Open Thread 10/31

- I’ve been reminded about how fitting the location is for them. Before Capitol Lake, that particular place was home to Little Hollywood, Olympia’s depression era shacktown. It was probably the most visible evidence of the Great Depression in town.

Occupy Wish List

– I assume you’ve already bought your Halloween candy, but holy cow.

Shorter Pudge: Congress forced me to keep my kids up late with its nefarious daylight savings time. (And From Carl, sunset is before 6:00. How early do Pudge’s kids need to be home?)

– Whoever is in charge of making signs for the NY Police protest needs to, um, try harder.

– It’s really annoying that jaywalking is ticketed. Also, apparently, not where the problem lies.

– If we’re not actually painting the map red, we can’t be an empire.



  1. 1

    Unlk Witz spews:

    Afraid I have to admit some sense of schadenfruede as I watch those who’s political party cynically used this racist tactic to gain support, now have to deal with the unintended consequences.


    Alabama & Eastern Washington are two of the most conservative and Republican areas of the country, so I doubt they will see the connection between their xenophobic voting habits and the hole in their pocketbooks.

  2. 2

    Unlk Witz spews:

    I wonder what “festivities” the Pudge household celebrates? Pudge is an avowed Bible Thumper and would most likely label Halloween as demonic.

    I would ask him directly, but he doesn’t let me post there anymore. We got into a little tiff over his Thumperism.

  3. 3

    Rabbit Stew spews:

    2. Why do you hate believers so much?

    I feel pity for you and your spewed hatred for Believers whether they are Christian or Jew. Perhaps you envy those with faith and belief.

    I don’t blame Pudge for banning you :)

  4. 4

    Unlk Witz spews:

    Hate them? No, I just dislike their irrational and homicidal behavior. They cause sooo much trouble and heartache.

    I wish we could isolate them elsewhere to slug out the difference between their inerrant revelations without killing the rest of us.

    Why do you love them so much?

  5. 5


    mbrownerhamlin Matt Browner Hamlin
    RT @TheBillWalton: Tonight I’m wearing a Tim Tebow jersey so I can throw candy 15 feet above kids heads. Oh, the hilarity.

    Oy veh….

  6. 7

    rhp6033 spews:

    Cain’s got some ‘splaining* to do.

    At the National Press Club, and in a friedly interview on Fox News, he addressed the allegations that two women accused him of sexual harrassment while he was President of the National Restaurant Association – sort of.

    “The report said the women signed agreements with the restaurant group that gave them five-figure financial payouts to leave the association and barred them from discussing their departures. Neither woman was identified.

    Cain said he had never personally settled any sexual harassment suit, and that if the NRA had settled any claims, it had done so without his knowledge.

    “If the Restaurant Association did a settlement, I wasn’t even aware of it, and I hope it wasn’t for much because nothing happened,” he explained on Fox. “So if there was a settlement, it was handled by some of the other officers that worked for me at the association.”

    Cain said, though, during an afternoon speech that he wouldn’t ask the association to release further information, and that his campaign viewed the issue as closed.

    “As far as we’re concerned, enough’s said about this issue,” Cain said.

    Cain says he was ‘falsely accused’ of harassment

    I guess Cain is counting on those non-disclosure agreements which the women signed to keep them quiet while he denied any guilt, and also denied any knowledge of the settlements.

    He may hope this story stays closed, but with those comments, he pretty much has insured that it will not. Even if the women and their lawyers can’t talk, Cain has pretty much given the green light to reporters to descend upon anyone who has ever worked at the National Restaurant Association to get them to spill the beans. It’s highly unlikely that he doesn’t have any enemies there (every boss has subordinates who don’t remain completely loyal to them decades later). Eventually the names of the women will surface – probably this week. And somebody who was involved in the settlement will probably bristle at the idea that they did this without Cain’s knowledge, and argue that Cain had detailed information about the progress of negotiations and the ultimate settlement.

    In the meantime, every candidate will be calling on him to release the files, in order to back up his claim that these were “baseless” charges.

    If they were baseless charges, the settlement would be pretty small – in the range of severence pay. But the reported six-figure payouts hardly seem like settlment amounts for “baseless” claims.

