You will be forced by your inherent egotism to continue to pile up a mountain of evidence that you are about as bright as a roomfull of Jerry Lewis impersonators.

  21. 34

    Billy Pulpit (identifying stuff) spews:

    The French love Jerry Lewis. That must mean that NPR is a socialist. Go ahead NPR, show me where I have not been factual.

    You are a lame, lame, French loving Jerry Lewis impersonator.

  22. 35

    rhp6033 spews:

    NPR @ 23 said” “…oh for christs sake RHP, you know damn well what I meant… dont be stupid.”

    I’m not the one using different terminology and then trying to get high-fives and bragging about how they “owned” their critics simply because they responded to the terms you used. When dates are important, the date someone is elected is different from the date they take office. Keep that in mind.

    If you are going to try to insert facts into the debate – something which I acknowledge is a new endeavor for you – you must stive to be precise about what you are measuring.

    If you make a mistake like that, just be man enough to admit it, apologize for wasting everyone’s time in a debate over what you meant, not what you said, and then move on. That’s the way gentlemen debate an issue. God knows, I’ve made enough mis-statement of my own over time, and that’s the way I try to handle it when I do so.

    Oh, and in a collegiate debate format, you would have lost miserably. Judges don’t give credit to participants who expect them to read their minds, in order to discern what they “meant”, versus what they said. And calling your opponants or the judges stupid for not reading your mind will just get your team disqualified, and kicked off the debate team.

  23. 36

    Zotz sez: Teahadists are Koch suckers! spews:

    @35: Sigh…

    You are wasting your really fine words on what amounts to a pile of dog shit looking for a shoe.

    This place should have banner that says:

    This site lets cretins leave piles of dogshit. Please don’t step in the dogshit. It just encourages them.

  24. 37

    Americafirst spews:

    Undoubtedly the Obama-Stalinist madcap economic policies which drive the dollar down move dollar-denominated oil prices higher over the long term; however the most significant reason for short-term oil price spikes is speculation, which magnifies uncertainties in oil-producing areas (another round of political unrest in the Middle East), something which is entirely normal in commodity trading. However leftist hyperbole should be met with rightist hyperbole; so by all means blame Obama

  25. 38

    rhp6033 spews:

    Looks like Haley Barbour is dropping out of the Presidential 2012 race, even before he’s officially “in”.

    Of course, there’s lots of time for Republicans to sort things out. It’s going to be entertaining, though. The “mainstream candidates are Romney and Christie. Then you have the “returning also-rans”, like Gingrich. But the real fireworks appear to be on the Tea Party side, with Trump, Palin, Bachman, and potentially others trying to jump on the band-wagon. I wouldn’t be surprised if Glen Beck didn’t give it a try. Or, as some have referred to it, the GOP primary process will resemble a circular firing squad.

    Right now they are still competing at trying to be the one who makes the craziest bashing of Obama. But sooner or later they are going to have to start criticizing each other (it’s already started to some extent), because nobody’s going to advance further without diminishing the others in the process.

  26. 39

    rhp6033 spews:

    36: Point taken. Or as another fellow once advised me, “don’t get into a pissing match with a skunk”.

  27. 40

    rhp6033 spews:

    39 (continued): Of course, I see this entire site as being an attempt to confront dishonosty and ignorance with facts and reasoning. It really doesn’t matter whether the trolls agree with us or not. It’s just that we need to correct the record, so others don’t confuse our silence with consent.

  28. 41

    Zotz sez: Teahadists are Koch suckers! spews:

    @40: I know. Even Pudpuller deserves a reasoned response once in a while (take your meds!).

    But it’s been clear for a while now that this particular piece of shit amounted to utter vileness. Waste of electrons, imo.

  29. 42

    proud leftist spews:

    41
    NPR is that special variety of idiot, the type who doesn’t recognize his own intellectual limitations. He can get eaten, shit out, and stepped on during an argument, yet think he prevailed. The poor bastard. Can you imagine passing your time on this old earth with that level of stupidity and self=delusion?

  30. 43

    slingshot spews:

    Here’s a quote from Romney in his oped in the Union Leader:

    “Barack Obama is facing a financial emergency on a grander scale. Yet his approach has been to engage in one of the biggest peacetime spending binges in American history”.

    It’s pretty darn peaceful out there, eh?

  31. 44

    rhp6033 spews:

    # 43: Yep, I just read that quote. Now Romney’s handlers are saying he meant “since WWII”, but I don’t see how that fits in the sentence. I would be willing to give him a mulligan, except that he would presumably well-remember that in the midst of his very public pro-Iraqi war position in the 2008 primary race, somebody asked him why none of his sons were serving in the military, and he feebly answered that they were serving their country by campaigning for him. Up to that point he still had a chance at the nomination, but with that single exchange his campaign jumped the shark, never to recover.

    He’s given his primary opponants a real gift with this one. I doubt the Republicans in the American heartland who have family members still serving in Iraq or Afganistan are going to look very favorably on a candidate who thinks we are at peace.

