Open Thread 4/24

- Well here’s a bulletin on this dog and pony show. Window dressing isn’t going to hack it. Women, the ones to hold families and communities together, are major casualties in the ongoing economic crisis. They and people of color have lost the most jobs, homes, savings and social services.

Seattle is the coolest city ever, you guys.

– I’m glad to see what they’re doing to improve One Bus Away. And I appreciate the digitizing analog music metaphor.

– The EEOC says you can’t discriminate based on gender identity.

Baseball in Portland

Norse faith: 1 Atheists: 0


  1. 6

    Liberal Scientist is a slut who occasionally wears a hoodie spews:

    Via kos, Ann Rmoney at the Connecticut Republican Party’s Prescott Bush (war criminal) Award ceremony yesterday:

    I love the fact that there are women out there who don’t have a choice and they must go to work and they still have to raise the kids. Thank goodness that we value those people too. And sometimes life isn’t easy for any of us.

    What a wretch.
    What foul people Republicans are.

  2. 7

    Liberal Scientist is a slut who occasionally wears a hoodie spews:

    Yup, I agree – Obama has failed tests of moral courage regarding both calling the Armenian Genocide ‘genocide’, and for failing to mount a full-throated defense of the civil rights issue of same-sex marriage.

    Hey, when was the last time you heard a Republican criticize one of their own for failures of moral courage?


  3. 8

    Liberal Scientist is a slut who occasionally wears a hoodie spews:

    puddles was slamming my personal hero Elizabeth Warren earlier today over on the 4/23 thread.

    Well, puddle, fuck you, too.

    Warren followed the law. Period. AND she is advocating for a change in the tax code that would be personally disadventageous for herself and hugely beneficial for the vast majority of working people.

    That’s, um, noble, and honest.

    Rather in contrast to prettyboi Scott Brown. Interesting that Brownie’s advisor, Eric Fehrnstrom, is also Rmoney’s advisor, though in the latter case Fehrnstrom is saying that the candidate may or may not release tax returns. I guess it’s only good to disclose when it might be in your favor.

    Doesn’t matter – Warren is going to send Scottie packing, rather like the Rmoneys very tackey suggestion to the Obamas.

  4. 9

    Bob spews:

    @ 7

    “Setting a good example is a far better way to spread ideals than through force of arms.”
    Ron Paul quote

    “War is never economically beneficial except for those in position to profit from war expenditures.”
    Ron Paul quote

    “The obligations of our representatives in Washington are to protect our liberty, not coddle the world, precipitating no-win wars, while bringing bankruptcy and economic turmoil to our people.”
    Ron Paul quote

  5. 10

    Bob spews:

    @6, @8

    Yeah, this election’s about cult religion, personal riches of one family, and DOGS!

    It’s not about, say, the economy:

    BTW, according to the current definition of recession (Cleveland Fed web site):

    The actual definition of a recession as given by the NBER, the committee responsible for determining and dating official recessions, is “a significant decline in economic activity spread across the economy, lasting more than a few months, normally visible in real GDP, real income, employment, industrial production, and wholesale–retail sales.” The definition is fairly vague, which explains why many prefer the shorthand definition, but the idea is fairly simple. A recession is any period when economic activity experiences a prolonged and widespread decline.

    We’re sort of in one now.

    No wonder you want to make it about polygamy (in Mitt’s family, not Barack’s, mind you), dogs, and silly tax rates comparing apples to oranges. If you make it about the economy, Obama loses 40 states.

  6. 11

    Liberal Scientist is a slut who occasionally wears a hoodie spews:

    Granted, and I would agree with those Paul statements. (though I think he is dangerously, amorally, bat-shit crazy on every other topic)

    However, I meant ordinary citizens like you, or puddles, or any of the other right-wingers around here. You may support Ron Paul, and therefore engage in the transitive property of criticism, but where was the criticism of Bush when it mattered? Are you claiming you were against the Iraq and Afghanistan wars when it mattered? Really?

    Have you acknowledged the economic devastation of those wars on our budget? Or of the things that were accomplished politically by making bush a “War President” ™? Like the Bush tax cuts? Domestic surveillance (shamelessly carried on by the Obama Administration)? Medicare part D and Medicare Advantage boondoggles?

  7. 12

    Liberal Scientist is a slut who occasionally wears a hoodie spews:

    silly tax rates

    I was responding to pustulous puddles’ inane comments on another open thread.

    personal riches of one family

    No, no, NO – and you know it. It’s not about being rich, it’s about being entitled and completely out of touch. Big difference, and quite relevant.

    We’re sort of in one now.

