Open Thread 10/26

- Obama endorses R-74.

Either these pro-life advocates are complacent monsters every bit as callously unconcerned with saving unborn babies as those they oppose. Or else, just like those they oppose, these folks do not really believe that “every embryo is morally equivalent to a fully developed child.”

– What the property tax swap would mean.

– What strangers does the McKenna campaign imagine are going to teach about alternative lifestyles? If your kid’s teachers are strangers, you’re doing something wrong.

– The My Lai is no big deal, wave fake anthrax to start a war guy endorses Obama. Yay? And the GOP reaction to it is pretty awful.

A neocon word for chutzpah


  1. 1


    Osama Bin Laden is dead, and General Motors is alive!

    And soon, Jeep will be Chinese:

    Fiat SpA (F), majority owner of Chrysler Group LLC, plans to return Jeep output to China and may eventually make all of its models in that country, according to the head of both automakers’ operations in the region.
    Fiat is in “very detailed conversations” with its Chinese partner, Guangzhou Automobile Group Co. (2238), about making Jeeps in the world’s largest auto market, said Mike Manley, chief operating officer of Fiat and Chrysler in Asia. Chrysler hasn’t built Jeeps there since before Fiat took control in 2009.

    US taxpayer dollars spent to offshore production of US automobiles.

    Well done, Team Obama. Well done.

  2. 2

    Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

    You are a complete moron, or worse, an unfiltered parrot of right wing talking points.

    Romney tried making the same scare-tactic argument you feebly whine @1.

    He was shot down mercilessly.

    However, Jeep is expanding US operations…

    About 1,100 new Chrysler employees will begin working next week on a third crew at Jefferson North Assembly Plant in Detroit as sales of Jeep Grand Cherokees continue to rise.

    From the Detroit News:

    The Bloomberg story, though accurate, “has given birth to a number of stories making readers believe that Chrysler plans to shift all Jeep production to China from North America, and therefore idle assembly lines and U.S. work force. It is a leap that would be difficult even for professional circus acrobats,” Chrysler spokesman Gualberto Ranieri said.

    “Let’s set the record straight: Jeep has no intention of shifting production of its Jeep models out of North America to China. It’s simply reviewing the opportunities to return Jeep output to China for the world’s largest auto market. U.S. Jeep assembly lines will continue to stay in operation.” [Ed. emphasis mine]

    Romney is apparently getting all of his information from the right-wing echo chamber…remember that second debate…well, his inability to access accurate information has bitten him on the ass…again.

    Way to go, Cap’n Crunch.

  3. 3

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    @1 Kap’n Kornflake – Serially WRONG and Serially spinning bullshit

    What does Chrysler have to say about Kap’n Kornflake and the Republican lying machine’s latest crock o’ shit?

    Jeep in China

    October 25, 2012 4:24 PM
    There are times when the reading of a newswire report generates storms originated by a biased or predisposed approach.

    On Oct. 22, 2012, at 11:10 a.m. ET, the Bloomberg News report “Fiat Says Jeep® Output May Return to China as Demand Rises” stated “Chrysler currently builds all Jeep SUV models at plants in Michigan, Illinois and Ohio. Manley (President and CEO of the Jeep brand) referred to adding Jeep production sites rather than shifting output from North America to China.”

    Despite clear and accurate reporting, the take has given birth to a number of stories making readers believe that Chrysler plans to shift all Jeep production to China from North America, and therefore idle assembly lines and U.S. workforce. It is a leap that would be difficult even for professional circus acrobats.

    Let’s set the record straight: Jeep has no intention of shifting production of its Jeep models out of North America to China. It’s simply reviewing the opportunities to return Jeep output to China for the world’s largest auto market. U.S. Jeep assembly lines will continue to stay in operation. A careful and unbiased reading of the Bloomberg take would have saved unnecessary fantasies and extravagant comments.

    Republicans and their supporters can’t win you with their policies, so they need to scare you with lies.

  4. 4


    @ 2

    First, your comments noted.


    Romney is apparently getting all of his information from the right-wing echo chamber

    The “right-wing echo chamber” that is Bloomberg News?

  5. 5

    Michael spews:

    - The My Lai is no big deal, wave fake anthrax to start a war guy endorses Obama. Yay? And the GOP reaction to it is pretty awful.

    The Colin Powell thing is just fun because The Righties were in love with him for so long.

  6. 6


    @ 3,4

    It’s still off-shoring of jobs by Chrysler. Making the argument that Jeeps will continue to be built in the US is similar to, say, Boeing saying that the South Carolina factory really doesn’t matter much, because planes will continue to be built in Seattle.

    What, we can’t ship US-built Jeeps to China and keep the manufacturing jobs in the US?

    My, HA libbies all of a sudden don’t really see a problem with manufacturing relocated to a foreign country, where production costs are far less expensive. And it’s not just labor to assemble. I would imagine they’ll be using Chinese steel rather than US steel. Right?

  7. 7

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    @6 Kap’n Kornflake - Devoted to Idiocy

    No, it’s not still anything asswipe.

    You led the day off with a lie which was debunked before you even got your sloth induced disease gout ass out of bed.

  8. 8


    A Special Operations team, or CIF which stands for Commanders in Extremis Force, operating in Central Europe had been moved to Sigonella, Italy, but they too were told to stand down. A second force that specializes in counterterrorism rescues was on hand at Sigonella, according to senior military and intelligence sources. According to those sources, they could have flown to Benghazi in less than two hours. They were the same distance to Benghazi as those that were sent from Tripoli. Specter gunships are commonly used by the Special Operations community to provide close air support.
    According to sources on the ground during the attack, the special operator on the roof of the CIA annex had visual contact and a laser pointing at the Libyan mortar team that was targeting the CIA annex. The operators were calling in coordinates of where the Libyan forces were firing from.

    Read more:

    Anyone else notice we haven’t heard a peep from General Patraeus on this?

