Open thread 5-13-05

Okay… so in case it wasn’t clear, let me explain again the concept of these Open Threads. I give you a thread here, to post whatever you want on whatever topic you want… and you agree to try to keep the other threads somewhat on topic. I don’t mind if the other threads organically stray off track, but if you have something entirely unrelated to say, this is the place to do it.


  1. 4

    christmasghost spews:

    Josef…please tell me you are just fooling around….’cause this whole thing is starting to be a little stalkerish? Unless I have totally missed the joke in which case please enlighten me…..

  2. 5


    Comment by christmasghost— 5/13/05 @ 9:22 pm

    Marummy is the name of our gorgeous Defense Secretary (at least from felon voters, dead voters, double voters) Mary “Marummy” Lane and I am her #1 fan, suck-up and messenger.

    Besides, she NEEDS a fan club as the coordinator of the re-vote effort – the press, being the press, mislabels her as “spokeswoman” because anybody who speaks for a campaign is labeled as such.

  3. 6

    christmasghost spews:

    Josef….yeah you’ve got the sucking up goin’ on alright.LOL.
    are we talking love and marriage here?…..*big grin*

  4. 7


    Comment by christmasghost— 5/13/05 @ 9:52 pm

    Long, long ways down the road :-). Gosh, I haven’t even seen her in the flesh yet. . .

    So I’m just a loyal trooper, blogger and campaign volunteer who has a relative who almost challenged a Democrat primary election but came up short on $$$… and therefore I want this fixed.

    Marummy’s the leader in directing the fight.

  5. 10

    Shelly spews:

    I need a fact-checker! Can anyone tell me if Tim Eyman has any school-aged children?

    I wrote an opinion piece for Seattle’s Parent mag on Seattle school closures (hysterical, fund-raising parent suggests ways to save our schools, ha-ha), in which I call Tim Eyman a horse’s ass. (It gave me great pleasure to do so.) My piece will be in the July issue.

    I made a reference to him also being a parent, and I did run into him once at the Children’s Museum with a kid in tow. But, is he actually a parent? Can anyone point me to a web site with a decent bio of him (personal or resume, not the usual political bio)?


  6. 12

    zapporo spews:

    An Open Letter to Tim Eyeman

    WATCH OUT FOR SHELLY – She’s stalking you.
    She’s just another Hedra Carlson in bright clothing.
    She’s just another Carrie on steroids.
    Do not allow her to babysit your children.
    Do not under any circumstances hire her as your nanny.
    Get that unlisted number NOW!

  7. 13

    Danw spews:

    Does anyone think that there will be a few military bases saved for the correct vote on the nuclear option? Intersting closings in moderate Republican states (Snow), Liebermans(repug in sheeps clothing) state and of course the new republian senator in N Dakota who beat Daschle on his promise to keep the base open….watch him end up looking like a hero for his fine negotiating skills.

    Damn this Rove is amazing….what a great evil mind.

  8. 14

    Patrick spews:

    My suggestion to Josef is try her out in a meretricious relationship first (and wear a rubber) so you don’t get stuck with alimony and child support if she disappoints you.

  9. 15

    JCH spews:

    Why dems are liars and hypocrites. Read on!!!……….Dems Back Bush Social Security Plan
    This is rich. Columnist Don Surber of the Charleston (W.Va.) Daily Mail reports that the West Virginia Legislature, dominated by Democrats, has a plan to invest $5.5 billion in pension money for state employees in stocks and bonds:

    With their $5.5 billion pension bond proposal, Democrats in West Virginia are promising voters that Wall Street will average better than 7.5 percent returns annually for the next 30 years. Most of that money will be used to shore up the teacher pension plan.

    If Wall Street is good enough for their teachers, then it should be good enough for my kids, who will face 30 percent cuts in their Social Security when they retire.

    President Bush ought to visit West Virginia and endorse this pension bond plan–and double-dog-dare Sens. Bob Byrd and [Jay] Rockefeller to denounce the $5.5 billion pension bond as a “risky scheme.”

  10. 16

    bf spews:

    As I read the comments put forth on this blog, on any variety of subjects, I find myself sad for our Republic. Are we at that point where the potential for thoughtful conversation has evaporated? Are we really at that point where we hate our fellow Americans simply for their political persuasion?

    Both sides have valid arguments, however, when we are at a point in our history where we disagree with a persons argument, just because they are a democrat or a republican, we are greatly discounting our fellow countrymen. Shouldn’t we look at people like Senator Lieberman as a great American because although he considers himself to be a democrat, he is strong enough to agree with the “otherside” when his conscious dictates? This is because he leads with conviction rather than at the whim of his party!

    Has the political dialogue gotten to that point where we are just a few steps away from the horror of the Hutus and Tutsis?

  11. 19

    bf spews:

    Of course, maybe the hijackings of both the Democratic and Republican Parties by extremists will finally make possible a viable third party. One smack dab in the middle.

  12. 21

    Stop their CATerwauling, spay/neuter ALL Pet Libs spews:

    Has the political dialogue gotten to that point where we are just a few steps away from the horror of the Hutus and Tutsis?
    -Comment by bf— 5/14/05 @ 10:11 am

    Here’s my take on that bf (please believe me when I tell you this is what I really do believe and am not – although it certainly will – trying to stir up more rhetoric):

    The liberals that post here are mostly high school and college students. Yes, they do stridently believe in the glories of liberalism/soci*lsim, but they are simply more interested in being HEARD and the debased language they invariably fall into guarantees them a modicom of momentary attention… and it makes them feel all grown up.

    Speaking for only myself, I am an unabashed adult conservative, not old enough to be considered senior but old enough to have kids out of college and law school. I am socially, fiscally and just about every other way a conservative. I don’t agree with everything those in my party do or say, but, as I would my own family, my country and my own faith, I will defend them from those who wish to destroy them, debase them or spread lies about them.

    That is NOT why I come here though and it’s a very small part of why I participate here: I come here because it’s entertaining – it’s that simple.