  7. 8

    rhp6033 spews:

    *splaining” was a reference to a Republican Senator on the Judiciary Committee which used the term while questioning Justice Sodameyor (sp?) about her writings. Some considered it a racially insensative joke, in that it used a disparaging “I Love Lucy” line from hispanic Desi Arnez towards a hispanic Supreme Court nominee.

  8. 9

    rhp6033 spews:

    Of course, Cain blamed the “liberals” for making the allegations against him. It’s far more likely that the allegations originated from his competitors for the Republican nomination.

    It looks like we’ve come a long way since Ronald Reagan’s “11th Comandment”: “Thou shalt speak no ill will against another Republican”.

  9. 10


    rhp6033 @9…

    Cain prolly should have read Howard Mackay’s book “How To Swim With The Sharks…” before he started. Had to know the “long knives” were gonna be out for him.

  10. 12

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @7 This story will not go away, and before it’s over, Cain will look like a fucking liar. Which he is.

  11. 13

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @9 I agree this story was leaked by Republican sources, but this is bigger than any candidate. Someone in the GOP hierarchy has decided this guy must be stopped. They fear anyone they can’t control. The “mechanic” probably is Rove.

  12. 15

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    The denial and coverup is always worse than the actual offense. Cain should have said, “Yes, I did something really dumb 15 years ago, but I learned my lesson and I promise all of you that it’ll never happen again.” People will forgive a human mistake. But they won’t forgive a liar.

  13. 17

    No time for Oligarchies spews:

    Wages are another issue. Like other employers, growers must pay workers at least the minimum wage. Some pay a per-bin or piece rate or some combination of that and an hourly rate.
    The piece rate growers were paying for jobs they listed with the state this past September was 3.5 percent less than they were paying the previous September.

    So in other words, the growers cannot make the profit they want, paying wages that Americans will work at.

  14. 19

    Michael spews:

    I saw the Pudge thing, if whining was an Olympic sport the man would get a gold.

    Giving credit where credit’s do, at least he still takes his kids trick or treating. A lot of the righty Christians around here think the practice is satanic or some rubbish and don’t do it.

  15. 20

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @1 “worker advocates say there’d be no shortage if growers were willing to pay workers more”

  16. 21

    No time for Oligarchies spews:

    The bankster 1% in Chicago had a little message they wanted to get out to the 99% movement camped out in the streets below. So someone at the Chicago Board of Trade poured leaflets out of the window – to rain down on the demonstrators below. The leaflets read

    “We are Wall Street, it is our jobs to make money…Go ahead and continue to take us down, but you’re only going to hurt yourselves. What’s going to happen when we can’t find jobs on the Street anymore? Guess what: We’re going to take yours.”

    Let’s have THEM pick apples.

  17. 22

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    It’s not that out-of-work gringos haven’t tried. It’s not even necessarily the low pay, lack of housing, and seasonal employment. Picking apples is back-breaking hard physical labor and you have to be conditioned to do it, and used to it, or you can’t do it. A Mexican accustomed to this work can pick 10 bins a day — and make $200 in a day. Americanos who have tried it are hard-pressed to pick 3 bins a day — that’s $60 a day for backbreaking outdoor labor, in all weather, and you have to burn $4 gas just to get there.

    Generations of eastern Washington growers have depended on cheap foreign labor. Then some rightwing ideologues came along and ran off the cheap foreign labor. Now what? Looks like they’re out of business.

    It seems to me those folks should have been voting for Democrats all along. Or, at least, ever since Democrats built those dams that make cheap electricity and cheap irrigation water possible. What on earth were they thinking when they became Republicans?

  18. 24

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @18 Of course you are! You’re a victim of your own sinful human nature. Now get down on your knees and pray for God’s forgiveness, and ask Her to give you the wisdom to become a Democrat. After you see the Light and become a Democrat, all will be well with you.

  19. 26


    Someone in the GOP hierarchy has decided this guy must be stopped.

    You all know he’s done this to get the crown jewel job: the top speaking fees at right wing confabs and a million buck/year gig on Faux News.

    Well played Mr. Cain.

  20. 27

    No time for Oligarchies spews:

    Someone in the GOP hierarchy has decided this guy must be stopped.

    That’s what it seemed like to me. Cain’s gotten big enough, time to fade him out and let the chosen one get the nomination.

  21. 30


    Heard on the raydeeo that the Bakken Shale may play out to as high as 36 billion barrels.