  9. 9

    Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:


    your comments noted

    You’re an officious prick. The appropriate response would be along the lines of, “Sorry, I fucked up” or better, just shutting up.

    Moreover, as noted in the quote…

    The Bloomberg story, though accurate, “has given birth to a number of stories…

    Places like the whackadoodle Washington Examiner (fav of puddl, BTW)…

    Jeep, an Obama favorite, looks to shift production to China

    You’re an ass.

  10. 10

    Michael spews:

    The link for this:

    - What the property tax swap would mean.

    is sending me to the same story as the link above it.

  11. 11

    Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

    My, HA libbies all of a sudden don’t really see a problem with manufacturing relocated to a foreign country

    No, we see a problem with Romney lying through his teeth, AGAIN, Dr. False Equivalence and Serial Deflection.


  12. 13

    Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

    Gawd…the 10″ sewer pipe of right-wing talking points and SCANDAL!!!! BENGHAZI!1!! du jour is just spewing relentlessly this morning.

  13. 14

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    Kap’n Kornflake,

    You no doubt will continue to attempt to conflate the latest lie here all day, but those of us who know better can take comfort in the FACT that the news today in Ohio and throughout the mid-west will be along the lines of what the Detroit News is reporting.

    Romney picks up incorrect story about Jeep production moving to China

    Just one more bold face lie from the most mendacious candidate for president ever – Slick Willard.

  14. 15

    Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

    I linked a Bloomberg piece.

    Yes, one that had been noted to spawn all sorts of misguided and inaccurate right wing conspiracy theories that Mittster retold, stupidly.

    How is it not offshoring of US production?

    They’re building cars in China to sell in China. They’re increasing production in USA to sell here. They’re NOT moving production to China to sell in US.

    You’re an imbecile, or a liar, hard to tell which.

  15. 16

    Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

    Cap’n….if you’re really interested in a factual and informed and honest debate, I’d try shutting up for a time, gathering some facts, and come back to debate without the snide 40th yard line spike or the latest easily debunked right wing screed.

    Just sayin’.

    Later – I’m outta here, at least for a while.

  16. 17

    don spews:

    Anyone else notice we haven’t heard a peep from General Patraeus on this?

    Maybe he’s doing his job rather than chasing down rumors on Fox News. The ambassador was dead before any special forces arrived in Sicily.

  17. 18

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    My last bit regarding Slick Willard’s latest (and Kap’n Kornflake’s repeated) crock-o’-shit lie:
    The Morning Plum: Romney’s false scare story in Ohio

    In political terms, this goes directly to the heart of the argument Obama has been making about Romney to Ohioans about trust: That Romney can’t be trusted in a very fundamental way to level with them or genuinely look out for their interests, that he’ll tell them anything to win the election.

    Slick Willard throws a high hanging fast ball into the wheelhouse.

    In the words of the immortal Bob Prince Kiss it goodbye!

  18. 20

    ArtFart spews:

    @5 That little tryst ended long ago. For some time the GOP has treated Powell as a former “useful idiot”. If he were an official of another country he’d probably have been assassinated.

  19. 21

    ArtFart spews:

    Re: the second item in this thread (the 50% of “concepti” which never attach to the uterine wall), this is something that Catholic theologians have been wrestling with for decades, and for which they don’t really have a definitive answer. In general they haven’t been going out of their way to share this dilemma with the laity, certainly not with the “pro-life” zealots–but that latter group are far too much in love with the sound of their own voices to listen to anyone else.

  20. 22

    czechsaaz spews:

    @6 Stupid analysis. No, it is not cost effective to build cars in the U.S. and ship them to China. Why does BMW have a plant in Arkansas? Why are most Hondas sold in the U.S. manufactured here? If, by manufacturing a Jeep in China they can compete on a price level with other Asian cars, sell more and bring the profits to an American company, that’s a good thing. It’s also a prime example of why the bailout was good. You can’t build a Ford in India and ship it here and still compete on pricing with like-class cars. Those cars need to be built here, or close to here. If you want to argue if Canadian or Mexican plants are good for the U.S. economy you might have something. You’re starting from a premise that all non-conservatives don’t understand global economics.

    @8 It’s all about the economy right? As pointed out less than 10% of people in this country get their news from Fox. So while they are trying to spin this narrative that Obama made every single decision in real time regarding Benghazi and some of them were wrong and then didn’t call it terrorism when the record is obvious to non-mouth-foamers that it was acknowledged as terrorism both 24 and 48 hours later. It’s not catching on.

    You’re like the Detroit Tigers of Campaigning. You keep swinging at the high heat, swinging for the fences even, and everyone in the seats is wondering, “What are you thinking? You can’t hit that.”

    1+1 does not equal 5. Or in the minds of rational people, fragments of info, an unverified claim for responsibility by a terror group and a cable from the embassy indicating the situation is under control when in reality it wasn’t does not equal “Oh my God the president is lying and foreign policy is in shambles.” It may ring true for 10% of the voters who never entertained the thought of voting for Obama but the rest of the folks aren’t buying it.

  21. 23


    Know what we haven’t seen yet? Press accounts of the Obama ‘If I haven’t blah blah blah in three years…….” video clip being used against him in Romney ads.

    That’s about to change:

    The long-awaited October Mitt Romney ad bomb is finally coming to a TV screen near you.

    Big, powerful ads in swing state media markets are in the pipeline, Romney aides told donors at the New York briefing. These ads will be focused on sealing the deal in North Carolina, Florida and Virginia, where Romney has gained momentum after the debates, and in breaking Obama’s hold in the midwestern states, Ohio, Wisconsin and Colorado.

    Another point for comforting Romney supporters is early voting trends. It was no doubt a key factor for Obama’s campaign in spending heavily on advertising in early October, but it wasn’t for the GOP because Democrats are more likely to vote early than Republicans.

    “Romney is betting the farm on actual-day voting,” a veteran GOP strategist said. “Expect that mass of ads and activity much closer to Nov. 6.”