    It’s raucously amusing to watch the little libs heads explode while they sputter with anger and seethe with indignation. It’s hysterical to watch them predictable devolve into name calling and filthy words when they can no longer contribute to a conversation. I can spend an hour or so here and get up from my chair and still laugh an hour later over the insanity and the fun of teasing the strident libs

    There is not one single solitary thing or person in this blog that I would EVER take serious or as a grain of truth. There are plenty of sources for truth, for facts, for hard information – but kiddo, ‘this ain’t one of em’! As long as a reader keeps that aspect in perspective, there’s no need to worry about the dialogue.

    Nothing of any consequence will be accomplished here – Goldy will probably get a few beers from his adoring fans, the youthful left will continue to vent and pretend tantrums make them all grown up and folks like me (and I suspect Chardonnay, Mr Cynical and a few others) will enjoy the best free entertainment to be had.

  13. 22

    Stop their CATerwauling, spay/neuter ALL Pet Libs spews:

    Sorry… somewhere in there I clearly forgot to properly close a tag.

    Deal with it.

  14. 23

    K spews:

    CAT @ 20,21

    Sorry to disappoint you, but I’m a proud liberal several decades out of college. I also know the difference between liberalism and socialism.

    And my head has not exploded, though I am sometimes irritated when the “righties” hijack a thread with their foolishness.

  15. 24

    Donnageddon spews:

    Has the political dialogue gotten to that point where we are just a few steps away from the horror of the Hutus and Tutsis?

    Comment by bf— 5/14/05 @ 10:11 am

    Yep, a facist state will do that to political dialogue. Deal with it.

  16. 25

    Stop their CATerwauling, spay/neuter ALL Pet Libs spews:

    Yep, a facist state will do that to political dialogue. -Comment by Donnageddon— 5/14/05 @ 12:41 pm

    “…It’s hysterical to watch them predictably devolve into name calling…” Comment by Stop their CATerwauling, spay/neuter ALL Pet Libs— 5/14/05 @ 12:00 pm


  17. 31

    GS spews:

    Interesting Shelly

    You can write a piece slamming Tim Eyman, but you know nothing about the man! You just know that the Libs hate him. He knows when goverment has stepped to far. We will see more of him thank goodness. But he is not the only one in town writing initiatives! He is no longer the only one bringing legal actions. There is a movement alive and Tim is just a piece of it! So when Tim has been silenced, (which I doubt he will) many many more are rising up to take the mantra.

    Legal action on I601 – Not Tim Eyman
    NONEGASTAX initiative – Not Tim Eyman
    Legal action on Election – Not TIm Eyeman
    Legal action on 98 mis-uses of the emergency clause – Not Tim Eyman

    The only initiative Tim Eyman has in the current works is Performance Audits for the state! Which is desperately necessary!

    So go ahead and write about him to your hearts content! The movement is alive and Tim has broad shoulders!

  18. 32

    Mr. Cynical spews:

    I find it quite interesting that Goldy & his ilk, who were fit to be tied about someone wrongfully narc’ing on Goldy about being
    a child-molesting depraved weirdo guy…..would then:
    1) Praise Jim West for threatening to kill Tom McCabe
    2) Encourage someone to stalk Mary Lane

    Why would you whine, piss & moan about how you were treated….and then promote even worse???
    You remind me of the scrawny little puke would would sneak up up someone, throw a rock at him and then run like hell behind his mommy. Then, when Goldy’s victim finds him alone in the yard and threatens to bitch-slap Goldy resulting in Goldy shitting his Star Wars tightie-whities….further resulting in Goldy complaining about people being mean to him.

    Aren’t you afraid Goldy that you may be escalating things???

  19. 33

    Mr. Cynical spews:

    Is this the new Goldy standard???
    Or Goldy, are you just being “funny” again??
    It’s funny when it’s someone else…
    but not funny when it’s you?????

  20. 34

    JCH spews:

    NO Nukes! No Nukes! No Nukes! er,…….Wait a second……[hehe…Dems and Libs are such dumb shits!] WASHINGTON – Several of the nation’s most prominent environmentalists have gone public with the message that nuclear power, long taboo among environmental advocates, should be reconsidered as a remedy for global warming. Their numbers are still small, but they represent growing cracks in what had been a virtually solid wall of opposition to nuclear power among most mainstream environmental groups…

  21. 36

    drivel spews:

    No Donnageddon @ 32, Mr. Cynica is just reliving his childhood experience with his tight undies in post 30. In fact, he wore the same size 28 underwear until they finally exploded (as he was up to size 42) That must be the reason Mrs. C cannot get any satisfaction from him

  22. 37

    bf spews:

    RE: Comment by Stop their CATerwauling, spay/neuter ALL Pet Libs— 5/14/05 @ 12:00 pm

    Thank you for the perspective ….. It should be easier to read the various posts (from both sides) with that in mind :)

  23. 38

    Patrick spews:

    Reply to 20

    Don’t believe anything this cat posts. Most of the liberals on this board are retired guys.

  24. 39

    Patrick spews:

    While we’re talking about “hysterical” people, no Democratic president has ever had people attending his public rallies arrested and carted away for opposing his policies, but this Republican president does.

  25. 40


    Comment by bf— 5/14/05 @ 10:42 am

    Thanks for the kind words :-).

    Comment by Mr. Cynical— 5/14/05 @ 1:34 pm

    Thanks for sticking up for me and my hero, one of the greatest Washingtonians that has lived, is living and will ever live.

  26. 41

    Mr. Cynical spews:

    Donna@33 and drivel@34–
    I find it extremely revealing that you morons would rush to “poor Goldy’s” defense when he was blindsided and wronged…
    yet encourage others to do something much, much worse.

    Circle the wagons around Goldy….fan the flames for others to do worse things to your enemies. I get it!