    Of course did ya know that the oil is harvested the same as fracked gas? Yep, horizontal drilling, high pressure water and noxious chemicals..

    Yes indeed another environmental catastrophe in the makings from the looks of it.

    Heh. Obamacare is really killing the jobs in the shale fields.

  22. 31

    Blue John spews:

    @28. how do you figure?
    What you said is a logical as “The sky turned orange therefore all red haired men are World of Warcraft players”

  23. 32

    Michael spews:

    Famous last words: let them eat cake.

    I think the banksters know that the game is rigged and that it can only go on for so long. What I don’t get is why they think people will be civil to them once they fall.

  24. 33


    Here’s a video of a “man camp” in ND. A place to hang your hat while you work your tail off grabbing whatever dollars there are to grab in the Bakken shale oil boom.

    I understand the man camps all have at least Dish Network and many may also have internet.

    And here’s a mildly interesting vid of a crude oil trucker following a gravel truck through the rugged terrain of western ND. I found it interesting to wonder what this place would be like travelling through it without the roads just like wondering what some wide open spaces are like without wind turbines polluting the view space.

    This is a decent blog on the Bakken Shale boom:

    I heard today you can make about 80 grand right now driving a truck hauling oil, gravel, what have you – watch that truck driving vid and judge for yourself if it’s worth it.

  25. 37


    This video is really interesting:

    Touches on a lot of aspects of a frac site operation but by no means all.. A lot of those truckers haul water. It takes millions of gallons..

    You might want to think twice about a trucker’s job in that boom. The vid taker said he dares go no faster than 20 mph on those dirt roads.

  26. 39

    proud leftist spews:

    Roger @ 16
    Could there be any doubt that Perry was totally hammered when he gave that speech? Utterly shitfaced.

  27. 41

    proud leftist spews:

    I really can’t imagine what alternative explanation there might be for such a performance.

  28. 43

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    2012 Presidential Debate Schedule

    “The Commission on Presidential Debates … announced the schedule and setting for three presidential debates, and the lone vice presidential debate of the 2012 cycle.

    “Obama and his would-be Republican challenger will debate Weds., Oct. 3 at the University of Denver, Tues., Oct. 16 at Hofstra University in metropolitan New York, and on Mon., Oct. 22 at Lynn University in Boca Raton, Fla. The Hofstra debate will be a town hall meeting-style format. The vice presidential debate will be held Thurs., Oct. 11 at Centre College in Danville, Ky.”

    (Source: MSNBC)

    Roger Rabbit Commentary: Okay, I know MSNBC is a liberal propaganda megaphone (our trolls told me so), so this schedule probably is bullshit. So is the NFL schedule, the NBA schedule, and all the other bullshit published by MSNBC. So go ahead, get the schedule from Fox, if you don’t want to believe anything MSNBC. Or sit at home playing with yourself.

  29. 44

    rhp6033 spews:

    The Grio claims that Cain’s supporters are sticking by him despite the “sex scandal”. I put this in quotation marks because it is a significant choice of words. Once media starts repeating the words “sex scandal”, the particulars begin to lose their importance as the label sticks – a tactic Republicans have been using for quite some time to their benefit, on any number of issues.

    So where does this leave us? With Cain with a 25% loyal base, Romney with a 25% loyal base, and with Perry in third place, keeping within striking distance?

    I still think that Perry is the only one left who will appeal to the Southern Evangelical wing of the Republican party, as well as the racist wing. With a lot of money behind him, he might be able to stick around until “Super Tuesday”, at least, hoping that Romeny or Cain stumble badly. I had placed my bet on Perry when he first entered the race, but his debate performances have caused him a lot of problems.

    Bachman, Gingrich, and the others all seem to be out of the running. They are just hanging on long enough to get past the Iowa Caucus, or perhaps the New Hampshire primary, and are praying for a miracle. I don’t think that’s going to happen. With Chris Christie and Palin out of the way, the field is set.

    I still think if the Republicans had any viable brain cells left they would nominate Romney and be done with it. He’s the only one with a prayer against Obama. But apparantly a significan majority of them don’t have the requisite brain cells.

    That being said, Cain has some potential to cause problems for Pres. Obama, if he’s the nominee. He could split the African-American base. He’s a dynamic speaker. He’s reasonably intelligent (two college degrees) and has an impressive resume’. He just has whacky ideas, and is too impressed with himself to question those ideas.