    “I don’t think there’s a missed opportunity here,” Hardin said. “They know what they are doing. This race is clearly in a dead heat. It’s not about undecided voters. The cliché it’s a base election has never been more relevant than it is this year.”

    What, $200 million spent by Obama in late Spring and Summer portraying Romney as a rich monster?

    One debate and all that was undone.

    And Romney, in response, has largely kept his powder dry.

    The Pain. It’s almost here.

  22. 24

    czechsaaz spews:

    Corollary to @22

    It’s been a month and a half since Benghazi and near constant screeching by Fox and radio echo chamber and more level headed reporting by CNN, CBS et al and which way are the national polls moving? What are the crosstabs on questions about who would be better keeping America safe?

    Go for it soggy in milk. It’s working.

  23. 25

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    @23 Kap’n Kornflake – Yellow Bellied Slothful Bullshitter!

    One debate and all that was undone.

    You don’t believe that!

    Prove to me and those who read this that you do believe the garbage you spew.

    Accept a Rmoney size wager of $10,000 with me at 2:1 in your favor that Obama/Biden defeats Gekko/Galt.

    Got the nut sack Kap’n?

  24. 28


    @ 25

    “You don’t believe that!”

    Actually, to some extent I do. For much of the 70 million people who watched the debate it was their first chance to focus on Romney for an extended period of time. Just the two of them, plus Lehrer, for 90 minutes.

    Obama was blah, sure, but Romney was poised, in command of his talking points (irrespective of accuracy), and came off as quite presidential to many.

    People expected to see a blow-out by Obama. Instead they saw a guy who came off looking far better than Obama did.

    70 million people. And look how things changed pretty much immediately after October 3rd.

    Yeah, I do believe that Obama’s efforts to make Romney into a monster went poof that night.

    I’m in no mood to ‘prove’ the size of my scrotum, nor anything else, to you. Keep hammering away at me. It’s not like you’ve got something I haven’t heard before.

    Unless you’re Rael. He always posts new and unique comments.

  25. 29

    czechsaaz spews:


    Yeah, wait ’til there are almost No undecided voters left and then “Release the Kraken!” Terrifying.

    Another sports analogy. Being down a field goal with 27 seconds left. That EXACTLY where we want to be! Our kicker is GREAT!

  26. 30


    Romney up 20 points amongst independents.

    Here’s how he got there:

    While 22 percent of likely voters personally have been contacted by Obama’s campaign, as many, 23 percent, have been contacted by Romney’s side. That’s tightened from a 5-point Obama advantage in contacts in mid-October; Obama similarly had a 7-point advantage over John McCain in contacts at about this point in 2008.
    More important, Romney has caught up in the efficiency of his outreach as well. Among likely voters who’ve been contacted by his campaign, 63 percent, indeed, are Romney supporters. That’s on pace with Obama, who has had 65 percent efficiency in his campaign contacts. It’s a measure on which Obama led Romney by 17 percentage points two weeks ago, and was ahead of McCain by 22 points at this time in 2008. Efficiency matters because contacts are meant to encourage turnout; the campaigns want to reach, and encourage, their supporters.

  27. 31

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    @28 Kap’n Kornflake – Yellow Bellied Slothful Bullshitter!

    I’m in no mood to ‘prove’ the size of my scrotum, nor anything else, to you.

    You PMS-ing? Got some mood issues?

    As long as you bleat out ridiculous Republican talking points you are incapable of proving anything asswipe.

    You are simply and repeatedly WRONG.

  28. 32

    Rael spews:

    30. Serial conservative spews:

    Romney up 20 points amongst independents.

    … you read that wrong … Romney’s up 20 points among idiots.

    Romney’s actually up 40 points among Bible thumping inbred rednecks.

  29. 33

    rhp6033 spews:

    Serial @#6, rebutted by czechsaaz @ 22:

    Czechsaaz led in with a point I was going to make.

    The concept of Jeep products being built in China for the Chinese market is not “off-shoring”, because that term implies that the products would then be imported back into the U.S. for consumer markets.

    The Chinese were successful and producing low-cost products for the U.S. markets, but if you look closely you will see that almost all of them are light items which can be shipped at a very low cost by ocean vessels. This included clothing, electronics, toys, and some processed food products.

    Once you get into the bigger, heavier items, the shipping costs will often outweigh the cheaper production costs overseas. When U.S. “voluntary” quotas on Japanese auto imports to the U.S. went into effect in the mid-1980’s, Honda promptly set up shop in Ohio, followed shortly thereafter by other Japanese automakers. But it was a mixed-bag – almost all the parts were Japanese-made, and although the final assembly was by American workers, the profits went back to Japan.

    Of course, China is no longer the low-cost leader in manufacturing of cheap products. As Chinese wages have risen somewhat, even Chinese firms are off-shoring production to Malasia, Indonesia, and Vietnam.

    Getting back to China – the government there is rather protectionist of it’s own markets. If you develop a market in China, they invariably find ways to limit imports and prop up local competition. So if too many Jeeps get sold in China, then China will find a way to develop a local alternative and discourage competition by limiting imports. The G.M. strategy may be to avoid that result by setting up shop in China – using Chinese labor, but sending the profits back home to the U.S.

    China is currently prepairing it’s aircraft industry to produce a regional jet and a single-aisle commercial jet which will compete with the Airbus A320 and Boeing 737. Experts who have seen the designs don’t think much of the Chinese airplanes when compared to the Airbus and Boeing counterparts, and don’t see it being a competative alternative in the world marketplace. But that’s not the point – China doesn’t want to see those huge amounts of Yen being sent overseas to pay for commercial aircraft, and is determined to develop a domestic industry that the government can support by “encouraging” Chinese airlines to “Buy Chinese”.

    In other words, Serial doesn’t know beens about the world markets, finance, exports and imports, or logistics. He should find something he knows about and stick to it.