  27. 42

    drivel spews:

    What’s up Mr Cynical, is it too early in the morning for you to laugh at yourself? You are the one always preaching that the left has no sense of humor. Guess you are coming back to your roots (or is it watermelons?). Welcome back. LMAO

  28. 43

    zapporo spews:

    Pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, wham!
    pop, wham!, pop, pop, pop, pop, WHAM!
    pop, pOp, POP, pOP, POp,pop, WHAM!, WHAM!, WHAM!
    What the hell is that background noise?
    Oh, I get it.
    Thermonuclear liberal pin-head explosions.
    One hell of a liberal chain reaction goin’ on at this site.

    The Liberal
    Chain Reaction

  29. 44

    Donnageddon spews:

    I think Mr Cs main problem is that he doesn’t seem to realise that his gibberish makes absolutley no sense.

    But then, it would probably be scarier if his posts actually did make any sense.

  30. 45

    Mr. Cynical spews:

    Donna & Drivel–
    Nice attempt to deflect from the point…
    You 2 losers were quick to be outraged that anyone would accuse Goldy of being a pervert….yet attacking your enemies in a vile manner is NO PROBLEM.
    Interesting revelation PINHEADS!

  31. 47

    Patrick spews:

    Alaska Airlines Baggage Chaos

    … continued for a second day after the airline fired 400+ union baggage handlers and outsourced their work to a contractor employing cheap labor. Many passengers had to wait 2 hours or more for their bags after deplaning while hapless spouses circled endlessly through the passenger pick-up zone. Hey, you get what you pay for! I can think of at least 3 good reasons NOT to fly on Alaska Airlines:

    1. Who wants to wait 2 hours for their bags?
    2. In solidarity with our union brothers and sisters, boycott this union-busting airline!
    3. Their airplanes started crashing after they started taking shortcuts on maintenance to save money — remember the falsified paperwork, the whistleblowers, and the stripped rudder jack screw that sent an Alaska Airlines plane spinning into the Pacific Ocean?

    Hey, you get what you pay for!

  32. 48

    Stop their CATerwauling, spay/neuter ALL Pet Libs spews:

    I actually know Bill Weaver, the fellow who was VP of Maintenance and Engineering for Alaska at that time – there was a bit more going on than was revealed to the general public and if you don’t think he was devastated by that crash, you are sadly mistaken.

    I’d fly Alaska in a heartbeat, although our family airline of preference is NWA on which my spouse has travelled over 2 million miles.

    We don’t shop union grocery stores either: while we’re no fans of WalMart, we love employee owned, union scorning Winco!

  33. 49

    Patrick spews:

    Cat @ 45

    If you want to fly on Alaska go right ahead! It’s a free country! You get what you pay for.

    It’s been quite a few years since I’ve flown on NWA, but in the old days I flew on NWA several times, and never once had a good experience with that airline. They had their chance. Never again.

    Winco may be an employee-owned grocery store, but Alaska sure isn’t an employee-owned airline. Nowadays, most corporations aren’t shareholder owned, either. Their sole purpose is to line the pockets of CEOs appointed, compensated, and protected by the CEO’s own hand-picked board.

    So go ahead and shop in your non-union grocery store, fly on your non-union airline, and buy stock in a crooked company … all your chickens will come home to roost someday. When they do, you’ll get no sympathy from me.

  34. 51

    Stop their CATerwauling, spay/neuter ALL Pet Libs spews:

    Well there’s the difference between us, kiddo: I never asked nor do I need, expect or want symapthy from you or anyone.

    You see, I believe in PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY which means I don’t do the whole “pity poor me” thing when I make choices that don’t work out the way I hoped.
    Pity wallowing is generally accepted as a childish liberal pastime.

    And FYI, NWA has been terrific – my spouse auto upgrades to 1st class within 24 hours of flight time – at no extra charge – and we’ve had FAMILY roundtrips to Europe FIRST CLASS with our miles. We leave this week for the east coast ALL IN PERKS for our oldests law school graduation. I can’t ever remember a piece of lost baggage or a miserable flight (unless it was one caused by passengers) with NWA.

    And no, we don’t own any airline or transportation stock in our portfolio’s

  35. 52

    GS spews:

    Well Alaska Airlines is taking the low road I agree! I never like to see people sent walking, especially when the company claimed to be a family. Not anymore.

    Having said that some of these laid off union people will find what I have found in looking for work in this state, that you will be offered much less in wages and benefits than you made before. Unless of course, you go to work for State Government!

    That is unless you are bestowed by Christine Gregoire! She and the democraps have a 12% increase in spending in their beloved world. They claimed 98 times that the emergency clause was necessary to kill the citizens constitutional right to referendum on their bullshit legislative agenda! And just to rub some salt – ALL STATE EMPLOYEES WILL GET ANOTHER RAISE THIS YEAR!

    So while Alaska airlines and many many others in this state collect their unemployment checks (while they last) just remember who is leading this state during these layoffs, and remember who is robbing you blind while you least can afford her massive Tax Hikes!


  36. 53

    Patrick spews:

    Cat @ 48

    You’re a real hardass, aren’t you? No feelings for your fellow man. Get a clue … this country was built on TEAMWORK and people looking out for each other.

  37. 54

    Patrick spews:

    GS @ 49

    A big part of the 12% spending increase went for deferred transportation projects and funding two education initiatives (to reduce class sizes and improve teacher pay) that were overwhelmingly approved by voters. Population growth, inflation, rising medical costs, and restoring health care funding for kids ate up most of the rest. This legislative session didn’t produce much in new spending programs.

    If you think state jobs pay so well, why aren’t you working in a state job? Probably becaus state workers earn far below the private sector for comparable work, and you’re not willing to take the pay cut, is my guess! This was their first raise since 1990, and is less than inflation for the six years it covers. Good God, people like you are mean and cheap.

    During the campaign, Rossi liked to brag about how he balanced the state budget in the last biennium. He did it by providing no funding for critical transportation projects, no raises for teachers or state employees, and throwing 40,000 poor kids off Medicaid. Is that the kind of man we want leading our state?

    What is it with you Republicans that you don’t want to spend money that benefits someone else or even yourselves? Do you run your families that way? I doubt it, as most of you aspire to live in $800,000 homes and drive $100,000 cars. But I’d hate to be your wife trying to get $40 from you to buy the kids new shoes for school! Geez you’re a bunch of mean, cheap, self-centered bastards!

