This Tea Party?

Speaking of going negative, Rep. Rick Larsen has a very effective web video up bashing is opponent, John Koster, for his lavish praise of the Tea Party. “The Tea Party Movement, the Patriot Movement to me is one of the most exciting things to happen to this country for a long time,” the video opens with Koster pronouncing, before proceeding to illustrate the teabaggers’ legacy of racism, stupidity, hate.

Just as disturbing is Koster’s praise of “the Patriot Movement,” long known for its white supremacist and anti-semitic rhetoric, and its close ties to the right-wing militia movement. Either Koster doesn’t really know what the Patriot Movement is, or more frightening… he does.

Comments

  1. 1

    Zotz sez: Puddybud is just another word for arschloch spews:

    Reposted from Open Thread.

    Larsen has data to support his ad’s intended effect.

    According to National Journal/Pew, by significant margins, voters like bacon and are less likely to vote for candidates associated with the Teahadists or Sarah Palin, here:

    http://congressionalconnection.....es-who.php

    And BTW, real patriots never refer to themselves as a patriot.

  2. 2

    rhp6033 spews:

    It wasn’t that long ago that politicians could meet with a lot of small groups, crafting their message to appeal specifically to that group. Consistency wasn’t a requirement. They could say one thing to one group, and give an entirely different message to another group. They could espouse extremist views to their “base”, and present a “moderate” base to the general electorate.

    But that hasn’t been true in, well, the last decade. Video cameras, or even cell phone videos, are present in just about every gathering. YouTube allows easy publication of a politician’s ramblings. The traditional media, which used to ignore such behavior among politicians it favored, is no longer the dominant news source for political news.

    You would have thought politicians would have caught on to that by now. But Reichart, Rossi, and others (such as Koster) just haven’t kept up with the times.

  3. 3

    Zotz sez: Puddybud is just another word for arschloch spews:

    Soon to be former Rep Bob Inglis (R-SC) talking about the Teahadists who defeated him in a recent primary:

    …’They say, ‘Bob, what don’t you get? Barack Obama is a socialist, communist Marxist who wants to destroy the American economy so he can take over as dictator. Health care is part of that. And he wants to open up the Mexican border and turn [the US] into a Muslim nation.’” Inglis didn’t know how to respond.

    As he tells this story, the veteran lawmaker is sitting in his congressional office, which he will have to vacate in a few months. On June 22, he was defeated in the primary runoff by Spartanburg County 7th Circuit Solicitor Trey Gowdy, who had assailed Inglis for supposedly straying from his conservative roots…

    [snip]

    “…I sat down, and they said on the back of your Social Security card, there’s a number. That number indicates the bank that bought you when you were born based on a projection of your life’s earnings, and you are collateral. We are all collateral for the banks. I have this look like, “What the heck are you talking about?” I’m trying to hide that look and look clueless. I figured clueless was better than argumentative. So they said, “You don’t know this?! You are a member of Congress, and you don’t know this?!” And I said, “Please forgive me. I’m just ignorant of these things.” And then of course, it turned into something about the Federal Reserve and the Bilderbergers and all that stuff. And now you have the feeling of anti-Semitism here coming in, mixing in.

    Here: http://motherjones.com/politic.....y-casualty

    Zotz comment:

    See the article for advice Boehner gave to Inglis about pandering to the Teahadists (“…you don’t know the half of it…”).

    The Ds, including Larsen, “punch the hippies” once in a while to burnish their cred for election purposes. But I bet they’re really thankful they don’t have to pander to these wackjobs. The commercials write themselves don’t they?

  4. 4

    Politically Incorrect spews:

    The Republican Party is NOT the friend of the Tea Party Movement. The Republicans wan to dominate the Tea Party to achive thier goal of ever-more meddling in foreign countries (particularly those wiht oil reserves) and expanding the military-industrial complex.

  5. 5

    Steve spews:

    @3 This was a good one. If it wasn’t for the damage they’d cause, I’d vote for teabaggers just for the entertainment value.

    With Boehner and others chasing after the tea party, he says, “that’s going to be the dog that catches the car.” He quickly adds: “And the Democrats, if they go into the minority, are going to have an enjoyable couple of years watching that dog deal with the car it’s caught.”

