by Will, 05/30/2007, 12:39 AM

A few months ago, Goldy had Rep. Kucinich on his radio show. At the time I felt it would be wrong to speak ill of Kucinch on the blog just before he rolls into town. If I’m nothing else, I’m shameless in my loyalty to Democrats, even ones with a few screws loose.

Today, I end my silence. Here’s why:

Big score for Fox News and the CBC’s effort to legitimize Fox News with a Democratic debate.

While Barack Obama, John Edwards, Hillary Clinton, and Bill Richardson have all announced plans to skip the debate, they can console themselves with the fact that yes — Dennis Kucinich has decided to attend.

It’s actually quite hilarious how Kucinich tries to justify his validation of the right wing’s premier propaganda outlet — he’s taking his courageous stance on behalf of black folk!

What a weasel. Fox News is garbage; it’s president makes jokes comparing Barack Obama to Osama bin Laden. Dennis is all too pleased to play ball with those folks. Thankfully, the big four presidential candidates (HRC, Edwards, Richardson, and Obama himself) have skipped this debate. It’s going to be Dennis Kucinch and Joe Biden sucking up to Brit Hume for 45 minutes. Fun.

45 Responses to “Dennis Kucinich: Friends with Fox”

1. Richard Pope spews:

How can someone be President and face up to our nation’s most implacable enemies, if they cannot handle questions from a supposedly hostile TV network? What if Bush banned CBS News from his press conferences because of their alleged bias?

2. Dylan Carlson spews:

@1 How can Democrats form honest opinions about their candidates when the debate questions are all funnelled through right-wing propagandists. This debate is for Democrats, by Democrats.

3. SeattleJew spews:

Il Popa

I knew CBS and Faux ain’t no CBS. Faux is nothing less than a fjull fledged Republican party organ.

As for Kucinich, this confirms my image of the lttle man as a self centered, self serving phony. He should be targeted the way Lieberman was.

4. RightEqualsStupid spews:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18924651/

It looks like Puffybutt’s been brought to justice.

5. RightEqualsStupid spews:

Whatadick Pope – Bush might as well ban CBS. What’s the difference between deliberately lying to the press all the time and just boycotting them? Very little.

And comparing CBS to Faux News is an insult to ALL journalists. You righties think ANY news source that doesn’t act as FNC does, i.e., to repeat and report EXACTLY what the government tells them to, is bias. Get a new argument. That one didn’t work for you in the last election, along with the other standard lies.

6. RightEqualsStupid spews:

http://blatherwatch.blogs.com/talk_radio/2007/05/rush_limbaugh_h.html

Blatherwatch has a great post about the right’s favorite drug-addict, limpdick, hypocrite, Lush Flimbaugh’s relapse.

7. Puddybud Who Left The Reservation spews:

Wow Stupidman@6: That’s real evidence!

8. Puddybud Who Left The Reservation spews:

Moonbat!s: I always picked on Kucinich because I thought he was way out in left field. One of those Progressive NEW Democrat Party types. He wants to ban hand guns like Fascists did in Germany in the 30s. He’s now coming back to short left field.

9. UnImpressed spews:

Kudo’s to Kucinich.
What legitimate candidate would avoid a debate on the most widely watched News Channel??
Like it or not, Fox News is significant.
Not attending a debate shows the other candidates are DIVIDERS…not UNITERS.
Was Dan Rather a real “newscaster”?
Did R’s avoid debates on CBS?
A real, legit candidate would jump at the opportunity to debate issues & discuss his views ANYTIME, ANY PLACE.

10. Yer Killin Me spews:

1

Well, you know, Helen Thomas was banished from her chair as de facto senior member of the White House press corps because she dared to ask questions Bush’s spokesdroids didn’t want to hear. So I’d think of a different example.

11. ConservativeFirst spews:

Kucinich is way too left to be elected President in 2008. Even if I don’t agree with him, I do admire him for proudly running on his left wing credentials. Unlike Hillary (or Bill for that matter) who “triangulate” their policies to garner them the most votes.