  30. 34

    rhp6033 spews:

    Limbaugh’s a real piece of work. He loved Colin Powell when he was a Republican, but when he demonstrated he could think for himself, he was persona-non-grata. The few blacks within the Republican Party should take note of that – despite the compliments and back-slapping, the Republicans consider them useful tools, and little more than that.

    Limbaugh’s comment, of course, went beyond Colin Powell. It was a thinly-veiled instruction to white voters: “It’s okay for blacks to vote for a black President, because whites should always vote for the white guy”.

  31. 35

    rhp6033 spews:

    Speaking of out-sourcing:

    The Boeing CEO McNerney is on the President’s task force to encourage U.S. exports. Which makes sense, because Boeing relies upon exports of aircraft to foreign airlines for much of it’s revenue.

    But on the other hand, Boeing just sent a letter to it’s suppliers, encouraging them to attend a conference in Mexico, stating that many of their suppliers have had great success in off-shoring production there.

    Apparantly he’s forgotten, or is not aware, of the huge SNAFU created by Mexican production of wiring harnesses for the 787 program. The vendor contract was given to a Texas firm, which then simply out-sourced the production to a Mexican firm. Apparantly there was no quality control either in Mexico where the product was being made, or in Texas where the final quality checks were supposed to have been made, or at the out-sourced firm in Everett (“New Breed”) which was suppose to handle all parts for the 787 program. The result was wiring wich was mis-labeled, with the wrong colors being used, and even the wrong materials used for the wiring. The problem was discovered on the factory floor – by electritions (IAM) who found wire colors that with no match in the aircraft drawings (Where’s the %&@**@@@ blue wire??? And what &*@#*$!! is this purple wire for????).

    (Note: much of the hped-for benefit of discouraging illegal immigration from Mexico under NAFTA was lost when China achieved most-favored nation status, and electronic production quickly shifted overseas to China. Left behind were empty factories and workers with no jobs, right in the border regions. This made the area ripe for the drug gangs to recruit young unemployed Mexicans, and helped create the “drug culture” which is so hard to penetrate there.)

  32. 36

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    I find it absolutely amazing that the knuckle heads at Boeing in Chicago have yet to figure out that the most profitable place to design and build aircraft is the US, and withing the US right here in the northwest.

    Each and every time they rely upon the northwest it is a home run (e.g. P8-A, 737(NG, MAX) and every time they source for cheaper they burn a pile of money (e.g. 787).

    Investing in designing and building airplanes in the NW is the easiest decision anyone could make.

  33. 38

    ArtFart spews:

    #36 It becomes more and more obvious that Al Mulally was smart enough to know when to leave and take on something feasible, like saving Ford. The goons from McDonnell Douglas put Boeing on a flight path that makes it a matter of when, not if, it’ll auger in.

  34. 39

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    A man dies, goes to heaven, stands before St. Peter, and sees a huge wall of clocks. The man asks what all the clocks are for and St. Peter explains, “These are lie clocks. Everyone on earth has a lie clock. Every time a person lies, the clock hands move.”

    Pointing to one, the man says, “Whose clock is that?”

    “That’s Mother Teresa’s,” St. Peter answers. “The hands have never moved, indicating she never told a lie.”

    “Incredible,” the man responds. “And whose clock is that?”

    St. Peter responds, “That’s Abraham Lincoln’s. The hands moved twice telling us he told two lies in his entire life.”

    “Where is Mitt Romney’s clock?” the man asks.

    “Romney’s clock is in Jesus’ office,” St. Peter says. “He’s using it as a ceiling fan.”

    Via Chronicling Mitt’s Mendacity, Vol. XL

  35. 41

    czechsaaz spews:


    Actually Mr. Loaf was last seen screaming like a maniac and threatening to beat up Gary Bussey on ToupeeFraud’s, “Hugely successful television show” and getting fired.

    That’s a new campaign button, Insane Has-beens for Romney.

  36. 42

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @6 “It’s still off-shoring of jobs by Chrysler. Making the argument that Jeeps will continue to be built in the US is similar to, say, Boeing saying that the South Carolina factory really doesn’t matter much, because planes will continue to be built in Seattle.”

    A false equivalency that unequivocally demonstrates your incapacity for analytical thinking.

    The South Carolina plant took jobs away from Seattle-area Boeing workers. It also took pay away from workers because the SC non-union jobs pay half as much as Seattle union jobs.

    Chrysler, on the other hand, is only talking about hiring Chinese workers in Chinese plants to make Jeeps for the new Chinese market. That takes nothing away from Chrysler’s North American workers.

  37. 43

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Cereal Bob is so worried about Mitt’s prospects he has to keep reassuring himself his man still has a chance to win.

    And if Rmoney does win? Cereal Bob and his fellow conservatives will get the man they least wanted back in the spring when the GOP was choosing its candidate.

    Sucks to be Bob.

  38. 44

    No Time for Fascists spews:

    Government forecasters said there is a 90 percent chance – up from 60 percent two days earlier – that the East will get pounded.

    Some interesting comments on the pending storm to hit the east coast.

    Now all you Red States,
    remember ya ain’t taking none of that gov’mint money this time.
    No FEMA.
    Ya’ll gotta learn to take care of ya’selfs and not be dependent of gov’mint handouts.

    Did we, or did we not, agree NOT to talk about Climate Change this election season?
    So, who invited Sandy to the party…

    Cue the fundy GOTPers to say this storm is God’s judgment on the northeast for supporting Obama in …5…4…3…2…1

    If the storm causes damage
    Take heart because according to Republicans it’s what God intended

    “When Republicans retook the U.S. House of Representatives in 2010, they made deep cuts in…Obama’s 2011 request for the Polar Joint Satellite System, a system of new satellites needed to replace the old ones, which currently provide 85 percent of the data used in hurricane forecasting. House Republicans proposed further deep cuts in the program in fiscal year 2012.”

    Any of you on the east coast, be careful.