  6. 6

    Zotz sez: Puddybud is just another word for arschloch spews:

    @4: True, in the sense that the Rs are not the friends of anyone but the top 2%.

    But, the Teahadists are most of what’s left of the R base.

    It’s also important to note that there would be no significant Tea_whatever without support, organizational / financial / otherwise, from the R establishment. Pretty much any rock you turn over in Tea Land, out scurries a Dick Armey or a Karl Rove or some other R hack.

  7. 8

    Daddy Love spews:

    The Republican Party is NOT the friend of the Tea Party Movement.

    The Republican Party IS the teabagger movement. They are one and the same thing.

  8. 10

    Maz spews:

    From Publicola today – file under “hell yeah!”

    3. The anonymous local liberal blogger, General J.C. Christian, who writes the spoof blog Jesus’ General , is trying to organize people to show up at the planned September 12th Tea Party rallies to burn confederate flags.

    “I think that it would start a great conversation about race and about how it’s being used for political gain right now,” the General J.C. told Talking Points Memo. “I can imagine people showing up at the tea parties, which I’ll do at my local one, and the tea party backers will start explaining why [the flag] is about state’s rights, not slavery, and all that and basically hang themselves.”

  9. 11

    The Riddle of Steel spews:

    Interesting, the only people I hear bringing race into the discussion are the progressives…why is that?

    not sure how they get from fiscal responsibility and small govt to race…but anyways….

  10. 12

    spews:

    Riddle: they are desperate and know that on the issues — since they are in power and people are pissed at the people in power — they will lose.

    So they use any tools at their disposal, including race-baiting, lies, and all manner of deceptions and sleights of hand.

    The Larsen ad in particular was one big deception from beginning to end, except for the part about oil drilling, which is funny since Koster is on the side of most Americans, most of the 2nd CD, and Obama, on that issue. Oh yeah, and Larsen is the only candidate in the race to get money from an oil company: and it just so happened to be BP.

    Framing the Tea Party racists? A lie. Trying to link Koster to racism? A lie.

    That confederate flag? It was not at a Koster parade float at all (it was the county GOP), AND the flag was part of a larger presentation about historical flags (about two dozen of them), and not being promoted as anything but a part of history. So that was a lie too. Actually, two lies: that the flag was being promoted, and that it was at Koster’s parade float.

    The quote about slavery? The guy who made it was talking about the New Testament. So that was a lie too.

    Hell, even the notion that Rick Larsen thinks the Tea Party is a bunch of bad people is a lie: Larsen has gone to Tea Party candidate events, which he wouldn’t have done if he thought of the Tea Party the way this video presents it.

    This video is really funny, and it won’t help him.

  11. 13

    Steve spews:

    @12 Only seven “lie” and “lies”. The record for you is fifteen in one comment. Try again, and no more of this lame, half-hearted shit.

  12. 15

    Puddybud identifies zotz as another arschloch and a as a dumb brick spews:

    Larsen’s video kind of reminds Puddy of Odumba’s poll ratings before The View visit 44%, after The View visit, 41%. And it wasn’t Rasmussen. Doubt it will help Larsen. Just lump him jackbooting lockstep voting with Nancy Stretch Pelosi!

  13. 16

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    putz @12 on 08/03/2010 at 4:21 pm informed us:

    That confederate flag? It was not at a Koster parade float at all (it was the county GOP), AND the flag was part of a larger presentation about historical flags (about two dozen of them), and not being promoted as anything but a part of history.

    It is nice to know pudge knows that today’s Republican party in Snohomish is so interested in the history of flags.

    Who are you going to believe? Pudge? Or your lying eyes?

  14. 17

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    As the 39th District Chair of the Snohomish County Republican Party, pudge and the base of supporters Koster were trying to send a message marching down the street with the Rebel Flag. What was that message? Pudge tells us it was a history lesson.

    A simple read at Wikipedia tells us:
    The display of the Confederate flag remains a highly controversial and emotional topic, generally because of disagreement over its symbolism.