    We need a Republican Party in this country. People like you need to have your own separate political party. We liberals don’t want anything to do with you.

  38. 55

    JCH spews:

    51….Patrick…”Guvment” Democrat union hacks are vastly overpaid, and most will not and can not hack it in the private sector. That is why you are a parasite. [Atlas has Shrugged]

  39. 56

    Puddybud spews:

    CAT @ 48:

    My son is a junior, looking at the five year JD program at GWU in WA., DC. Is it a good program? He also is looking at WA University in St. Louis. I read it’s a good school.

    It is good to read about someone who flies a lot tell it as it is instead of those who watch airplanes from the road wishing they were going somewhere. I used to fly United, and in 6 years was close to becoming a million miler, flying around the world 5 times and three other times real close. I would buy business class and after flying so much United would upgrade me to first almost all the time. Can you say $5000 per ticket?

    I enjoyed flying first class to Australia three to four times a year until 2000. But when United saw bankruptcy and started their spiral down into the toilet, I changed to Alaska. Now I am an MVP Gold, close to becoming Gold again, yes, already close before half the year is up. In June I will renew my Marriott Gold and Avis Preferred. The problem is with most liberal democraps in this state they haven’t seen the world. Can you say vacation at Lake Chelan? Once they leave their little cocoon of WA state and see how the real people live, ha, it will be too much sunlight into their darkened rooms.

    I was in that Fiasco on Friday, as the SEA-SF flight corridor was a mess. My ASA (Alaska for you democraps) flight was 7 hours late, but I didn’t bail on the flight. If fact we determined most of us on the flight who stayed at SFO to fly home late were Repubs. How? Well we discussed the two blogs, HA vs. SP and SP was the more favorite one hands down, with better stories and more truthful responders. Many of us were passing the time on the airport Internet connection, (invented by DARPA, not Al Gore – get it Donnageddon et. al.?) watching our flight on the runway at SEA-TAC.

    I have flight attendant friends, one of them lives on my street. I think the United paymasters getting to keep their pensions sucks, as everyone should go down on the ship together. I think the people got screwed at United.

    And don’t give me that crap all corporate boardrooms are Republican. Is Bill Gates a democrat – yes. Warren Buffet a democrat – yes. Two big $$$ guys. Oh yes, mr. moveon.porker himself Geroge Soros a democrat – yes!!! What about Steve Balmer – I bet you yes. One day I was in the Everett Costo, and whom did I see shopping in the Everett Costco, Steve Balmer and family. I looked at him dead in the eye, letting him know I knew who he was while most Everett lefties didn’t have a clue. He spent $900 that day.

    In a previous blog thread I asked dees liberals if they are so generous with doling out our hard earned tax money, how generous are they with their own money. Do they give to charity? If so did they meet the Al Gore $353 threshold? H&R Block knows how much I give to charity and it is a lot. So when these democraps start living their lives with their money the way they want to spend my tax money, maybe I will start hearing their conversations vs. ignoring them!!!

    Getting ready for my flight this afternoon. Just ask Goldy where I was last week. BTW, I met PacMan. I like him. I told him Goldy et. al. will never answer any of his well thought out questions. He agreed, and wished me good luck living in WA State, land of lefties.


  40. 57

    Patrick spews:

    Braggart @ 52

    Must be nice to make enough money to fly business class and brag about how much you give to charity. Most of the Democratic families you’re making fun of struggle to afford basic necessities. If we saw your tax return I’ll bet it’s chock full of deductions for things most of us consider luxuries. Nobody has it better in this country than the self-employed, and no one is taken advantage of more than ordinary working folks.

  41. 58

    New LIBERAL - gimme most of your $$$$ spews:

    … this country was built on TEAMWORK and people looking out for each other. -Comment by Patrick— 5/15/05 @ 9:18 am


    Whose team are unions on?

    Certainly not consumers: high prices, low quality.

    Certainly not students: worse than crappy PUBLIC schools and a very well paid overabundance of useless administrators.

    Cetainly not workers – outsourced jobs, compulsary union dues paying for the UNION THUGS high salaries.

    Certainly not business: compulsory union contracts interfere with companies’ abilities to compete.

    Certainly not investors: Unions gladly drive entire corporations out of business, such as Eastern Airlines, the steel industry, sacrificing the jobs of thousands of employees.

    Certainly not capable employees: not only can’t employees be rewarded for their OWN merits, because of limits in union contracts, there is no way to get rid of lousy employees.

    Certainly not a members self esteem: workers brainwashed into thinking they’ll never be good enough to get another job without the Unions help.

    Certainly not their members: while these hapless shmucks are pounding the pavement, carrying signs, actually believing that the Union is out for their best interests, the Union bosses drive by in their big cars on the way to fatcat lunches, raising their fists and shouting, “Solidarity”

    All in all, a pretty damned crappy team, and, thankfully, a losing one at that:
    Organized labor was a one-century phenomenon. Look it up. Union members were only 9.5 percent of the private sector work force in 1999, down from a peak of 37 percent 40 years earlier. The last time union membership was that low was in 1902, when union members were 9.3 percent of the private sector work force. And back then, unions were true member-based organizations poised to play a significant role in the new century’s economic growth, not the government coddled, coercive institutions they have become.

  42. 59

    Patrick spews:

    Democrats believe in government programs to solve hunger, homelessness, and lack of medical care because private charity doesn’t make a dent in these problems. Only government has enough resources. Wingnuts use arguments like capitalism and the work ethic to justify their selfishness. Democrats believe in capitalism and hard work, too. The difference is some people have economic power, while many don’t. It doesn’t matter that you’re willing to work hard if there’s no jobs, or your boss won’t pay a living wage. In our society, economic advantage tends to be inherited, as much as it’s earned. How many people working for Wal-Mart at $8 an hour will ever have the opportunity to start their own business? How many people who inherited their grandfather’s or father’s business end up working at Wal-Mart for $8 an hour? Yes, I believe in hard work, and I’m willing to see my family spend several generations working its way up in the system, but I also want to know that no one is going to starve or be denied vital medical care just because they didn’t have the right parents or weren’t lucky in the job market lottery. And don’t tell me the most qualified person always gets hired, that’s bullshit. I’ve seen hard workers get fired because the boss wanted to give that job to his brother’s lazy kid.