  39. 45

    Lib Sci spews:

    Check it out – Romney photoshop of rally to make it appear larger!

    That’s confidence. Must make Cap’n Bob proud.

    Bad photoshop – first sign of an incompetent repressive regime.


  40. 46

    wharfrat spews:

    Just what is it about globalization that you numbskull trolls don’t understand. American [ok, Italian-American] manufacturer opens up plant overseas to serve that market and repatriate profits to parent in US. What’s bad about snatching a share of expanding markets? I guess the trolls will try to weave whole cloth from pigs’ ears or whatever aphorism fits.

  41. 47


    @ 45

    That’s the worse job I’ve seen.

    I’ve never done a panorama image. Does the computer do it automatically?

    Here’s what BuzzFeed said – they gave some credence to the possibility that it was a glitch. I mean, it’s SUCH a bad job…..

    At best, the official Romney Instagram account posted a really bad panorama.

    I wonder if the White House has ever released a photo of a two-headed Bo?

  42. 49

    rhp6033 spews:

    # 42: And one point Serial keeps forgetting entirely – this is a job segment which isn’t being adequately served right now. All those Jeeps which Serial thinks are “American Jobs” aren’t even being sold in China right now. And they won’t be, because the U.S. factories right now aren’t keeping up with demand as it is, and the Chinese market won’t materialize until the prices come down – which would happen if, for example, the jeeps were made in China, where there wouldn’t have the huge expense of shipping the products. So he’s talking about a hypothetical market making hypothetical cars.

    Sure, there are Jeeps selling in China now – mostly to the rich Chinese. But before we can appeal to the emerging middle-class, we have to have get within a price which is comparable to Japanese and Indian imports.

    Which is again why Serial merely throws out talking points, but doesn’t understand international markets at all.

  43. 50

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    No, this is not the Onion.

    White voters still matter

    RENO, Nev. — If Mitt Romney wins the presidency, part of the lesson of 2012 will be that white voters still matter.

    Prove Dr. Martin Luther King Jr wrong,
    vote Gekko/Galt

  44. 51

    rhp6033 spews:

    # 44: My sister, who lives in central Pennsylvania, said that their town is celebrating Halloween on Saturday night – the expect to get pummelled Tuesday – Wednesday, either with heavy rain and flooding or snow. Weather forcasters say that by Halloween, the rain/snow could be hitting even Ohio pretty hard.

    Businesses everywhere are already re-scheduling events or canceling them entirely, with airports expected to be closed and national air travel disrupted (including NYC airports, some of the busiest in the world). In my office we have already subsituted a teleconference instead of a quarterly management conference in L.A., because the director of the New York office is expected to be unable to attend.

    Which means that for the various campaigns in the central rustbelt and north-east, the campaigns may be effectively over. By the time the rain/snow/flooding settle out, we will be in the weekend before election day. Instead of the flurry of rallies, photo ops, etc., they will have to settle with press releases, you-tube videos, etc.

  45. 52

    rhp6033 spews:

    The newest economic numbers are out. New unemployment claims are down a bit (yesterday’s news), and the GDP increased last quarter to an effective 2% annual rate.

    Both are good news, but not great news. It shows slow but steady economic recovery.

    Romney, on the other hand, called the news “dissapointing”. Which shouldn’t be a surprise, since Republicans have been gambling on the U.S. economy failing in order to win this election. Heaven knows, they’ve done enough to try to destroy it. At first it seemed it was just an unfortunate result of their “cut safety net, lower taxes on rich” philosophy. But it turns out that it’s been a central part of Republican strategy since the night of the President’s inaugeration.

  46. 53


    If possible, Mitt Romney will be flapping around like Chicken Little claiming that his response to the storm would have been faster than Obama’s.

  47. 54

    rhp6033 spews:

    They Wynn Resorts chain (one of the largest gambling organizations) has a policy forbiding the discussion of politics on the job.

    But that didn’t stop management from issuing a bound 67-page “voting guide”, indicating which candidates should receive the votes of Wynn employees. The “voting guide” was mailed to the homes of all employees, and invariably picked Republican candidates for Congress, state, and county positions. It didn’t express a preference on the Obama/Romney race, but the language of the letter from the President of Wynn Resorts, at the front of the package, left no doubt about who management preferred to be President.

    The few Wynn employees who were willing to talk with reports, on condition of anonymity, said they believed that if they had an Obama bumper sticker on their car, or an Obama yard sign at their home, that they would probably lose their jobs.

  48. 56

    rhp6033 spews:

    Romney’s spent the past few days saying that attacks on him “aren’t an agenda”.

    Which means, of course, that telling the truth about him and his lies is hurting his chances of being elected. The Obama campaign should put the throttle down right about now.

    Mitt can be such a whiner sometimes.

  49. 57

    Michael spews:

    @44 I’ve got a few friends in the NYC area. They’ll all stocked up on stuff and battened down. Looks like they’re going to have a few nasty days.

  50. 60

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    Sen. Rob Portman (R-OH) acknowledged today it will be “very difficult” for Romney to win without Ohio.

    Roger Rabbit Commentary: Most pollsters have Ohio leaning to Obama, and Obama can still win without Florida or Ohio (whereas Romney must win at least one of those states), so Obama still has the advantage despite Romney’s recent surge.

  51. 61

    Michael spews:

    A chunk of that growth was in defense spending which is unsustainable and probably stupid.

    The growth was a bit better than economists had expected, in part because of a surge in government defense spending, which was not expected to last. Defense spending rose at its fastest pace in three years, and combined with the rise in household consumption and a jump in home building to strengthen domestic demand.

  52. 62

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @61 If Romney wins, maybe he’ll reopen some bayonet factories in the rust belt, and western horse ranchers might get a piece of the action, too.

  53. 63

    Michael spews:

    My 2016 picks are Antonio Villaraigosa (D) and Mick Cornett (R). You can’t miss with two cycling advocates battling for the white house. I think it would be first time we had mayors running for president.