    Some groups use the Southern Cross as one of the symbols associated with their organizations, including racist groups such as the Neo-Nazis and the Ku Klux Klan. The flag is also sometimes used by separatist organizations such as the Aryan Nations.

    Despite what anybody can find out, and most people know, the Snohomish County Republican party would like you to believe now that it’s marching down our streets with this banner of racism and secession was some sort of history lesson – as if the solution to letting thousands of teachers being furloughed across the nation is Republicans marching parties.

    And you know, all the current hullabaloo of senate Republicans wanting to modify the 14th amendment to the constitution, the Texas teabagging governor talking about secession, the Tennessee Republican gubernatorial candidate Rep. Zach Wampwell talking about ssecession, well the Koster base marching with the Dixie flag is just a coincidence.

  15. 18

    spews:

    MikeBullShit:

    It is nice to know pudge knows that today’s Republican party in Snohomish is so interested in the history of flags. Who are you going to believe? Pudge? Or your lying eyes?

    You think I am lying? Hugh Fleet. Republican candidate for 38th LD. He does presentations with his historical flags.

    I’ve seen his presentation: it’s excellent.

    As usual, you’re not only full of crap, but it’s also so incredibly easy to prove it.

    Oh, and what’s that, on that slideshow at the votefleet.org web site? A picture of Rick Larsen AT THE FLAG PRESENTATION! LOL.

    all the current hullabaloo of senate Republicans wanting to modify the 14th amendment to the constitution

    Shrug. It’s a well-understood (by people who can read) historical fact that the 14th Amendment was never intended to grant citizenship to everyone born in the borders of the U.S.: that is why there is the clause “subject to the jurisdiction thereof.” I can understand, and am not offended by, attempts to make this more clear.

    That said, I am personally against it. It’s become a part of our history and I am unconvinced that “anchor babies” are a serious problem contributing significantly to our problems with immigration, the economy, and border violence.

    But to frame it as “crazy” for trying to get back to the original intent of the words of the Constitution makes you look stupid. As usual. Just like when you falsely imply that Rick Perry spoke in favor of recession.

  16. 19

    Steve spews:

    @18 The flag has historical significance, but it has also long been the flag of racists and a powerful symbol of centuries of oppression for millions of Americans. There’s no escaping it, and any discussion or display of the stars and bars should acknowledge this fact, which you don’t. Where are your sensitivities? Can you possibly be in denial over the fact that the flag has been so despicably waved at tea party events before this one took place? Search YouTube for yourself and get over it. When this flag was held high at this event, it doesn’t matter what other historical flag were there. When you’re waving a symbol of hate, show some damned sensitivity. And if you don’t like Goldy’s post and the effectiveness of that commercial, then blame yourself for your utter lack of sensitivity, and your failure to confront the racist elements in the Republican party as well as Dick Armey’s faux-grassroots rebranding effort called the Tea Party.

  17. 20

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    @18 on 08/04/2010 at 7:26 am pudge, the 39th District Chair of the Snohomish County Republican Party asks:

    “You think I am lying?”

    While I am flattered you are asking what I am thinking, whatever I am thinking is irrelevant to the topic.

    Let’s examine what you have provided, and determine whether or not it is in fact true, and if it is not feel free to come back and explain why.

    From the site you provided @18

    Veterans Day Presentation
    Sunday, 20 September 2009 10:34
    “I have a passion, because of my love of country, which has kept my interest in giving American heritage flag presentations for the passed 25 years to hundreds of schools and numerous organizations. By using my historical American flags I tell our American story by giving short histories of each flag in my presentations.”

    1. Larsen’s advertisement is clearly not the Veterans’ Day Presentation of September 2009.
    2. The Confederate Flag is not part of Hugh Fleet’s presentation on his site.
    3. The Confederate Flag (sometimes used by separatist organizations such as the Aryan Nations) was never an American flag.
    4. Larsen’s ad clearly shows a parade, not a school or organization presentation.

    While it should be expected of any 2nd rate propagandist with delusions of grandeur to obfuscate (which you do by conflating a Veterans’ Day presentation with a completely separate Republican parade where Republicans proudly march with the flag of secessionists and historic symbol of racism), I am sure the folks over at the Larsen campaign are thankful for your bumping their view count by posting up his ad.