  43. 61

    Patrick spews:

    Workers own their labor, and have every right to join together to bargain for the best price they can get for their labor. There’s absolutely no reason for business owners to have all the economic power, and workers none. Many employers find union hiring halls provide dependable, well trained, competent workers who get the job done. Just try building an office tower or suspension bridge with low-wage labor and see whether you can complete the project on time and on budget! Union workers are paid well, but they’re dedicated workers who show up when they’re needed and do a good job! In American manufacturing, the union label has always meant high quality goods.

    This is a free country, and Alaska Airlines has the right to fire their union baggage handlers and hire cheap labor to replace them. But they don’t have the right to expect union workers and their families to patronize their business. Alaska Airlines will NOT get my hard-earned dollar! I hope everyone who supports unions and working people boycotts Alaska Airlines. Let them try to live off Republican travelers if they can. You can all sit in the waiting room talking about Sound Politics while waiting for your luggage. (Raucous laughter in background)

  44. 62

    New LIBERAL - gimme most of your $$$$ spews:

    Only government has enough resources-Comment by Patrick— 5/15/05 @ 12:14 pm

    Complete and utter BULLSHIT.

    Do they teach you NOTHING in your crappy union schools?

    The GOVERNMENT has NO, NONE, ZIP, ZERO, NADA resources and no way to produce any except what they TAKE from citizens.

    (Raucous laughter in background) at your complete idiocy.

    Like my new liberalism?
    Send me a $100 Starbucks card!

  45. 63

    New LIBERAL - gimme most of your $$$$ spews:

    Not a word you say is true. Enough said. -Comment by Patrick— 5/15/05 @ 12:15 pm

    Point by point, disprove it kiddo.

    I’ll be waiting.

    Like my new liberalism?
    Send me a $150 Starbucks card!

  46. 66

    Patrick spews:

    I hope someone does send you a $200 Starbucks card … so my Starbucks stock goes up.

    Without government, you would still be living in a cave eating whatever the hyenas didn’t get — mostly bone marrow. You are NOTHING without the education, infrastructure, laws, and financial benefits that society provides to you through government.

  47. 67

    New LIBERAL - gimme most of your $$$$ spews:

    You are NOTHING without the education, infrastructure, laws, and financial benefits that society provides to you through government. -Comment by Patrick— 5/15/05 @ 2:31 pm

    Once again, Complete and utter BULLSHIT.

    Do they teach you NOTHING in your crappy union schools?

    My value (and yours), my self esteem (and yours) do NOT come from the government, or benefits or infrastructure or laws or education you dimwit.

    They come from WITHIN not from goodies doled out by nanny state after ‘pity poor me’ whining:

    Must be nice to make enough money to fly business class and brag about how much you give to charity. Most of the Democratic families you’re making fun of struggle to afford basic necessities. If we saw your tax return I’ll bet it’s chock full of deductions for things most of us consider luxuries. Nobody has it better in this country than the self-employed, and no one is taken advantage of more than ordinary working folks.
    -Comment by Patrick— 5/15/05 @ 11:46 am

    If your such a ‘pity poor me’, put upon, downtrodden, envious, ‘ordinary working folks’, I suggest you get off your ass (and keyboard) and find a better way to succeed.

  48. 68

    New LIBERAL - gimme most of your $$$$ spews:

    oops I forgot my new Lib whining:

    Like my new liberalism?
    Send me a $250 Starbucks card!

  49. 69

    New LIBERAL - gimme most of your $$$$ spews:

    I hope someone does send you a $200 Starbucks card … so my Starbucks stock goes up. -Comment by Patrick— 5/15/05 @ 2:31 pm

    LMAO – I have a NEWSFLASH for you chump:

    As a mystery shopper, you BUY my lattes (and mochas and white chocolate mochas (ick) and pay me $10 each for drinking them and writing a 5 min. report. Thanks!

    Like my new liberalism?
    Send me a $300 Starbucks card!

  50. 70

    dj spews:

    Eugenics @ 39

    Re: name calling and “filthy” words.

    Thanks for bringing that subject up! It helps put the thread back on topic:

    More moralistic hypocrisy from our “born again” president and his henchmen:

    Just before a campaign speech in Illinois in 2000, Bush said to Dick Cheney, in a moment of Christian love: “There’s Adam Clymer, major league asshole from the New York Times.” “Yeah, big time,” replied Cheney. This after Bush promised to “change the tone of the campaign.”

    From ’At the Republican National Convention in 1988, [Bush] was asked by a Hartford Courant reporter about what he and his father talked about when they weren’t talking about politics.

    “Pussy,” Bush replied,’ not beating around the bush.

    In April 1986, while Wall Street Journal executive Washington editor Al Hunt, his wife Judy Woodruff and their 4-year old child were eating in a Dallas restaurant, Bush gave Mr. Hunt the godly advice, “You fucking son of a bitch. I saw what you wrote. We’re not going to forget this.” Thank you, Mr. “President” for setting a fine Christian example for four-year-olds everywhere.

    ”Go fuck yourself!” said Dick Cheney to U.S. Sen. Patrick Leahy on the Senate floor in June 2004. Thanks for the moral courage Mr. President of the Senate.

    “Fuck you.” said Deputy Secretary of Defense Paul Wolfowitz to Al Franken during the April 2003 White House Correspondents Dinner.

    Fuck you, too, Wolfie.

  51. 72

    jpgee spews:

    Oh Oh, some additional ‘Great News’ for the Great W< ?B>hite Bunny and his Alice in Wonderand administration.