    The Republican’s are going to be a bit up shit creek in 2016 as they have a habit of running the guy who didn’t the nod the last time around and only sane person, other than Mitt, was Jon Huntsman and we know that ‘aint gonna happen.

  54. 66

    Piltdown Man spews:

    said they believed that if they had an Obama bumper sticker on their car, or an Obama yard sign at their home, that they would probably lose their jobs.

    10/26/2012 AT 2:45 PM

    that is such a crock of shit….do you realize how many people are employed with Wynn Resorts??

    you a total dipshit if you believe this stuff…of course, we all know RHPiss is already a total dipshit.

  55. 67

    Piltdown Man spews:

    LMFAO at all the people crying about companies suggesting to their employees who they might want to vote for. Big Fucking Deal!

    how come you dont show the same concern when unions(including public employee unions!) do the same fucking thing?

    what a bunch of pussies.

  56. 69

    rhp6033 spews:

    # 67: Unions can’t fire people.

    If the employees are non-union and not protected by a contract of employment, the management can fire them at will – for any reason, or for no reason. Even if they are protected by a Union contract, employers can think of a hundred different ways to fire an employee or force them to quit.

    That’s just one of the reaons why Citizens United was so much B.S. – it was claimed that since Corporations and Unions were both allowed to contribute to campaigns and engage in political activity, they were equal. Obviously, they aren’t the same.

    But such reasoning is lost on PillowDown man. He doesn’t care, as long as it’s his side which is bullying the other side. He thinks it’s funny. But he’d be crying like a little baby if he had to receive just a fraction of the abuse he likes to have heaped on his political opponants.

  57. 70

    rhp6033 spews:

    Speaking of which….

    Reports are perculating up from Boeing employees of some practices which may constitute unfair labor practices.

    New employees (and those being re-tasked from legacy programs to the 787 program) undergo initial training at an off-site program in a building south of the Everett factory. That is a joint Washington State/Boeing funded program, as part of the initiative a few years back to get the 787 program in Washington State. The instructors are former Boeing employees.

    But legacy program employees, who know better, say that the instructors currently being chosen and hired are pretty solidly anti-union. They will make frequent comments in class which are derogatory to the unions. One even told the class that if he saw any of them picketing during a strike, they could expect that he would swerve his car and “take them out”. Others have said that they would all be unemployed soon unless they agreed to substantial wage and benefit cuts in the next contract cycle.

    In addition to that, Boeing is ciculating a notice to employees on it’s intranet (unpritable) which says that it is against company policy to say anything derogatory against the company, whether at work or in their private life. Boeing management considers criticism of management’s contract offers to be such criticism, subjecting the employee to immediate termination.

    Apparantly this is part of the recent Unfair Labor Practice complaint which SPEEA is pursuing against Boeing.

  58. 71

    rhp6033 spews:

    By the way, Ann Coulter is tripling down on her comment that the President was a “retard”. Despite such criticism, she is whipping up the Republican crackpots, alleging that she is a victim of the “word police”, and arguing that the use of the term is completely proper, as long as one isn’t refering to someone who is actually disabled.

    Which brings about this question: Was Ann Coulter a bully her entire life, abusing minorities and anyone who crossed her path, or did she acquire that trait when she learned that Republicans would pay her to act like a bully? If the former is true, she needs serious counseling. If the latter is true, she’s just a pit bull trained to attack by bullies.

  59. 72

    Piltdown Man spews:

    # 67: Unions can’t fire people.

    you silly retard, a union can make a members life hell if they so choose….

    but thats not the point – the point is you dont like people speaking up, in this case business owners, in support of things or people you dont like..

    you are just like every other POS OWSer progressive out there: free speech only applies if people go along with your nutty, lazy ass party bullshit.

    oh, and Im sure Wynn is gonna fire hundred or thousands of employees for voting obama….ya, keep believing that, you clueless motherfucker.

    nutballs like you believe in the silliest crap – and you have shown this over and over again with your black helicopter BS.


  60. 73

    Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

    Rachel Maddow is now going over Mitt Romney’s “flat out lying” based on what he “read in the right wing blogosphere”…

    …making him look like the total tool he is.

    Like what happened around here this morning, “a humiliating ‘gotcha’ attempt that failed in front of 50 million people” Maddow just described it Mitt’s naked lying about Jeep moving to China.

    Do you guys suppose that Cap’n Crunch’s humiliation in front of this small but august community explains his relative absence today?

  61. 74

    Puddybud spews:

    Registered Voters

    Obama 48% – 0
    Romney 48% + 1
    7-day rolling average

    Likely Voters

    Romney 51% + 1
    Obama 46% – 1
    7-day rolling average


  62. 80

    Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

    I just turned on Greta vansustern – just to see what’s going on where puddl and bob get their ‘ideas’ – and it was ALL BENGHAZI ALL THE TIME, again.

    These guys are beating that horse, trying desperately to concoct a scandal that isn’t.

    More of the fucking same.

    Sad think is, on Nov 7, when Cap’n bob evaporates away…puddl will still be here, Faux christian and insane as ever…

  63. 82

    Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

    26473624. Puddybud spews: …….

    Who fucking cares.

  64. 84


    A letter from one of the “apostles” to George Romney – that refugee from Mexico and one time recipient of “free stuff”:

    Now, don’t think I am against the Negro people, because I have several in my employ. We must understand and recognize their status and then, accordingly, provide for them. I just don’t think we can get around the Lord’s position in relation to the Negro without punishment for our acts; going contrary to that which He has revealed. The Lord will not permit His purposes to be frustrated by man.

  65. 85

    Puddybud spews:

    Nice Tumblr!

    “If Joseph Goebbels was around, he’d be very proud of the Democrat party, because they have an incredible propaganda machine.”

    “I must confess, when I see anyone with an Obama 2012 bumper sticker, I recognize them as a threat to the gene pool.”