    And for a laugh (at pudge’s expense), I point you to the sloppy stupidity in the last sentence of pudge’s comment @18 which is the trademark of pudge:

    “Just like when you falsely imply that Rick Perry spoke in favor of recession.”

    Recession? Huh???

    Could it be that pudge doesn’t know how to read? Cut and paste? Or maybe he is just delusional?

  18. 21

    Steve spews:

    “Recession? Huh???”

    heh- Even if you Google “Rick Perry recession”, it has at the top of the page,

    Did you mean: rick perry secession

    Geez, I wonder why?

  19. 22

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    @21 Steve 08/04/2010 at 11:45 am,

    I’m posting for pudgecicle in advance. He is obviously busy being deluded elsewhere at the moment. I think I’ve caught the spirit of a pudge retort. You decide.

    You think I’m lying?
    False.
    Blah, blah, blah you lying liar.
    Yack, yack, yack you lying liar.
    Irrelevant subject, yackity yack you liar

  20. 23

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    Re 21

    To be fair (I know, partisans of left or right are uninterested in fair play, but just for laughs) I’ve heard Texan politicians ranting about secession off and on as long as I can remember. While it hasn’t been a continuous thread in Texan politics it certainly isn’t new.

    The fear that the left has of Tea Party movements is interesting. Why, if as you constantly proclaim the movement is ‘astroturf’ and lacking in popular significance, does it get so much attention from you folks.

    Ask yourself-

    Obama is a very unpopular president, seen as holding extreme political views. Reid is barely ahead of a far right (not to say nutty) candidate in Nevada. All over the country democrats are in trouble.

    Do you really think America approves of the progressive vision for our country? Really?

  21. 24

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    I’ve heard Texan politicians ranting about secession off and on as long as I can remember.

    And I’ve read your unsupported straw-man analogies as long as you have commented on HA.

    IF there are so many Texas politicians ranting about succession, as you claim, we look forward to your providing 3 cited examples.

    Do you really think America approves of the progressive vision for our country? Really?

    Interesting question.
    All I know is that the “progressive vision” won the last 2 elections,
    and that voters are less likely to vote for a candidate who supports the teabaggers.

  22. 25

    rhp6033 spews:

    I saw a mugshot photo recently where the suspect had a big tattoo of the U.S. Marines raising the flag on Mt. Surabachi at Iwo Jima. But instead of the U.S. flag, the tattoo substituted the a modern version of the Confederate Battle Flag.

    I can’t even imagine how many people would find that offensive. The guy probably shouldn’t attend any reunions of WWII G.I.s where he takes off his shirt, he might get shot by one of them – even those from the South.

    Historical Note:

    The “Rebel Flag” was never a national flag of the Confederacy, or even of it’s army.

    The “Stars and Bars” reference applies to the original national flags – two red strips intersected by a white stripe, with a blue union in the corner with stars for each state. There were four versions of this flag as states were added, ending with thirteen states (which was a bit of hopeful thinking on their part).

    But there were problems on the battlefield. From a distance, with little breeze and lots of black-powder smoke, it was impossible to tell the Stars and Bars from the U.S. flag. During the first Battle of Mannassas, there were numerous instances of friendly-fire or failure to fire upon enemy units. The lack of uniformity in uniforms on both sides added to the confusion.

    To avoid this confusion, by November 1861 the Army of Northern Virginia adopted a square flag with a red field, upon which was imposed a blue cross of St. Andrew (diagonal), trimmed in white, with eleven (later thirteen) stars inside the cross. This is commonly referred to as the Confederate Battle Flag or the Virginia Battle Flag. Although it was originally designed to be rectangular, Gen. Joseph Johnston ordered that it be square, due to the shortage of fabric.

    The second attempt at a national flag in May 1863 incorporated the square Confederate Battle Flag as the union upon an all-white field, which was later described as the “Stainless Banner”. This avoided confusion with the U.S. flag, but it made it look like a flag of surrender or parley. Army commanders also pointed out that it was virtually impossible to keep it white, it was hardly “stainless” in the field.