    And this wasn’t an interview, where perhaps he could be excused for making a verbal blunder. This was an Op-Ed piece, written under his name, which presumably would have been subject to several editing cycles.

  32. 45

    proud leftist spews:

    43, 44
    I, who have been guilty of a few in my time, forgive a lot of verbal gaffes, but, as rhp points out, this blunder occurred in writing. Holy crap. What kind of incompetence is Romney surrounding himself with? Of course, given the present nature of the GOP, finding staffers who don’t pick their noses in public and eat it is a huge challenge.

  33. 46

    rhp6033 spews:

    The funny thing is, ALL of the Republican candidates have major problems on the path to the nomination. Let’s consider a few:

    Romney is Morman, which is considered by many Evangelicals as being the equivilent of an anti-Christian cult. We can argue about Mormanism and whether religion should be a factor in an election all we want, but there’s a signifant portion of the Republican electorate who simply won’t vote for him.

    Palin couldn’t even stick out one term as governor of Alaska. Why should we assume she’s going to stick out four years as President?

    Trump may be the guy the media goes to for quotes right now, because they are all so – entertaining. But his three marriages aren’t going to win him any votes among the Evangelicals either. (Oh, did you note that he was following Newt’s example, and saying that he “strayed” because he was working too hard?)

    Newt has the same problem as Trump – three marriages including infidelity = no Evangelical support.

    Huckabee probably has the least amount of baggage, but reducing the sentence to allow the release Maurice Clemmens, who went on to murder several police officers in a cold-blodded assasination a little over a year ago should give his opponants some ammunition to throw at him – it’s the Willie Horton problem, except aimed at a Republican BY Republicans this time around.

  34. 47

    spews:

    NPR:

    You’re a fucking retard. Case closed. Say whatever you want, no one here will take you seriously, so enjoy being our punching bag. These newer trolls are even dumber than the last batch.

  35. 49

    slingshot spews:

    @44, Yes, that ‘since WWII’ was a doosie. Rather than clearing things up, it just stirred the mud.

    Except for Trump, their field looks the same as it did for ’08, and they chose the ridiculous clown McCain over all of them. It’ll be fun to watch.

  36. 51

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @14 Obama wasn’t elected in Jan 2009, you stupid shit. What part of “when Obama was elected” don’t you understand? Cripes, you don’t even read your own posts!!

  37. 52

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    We need better trolls on this blog. This kinda stuff is so bad it even takes the fun out of crotch-kicking them.

  38. 53

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @16 After you “do not pass Go, do not collect $200, go back to first grade” and learn to not write “when Obama was elected” when you mean “when Obama took office,” we can discuss the data showing that gas prices fell almost a buck a gallon between the time Obama was elected and the time he took office — and who should get credit for that.

    You arguably might have a debating point if gas prices had gone up a buck a gallon between the time he was elected and when he took office … but unless you like higher gas prices it’s hard to see why you’re faulting Obama for such a dramatic drop in gas prices following his election …

  39. 54

    spews:

    http://www.bartcop.com/

    Dear Trolls-

    You didn’t get mad when the Supreme Court stopped a legal recount and appointed a President.

    You didn’t get mad when Cheney allowed Energy company officials to dictate energy Policy.

    You didn’t get mad when a covert CIA Operative was revealed.

    You didn’t get mad when the Patriot Act was passed.

    You didn’t get mad when we illegally invaded Iraq looking for WMD’S that didn’t exist.

    You didn’t get mad when we spent over 600 Billion dollars(and counting) on Iraq War.

    You didn’t get mad when over 10 billion dollars just disappeared in Iraq.

    You didn’t get mad when Bush was illegally wiretapping us at home and work.

    You didn’t get mad when Bush borrowed money to give to the oil companies.

    You didn’t get mad when Bush failed to catch Bin Laden.

    You didn’t get mad when you saw the cockroaches at Walter Reed.

    You didn’t get mad when we let New Orleans drown.

    You didn’t get mad when Bush got 4,500 soldiers killed.

    You didn’t get mad when the deficit hit the trillion dollar mark.

    You finally got mad when—- Obama decided that people in America deserved the right to see a doctor if they are sick.

    Illegal wars, lies, corruption, torture, giving your tax dollars to super-rich, are all OK with you? But helping other Americans is the last straw?

    Seven presidents have tried to pass a Health Care Plan of some sort and have failed. None have had the “hate filled” opposition this president has received.

  40. 55

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Oh wait, I get it, BUSH was still in office and he made gas prices go down to make Obama look good …

    (dripping with sarcasm)

  41. 56

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @19 Actually, no. What I feel about now is that you’re really stupid — too stupid for words, so incredibly stupid you don’t even know you’re stupid, or why.

  42. 57

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @47 It’s useless. He’s so stupid he doesn’t even feel anything when we kick him. He’s an insentient object. I’ve met cinder blocks with more awareness than him.

  43. 58

    proud leftist spews:

    Rujax @ 54
    Exactly. Good post. Our current righties don’t know fascism from communism from monarchism from anarchism from socialism from republicanism from DeadSkunkism. All they know is what their corporate masters tell them to believe.