Now that’s rich… the Seattle Times editorial board advising organized labor on what’s good for workers and the Democratic Party.
THE revolt of organized labor within the state Democratic Party is a kamikaze effort that works against the interests of the Democratic Party and the workers of Washington.
Yeah, because nobody has the interests of organized labor more at heart than Frank Blethen and his union-busting editors. And nobody is a bigger supporter of the Democratic Party than the Bush/Rossi/McGavick/Reichert/Hutchison endorsing Times.
That’s kinda like an ice axe advising Leon Trotsky on personal security.
The Washington State Labor Council and its allies don’t get this. They have their heads in the world of John L. Lewis and Dave Beck, and it is to the peril of the workers they represent.
We saw the same attitude in the International Association of Machinists’ negotiation with Boeing. The union made its demands, and it lost an airplane assembly line to a nonunion plant in South Carolina. It then held a news conference to announce that the loss was not its fault.
To which, really, the only rational and reasonable response is… FUCK YOU!
Do the Times’ editors bother to even read their own business columnist, the excellent Jon Talton? Do they really believe that cheerleading Boeing’s race-to-the-bottom decision to move thousands of jobs out of state is going to endear the Times to local readers?
If you’re ever confused about how to access the SOV lanes to and from Mercer Island, you might want to turn to the Times’ editors for advice. But when it comes to what’s good for workers and the Democratic Party… not so much.
the only rational and reasonable response is… FUCK YOU!
I second that. What they really fear is a return to the world of Harry Bridges, Anna Louise Strong, and Gene Debs. Bring it on.
Goldy
Leaving the Seattle Times aside, I strongly disagree with you about WASTATE labor.
“Labor” in Europe and Canada is not just a set of self interested Unions, it is a movement. American labor is rarely able to come together.
Let me give you one of my favorite examples … the NEA. The Teacher Unions dio what democracy dictates THEY should do … theyt advocate for THEIR members. The result is an “education” lobby that promotes increases in pay for a poorly educated teacher corps and opposes educational reforms of the kind Arnie Duncan is now pursuing.
This is inevitable in any democratic organization but in Europe, “labor” can take a larger view and conivnce their teachers to work with, for example, the auto workers, to promote educational policies good for ALL workers.
The same dismal picture of the US left is contaminating the health care debate. Among the saddest parts of thsi season of reform has been listening to a Boeing machinist rail AGAINST Obamacare because of the threat that health care might no longer be the business of the Lazy B.
The Radical Reaganite Right beat the pants off of our side by creating a coalition of money, God, and country, Within their coalition the Repricans enforced (and still do) party discipline.
The contrast of rightie discipline with the chaos of the liberal coalition is obvious.
You know I am an Obamite. However, I did not like the top down structure of the 08 cmapaign and worried about Obama’s ability to create a local machine. That worry is all to real now here in WASTATE.
@1….great, just what we need – a bunch of communists and socialists…can the gulags be far behind?
This crime scene is easy to analyze. Wherever you find a diatribe against estate taxes or unions, you’re sure to find Frank Blethen’s personal fingerprints.
They got one thing right, though:
“They have their heads in the world of John L. Lewis and Dave Beck”
Exactly! John L. Lewis and Dave Beck are exactly what the labor movement needs! Even a troglodyte like F.B. instinctively understands that. After all, as a union-hating capitalist and worker-baiting employer, Frank knows what it takes to bring bosses like him around: Strikes, boycotts, picket lines, bad publicity, demonstrations, etc.
Unfortunately, those immortal champions of the working class are no longer with us. But Andy Stern of the SEIU is putting on a pretty good show of what a labor leader and a union should look like. Workers need more, not less, like him.
Of course, if you don’t work, you don’t need a union. People who don’t work have no boss problems. For example, even if the newspaper business completely implodes, the public’s thirst for news won’t go away and there’ll still be demand for journalists. They won’t work for newspapers, that’s all. More and more journalists will become self-employed entrepreneurs who will find new business models for gathering and disseminating news.
Contrary to the natterings of the shrieking monkey crowd, I’m a capitalist through and through. I think everyone should be capitalists, right down to waitresses and janitors! Why would you want to be a minimum-wage waitress working for some asshole boss when you can own your own hospitality consulting business, deal with restaurant owners as an equal, and charge your restaurant clients B2B rates for your expertise? Same goes for janitors; every janitor job should be replaced by an independent building sanitation consultant who, like hospitality consultants, charges his building owner clients B2B rates. This way, no one will pay any taxes, and everyone will be a millionaire!
@2 I don’t fault the teachers union for wanting to be paid as much as they can get. But I do fault our spineless legislators for taking money away from state workers as punishment for not striking and giving it to teachers as reward for striking. Then, after beating this message into state workers for 40 years, legislators were shocked — SHOCKED! I tell you! — when, a few years ago, state workers walked off their jobs when the legislature stuck it to them again.
@3 The gulags are already here. They simply have a different name, that’s all. Here in America, we call them “workplaces.”
@8
Tee-hee-hee…
@3
Keep up the good work. Every time your side launches a hate fill over exaggeration it sends a person to our side.
Yes, those 8th graderzs on mommy’s computer are clearly an asset. AssET? Well…..