    The final Confederate flag responded to these complaints by adding a broad verticle red bar to the end of the flag, which became known as the “Blood-Stained Banner”. But it wasn’t adopted until March of 1865, and the Confederacy had only about a month of life left in it.

    The rectangular version of the Confederate Battle Flag made it’s appearance in the late 1950′s and 1960′s as an expression of southern resistance to civil rights legislation. This also roughly corresponded with the centenial of the Civil War. As I mentioned before, the rectangular version was never used by the Confederates, except as a navy jack (1863-65).

  23. 26

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    Try to follow this like a laser Mike-

    First, a thing being on the internet is not the sole qualifier of its reality. I’m guessing from your posts that you’re a young man. Before the internet we had these things called magazines, newspapers and books. Believe me or not, that’s your business, but I don’t propose to pander to your belief that only those things preceded by ‘www’ are true. In fact the opposite is more often the case. Something being posted on the internet immediately makes me suspicious of its’ validity.

    I don’t think Sharon Angle was a good choice for the conservative voters of Nevada. Her opponent would handily have beaten Reid and rid the Senate of a pestiferous and persnickity proponent of poor public policy. (Try saying that 3 times quickly!)

    In 2010 Republicans have a chance to slow the ship before it hits the iceberg. (some marine architects theorize that had Titanic rammed that fatal iceberg bow-on while running her engines full astern rather than attempting a turn at 3/4 speed she would not have sunk. True whether I can cite it from a website or not.) But they seem to be ignoring the tried and true workhorses of conservative politics for the fringe elements. This risks Republican losses and is in my view poor strategy. More to the point, it risks the future of this great nation if Obama, Reid and Pelosi are allowed to continue in their disastrous paths.

  24. 27

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    RHP,

    Completely off topic and likely to be deleted, but you mentioned being from Tennessee the other day.

    Best dog in the world was bred down in the South, the redbone coonhound. I have 2, one of which was a rescue from an idiot that thought a hunting dog could be kept in a Pioneer Square studio. They look fantastic when working or playing. They can go on 15 mile hikes or carry a backpack on overnights. They are affectionate and loyal. And they chase cats so they make it so my wife can’t keep one of those worthless pets. Say thanks to anyone you know who breeds these guys, would you?

  25. 28

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    27RE

    Forgot an important trait of the dog. Their bay is pure mountain music to the ears.

  26. 29

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    RE 24

    Mike, what won the last election cycle was fear, pure and simple. It’s what won for FDR. Now voters have had time to analyze the real consequences of progressive politics, and the polls show how they’ve reacted.

  27. 30

    Steve spews:

    “In 2010 Republicans have a chance to slow the ship before it hits the iceberg.”

    The same Republicans who steered the ship into the iceberg in the first place? The same Republicans who blamed Obama for everything wrong in this country before he even took office? The same Republicans who called us traitors for not going along with that bullshit, failed war in Iraq? The same Republicans who ran up huge deficits? The same Republicans whose only answer to the jobs problem is lower taxes on the rich and eliminating the inheritance tax? The same Republicans who call us socialists? The same Republicans who talk secession the moment a black man became president? The same Republicans who turn a blind eye to racism in their party?

    Those Republicans?

  28. 31

    Steve spews:

    “Mike, what won the last election cycle was fear, pure and simple.”

    “Hope and Change” was a message of fear to you? Such fears are illusory and only reside in your head and in those of your ilk, pure and simple.

  29. 32

    Stating the Obvious, I guess spews:

    Steve raised good points.
    I’d like to hear how blue would refute them.

  30. 33

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    Steve,

    ““Hope and Change” was a message of fear to you? Such fears are illusory and only reside in your head and in those of your ilk, pure and simple.”

    I wasn’t referring to fear of Obama, Steve. And ‘Hope and Change’ was a meaningless and irritating blurb eObama partisans grew weary of before the actual election.

    I was referring to fear of losing ones job and home. I was referring to the background anxiety of the economy of 2008, and the precipitous fall immediately prior to the election.

    Had that not been the case Obama would not now be the President of this country.