    Polling Report has the details, not much of which is good news for President Bush (MoE +/- 3%):

    Job Approval
    Approve: 46%
    Disapprove: 47%
    Unsure: 7%

    President’s Handling of Iraq
    Approve: 41%
    ove: 55%
    Unsure: 4%

    President’s Handling of Social Security
    Approve: 31%
    Disapprove: 59%
    Unsure: 10%

    Should Republicans be able to end the filibuster?
    Should: 28%
    Should Not: 59%
    Unsure: 14%

    but then again these numbers mean nothing to the current powermongerers. They have fleeced their sheep for all that they are worth…….

  52. 73

    Patrick spews:


  53. 74

    Patrick spews:

    From Harding In 1921 to Bush in 2003:

    –Democrats held White House for 40 years and Republicans for 42.5 years.
    –Democrats created 75,820,000 net new jobs — Republicans 36,440,000.
    –Per Year Average-Democrats 1,825,200—Republicans 856,400.
    –Republicans had 9 presidents during the period and 6 had depression or recession.
    –DOW-grew by 52% more under Democrats.
    –GDP-grew by 43% more under Democrats.

    Comparing Clinton to Reagan:

    –JOBS-grew by 43% more under Clinton.
    –GDP—grew by 57% more under Clinton.
    –DOW-grew by 700% more under Clinton..
    –NASDAQ-grew by 18 times as much under Clinton.
    –SPENDING–grew by 28% under Clinton—80% under Reagan.
    –DEBT-grew by 43% under Clinton-187% under Reagan.
    –DEFICITS-Clinton got a large surplus–grew by 112% under Reagan.
    –NATIONAL INCOME-grew by100% more under Clinton.
    –PERSONAL INCOME-Grew by 110% more under Clinton.

    SOURCES-Bureau of Labor Statistics (
    Economic Policy Institute ( & World Almanacs from 1980 to 2003 (annual issues)

    Job Creation Record of Presidents from Coolidge to Bush
    (jobs created as percentage of work force)

    Democrat Roosevelt 5.3%
    Democrat Johnson 3.8%
    Democrat Carter 3.1%
    Democrat Truman 2.5%
    Democrat Clinton 2.4%
    Democrat Kennedy 2.3%
    Republican Nixon 2.2%
    Republican Reagan 2.1%
    Republican Coolidge 1.1%
    Republican Ford 1.1%
    Republican Eisenhower 0.9%
    Republican Bush Sr. 0.6%
    Republican Bush Jr. (0.7%)
    Republican Hoover (9.0%)

    Source: J. Carville, “Had Enough?” (Simon & Schuster, New York, 2003), p. 87.

  54. 75

    New LIBERAL - gimme most (hell, ALL) of your $$$$ spews:


    Dear nutburger: they pay me for certain work… it’s called A JOB

    I know you MUST be pretending… no one with a keyboard can possibly be that stupid… then again…

  55. 76

    jpgee spews:

    Patrick and Thehim, of course you both know that posting facts here for the trolls to read does absoutely no good. 1. They will never admit that facts are ‘FACTS’, 2. They will either not respond, or respond with deflections, innuendos and denial, 3. They will just retreat to B. O’leily and the (lol) unbiased FOX news network or their dear friends Annie C, and Rush L. ‘Living in a shell usually ends up in a rude awakening

  56. 77

    Patrick spews:

    Not a Liberal @ 71

    You expect us to believe that drinking lattes is a job? If that’s what you do all day, I suggest you get a real job. You know, something … um … productive.

  57. 78

    Patrick spews:

    Reply to 71, of course I know. The facts are not on their side, and I’m merely rubbing their faces in it.

  58. 80

    zapporo spews:

    jpgee – Try again. How about WSJ for unbiased news?


    To state job creation figures for a President is a bit misleading.
    One could reasonably argue that Clinton reaped the windfall created by the economic policies put in place by the Reagan and Bush (Sr.) administrations. Similarly, the effects of WWII cannot be overlooked when comparing Roosevelt’s administration to other presidents. Further, your 60 second analysis ignores the long-time congressional democrat majorities (until recently) that are truly responsible, to the largest degree, for federal government spending policies. So again, basically, your factoids are pretty much meaningless.

    That being said, if you want to win on issues, then I suggest reducing government debt, providing a coordinated american industrial policy, and improving educational standards (i.e. – educational privatisation because communist no-competition dumbed-down schools just don’t cut it) are winners.

    Back to you liberals for some sort of coherent response (i.e., jpgee – just waiting for more deflection and innuendo from lefties)

  59. 81

    New LIBERAL - gimme most (hell, ALL) of your $$$$ spews:

    You expect us to believe that drinking lattes is a job? If that’s what you do all day, I suggest you get a real job. You know, something … um … productive. -Comment by Patrick— 5/15/05 @ 9:37 pm

    A. I don’t need a real job.
    B. Mystery shopping is very useful to folks like Starbucks, Sharper Image, Azteca, Timberland, QFC, Olympic Boat Centers and dozens of others.

    You see, they know the VALUE of their customers, they know the VALUE of good service, good products, clean, welcoming environments and they PAY us mystery shoppers to help them identify problems.

    C. It pays pretty damned good fun money.

    Is there no limit to what you DON’T know pattycakes?

  60. 82

    DamnageD spews:

    Donna @ 8

    No, no, no…

    Gravity PULLS, Magnetism REPELLS (or attracts), VACUMES suck and WIND blows.

  61. 83

    JCH spews:

    Goldy, I must have missed your post on Comrade Jim!……………………….McDermott first up for ethics panel
    The Washington Times, by James G. Lakely Original Article
    Posted By: Dreadnought – 5/16/2005 1:34:41 AM Post Reply
    When the partisan impasse over rules and procedures on the House ethics committee ends, the first member to face the panel won’t be House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, but rather Democrat Jim McDermott of Washington. The Seattle-area congressman, one of the most vocal critics of Republicans, has been under investigation by the panel since last year over his role nearly nine years ago in the illegal taping and distribution…

  62. 84

    GS spews:

    Just remember:

    If 6000 people go out and just get 50 signatures apiece by the end of June, this Gas tax will end up on the November Ballot. It will be killed dead there!