    DUH. We’ve been in one, whatever metrics you might use to say otherwise, technically, since the various financial and real estate collapses of the last Bush Administration. And, yes, I do hold Bush and Republicans in general, responsible for both the genesis of the collapses AND the cynical obstructionism designed explicitly to prevent effective collective/governmental action – both to further undermine both our shared government in principle, and Obama specifically.

    Republican theory of governance demands that the government per se, and its effectiveness empirically, be de-legitimized and denied. It’s an essential step in the direction of Neo-feudalism that you fools demand.

  8. 13

    Bob spews:

    @11 Asked and answered. Now you’re re-framing the question. No time to respond but be assured if I was able to answer your first question I could answer your revision.

    I probably am 95+% in agreement with you about Ron Paul and his danger to the country. Off topic, but, Jesus H.

    You might have missed it, but a huge part of what the Tea Party is about is criticism of those in the GOP who do not share their values. You asked for criticism, right or wrong, and there’s your ‘common citizen’ answer right there. All those GOP guys getting primaried – that’s implicit criticism. You probably liked it when your side did it to Lieberman. Acknowledge the same interest in seeing the country do something different displayed by those who are shaking up the entrenched GOP representatives in Congress right now.

    Have a good day. Look around you. Criticism has many forms. It’s Greg Nickels being bounced in Round 1. It’s Hatch and Lugar needing to change their shorts frequently these days.

  9. 14

    Liberal Scientist is a slut who occasionally wears a hoodie spews:

    If you make it about the economy, Obama loses 40 states.

    Seriously, seriously doubt that. Who would you rather be with this map?

  10. 15

    Bob spews:


    If it’s a referendum on the economy, Obama loses. Recessionary numbers and that tape of Obama saying if he doesn’t have it fixed in three years he’s a one-termer will play repeatedly in October. Count on it.

    Dems have to make it about something else. Hence the dog shit, the slams against Mormonism on MSNBC and by certain short-sighted Democrat governors, the focus on Romney’s wealth.

    If rich wives are so divorced from reality, why did the Dems give Kerry’s wife keynote time at the ’04 DNC convention? All she did was marry two Senators. The first guy had oodles of cash and the misfortune of being on the wrong plane.

  11. 16

    Michael spews:

    Rmoney is Bush. He’s pushing the same train wreck that Bush pushed that got us into this mess. Rmoney can’t win. Make the election about whatever you like Obama will win.

  12. 17

    Bob spews:

    @ 16 Thank you for that reasoned and well-sourced argument. Adds much to the discussion. I could say Obama is Carter but that would just be stooping to your level.

    Here’s a little inconvenient factoid:

    The Department of Labor has revised higher the number of people who filed for unemployment benefits for the first time in 58 out of the last 59 weeks.
    The same has held true since the beginning of the year. There have been 14 weeks of jobless data this year, and there have been 14 revisions. And all 14 were revisions that made the claims picture higher than what the government originally reported.

    Read more:

  13. 18

    Michael spews:

    I could say Obama is Carter but that would just be stooping to your level.

    If Obama’s policies are the same as Carter’s, yes you could. I don’t know enough about Carter to say one way or the other. But, I do know about Bush and Romney and Romney’s policies are the same tired crap that Bush pushed. Romney is Bush.

  14. 19

    the 5% spews:

    How about that john edwards? Lmfao..

    And the mancrush will surely come out and defend edwards…like he aways does.

  15. 22

    Bob spews:

    @ 20 Watch Don Lemon’s latest commentary on CNN.

    Obama will be a one-termer because other than continually re-defining just how bad things were four years ago, he’s got no defense for what he’s done.

    And the excuses are old. Hell, they were old a year ago.

    ‘He made it worse’. There’s your GOP election slogan.

  16. 23

    Michael spews:

    Edward’s is a douche nozzle. I bought his “man of the people” act for about a week, when he first showed up on the national scene.

    But, the money in question never hit his campaign’s bank account, so what he did might have been legal. Personally, I hope he’s found guilty.

  17. 24


    22 – Don’t see any facts there Bob..

    Just odious resentment.

    FWIW, I’ll draw one contrast – Sweden..

    They did a stimulus too.. With tax cuts.. Although their finance minister doesn’t it call it that. More money in people’s hands apparently doesn’t “stimulate” anything. It works some other magic.

    And after the tax cuts were done?? They still have the highest taxes around – either no 1 or 2..

    So stimulus works – if enough is applied.

  18. 25

    Bob spews:

    @ 24

    Facts can be inconvenient things, sometimes, YLB. All those high taxes and they’re at 0.4% GDP increase.

    Maybe they need to raise taxes.


    April 16, 2012 2:55 AM
    Sweden lowers economic growth outlook for 2012
    STOCKHOLM — Sweden’s government has cut its economic outlook for 2012, saying problems in the eurozone are also affecting the Nordic country.