    It would be fun, however, to see a race between two black men. The bigots would have apoplexy.

  30. 45

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @39 Yeah, but it’s okay, ‘cuz he’s gonna create lots of jobs*:

    “If you’re looking for a slick politician, or a guy with great teleprompter skills, we already have that, and he’s destroying our economy,” Perry says in the new ad, a direct jab at President Barack Obama. “I’m a doer, not a talker.”

    * If he follows his Texas template, they’ll be gummint jobs (presumably created for his friends, relatives, and campaign supporters), because that’s what his ‘Texas miracle’ is.

  31. 47

    rhp6033 spews:

    The Republican candidates are taking potshots of each other like they were Dick Cheney and his hunting companions. You would have to think this would leave the eventual nominee to enter the run for the general election as a wounded figure, with his former rivals for the nomination too angry at his/her tactics to cooperate in the campaign.

    But the down side is that the Republicans will get to test their ads, like Roger Rabbit referenced in # 45. They will know which ones work and which ones to discard early. They can also dismiss questions about their qualifications raised early in the primary campaign as being “old news”, having already been proven irrelevent (whether it is or not).

    While I’m glad the President doesn’t have to concentrate on a primary campaign, I kind of wish he could be honing his skills a little better. He needs to rally the 99% and get them organized to vote if he wants to win re-election.

  32. 49

    proud leftist spews:

    rhp @ 44
    I actually half expect a Gingrich run at some point. Those who are not enamored of Romney are running out of options, and Gingrich has not yet had his 15 minutes of being the latest darling.

  33. 50


    Herman Cain Accuses Karl Rove Of ‘Deliberate Attempt To Damage’ Him

    by Jon Bershad | 3:10 pm, October 24th, 2011

    This morning, Karl Rove went on Fox News and listed Herman Cain’s past mistakes on a white board, claiming the candidate had “peaked” in the polls. At the time, we suggested that this might just be another case of a GOP establishment type knocking a Tea Party favorite. Unsurprisingly, there was at least one person who was quick to jump on that theory. That person? Herman Cain.
    Cain spoke to the Washington Examiner‘s Byron York today and hit back at Rove’s comments.

    “‘It’s a good thing the voters are not looking at Karl Rove’s little whiteboard,’ Cain said in a phone conversation from a stop in Chicago Monday afternoon. ‘I believe it is a deliberate attempt to damage me because I am not, quote unquote, the establishment choice. But why not go with the choice that the people seem to like?’

    Cain accused Rove of bias in favor of candidates with big organizations, lots of money, and prior experience in political office — all things Cain doesn’t have. ‘What has Karl Rove done?’ Cain continued. ‘If I become the nominee, he has given Democrats talking points for a commercial to attack me. It makes no sense unless it’s a deliberate attempt on his part to try to push me down so that the candidate he wants rises to the top.’”

    York asked Rove for a response and the GOP strategist countered, “Herman Cain is the one giving the Democrats material for attack ads.”


    Check out Karl Rove’s earlier remarks below:

    First thing Cain’s got right the whole campaign.

    PS…Psst…Herm! It worked.

  34. 51

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Why I’m Not Shoveling Money Into Stocks Yet …

    Read this article; things aren’t as rosy as the herd stampeding back into stocks wants to believe:

    Some choice excerpts:

    First, I’ll skip over the bullshit coming out of year, and go straight to the bullshit emanating from our own government:

    “[D]idn’t the Bureau of Economic Analysis report on Thursday that gross domestic product in the third quarter grew at a reasonably decent annual rate of 2.5% …? But … John Williams … at Shadow Government Statistics … declares the supposed 2.5% gain ‘outright nonsense.’ And, indeed, he sees it as fresh proof of his contention that GDP is the most ‘heavily biased, heavily guessed at, heavily politicized and most worthless’ measure of the economy foisted … by the powers that be. John’s convinced that, in truth, the economy is limping badly.”

    A phony ginned-up GDP number isn’t the only problem:

    “What makes us especially uneasy is … the very real yawning gap between consumer income and outgo. In September, by way of illustration, personal income rose all of 0.1%, while consumer spending climbed 0.6%.”