    So if you are as angry at this huge gas tax increase as I am, get your initatives at NONEWGASTAX.COM, Get them filled out, and get them turned in early!

    This is a tight window, and every day the state spends looking at the initiative and not giving it a number, a day will be lost. So Get out there and show them what 6000 angry citizens think of their leadership!

  63. 85

    Puddybud spews:

    Patrick, you are swell at them statistics. You completely missed my points in post #52. I was lucky and God-blessed to have the job I had in the 90’s but United tanked. You completely missed the other points I was making about taxes and who are the democrats rich of this era. Butt then you would.

    Before you destroy Hoover in the depression read:

    I also ask you:

    What about the tax cuts of the 1994, which most economists now agree helped our economy in the 90’s.

    What about the tax cuts of the 80’s? Reagan would have done better in his economy since he had to overcome astronomical interest rates. He also had to overcome a democratic congress that didn’t want him to succeed. I remember them as my first house mortgage was at 15.5% in the early 80’s. There is much more to the eye than simple statistics without looking at the whole picture. So give Clinton his due, he was there with a Republican congress and the US Economy did grow. But talk to any economist and ask, can you tax your way to prosperity?


  64. 86

    chardonnay spews:

    jpgee @ 72
    especially when those “facts” are from James carvelle. gimme a break.
    if bullshit where FUEL, liberals would be a national treasure.

  65. 87

    chardonnay spews:

    This news just in. The Mexicans say they will be building a PORT in Baja California (Mexico) which will pull cargo ships in and take away from San Pedro, CA, maybe even Seattle would be hit harder. cheaper dock workers, more ships wuold be unloaded per day and unions Lose membership.

  66. 89

    drivel spews:

    looks like the witch is back out of hybernation. welcome back chard’s of idiotic posts

  67. 91

    chardonnay spews:

    oh you guys missed me. lol, too bad you guys don’t swing that way. I was busy working on my home, buying my son a new bike, making a chocolate cake for the neighbor kids. shopping at the new walmart. fun family stuff. A normal person can only take the evil spewed here for so long and needs a breath of fresh wholesome air.

  68. 92

    GS spews:

    Gee I thought groceries weren’t taxed, and for the most part that is true, but I noticed today that I did have one thing on my buying list taxed (won’t buy any more of it) and that was a V8 juice tropical in the large jugs. No tax on apple juice or bottled water. So while I am looking at each receipt these days to screw the Gov out of 4 x the cost of her massive tax hikes, it has been very effective and one hell of a lot of fun!

    So I’ll be making my list
    Checking it twice
    Visiting relatives in Oregon more often
    and…………………I got one big ass Pick up truck!

  69. 93

    Drivel spews:

    Chardonnay @ 91 You mean you are copying YOUR GOVERNOR and handing out fresh baked cake to potential customers?

  70. 95

    K spews:

    So much BS

    Let’s start with JCH @ 83-

    Is it any surprise that a Repub majority congress would start with an ethics investigation of McDermott, a Dem?

  71. 96

    K spews:

    Chards @ 87-
    SO you build a port. How does cargo move? Highways, railroads, Customs Check points. Who builds? The government. We have a port with a bottleneck getting out. Railroads barely keeping up. Note Snohomish County cannot get the containers in to haul out garbage.

  72. 97

    Puddybud spews:

    I look at it from a Biblical view. God is in control of this earth. In the last days before Jesus comes God’s first plague of the seven end time ones will be the scorching sun. YEah it’s in Revelation, but I think tj said the stuff written by John the Revelator is bunkum.

    But since most here hate me bringing up the Bible, I was trolling the Internet and one of the big names on global warming has changed his tune, Dr. David Bellamy. I know many of the far-left eco-snots have heard of him. He is the father of many of the eco-snots movements. Now he has changed his tune.

    Well read these articles:

    Did you all know that there are over 160,000 glaciers in the world and only 80 of them have any measurements for 5 years or more? Yet the eco-snots are basing all of their science on their retreat. What about the other over 159,920 glaciers?

    I wonder what caused his epiphany? What do you all think?


  73. 98

    GS spews:

    Newsweek is following the lead of other dying news (I say this loosly) sources and are in such a rush to get their anti Bush and anti war mantra out, that now they admit the rushed out the story and that was wrong so they have retracted it. Well isn’t that just wonderful! With over 15 people dead they say the got it wrong. The horses are running from the stable. Credible magazine no more! Amazing! Someone’s head(s) should be rolling!

  74. 99

    dj spews:

    GS @ 99

    Sad about those 15 people.

    White House spokesman Scott McClellan put it best yesterday, “People have lost their lives. The image of the United States abroad has been damaged.”

    He was refering to a Newsweek story, and apparently missed the unbelievable irony of the words he spoke.

    Sad about those 1,622 US Soldiers, and some 10,000 to 100,000 Iraqi civilians, too.

  75. 100

    Puddybud spews:

    So DJ, I feel for the loss of life. War sucks anyway you look at it. I turned 18 near the end of Vietnam, my date was 306. But, in the words of Donnageddon, tj, et. al., prove to me that the US killed >=10K Iraqis. Credible sources, not democrapic swill. Not MoveOn.pork web sites. Just their names will do. I don’t need a Jeanne Garafalo regurgitation. Even her father disagrees with her politics.

    I had two nephews in the Navy. One on an aircraft carrier left for college last year as his tour ended and the other a corpsman with the Marines is about the leave for college as his tour is ending. They both felt we did the right thing in getting rid of Saddam.

    Now we’re beginning to see how Saddam bribed the Security council (France, Russia, et. cetera) with his oil for food monies, all the way to Kofi Annan’s inner circle. Have you read that some from the great Paul Volker Commission were upset at the whitewash on the UN investigation of itself that they sent buried damaging UN documents to Congress? Stuff continues to leak out everyday. UN Corruption, is a good thing? We see how France, Russia and Germany sold him weapons with the Oil for Food money all the way through 2002, when it was to go for food and medicines for his people, is a good thing? But do you think leaving Saddam in power is a good thing, killing >500K innocent people? Please tell me why.