    The center-right government on Monday lowered its expectation for 2012 gross domestic product growth to 0.4 percent from 1.3 percent previously.

  19. 27


    25 – No country is an island. Well duh..

    Sweden is an export oriented mixed economy and if demand isn’t quite there for its products then so it goes..

    But ahh those magic tax cuts and that “privatization” it works wonders always.. Just look at the privatization of national security in this country – all those jobs!

  20. 28

    No Time for Fascists spews:

    Bob, Puddy, 5%
    What proposals do the republicans have that will strengthen the middle class and help the poor get out of poverty? Let’s discuss their merits.

  21. 29


    28 – Cut taxes on the rich, raise the retirement age for Social Security, institute ‘coupon care’, gut environmental and other regulations, frack, frack, frack, drill, baby, drill (if the locals don’t like the water, noise and air – move), increase defense spending, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb Iran.

    It’ll all “trickle on” the middle class and the poor.

  22. 30

    Richard Pope spews:

    So how come almost every time I load HA, there is a banner ad for ROB McKENNA for Governor? Selling advertising to the highest bidder is the American way, but does McKenna really think this is an effective use of his campaign money?

  23. 32

    ArtFart spews:

    There’s a story running today in the New York Times and other rags around the country about a company called Accretive Health, whose business is to serve as a sort of collection agency for health care providers. They knock on hospitals’ doors, schmooze the docs and administrators, dropping nice gifts in their laps as required. They they dispatch their “agents” into the ER’s, ICCU’s, cancer wards and surgery wings, wearing white coats and scrubs and masquerading as caregivers, confronting patients and their next of kin and trying to convince them that their options are to pay up or die. They’re now facing legal action in several states (why do I think Rob McKenna wouldn’t be lifing a finger?). The shit really hit the fan in Minnesota, where one of their employees’s laptop was found to be full of patient records. Until things started to unravel, they and their CEO (who’s been bragging that she’s made $320 million in a few years from a “back-of-a-napkin idea”) were being lauded by the financial press for their “innovation” and “pursuit of excellence”.

  24. 35

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    The TSA Is Out Of Control

    I mean, really, patting down a 4-year-old for hugging her grandmother to make sure granny didn’t pass a gun to the kid …


    Roger Rabbit Commentary: If conservatives need a “Big Brother” horror story, this is it — trouble is the TSA is their baby …

  25. 37

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    B-b-b-ut I Thought Public Services Were Free Dep’t

    Here’s something remarkable — public school bus transportation isn’t free, and if you don’t pay taxes for it, schools will find other ways to get the money it takes to maintain school buses, buy gas, pay drivers, etc.

    Roger Rabbit Commentary: After this, it’s only a matter of time until the anti-tax crowd tries to break the teacher unions, demands that teachers give up their pensions and health benefits, teach larger classes, take pay cuts, and buy books and materials out of their own pockets …

  26. 40

    No Time for Fascists spews:

    On my drive in, on the talk stations,

    On the one conservative station they were talking about the beating of Reginald Denny and the coming Race Riots and that all white people should be very afraid of the violent brown people. The demo-crat black president is not doing anything to stop this and that when the riots come, it will be a win for the President.

    On the other conservative station, they were talking about the dangers of Islamic terrorist and how they were hell bent on destroying Christian white Americans and the demo-crat black president is not doing anything to stop this.

    Hear a theme?

    On the one lone liberal talk station, they were talk about the republicans being unwilling to keep Student Loan rates low but that our president was trying to do something about this.
    How come republicans are against raising taxes on millionaires and billionaires and oil companies, but it’s perfectly OK to raise interest rates on students? Oh yeah, students don’t give money to, or vote republican.

    The liberal station needs to pick up its game. Rational talk is never going to get anywhere, they need to start spreading more fear and hatred like the conservative stations are, to get better ratings and solidify the base.

  27. 41

    No Time for Fascists spews:

    On my drive in, on the talk stations, 4/26

    On one Conservative talk radio station they were discussing that new labor rules would not allow Christians like Tim Tebow to work on small farms. (huh?) The federal government is once again oppressing small christian businesses.

    On the other Conservative talk radio station they were wondering if FARC (Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia) was behind the Secret Service scandal, or maybe it was the Russians. Either way, communists were some how involved. but not Chinese communists, we buy stuff from them, so they are OK.

    On liberal talk, they were discussing the consequences of the republican funding rules will require closing post offices in small rural communities.
    I guess the republicans didn’t get the memo that post office serve small christian business too.
    How come the conservatives will scream bloody murder that their right to automatic machine guns is in the Constitution, but the post office that IS listed in the constitution should be allowed to wither and die?