    In other words, consumers increased their spending by six times the increase in their incomes, which doesn’t seem very sustainable:

    “Logic … would suggest that a pinched consumer, whose house is often underwater, whose job is anything but secure and whose paycheck is unremittingly eaten into by sharply escalating medical costs and painfully higher food and gas prices, is destined to cut down on his spending ….

    And what this means is:

    “Since … the lukewarm recovery is the result of an anticipatory inventory build by business, a reluctant consumer … obviously … makes for a gathering cloud over the investment environment ….”

    But that’s not all. Abroad, Europe is “moving toward a far greater crisis” and China is a house of cards ripe for “a real-estate panic with all the dressing: the drying up of mortgage credit, a severe hit to household wealth, and businesses going belly up.”

    Personally, I think the current situation is too opaque to invest my life savings in it, so I’m gonna sit down here in my rabbit hole and wait a little longer to see what happens upstairs.

  35. 52


    I wonder if SCCC would other groups set up camp on their campus. The NRA? The Tea Party?

    And with that, I believe I just won this argument.

  36. 53

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @50 I said it here first: Rove is the evil puppeteer behind the sex-scandal hit on Cain.

  37. 54


    Oct 31, 7:49 PM EDT

    Pregnant mom says sandwich arrest was ‘horrifying’

    Associated Press

    HONOLULU (AP) — Nicole Leszczynski couldn’t imagine that two chicken salad sandwiches would land her and her husband in jail and her 2-year-old daughter in state custody. But it happened five days ago, when the 30-weeks-pregnant woman forgot to pay for her snack while grocery shopping.

    “It was the most ridiculous chain of events that happened,” she said while sobbing Monday. “It’s still hard to believe what happened.”

    Leszczynski, 28, and her husband Marcin, 33, were handcuffed, searched then released on $50 bail each. Their ordeal at the police station lasted a few hours, but their daughter Zofia spent the night away from her parents in a case that has sparked nationwide outrage and forced the Safeway supermarket chain to review the incident.

    The family had moved to an apartment near downtown Honolulu from California two weeks ago. Still settling in, they ventured out Wednesday to stock up on groceries, took the bus, got lost, and ended up at a Safeway supermarket.

    Famished, the former Air Force staff sergeant picked up the two sandwiches that together cost $5. She openly munched on one while they shopped, saving the wrapper to be scanned at the register later.

    But they forgot to pay for the sandwiches as they checked out with about $50 worth of groceries.

    “When the security guard questioned us, I was really embarrassed, I was horrified,” she said. They were led upstairs, where the couple expected to get a lecture, pay for the sandwiches, and be allowed on their way.

    But store managers wouldn’t allow them to pay for the sandwiches, she said.

    “I asked to talk to a manager and he said it was against their policy to pay for items that left the store,” she said. “The security guard said we were being charged with shoplifting.”

    Four hours later, a police officer arrived and read them their rights. A woman from the state Child Welfare Services arrived to take Zofia away.

    The pregnant mother said she tried to keep her composure until Zofia, who turns 3 in December, left the store. “I didn’t want Zofia to be scared because she’s never spent a night away from us. She didn’t have her stuffed animal. She didn’t have her toothbrush.”

    But as soon as her daughter left, “I got completely hysterical. I went to the bathroom and I threw up,” she recalled.

    A Honolulu police spokeswoman said it was procedure to call Child Welfare Services if a child is present when both parents are arrested. The store’s management did not know the girl would be taken away, Houghton said.

    The national supermarket chain said it was looking into the incident. “It was never our intent to separate a mother from her child. That was a very unfortunate consequence to this situation,” said Susan Houghton, a spokeswoman for the California-based supermarket chain. “We understand the outrage. We are concerned about how this was handled.”

    Leszczynski called the incident “so horrifying, it seemed to escalate and no one could say, `this is too much.'”

    The couple was handcuffed and driven separately to police headquarters a few blocks away, where they were searched, had their mug shots taken and then released after paying bail. A police officer escorted them back to the store – which banned them for a year, Leszczynski said – where they picked up their groceries and walked home just before midnight.

    “We basically stared at each other all night. We woke up at the crack of dawn and called (the state child welfare office),” Leszczynski said. While they waited, Leszczynski vented about the experience on and contacted a lawyer for help with being reunited with Zofia. At the lawyer’s suggestion, they took their story to the media.