    I don’t fear Obama. I don’t respect him. I don’t like his policies. I don’t think he’s qualified to run the corner McDonalds, never mind the country. But I don’t fear him.

  31. 34

    MikeBoyScout spews:

    @26 lostinaseaofblue on 08/04/2010 at 1:21 pm, failed to cite any of the many examples Lost says he heard Texan politicians ranting about secession for years.

    Like I said, you are all wind.
    Regardless of my age, I not only know about printed media, I know how to cite it. Bet you don’t. :-)

    @29 lostinaseaofblue,

    What won the last 2 elections across the USA was Democrats. What lost the last 2 elections across the USA was Republicans.
    We can argue until the cows come home about why, but thems is da facts, Jack.
    We can argue about which party will win in November, but I think we should just wait until November 3rd. I promise you this, that IF the Dems take the beating you hope, I’ll come on here and eat crow. And I’m sure you’ll come back if the Dems keep the House & Senate and whine about soshuleesim and AKORN and teabagging baloney.

    Have a nice day.

  32. 35

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    Re 32

    I’d refute them by agreeing with many of his points.

    Bush betrayed core principles of conservativism with his bank bailouts and massive spending. He did likewise with a pointless war in Iraq that is still sucking the lifeblood from our economy. He did this with unconstitutional restrictions on basic liberties and illegal government surveilance of unindicted citizens. Bush missed an historical chance to unite the world against terrorism and treat it as the international threat to law and order that it is.

    I’m not going to bother with the references to traitors and so on. It was always stupid to use those terms to refer to political or ideological opponents.

    But you’re talking about the points where Republicans didn’t practice conservative principles.

    You’re also talking about policies with which many Democrats went along. Corporate special interests buy democrat politicians as well as those who follow their names with an ‘r.’

    Spending our children and grandchildren into bankruptcy on inane theories thought up by professors who don’t have to deal with the real world isn’t a solution. Paying unemployment in perpetuaty for those too lazy to work or go where the work is isn’t the solution.

    As painful in the short term as it would be, massive cuts in government expenditure and re-alignment with the limited government envisioned by the founders is the only way to regain American prosperity in the long term. Otherwise we’re bandaging a gaping chest wound and expecting the patient to live.

  33. 36

    Steve spews:

    I take it you can’t come up with a reason to vote Republican. This is understandable. I can’t come up with a reason to vote for them either. Here’s an easier one. After betraying their own conservative principles for so many years and after having driven this country to the brink of financial ruin, why on earth should anybody trust them now or even believe one word they say?

  34. 37

    Blue John spews:

    @35 lostinaseaofblue said “As painful in the short term as it would be, massive cuts in government expenditure and re-alignment with the limited government envisioned by the founders is the only way to regain American prosperity in the long term.”
    I would love to know what broad programs and areas of federal spending you think America should keep to be in alignment with limited government.

    If you were able tomorrow to make the cuts you think were appropriate, what would you keep paying for?

    Here is a pie chart to help you…
    http://www.elapro.net/Fy2009sp.jpg

    I’ll assume anything you don’t list is cut out.

  35. 38

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    Why? Because between the devil and the deep blue sea a choice must be made.

    I don’t like the trend in Republican violations of personal civil rights. Americans will fight these, eventually. I guess I believe in Americans fighting the tapping the phones of citizens or viewing their email, surveilance without a warrant and all the other stuff Bush initiated and Obama retained.

    What people will justify with everything in them, what they will delude themselves into believing no matter the cost in logical inconsistencies, is personal gain. They will justify their right to the possessions of their neighbors when every moral and ethical principle they know screams against it, if once we establish the government as the means for transferring that property.

  36. 39

    Steve spews:

    “Paying unemployment in perpetuaty for those too lazy to work or go where the work is isn’t the solution.”

    Where are these jobs located that are available to all the millions of Americans who are now unemployed?

    Give us one example of an unemployed person collecting unemployment checks in perpetuity because they’re too lazy to work.

  37. 40

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    Steve,

    I can tell you this. All of the men in my old special projects department are working. One was just laid off, and found another job a few days later. I keep in touch with them as they are good men with families about whom I was worried. As it turns out the worry was unnecessary.