  66. 86

    Puddybud spews:

    Concoct a scandal that isn’t?

    Ummm nope you dope dunceman… The lamestream heads up de Obummer ASS slobbering libtardo media won’t cover the story. But a small news outfit will!

  67. 87


    Former COS to Colin Powell, Retired Army Col. Lawrence Wilkerson:

    “My party is full of racists.”

    My party, unfortunately, is the bastion of those people — not all of them, but most of them — who are still basing their positions on race. Let me just be candid: My party is full of racists, and the real reason a considerable portion of my party wants President Obama out of the White House has nothing to do with the content of his character, nothing to do with his competence as commander-in-chief and president, and everything to do with the color of his skin, and that’s despicable.

    The REPUBLICAN Party…

  68. 88

    Puddybud spews:

    Puddl can be distracted by anything.

    Nope Puddy laughs at dunceman! I own the dunceman!


    Notice how nasty dunceman has become since his candidate is dropping in approval ratings? Notice how dunceman has lost his marbuls? Go back before the first debate and review dunceman comments and now view them. He’s more shrill, more acerbic, and definitely more stoooooooooooopid than ever.

  69. 89


    The Romney Plan – WAR with IRAN:

    In what appears to be a planned, pre-debate volley, the former head of the Mossad, Israel’s intelligence agency, Ephraim Halevy, granted an unusual interview. He praised Obama’s efforts against Iranian nuclear development as “brave” and referred to the crippling sanctions Obama has instituted as “a success.” In stark contrast, and in defiance of what many Israelis perceive to be Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s all-but-endorsement of Romney, Halevy said that Romney’s approach would practically shut down any possibility of a resolution to the standoff with Iran without war.

  70. 93

    Puddybud spews:

    Is Colin Powell STILL a “man of integrity”????

    Sure… he’s also misguided kissing Obummer’s ASS! One can have their integrity and be misguided!

    PWNED! Wow word cataloged every Puddy word eh arschloch ylbuttspigot? While others are working you act the fool!

    ylbitchslapped by his own crazed databaze.

  71. 95


    he’s also misguided kissing Obummer’s ASS! One can have their integrity and be misguided!

    Love your judgement call there Prof Butthead! How was this “man of integrity” “misguided”???

    Perhaps “misguided” by Larry Wilkerson, his hire, who judges your disgusting party “full of racists”?

    So miserable in your moronic bullshit.

  72. 96


    For 2012 every active commenter here is tagged – all their aliases grouped under one tag. If the commenter isn’t tagged then he/or she is “typed” – troll or hero..

    How many puddymoron comments in 2012?

    % b cs -t puddymoron -d 2012 -c
    | count |
    | 2948 |
    1 row in set

    How many ylb?

    % b cs -t ylb -d 2012 -c
    | count |
    | 2492 |
    1 row in set

    Wow! How could I have less than puddymoron who was barely freaking active until April of this year?

    % b cs -r -t puddymoron -d 2012-0[1-3] -c
    | count |
    | 1 |
    1 row in set

    No. of hero comments:

    % b hacols -f c -c type:eq~h,datetime:bw~2012 -C
    | count |
    | 23131 |
    1 row in set

    No of troll comments:

    % b hacols -f c -c type:eq~t,datetime:bw~2012 -C
    | count |
    | 8342 |
    1 row in set

    That’s about right. Troll comments have tended to be in the 30-something percentage range. And as you can see Dr. Buttface aka puddyfreakazoid accounts for a significant slice of that.

  73. 97

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    @94 I’m a hell of a lot more coherent than you are. I hate to think what you’ll be like when you’re my age.

  74. 99

    czechsaaz spews:


    Just yesterday Piddles was crowing about CBS also covering the story. (though not hyperventilating over it or spooging on their copy like Fox.)

    Try to keep consistent for 24 hours.

    Oh by the way. Thanks for quoting a NATIONAL poll. There are several that show Obama up but I don’t need to cherry pick ’cause even the dimmest of bulbs knows that we have 50 state elections and not a general. Oh, right, your bulb is a candle. Sorry.

  75. 100


    Foreign hackers broke into a state server containing taxpayer information. They got got 3.6 million Social Security Numbers and 387,000 credit card numbers.

    This must mean it’s time for more tax cuts and layoffs of state workers…

    Outsource the whole mess to some relative of Nikki Haley’s in India.

    That’ll fix it every time.

  76. 101

    czechsaaz spews:

    I’ll leave this here so Piddles might have trouble sleeping…oh who am I kidding, it’s from a left-wing site so Piddles will pretend hard statistics are biased. But someone noticed something strange about Ohio. Seems if you chart live call polls that include cell phones from Robopolls that by law do not, you can’t legally robocall a cell phone, The President has a much more substantial lead.

    Romney led in just five surveys in the weeks following that debate. Four of them were robo-polls.

    Enjoy your weekend Piddles. Without Ohio Willard can’t win. Without Ohio, Willard can win Florida, Virginia, North Carolina, New Hampshire and Colorado (not likely) AND STILL LOSE -The President can still piece together the math without Ohio through many combinations but he won’t need to.

    I hope that Gallup LV poll is comforting for you.

  77. 102

    czechsaaz spews:


    Well clearly what we need to do is keep IT and Cyber Security measures steady and build MORE BATTLESHIPS!

  78. 104

    EvergreenRailfan spews:

    57, I hope it does not get to the point for NYC that they had to do with Irene last year. The MTA had to do something they rarely do, an orderly shutdown of the entire system. That is, the NYCT Bus, NYCT Subway, MTA Bus, Metro-North Railroad, Staten Island Railway, and the Long Island Railroad. The decision they made with Irene, was made on a Friday Night, the last trains ran at noon the next day, and then it took 8 hours after that to park over 6000 subway cars, and the Coney Island Shops were out of the question too. For weeks, a couple NJT lines were not back up to full running, as some got hit by Irene. With the amount of people the MTA carries every day, it is going to be a tough decision when to make the call, but a moderator on a railfan board I post on, and lives on the east coast, said they will make the call if they have to. The tough part is, the call whether to begin the shutdown or not cannot be made until they definitely know the storm is coming towards NY. So far, weekend trackwork on the LIRR has been canceled. 39MPH is the wind speed threshold for when they would make the call for an orderly shutdown.