    Zofia was returned after an 18-hour separation from her parents.

    The couple has a court date in November for the petty misdemeanor arrest. They haven’t decided whether they will pursue legal action.

    Houghton said the company will review the police report and store security footage before deciding whether to press charges.

    Remember the Banksters that went to Jail for crashing the world economy and wrecking the US Housing market?

    Yeah…I don’t either.

  38. 55

    Michael spews:

    Jim Matheson, congressman from SLC. There’s others, but they either keep quiet about being center→left or keep quiet about being Mormon. I think it’s time for these folks to be loud and proud about both.

  39. 56

    rhp6033 spews:

    Hey, Roger, I had an idea. If we are going to be reducing spending anyway, why don’t we identify corporations which limite their CEO salaries and benefits to a reasonable level? Perhaps, say, 100 X the lowest paid worker’s pay?

    Anybody else can do without our money.

  40. 57

    rhp6033 spews:

    Troll @ 52: Aren’t you supposed to be out stealing candy from kid’s halloween baskets tonight?

  41. 58

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @52 You believe you win arguments in the same way ancients believed the earth is flat and the sun revolves around it.

  42. 60

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @56 You may be interested in this CNBC video about CEO pay. But the punch line, and my reason for posting it, comes at the very end when a guest expresses “concern” about the political clout of unions — with no mention of corporations’ gargantuan political spending and armies of lobbyists — with a straight face.

    This is typical of how business people think. They worry about “market distortions” of labor costs, but it never occurs to them there’s any problem with the power wielded on the corporate side — even though that power nearly brought the entire system down.

  43. 63

    Ekim spews:

    52. Troll spews:

    I wonder if SCCC would other groups set up camp on their campus. The NRA? The Tea Party?

    And with that, I believe I just won this argument.

    Yeah, sure Troll, you just won the argument. So could you explain what argument you won to the audience that doesn’t share space in your head?

  44. 64

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Everybody knows government economic statistics are bullshit, none more so than the CPI, which excludes food and energy costs. But laughable as official numbers are, they’re important, because they drive policy. For example, with gas and food prices stripped out of the CPI, the Fed’s policymakers don’t see this inflation, so they continue making policies that create inflation (e.g., quantitative easing or QE). For a couple of years now, the Fed has been pushing up stock prices at the expense of working-class families facing “stagflation” (stagnant wages and rising prices). I’m not the only one complaining about the myopia of official statistics; the business community is noticing too:

    Roger Rabbit Commentary: Our trolls ought to be applauding this comment (and others like it), because I’m basically parroting the conservative line on government statistics, the Federal Reserve, and monetary policy. That’s not because I’m falling in line with conservative ideology; rather, it’s because they’re falling in line (whether they know it or not) with my liberal beliefs that government ought to serve the people.

  45. 66

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Another big European financial institution has gone under because of the European debt crisis. Last week Belgian bank Dexia went bust; today MF Global filed for bankruptcy protection. The Euro Zone’s house of cards is tumbling down; this is only the beginning.

    “’The euphoria about the latest euro zone bailout will fade quickly, as investors realize that the underlying solvency issues have not been addressed,’ Charles Biderman, CEO at TrimTabs market research firm, wrote in his weekly analysis that came out before the MF Global bankruptcy filing Monday morning. ‘Trying to solve the sovereign debt crisis with more debt and more leverage will not work,’ he added. ‘Instead, it will make the problem worse and make the inevitable bust bigger.’”

  46. 67

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @65 The Greeks haven’t been bailed out. The European pols only created an illusion they’ve been bailed out. Investors see through it and that’s why stock markets plunged today.

  47. 68

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    What Occupy Is All About

    Here, let me help our trolls understand the “Occupy” protests:

    Corporate earnings are up 16% since last year, unemployment down not at all. Analyst estimates for next quarter are 16% also — and also zero change for unemployment.

    Does that clarify why the 99% who don’t benefit from a booming corporate sector are taking to the streets?

  48. 70

    Michael spews:

    Did ya’ hear the one about the giant roadside coffee pot that’s getting funding in the latest federal transportation bill?

    Well, it turns out that the righties (like Mr. McCain) made that one up out of thin air.