    Personally, I’m unsure how I’m going to meet all the project obligations I have for the next two or three months. Between personal projects, home remodels for resale, and helping old business friends short of staff I’m a bit over-booked. I was laid off 15 months ago and have had this difficulty since.

    We all work in construction, which is supposedly among the worst industries for unemployment at the moment.

    Granted if I lived in Detroit this would not likely be true. But if I lived in Detroit and couldn’t find work for 2 years I think I’d move out of Detroit.

  38. 41

    Blue John spews:

    So, lostinaseaofblue
    If you were able tomorrow to make the cuts you think were appropriate, what would you keep the federal government paying for?

    I think it would be insightful.

  39. 42

    Steve spews:

    Anecdotes and an invitation to millions of our nation’s unemployed to move to our state to remodel houses? Is that the all you’ve got?

  40. 43

    Steve spews:

    I take it that you have no example of an unemployed person collecting unemployment in perpetuity. Why did you demonize as “too lazy to work” those people who have lost their jobs and still can’t find work during the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression?

  41. 44

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    Re 41

    Sorry Blue John, the question is a good one worthy of a good answer. Accordingly, I’ve been trying to find the source of the chart first, and trying to read it. The color coding makes some of the categories difficult to read on my laptop.

    If waiting a few minutes isn’t a problem I’ve no objection to trying to answer your question.

  42. 45

    spews:

    Stve:

    The flag has historical significance, but it has also long been the flag of racists and a powerful symbol of centuries of oppression for millions of Americans.

    In certain contexts, yes. This flag was in an explicitly historical context, and anyone offended by it is beyond help.

    Can you possibly be in denial over the fact that the flag has been so despicably waved at tea party events before this one took place?

    At a Tea Party event in WA? That had anything to do with Koster? Nope.

    An American flag was flown upside down at a pro-immigration rally. Does that mean all pro-immigration people hate America? Don’t be stupid.

    When this flag was held high at this event, it doesn’t matter what other historical flag were there.

    Obviously false. Not even worth responding to beyond that.

    your failure to confront the racist elements in the Republican party

    You’re a liar. Not only is this not true, but you have no way of knowing whether it’s true, which means you’re speaking with a complete disregard for truth or falsity, which means you’re lying.

    as well as Dick Armey’s faux-grassroots rebranding effort called the Tea Party.

    You are either ignorant or lying. The Tea Party started as a grassroots effort right in Seattle, and it mostly remains one. In Seattle, in Snohomish County, in Island County, in Skagit County … I’ve never seen FreedomWorks at any of the Tea Parties around here. They have jumped on the Tea Party bandwagon, rather than the other wau around: the facts are clear.

    And I welcome them. The more the merrier.

  43. 46

    Michael spews:

    I’ve never seen FreedomWorks at any of the Tea Parties around here.

    Hmm… I sorta remember seeing pictures in the paper of Tea Party folks down in Oly with professionally made signs with KVI Radio stamped on them.

  44. 47

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    Blue John,

    Having thought about it over dinner-

    Social Security could be phased out over the next 20 years. Personal retirement is a personal responsibility, not a public one. The phase out would allow those currently on it who have paid for it to pass through the system.

    The Department of Homeland Security could be shut down and all the men and women who worked for it imprisoned for treason. Actually the second part I’m kidding. Kind of. We waste tens of billions a month attempting the Sisyphusian task of gaurding every federal or state building, badly screening every airline passenger and on and on. For what? TSA audits of their own operations say they miss 30%-50% of people carrying contraband. I don’t feel a whit safer in the courthouse on account of the Gestapo thug searching everyone who enters without either probable cause or a warrant.

    A flat tax would simplify our tax system and make it more fair. We could lay off 75% or more of the IRS employees if we did this. Tax evasion would diminish and consequently collections increase.

    The DOD could be audited for waste, reduntant operations, fraud etc. This would necessarily be more sensitive, but it could be done.

    Why the do we have a federal Department of Education. This is manifestly a state function.

    All welfare recipients should be US citizens who can’t collect benefits for more than 2 consequetive years in a 10 year period.