    Thank you


  76. 101

    chardonnay spews:

    yes, global warming is a myth, a theiry and lie. all to please the Earth worshipers. worship mother earth. make earth day a national HolyDay (monday of course) all govn’t workers off w/pay (dbl time). Outdoor festivals where they (wicca, pagans etc.) can gayly frolick themselves. LOL what a bunch of crap. measuring glaciers turns out to be a frikin lie also. they measure them at different times of the year. dorks. if your going to measure them, measure them on the same day every year. DUH!!

  77. 102

    chardonnay spews:

    DJ, have you heard about the new film produced by an Iraqi citizen being presented at the Cannes Film Festival? It’s about Chemical Ali and Sadam and how they killed thousands of Kurds. You know, their own people.
    Your rhetoric is old and useless, no one buys it anymore. Next!

  78. 103

    chardonnay spews:

    oh and dj, here you go, Kilometre Zero by Hiner Saleem
    In making a road movie based on episodes from his own life and that of his brother, Hiner Saleem gets back in touch with his Kurdish roots. At the age of seventeen, he fled Iraq to escape the oppression of Saddam Hussein. “Kilometre Zero says that we have made no forward progress, Saleem explains. Iraq was invented eighty years ago, and since then, the country hasn’t taken a single step forward. That could be a reason to give up in despair. Or it could be a source of hope: When you start from zero, the only direction to go is forward. (…) My primary intention in this film was to re-create a certain atmosphere. To give viewers a whiff of the dictatorship;jour=12

    Lets just see if this guy wins any awards. the spectacular thing is that this film would not have been made at all if Sadam were still in power.

  79. 104

    dj spews:

    Puddy @ 101

    ”But, in the words of Donnageddon, tj, et. al., prove to me that the US killed >=10K Iraqis. Credible sources, not democrapic swill.”

    Right. We will ignore the 21,684-24,603 civilian deaths reported by the media and summarized here: Obviously, the media makes shit like this up, right?

    How about a study based on an “on the ground” household survey, using scientifically accepted research methods, conducted by researchers at a respected research University (Johns Hopkins), and published in one of the most respected academic journals in the world? Will that work as a “credible source” for you?

    Read: Roberts et al. (2004) Mortality before and after the 2003 invasion of Iraq: cluster sample survey, The Lancet. 364 (Iss. 9448):1857.

    The take home message: an estimated 98,000 excess deaths (as a result of the military invasion) with a 95% confidence interval of 8,000-194,000.

  80. 105

    dj spews:

    chardonnay @ 103

    “Your rhetoric is old and useless, no one buys it anymore. Next!”

    Tell that to the friends and families of the dead, asshole.

  81. 106

    chardonnay spews:

    dj, go to the cannes web sight and search for the film. The film makers name is Hiler Saleem. Kilometre Zero is the name of his film.
    this would never have happened if Sadam were still in power.
    I hope he gets an award but doubtful since Michael eatMOOREthananyoneelse won an award last year for his fairy tale 911. I hope the guy acknowledges President Bush for bringing freedom to Iraq.

  82. 107

    zapporo spews:

    Chardonnay – Oh no, we would have been much better leaving Saddam in place, allowing all that oil money to be funnelled to terrorists, allowing Syria to continue to export revolution and death, and by the way, chemical Ali is a friend of America.

    Whitewater never happened, Bill’s cigar was never wet, and Vince Foster is living in the Bahamas. John Kerry was robbed, I say robbed in Ohio. The uproar in Wisconsin is a product of a vast right-wing conspiracy and Gore was cheated in Florida by racist republican CIA agents and various mind-control tricks. Finally, PBS, the last bastion of liberal welfare is being taken over by conservative Christians and Clear Channel Communications. That’s right, you heard it first at HA Liberal LaLaLand. *

    * Warning – Not to be confused with reality. Must be a liberal idiot with severely diminished mental capacity currently under the simultaneous influence of alcohol, anti-depressants and three varieties of psychotropic drugs OR you must be Al Gore to believe this. Use only with caution. Not appropriate for ingestion. For topical use only. License and taxes apply.

  83. 108

    dj spews:

    chardonnay @ 106

    It looks like a good movie, really! I’ll rent it when it is available on dvd.

    But, I don’t think it was worth the lives of 1600 American soldiers and 10,000 to 100,000 Iraqi to make the movie!

    Even Hollywood doesn’t make movies that are so expensive.

  84. 109

    U2 spews:

    chardonnay, I do not think they will honor GWB for bringing death and destruction to a soverign nation. Maybe your wingnut politicians can give him a special gift. Like a 3 month honeymoon with Delay, Frist and the neocon radio hoaxes

  85. 110

    jpgee spews:

    and speaking of the wingnut saviour, GWB, now that the Senate did the ‘dishonest’ thing and passed a transportation budget of $295,000,000,000 and the Idiot didn’t want to spend that much,
    White House press secretary Scott McClellan repeated the veto threat Tuesday, saying the president was “very serious” about following a fiscally responsible budget. What a JOKE

  86. 112

    dj spews:

    U2 @ 109

    “Maybe your wingnut politicians can give him a special gift. Like a 3 month honeymoon with Delay, Frist and the neocon radio hoaxes”

    I am looking forward to the going-away party for Shrub in 2009. I think the lefties can pitch in for a going away gift: an airline ticket to The Hague.

  87. 113

    chardonnay spews:

    I’d say TODAY we owe our freedom to the men and women in the US Military that made the sacrifice. If they had not voluntarily signed up you might have already had your head cut off by a wacko muslim extremist terrorists. We should be honoring those 1600 that died. they deserve the greatest honor of all. Yes GW deserves credit for having the guts to take on the biggest threat to our world. Muslim terrorists.
    I know you lefty’s are anti-war extremists, and anti-american extremists and anti-military extremists. You have the right to be that and talk about it thanks to the military.