    “Pennsylvania ranks first out of all states for deficient bridges. Yet it seems to be more important to furbish large roadside coffee pots,” McCain said.

    But no transportation aid was spent on the coffee pot’s $100,000 restoration, said Olga Herbert, executive director of the Lincoln Highway Heritage Corridor. The money was raised entirely from preservation and civic organizations and local supporters.

    “We did not use any of this $300,000 award for anything to do with the coffee pot,” she said. “It’s interesting that nobody from Senator Coburn’s office called me about this.”

    Read more:

    I can see how people might not like the Democrats and I’m fine with that, but how anyone can support lying sleaze bags like Coburn is beyond me.

  49. 71

    fleabaggerssuck spews:

    roger rabbit—i’m glad I listened to cynical and got out of the market when the dow was at 12,200. it’s 11,700 now, down another 250 points. i think this europe mess is far from over. the bounce up however, showed how badly the market wants it to be over. you are also right about corp earnings and unemployment. current earnings dont predict the future necessarily. with unemployment continuing to be horrible, likely earnings will eventually reflect that, along with the europe mess

  50. 72


    Waaaaah! Waaaah! It’s not fair!!! Whine the neo-crazies!

    JERUSALEM — Israel’s summertime protest movement, which was occupying “Wall Street” before it was cool, can now celebrate their first major tangible success.

    At a Sunday cabinet meeting the government approved the restructuring of Israel’s tax system, shifting a few degrees of the social burden onto corporations and the very rich.

    If it can happen in Israel of all places with a freaking right wing government in charge why not here?

    I guess the right wing nutcases will now say those rich Israelis will now come here to the good ole’ USA.

    We’re going to get new “job creators” wingnuts! You can be happy!

    Pffft. It never ends with these idiots.

  51. 73

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @71 It’s not domestic unemployment that’s hurting corporate earnings. Profits have risen mightily since 2009 despite a U.S. unemployment rate stuck at 9% and stagnant household incomes. To understand why profits will weaken going forward, you have to know where the strong profits of the last couple years came from. Mostly one-time productivity gains realized by laying off workers and making those who remain on the payroll work harder for less pay. That cow gives only so much milk before she goes dry, and she’s about empty. When that’s over, corporations will need increased sales to grow their bottom lines, but it’s very hard to see where the demand will come from with unemployment stuck at 9% and household incomes stagnant.

    Here’s why stocks aren’t cheap even after this summer’s selloff. Let’s assume stocks give up their October gains and fall back to their August and September lows — they still aren’t cheap. To illustrate why, let’s assume XYZ Corp. shares are $20 and EPS (earnings per share) are $1.60, which gives you a P/E of 12.5. But you’re not buying past earnings; you’re buying future earnings. And if next year’s earnings fall to $1.40, you’re actually paying a multiple of 14.3 for that stock. Thus, if you believe corporate earnings will weaken next year, it follows that current P/Es overstate the value of the EPS you’re buying. For many companies, I adjust the P/E upward by 15% to get a rule-of-thumb valuation.

  52. 74

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Greece’s ruling party doesn’t want to take the heat for unpopular austerity measures or the collapse of the EU, so they’ve passed the hot potato to the public rioting outside parliament by putting austerity up for a public vote. You know what’s going to happen. The Greeks in the streets aren’t going to vote for higher bread prices and smaller paychecks! After they’ve voted Greece into insolvency the pols will wash their hands of the whole mess and retire to seaside villas. Greece will default, European banks will go under, the EU will break up, Europe will sink into a long recession, and American banks and corporations will be hit hard enough to drag the U.S. back into recession. Once again, political cowardice and failure by leaders to lead is going to rule the day.

  53. 76

    rhp6033 spews:

    RR @ 73: At a cargo industry conference I recently attended, the consensus of the experts was that cargo volumes (both air and sea) would remain flat internationally, for at lest the next year, perhaps two. That assumes that the economy doesn’t get any worse, and the experts were concerned about the situation in Europe.

    Cargo volumes are a pretty fair indicator of whch way the economy is going. Import volumes are a measure of retail confidence (itself an indication of consumer confidence), as retailers stock their shelves in expectation of future sales. Export volumes are a measure of worldwide confidence in the economy, as well as the available money supply.