    On broad general lines that would be a start.

  45. 48

    Steve spews:

    ” This flag was in an explicitly historical context, and anyone offended by it is beyond help.”

    Your contempt for anyone offended by this comes as no surprise, Pudge.

    “An American flag was flown upside down at a pro-immigration rally. Does that mean all pro-immigration people hate America? Don’t be stupid.”

    Don’t project your stupidity on me, Pudge. Did I say that all teabaggers are racists or something? No, I didn’t. You can take that one and shove it back up your ass where you found it.

    “Obviously false. Not even worth responding to beyond that.”

    Would you please stay in touch with reality? At least until we finish this exchange? Thanks.

    “You’re a liar. Not only is this not true, but you have no way of knowing whether it’s true, which means you’re speaking with a complete disregard for truth or falsity, which means you’re lying.”

    Bore me to tears with your insipid accusations of lying, why don’t you?

    “You are either ignorant or lying.”

    So tiresome. So insipid. So like Pudge.

    I tell you what, Pudge, I’ll be absolutely clear with you. Try waving that damned flag around me with that bitch attitude of yours and you’ll soon find that damned flag unfurled up your goddamned teabagging ass.

  46. 49

    Steve spews:

    “Personal retirement is a personal responsibility, not a public one.”

    Lost shares his vision of the elderly poor eating catfood as he heaps contempt upon them.

    “The Department of Homeland Security could be shut down and all the men and women who worked for it imprisoned for treason.”

    Good grief! Hate government employees much?

    “A flat tax would simplify our tax system and make it more fair.”

    I’m reminded here that regressive is the opposite of progressive. Also how the rich have far more to gain from the use of the commons than the poor.

    “All welfare recipients should be US citizens who can’t collect benefits for more than 2 consequetive years in a 10 year period.”

    I see you guys have ditched that “compassionate” conservative thing. Fine by me. It was at best nothing but unfunded bullshit anyway. Oh, and thanks for thinking that my very ill and invalid Mom should have been cut off from welfare and thrown out on the street to die and me along with her.

    Some vision you have going there, Lost.

  47. 51

    Steve spews:

    Lost certainly has Piper’s unwarranted smugness and condescending ways down pat, although proud leftisttells me that, in person, Piper at least displays a self-deprecating sense of humor. Perhaps he does. I wouldn’t know. I do know that I haven’t seen a drop of humor or humility in anything Lost or Pudge have ever written. It beats me how these people, being the obvious dumb fucks that they are, can be so damned full of themselves. It’s like having a severe case of narcissism is a prerequisite for becoming a wingnut.

  48. 52

    Steve spews:

    Pudge over on the krazy wingnut blog sez, “apparently, Larsen didn’t have the cajones to tell the”

    WTF do “drawers” have to do with anything, Pudge? Or are you just aping your Fearless Leader, that failed mother of severely dysfunctional children and half-term failure of a governor, $arah Palin? Damn, by now I bet those kids are wishing that they’d been raised by Bill and Hillary. Don’t you agree, Pudge? Hell, as fucked up as you turned out, I bet you’re probably wishing that you’d been raised by Bill and Hillary too.

  49. 53

    lostinaseaofblue spews:

    RE 49

    You do know that Social Security was intended to be a short term solution? It was to aid people who did save and invest and lost everything in 1929 after they had retired. Nor was it intended to be anything other than a lifeline for a few. The monstrosity it has become was beyond even FDRs crazed imaginings.

    I take it you like the security at the airport and find it effective? I take it you support illegal wiretaps and surveilance? Sheesh, you disagree sometimes just to disagree, I think.

    So the rich get fire departments, police, schools and so on while the poor don’t? They get private freeways and railcars and are privately defended by the army? Wait a minute… no they don’t! So how exactly do the wealthy owe more for their share of citizenship?

    At the last one I’m humbly acknowledging an incomplete thought. What should have been written is that those able to work should only benefit from welfare for 2 years in 10.

    Compassionate? In the long run, when the people expect to fulfill duties to their government as well as obtain rights from it it is compassionate. In the long run when a competent and self reliant citizenry is the result, yes it is compassionate.