I do find it revealing that lefties like SeattleJew want to “target” Kucininch for merely appearing on Fox News. Now that’s tolerance that shows “The Big Tent” just keeps getting bigger.

Dylan Carlson says:

@1 How can Democrats form honest opinions about their candidates when the debate questions are all funnelled through right-wing propagandists. This debate is for Democrats, by Democrats.

05/30/2007 at 1:15 am

Mabye Democrats should stop watching Fox News and the network morning shows.

http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003571876

Virtually bringing up the rear were regular watchers of Fox News. Only 1 in 3 could answer 2 out of 3 questions correctly. Fox topped only network morning show viewers.

Men scored higher than women, and older Americans did better than younger, on average. Democrats and Republicans were about equally represented in the most knowledgeable group but there were more Democrats in the least aware group.

(my emphasis)

12. RightEqualsStupid spews:

Top three things righties like ass-licker Puffybutt don’t want to talk about

1) PUBLICAN Prosecutor says Plame WAS INDEED COVERT when WHATADICK Cheney and CoverboyLover Karl Rove outed her. Makes em traitors plain and simple and makes Puffy a traitor for supporting them
2) Ron Paul is starting to be a thorn in the Publican party side. He’s out there telling the truth about REAL conservatives and the right is working overtime to shut him up while at the same time claiming to have a big tent
3) Publican corruption is so widespread that 4 out of 5 Americans say they trust Dems more to run government.

Looks like another bad year for the inbred right.

13. Libertarian spews:

I think many on this blog hate Fox News because it is not the standard far-left view of the world that permeates the traditional media. Bill O’Reilly is a pompous ass, but who would argue that Keith Obermann is NOT a pompous ass, too? Therein lies the hypocrisy with those that attack Fox News. “Anyone who does not totally agree with our world view is an inbred idiot. We are correct. We are ordained by the Supreme Being to bring Truth and Justice to the Universe. Any other view is not tolerated.” Yeah, right…

If one doesn’t like Fox News, change the channel.

14. YOS LIB BRO spews:

I think many on this blog hate Fox News because it is not the standard far-left view

NO NO NO. FAUX IS NOT NEWS. IT IS PROPAGANDA, COORDINATED WITH THE RNC!

AND WHAT THE HELL IS FAR LEFT? MARXISM? RADICAL? THIS WEBSITE IS NOT THAT AND NEITHER IS ANY OF FAUX’S COMPETITORS.

15. SeattleJew spews:

Libertarian

The differences between Oberman and Hannity/O’Reilly is that the former is on a channel where the news is balanced. Faux is 24/7 spin.

I have no issue with having more opinionated folks on the news … indeed it would be nice to see a greater diversity on the right since most of their hosts, unlike Oberman, come across
as simplistic partisans.

It would, for example, be great to see George Will or Buckley on Faux r, for that matter on CNN. How about Paul O’Neil? Surely there are intelligent Publicans left?

The current left is not much better. Oberman iis not that different from Bill Mahr. While I agree with them and see them as “balance,” I would like to see more thougth here too.

BUT, calling Faux a news channel is false. Imagine the outrage of a similar left channel appeared.

16. Andy spews:

While I agree with you that any Democrat patronizing the FOX Nutwork is a mistake, I hardly think that Kucinich will be “sucking up to Brit Hume for 45 minutes.”

Also candidates like Kucinch, who basically running as a protest vote against the DLC sellout positions on Iraq, free trade, and social justice, will take just about any exposure that they can get. They certainly can’t buy it.

17. kirk spews:

On “left-wing” Air American Thom Hartmann has right wing folks on all the time. I don’t watch Fox “news” but I don’t care if Dems want to “debate” on there. It might get some righties to think twice.
How was Leiberman targeted? He’s still got senority and had the backing of the Dem establishment, even though he’s a Repub in all but name.

18. Another TJ spews:

How can someone be President and face up to our nation’s most implacable enemies, if they capitulate to a hostile TV network?

19. Right Stuff spews:

@11 I see your mommy has given you use of her computer today..