    In the fall of 2008 we saw an incredible drop-off of cargo volumes worldwide as early as September, as retailers cancelled orders to Chinese manufacturers for products destined for the holiday shelves. Ocean-cargo rates fell so far that shipping charges were inconsequential in the calculations. The volumes (and rates) recovered somewhat in the first half of 2009, but have remained flat since then.

  54. 77

    fleabaggerssuck spews:

    excellent assessment @ 73.
    you and cynical seem to think alike on many investment principles. He seems to think it could be 2-3 more years before being a long-term investor is wise. there is money to be made on short term swings. i know he was playing Chevron for awhile when it hit around $90. but when i talked to him yesterday, he said he was still all out since the move @ dow 12,200.
    me too.

  55. 80

    Michael spews:

    Greece’s Referendum Step Leaves Europe Aghast
    The European Commission was rendered speechless last night, unable to react to George Papandreou’s dramatic choice to have Greece’s people vote on the country’s future in the euro zone.

    Referendums are anathema in Brussels, where scripted summits and handed-down directives are more the style than popular votes and their messy democratic outcomes.

    The Greek Prime Minister’s sudden lurch toward more democracy also seems to have caught most of the rest of Europe unawares.

    It was, in the tempered words of Rainer Bruederle, a senior German lawmaker, “a strange thing to do.” Why jeopardize the hard-won rescue plan secured only four days earlier at the European Union summit, a deal bearing no small financial risk to Greece’s euro partners?

    What they should have been Aghast is all the money that was loaned to the Greeks over the last decade. They’re not going to pay it back, because they can’t. And everyone knew all along that that that money wasn’t going to get paid back, they just figured that they weren’t the ones going to get left holding the bag.

    Greece needs to get it over with and default. The sooner they go belly up the sooner they can get on with life.

  56. 81

    Steve spews:

    I don’t know if this one has been brought up, but this is some sick Wall Street bullshit. If they keep this up, they’re going to get their damned throats slit and nobody will give a fuck because they’ll have it coming to them. Class warfare? Haven’t they a fucking clue? They can lose this “war” and, if they do, some people are going to get downright fucking ugly on their ass.

    Party on, you fools. The 99% are coming for you.

  57. 82

    rhp6033 spews:

    I saw this today, I had to chuckle at the matter-of-fact way it was reported. It seems a shoplifter was trying to escape from a Best Buy store in Augusta, Georgia, and ran into a couple of Marines out front who were manning a Toys for Tots collection station. He stabbed one Marine in the back (the injury was “not severe”, and Cpl. Duggan was transported to the hospital. The report continues…

    “…The subject was also transported to the local hospital with two broken arms, a broken ankle, a broken leg, several missing teeth, possible broken ribs, multiple contusions, assorted lacerations, a broken nose and a broken jaw…injuries he sustained when he slipped and fell off the curb after stabbing the Marine.”

    Assailant suffers injuries from fall

    Personally, I think he got off easy. Remember, this is the part of the country were “He needed killing” is still considered a valid defense to a homicide charge.

  58. 83

    rhp6033 spews:

    # 79: Yep, that was some good flying, and when you talk about a three-point landing, you usually aren’t referring to the aft under-belly and the bottom of two engine cowlings. The pilot did get lucky – once he’s on the ground, he’s got absolutely no control, and the airplane could slide anywhere it wants – like those old snow disks we used to use back in the day.

    But I’m still perplexed over the cause. A complete hyraulic failure which prevents the landing gear from deploying? That’s strange – there are back-up systems and lots of ways to avoid such a total failure. Heck, even the Gimli Glider was able to deploy it’s RAT and maintain minimal hyraulics even without power, enough to lower it’s landing gear and have some control over the flight control surfaces.

    I suspect there’s more to that story, we will probably find out more over the next few weeks as the investigation continues. In the meantime, despite the great landing, that 767 is probably toast – it would be difficult to get it back to the point where it would be considered airworthy. The regulatory authorities are very wary of accidents which put so much stress on the airframe structure in ways it wasn’t intended. If that airplane has a lot of hours on it already, they would probably scrap it.

  59. 85

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @83 Darwinian selection at work — nature has a way of eliminating specimens like him before they’re able to spread their defective seed.

  60. 86

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    In case you guys missed it, MSNBC reports tonight that four members of a rightwing militia group were arrested by the FBI for plotting to blow up federal buildings and spread poison.