Seems to me, Unions are not the fundamental critical lynch pin that make or break a company, it’s management decisions. The decisions to outsource the 787 or cars people don’t want, or toxic financial directives that almost took down the world economy, is not the fault of the workers in a vacuum.
But they are a great source of mis direction.
Usuall it is “Natzi” or “Hitler” that signals an end to meaningful debate of opinions expressed as facts, in the case of the Seattle Times it is “Jack Welch”.
The under/over on somebody calling “Jack Welch” is 32 posts (this one does not count).
@13 What meaningful debate? There isn’t any. The right withdrew from public debate years ago. They’re eliminationists now.
@14, yes, but we keep pretending that what they say matters. Until we stop pretending, the under/over is still 32, these three posts do not count.
I accept that by saying “Jack Welch” I have influence the outcome, like attempting to observe an electron spinning, or a Republican spinning in a chair, just paying attention could cause either to flip upside down.
The company is supposed to maximize profits, to make as much money as possible, but the worker, is NOT supposed to maximize his profits, the work is supposed, willing, work for less and less, so the corporation can maintain profits? Can you see the disconnect there?
Conservatives, can you explain to me why greed for corporations is good but greed for workers and unions is bad?
BTW, The Seattle Times editorial flat misses the point, the unions are supporting candidates that are not supporting their issues, and in a free market they have the right to support candidates that do.
Is it irony, or hypocracy, on the part of the free market promoting Seattle Times, that they are not supporting the fee market move by the unions?
I say both.
I imagine the Times will not editorialize about who the Master Builders fund, how driving this state into attempting to compete with Elbonia on low wages is a collective loser for the state.
What’s even more amazing is that all the talking heads claimed that it was the union and the state that forced Boeing to open their second 787 assembly line in SC. But just two weeks ago, a Boeing VP told Renton business leaders that Boeing was committed to 737 production in Renton until at least 2020. Did the union just abandon their collective bargaining rights in Renton? No, then that puts a lie to the assertion that Washington is bad for business.
@18, everybody knows that порно mean porno.
Hey, where did the Russian porn spam go?
That would have filtered off tons of Republicans.
@2 Rabbit
I did not say I blame the teachers.
For unions to function there has to be a creative tension between the union nad the employer.
In this case the employer does not have the leadership it (we) need to stand up to the union on issues OTHER than salary.
Do Companies Exist to Make Profits???
I am not convinced this is any longer true.
Companies exist
1. to benefit over paid managers whose pay is poorly tied to profit.
2. to increase stock price a parameter also poorly tied to profits.
3. to provide financial benefit to the stockholders who have controlling interests. In today’s system these folks may often comprise a small part of the total ownership.
@10….its the facts – and just because you dont like them, you have to throw the “hate” label out there….do a little research on the 3 names listed and then tell me they arent socialists and communists…hell, they PROMOTED it.
@3, @23
Huh? You say “communism” and “socialism” like they are BAD things.
Hell I’d love for the US to be more of a democratic socialist country like Denmark, Finland, The Netherlands, Norway, or Sweden.
Boeing said something interesting about the 737, that it most likely will be in production into the 2020s, but sometime in the next decade a decision on if and where to build a replacement for it. What sounds re-assuring is, they said after building 6000 737s, they are good at it. Although the 737 is produced at other sites now and put together in Renton. It has worked for 40 years, maybe not worth relocating that line yet. ALthough the replacement might be in SC though, although things can change in the next decade or two.
http://www.seattlepi.com/sound.....92097.html
Turns out, they have not been able to scale down the 787 to 737-size, yet. Apparently, still is better to make it out of aluminum instead of the space age stuff the 787 is made out of. Some 787 technology is going into the next-generation 747 though. Hard to believe that both the 737 and 747 have been around for 40 years, and two different aircraft programs that followed have either ceased production, or are about to.
@25
I half expect Boeing to announce the 737 replacement will be built in China or Vietnam. SC is just a pit stop before moving everything overseas.
The only real “good news” is that it is very expensive to move an aircraft production line once it is set up. Therefore the 737, 747, and 777 will continue to be built in Renton and Everett. The Everett 787 line will stick around at least as long as there is more demand than the SC line can handle, though what happens once the backorder is gone is an open question.
I am not sure if Boeing will be able to compete in the 737 class with a replacement. They will have competition, not just from Airbus, but from China. There is also the case of Embraer of Brazil and Canada’s Bombardier. Bombardier is moving up into the low-end 737 range, they keep waivering, but it looks like this time the CSeries as it is called, is a go. Probably because the CRJ series is going to have too much competition, and need diversity. The CRJ is probably in the region where High Speed Rail can steal a lot of passengers from, but Bombardier is not going to pull a GM to cut out the competition. They also own rail-assembly assets and they are making them a lot of money. They did a better job of diversifing into other industries than Boeing. Boeing tried to build an LRV for San Francisco and Boston, those were the only takers. They had some L cars fro Chicago as well. They pretty much started with a clean sheet. Bombardier started out in the snowmobile business, they bought over the years other assets, in railroading, the Montreal Locomotive Works(which built ALCO products in Canada), and a few other Canadian rail assets, and in aviation, they bought Canadair and De Haviland Canada(ironically, from Boeing), and also own Learjet. When they diversified into other industries, Bombardier did not go clean sheet, they bought companies with the experience, and put it to good work.
Bombardier CSeries
http://www.bombardier.com/en/a.....0d800091e6