1) PUBLICAN Prosecutor says Plame WAS INDEED COVERT when WHATADICK Cheney and CoverboyLover Karl Rove outed her. Makes em traitors plain and simple and makes Puffy a traitor for supporting them
……….Well then where are the indictments?….Better yet, Plame can’t keep her story straight….
“Ex-CIA officer called on to explain varied accounts
Senator: Plame’s versions add to ‘misinformation’
By Richard Willing USA TODAY”

2) Ron Paul is starting to be a thorn in the Publican party side. He’s out there telling the truth about REAL conservatives and the right is working overtime to shut him up while at the same time claiming to have a big tent
…..Ron Paul is not the voice of the republican party. He is a libertarian. As much as the Libs want to make him mainstream, he has no chance in 2008…. As a matter of fact, Biden or Kucinich have a better chance in 2008 than Paul.

3) Publican corruption is so widespread that 4 out of 5 Americans say they trust Dems more to run government

…….Democrat Congress 29% approval rating…… Lower than Bush.

20. David Aquarius spews:

Appearing in the debate on Fox isn’t a demonstration of courage in the face of opposition, it’s stupidity in the face of ridicule.

Fox talking heads will ask those “When did you stop beating your wife” questions just to watch Kucinich, Gravel, and Biden squirm for an answer.

It isn’t capitulation, it’s intelligence. All the nutballs at Fox want to do is throw rocks at our candidates, nothing more. It isn’t courage to stand there and let stones bounce off your skull, it’s stupidity.

Fox will use the debate as a blooper reel for all their vile programs when the subject of Democrats comes up.

Kucinich is unimportant, irrelevant, and an embarrassment. He has no base, no chance of success and no standing. People who support him still believe in Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny.

Dennis Kucinich will be president about the same time Hugh Hefner takes over Jerry Falwell’s spot at Liberty University.

21. RightEqualsStupid spews:

Hey Wrong Stuff so is your argument that it’s okay that Plame was outed because nobody’s been indicted? Are you arguing that your previous position that she wasn’t covert just doesn’t matter now that a fellow Publican – a prosecutor serving under the Pretend President Bush no less says she was covert? Are you arguing that it’s okay to risk damage to national security because a covert agent has trouble maintaining her cover while agents of her own government work against her?

As for Paul, he is NOT a member of the Libertarian party but a card-carrying Publican. Is your approach to simply lie your way through this when faced with facts that don’t support your position? And you really show how Publicans think by dismissing your fellow Publican Paul simply because he won’t win the office of President. That wasn’t my argument – i.e., that he’d win. My argument was that he presents a problem for your ilk because he’s pointing out truth that you don’t want told.

As for Congress’s approval rating, nearly half of those members are Publican, hence the low overall numbers. Bush’s numbers are as low as any recent President’s have ever been and as I said, and as you were unable to refute, Americans trust Dems more than Publicans given the high rate of Publican corruption.

But hey, congrats for trying to run the standard Publican talking points up the flagpoll. That’s more than the rest of your fellow traitors could do.

Must suck to be a righties these days huh Wrong Stuff.

22. Right Stuff spews:

SeattleJew says:

Libertarian

The differences between Oberman and Hannity/O’Reilly is that the former is on a channel where the news is balanced. Faux is 24/7 spin.

HOOOO-HOOOO, HA-HA, HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA, OHHHHHHH OH OH OH, HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR

IT’S OLBERMANN BY THE WAY, AND MSNBC BALANCED???

HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR
HOO HOO

THANKS FOR THE LAUGH………

The other difference is that nobody watches Olbermann. O’Reilly and Hannity&Colmes eclipse all other cable news channels combined in ratings/viewership.

“BUT, calling Faux a news channel is false. Imagine the outrage of a similar left channel appeared. ”

you must have missed the memo….
They are called CNN, CNN/HN, CNBC, & MSNBC.

23. Roger Rabbit spews:

@1 How can Bush ban CBS from his press conferences, when he doesn’t hold press conferences? He’s banned everyone because he doesn’t want to answer any questions. I wouldn’t answer questions, either, if I was George W. Bush or Meyer Lansky or …

24. John425 spews:

Leave it to the DNC to marginalize the Congressional Black Caucus. Democrat anti-Semitism is out in the open- and now so is it’s racism.