  79. 105

    Puddybud spews:

    Let’s first start with checkmated…

    Oh by the way. Thanks for quoting a NATIONAL poll. There are several that show Obama up but I don’t need to cherry pick ’cause even the dimmest of bulbs knows that we have 50 state elections and not a general. Oh, right, your bulb is a candle. Sorry.

    And those other polls are still over sampling DUMMOCRAPTS by +5 to +9 over Republicans and Independents.

    Next we see checkmated running to left wrong site TPM. Puddy remembers TPM… They claimed Trigg Palin was Bristol’s baby then meticulously scrubbed it from their site like Daily Kooks did with arcxix when caught holding their Anthony Weiners.

    TPM as trustworthy as a diarrhea puddle left by ylbuttspigot.

    Keep dope alive. Check mate!

  80. 106

    Puddybud spews:

    @96 The fiend is PWNED… ylbitchslapped AGAIN!

    100 attacks with the crazed databaze fiend and each an EPIC FAYLE. Remember when you were Clueless (you still are ylbuttspigot) and you claimed Puddy danced on Mike Webb’s grave… A classic… Or when you told all of us to take a fake test… Another classic… Or when you went headless lucy on Marvin Stamn and demonstrated your racist streak against North Pasadena blacks… A real classic…

    You see ylbuttspigot, your foolishness doesn’t need Puddy to create a crazed databaze to catalog your innate inbred lunacy… It’s so memorable Puddy remembers without assistance!

    See ya douche bag water fiend! ylbitchslapped AGAIN!

  81. 107

    Puddybud spews:

    I’m a hell of a lot more coherent than you are.

    Stay in that cocoon Roger SENILE Wabbit! You’ve been saying some wacky crapola lately, even for you!

  82. 108

    Czechsaaz spews:


    Right on cue, don’t trust FACTS, not opinion, FACTS cause TPM, why they once gave Sarah a sad.

    Defend the National poll as if it’s any more relevant today than yesterday. “Oversampling! Jeremiah Wright! Yaaaaargh.”

  83. 109

    Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

    I find I can get through 3 to 5 puddl posts before my eyes glaze over and my brain refuses to decode all the insults and neologisms and pet names with which he decorates his diction.

    He clearly is living in his own private Idaho, and just as clearly fancies himself some sort of conquering hero, blasting his enemies with death rays of wit and insight.

    As I’ve said before, I think the best analogy for puddl is that of a very little boy, just able to poop in the toilet by himself, who interrupts the adults in the living room, demanding they come and see what he has accomplished. A little boy deeply impaired by early-onset delusions and paranoia, of course.

  84. 111

    Roger Rabbit spews:

    I hate to break it to you, puddles, but every pro-Republican investing publication I read this weekend is conceding the election to Obama. Even Investors Business Daily, which is as rabidly rightwing as they come, has Obama decisively ahead. The zinger:

    “Among all women, Obama’s lead is now 14 points – the largest gender divide since we began polling.”

    Roger Rabbit Commentary: Note the only region Romney where leads is the South, the only age group he leads in is 45-64, the only demographic area he leads in is “rural” (the choices are urban, suburban, and rural), he trails in every educational group except “high school” in which he’s tied with Obama, and even in the “investor class” he leads by only 1 point (46%-45%).

  85. 112

    Liberal Scientist is a Dirty Fucking Socialist Hippie spews:

    What a moron!


    You make my points for me – thank you.

  86. 113

    EvergreenRailfan spews:

    Impacts for NY from Sandy. As I said before, they need time for an orderly shutdown of one of the biggest, if not the biggest, mass transit system in the country, if they have to make the call. The MTA says the decision whether to shut down due to the storm will have to be made early tomorrow, in order to have the last trains run at 7PM, so they can have everything parked safely by the time the brunt of the storm reaches the Greater NYC area.

  87. 114


    106 – The poor babbling fool has been exposed..

    Can’t handle the simple fact that’s he spends more time here than I do – even when he’s freaking gone for 3 months out of this year.

  88. 115

    EvergreenRailfan spews:

    I was looking at the MTA website, on service advisories, so far just a couple commuter rail routes, the LIRR Montauk and West Hempstead lines. Last summer, when Irene hit, the MTA suspended all service, and on the LIRR, that included removing all grade crossing arms, to prevent the hurricane from turning those into projectiles, on the Montauk Branch, they are doing that again right now, just like what crews are doing to open vent shafts on the subway. The Montauk Branch of the LIRR, on summer weekends, has a good premium service, the Hamptons Reserve, which charges a higher fare, and provides adult beverages to the clientele, and no stops after Jamaica until the Hamptons.

    Also in the news right now, there was an earthquake, 7.7 up near the Queen Charlotte Islands, and as a result, Tsunami warnings are in effect for Hawaii, and some of the first waves, small ones, are reaching Hawaii now. Now, I hope Hawaii comes through, and nobody gets hurt. I still wonder, didn’t they cut some of the funding for the Tsunami Warning Center last year, right as Hawaii was facing another Tsunami, caused by another earthquake, in Japan.

  89. 116

    Puddybud spews:

    The poor babbling fool has been exposed..

    ylbuttspigot tracks Puddy all around the world… See Friday Night Extravaganza (Comics) link. Such a babbling crazed moron lunatic fool!

  90. 117


    ylb hero ignores Dr. Buttface if only for the rare occasions comic relief is required

    like most people ignore a babbling street corner loon. I’d feel normally feel pity for such a sad sack but those bridges were burnt so long ago.