25. RightEqualsStupid spews:

See Robert Greenwald’s excellent documentary OUTFOXED if you want to know the truth about the Faux News Channel. I put copies in every Pierce County Library so you can get one there.

26. Broadway Joe spews:

I just love troll logic…….

“You can tell the same lie a thousand times, but it never gets any more true.”

from the song “Redneck”, by Lamb of God

Y’know, anyone with an IQ of more than say, 5, can tell that Faux Noise isn’t conservative, it’s Republican. When was the last time you saw any INTELLIGENT conservative, like say, Andrew Sullivan on Faux Noise? Bill Maher and MSNBC give him more air time in any given month than Faux Noise ever has.

RIP GOP

PS: Kucinich, Biden and Gravel are IRRELEVANT. That’s why Faux Noise needs them, and they need Faux Noise. To perpetuate the stereotype that Democrats are irrelevant.

27. ArtFart spews:

John Dean has ventured that by the skewed political yardstick foisted off by the neocons, both he and Barry Goldwater would qualify as liberals, if not as leftists. I personally couldn’t agree with him more.

28. IMPEACH GONZO spews:

@1 “MSNBC BALANCED???”

Yes. MSNBC is news; Fox is propaganda. Glad you asked; it’s time we straightened that out. Next.

29. uptown spews:

Is this the same Kucinich who didn’t believe in the womens’s right to choose; until he decided to run for President?
Kucinich is a middle of the roader who picks issues like gun control to make it seem like he’s a lefty.

31. Puddybud Who Left The Reservation spews:

Stupidman: I say again. If ANYONE “outed” Val Plame, you need to pick on Richard Armitage. You know friend of Maddy NotAllThatBright, friend of the lefty loonies, Moonbat! all the way. He was the first to “out” Val Plame as you say!

If wasn’t Karl Rove or Dick Cheney, it was Richard Armitage, and he said so!

32. RightEqualsStupid spews:

But wait Puffybutt you said she wasn’t covert. Are you trying to gloss over that lie?

33. RightEqualsStupid spews:

All the evidence points to WHATADICK Cheney as the villlian here – that’s why they sent Scooter up to take the fall – so we couldn’t impeach that draft-dodging traitor Cheney.

34. jsa on commercial drive spews:

Outfoxed is also available in its entirety on the Google:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6737097743434902428&q=outfoxed

I found it a little alarming, but that’s me.

I will ask people who are harping about bias this.

I measure things all day. I have to measure temperatures, bandwidth usage. I get to measure how CPUs are being utilized. I get to measure memory usage. I get to measure lengths, I get to measure how long it takes for a given job to run on a distributed network, and with that information, I get to deliver estimates of how long it will take for a similar job that might run in the future will take.

A huge part of my job is measuring things. I am fortunate, in that I generally work with nice, simple easy to quantify things. 500 megabytes per second is measurable and quantifiable. 20 meters is always the same. 20 minutes of CPU time will be constant given your CPUs are the same. When you speed them up, slow them down, or change the architecture, this adds a fudge factor that can generally be estimated pretty closely by running benchmarks.

So anyhow, what I am wondering is how do you quantify political bias? I’ve seen several people try by counting number of liberal guests vs conservative guests, but I don’t know how to identify liberals or conservatives. I don’t con sider myself to be particularly liberal, but I’ve been assured many times on this blog that I am.

If anyone has some guidance as to how a poor quantization geek can find some metrics for political bias, I’d like it if you sent them my way. Right now, I’m stumped, and I still only trust Pacifica as the only fair and balanced news source in the whole Republic.

35. David Sucher spews:

So by the same reasoning you would agree that Bush is correct not to talk with, say, Syria because we don’t like their policies?

36. Will spews:

@ 35

Uh, no. Big difference between the two.

37. R's are evil, D's are pussies spews:

Didn’t Kucinich vote against the war, and continues to do so?

Doesn’t Maria Cantwell vote for the war at every opportunity?

But, according to you, Will, Dennis…bad, Maria….good.

I guess our President doesn’t have the patent on screwy logic.

38. A spews:

If Fox is not legit, than what about NPR, PBS, NBC and CBS? They, in particular NPR and PBS, are unashamedly leftist outlets and yet Republicans don’t mind appearing on their programs.

Oh wait, Republicans favor freedom of the press (no matter how crazy the press is) while leftists (just as today’s Chavez wonderfully demonstrates) believe in controlling the media. The truth is, there is nothing liberal or free about the left.

39. SeattleJew spews:

Gsh A, if NPR. PBS, NBC, and CBS leftist, what would you do if Amerika were to spout a European style media.

I have a small favor to ask.

First, please go to the door of your room and close it.

OK?

Tx.

Now, let me tell you a secret …

France, Germany, Italy, even Britain have …f, f,f, functional COMMUNIST parties!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What??? You did not know???? What about them Canucks??? soshalized medicne and free edjucation!!!!!!

How come you din know this? Must be them left media keeping all this secret! Gad.

40. outfoxed spews:

It’s very possible that Kucinich is not aware how most people feel about Fox. Their “popularity” (or infamy) has been greatly exagerated imo, cause if I base myself just on the comments their videos recieve on blogs, video networking sites like youtube, it would appear that people cannot stand Fox.

It’s a network that is out to divide Americans and put them at odds with each other, so Rupert Murdoch can quietly continue his racket of the country’s airwaves.

41. David Sucher spews:

Maybe some folks are focussing too much on FOX the network rather than the audience one can reach by appearing on and using FOX. Now I wouldn’t go on FOX because I lack the verbal swiftness to take on the pros there. But another pro like Colbert? or Bill Clinton? Easy-squeeezee. The only issue I’d have with Kucinich going on is whether he is a sharp and strong speaker in that sort of context.

Yes confusing FOX with its audience well may be the issue and if so then I say “Condemn the network if you like but not its audience.”

42. righton spews:

ok, i’m late to the party. Yeah fox leans right, but no more than the big 3 lean left. Ever watch Katie rip into Bush 1, or slant the news their way?

you guys just squawking cuz we have some equal time

43. John Barelli spews:

Yes, righton, I’ve seen news reporters report news that was unfavorable to the Republicans during Republican administrations.

And I’ve seen them report news that was unfavorable to the Democrats during Democratic administrations.

It might have something to do with the fact that the people in power are making more of the news than the people out of power are making.

Frankly, in the run up to the Iraq war, all of the major networks were acting like cheerleaders for the Bush administration. It was difficult to find anyone asking hard questions. They chose to believe that the President of the United States would not willfully and blatantly lie.

Since they had their noses rubbed in the fact that they were used, they’ve started “turning over the rocks” in the Bush administration.

Now, if the Bush administration was simply mistaken, but basically honest, this would have been an inconvenience, but little more. There would have been very little to find, despite all the looking.

Oops. It turns out that every time a reporter looked into almost anything that the Republicans had any contact with, there was either a crime or a scandal (or both) attached. There were lots of things to find, and the reporters, feeling that their trust had been abused, went all out to find everything.

Remember back in American History class, where we learned about the Grant administration and how it might be considered to be the most corrupt administration in history?

They’ve been reduced to a footnote, and while historians generally think that President Grant was probably inept and unaware, but basically honest, President Bush will probably be considered to be a big part of the corruption.

He lied to the reporters and got them to lie to us. So sorry if you don’t think those same reporters are giving him a fair shake after that.

44. SeattleDan spews:

Will, I do think you protest too much.

45. Ruth spews:

This is about respect for the Congressional Black Caucus and its ability to make its own decisions. The CBC has chosen to educate a new audience. Clearly, they have that right. Those who watch Fox have as much right to be educated as the Republicans who watch CNN (another Republican station). The CBC is correct. Fox could be the loser after this debate.

Kucinich is clearly the candidate most closely in touch with Black America as his record shows. He is continuing to be the Black Candidate (as the “Black Agenda Report” has called him) by standing with the Congressional Black Caucus on the issue of this debate. Obama, Edwards and Clinton have snubbed Black America. They may find Black America snubbing them at the polls.