Nothing says “silly” like dismissing the concerns of regular folks.
SIX Democratic legislators have introduced a bill to stop Boeing from threatening to move out of Washington. That’s right: threatening to move. Such is a silly end to a silly story.
Um, I think those six were trying to make a larger point. But I wager the editorial writers know that.
These editorial keepers of the gate, freshly content with their re-installation of Dave Reichert, probably don’t like how this labor bill issue actually became a big story in the first place. As they admit in their editorial, the newspaper can’t possibly abide a law that keeps corporations from forcing workers to attend anti-union pep rallies against their will. So to them, anyone who cares about the issue is silly.
Have you ever noticed that anyone or anything who isn’t approved by The Seattle Times winds up being portrayed as not serious? And the legacy media wonders why people have it in for them. After nearly four decades of class warfare waged against the earning power of regular citizens, a key worker’s rights issue is demoted to a mocking editorial.
Nothing the Seattle Times editorial board (or most editorial boards, frankly) does comes as much of a surprise, especially when it comes to labor issues. Basically these editorial writers are a sort of mini-derivatives trader of the written word, whose currency is not phony-baloney financial products but the equally phony and intellectually dishonest job of defending concentrated and corrupt economic power while trying to appear compassionate, thoughtful and pro-democracy. It’s getting hard and harder to do without reality smacking them in the face, though.
These derivative-editorialists also must make sure only the “right” kind of people and ideas are allowed into the sandbox of democracy, because after all it’s their sandbox. Only certain types of candidates are truly allowed, and while the will of the people must be respected, it need only be respected to a point, or more accurately, along a certain spectrum of conventional thought. Should anyone question excessive militarism or promote clean energy and worker rights too loudly, they risk being sent packing without their pail and shovel.
In the sandbox, it’s okay for corporate lobbyists to put out the word to kill legislation that was likely going to pass, because the media, economic and political elites of this state deem it acceptable practice. Nothing silly about that, for certain. It’s probably the most not-silly thing I can recall while living in this state for the last 19 years, at least in terms of revealing in very stark terms who pulls what levers.
Sadly for these editorial traders in derivative thought, their market is collapsing as badly as the real derivatives market did, and predictably enough newspaper owners have asked for their own bailout in the form of a tax break.
What would be truly silly is wasting taxpayer dollars on a special tax break for newspapers that relentlessly attack and mock the democratic process itself. Given the budget situation, you’d be better off buying some extra paste and construction paper for the wee kiddies; at least first graders have some dignity and original ideas.
This is America, land of laissez-faire promise you know! If The Seattle Times and the rest truly believe in the business uber alles world view they constantly espouse, they don’t need government help. Neo-liberal philosophy itself says so. The grand results of this philosophy touch Washington state households every day in the form of decimated 401(k) statements, job losses, foreclosure notices and ruinous medical bills.
Or is it “silly” to point all that out?
Sounds like you are bitter and kind of depressed tonight Jon. Take your Prozac, light up an extra bowlful of BC Bud….and chill.
No Jon, there is not some vast conspiracy against your off-the-wall anti-business beliefs at the Times. There is a more pragmatic approach that real adults take to the needs of those who invest, pay most of the taxes and create real jobs.
Come on in out of the dark Jon. Things are much brighter in the job-creating world than you give credit for.
Seems like every time the Times disagrees with your “silly” positions, you get into this dark, dank funk Jon. Chin up! Head outta yer ASS! Now, what can you do to create a positive environment for job-creating businesses?
Or, perhaps like our President, you don’t really want that. You really want more & more Government control.
I’m just sayin’!
Hell Boeing has already moved out of this state Goldy, how blind can you be.
There will be nothing left of Renton Boeing, Auburn Boeing, and soon Everett Boeing because of these massive state taxes and Unions in this state.
Go Boeing Go to where you can succeed.
It is not in a liberal Washington
2 Uhhhhh….you’re saying Boeing didn’t like the high taxes and union dominance in Washington so they moved their headquarters to Illinois?????
Dude, you must be the one smoking wakky tabakky.
The Seattle Times is 100% correct on this editorial. The proposed legislation to ban Boeing from talking about leaving the state is completely ridiculous and 100% unconstitutional. Not only that, but the audacity of a handful of legislators to introduce such legislation will tend to make Boeing think harder about actually moving out of state.
I don’t know where the proposed “Worker Privacy Act” stands in comparison to what other states may have enacted or not enacted. But if it is extreme in comparison to other states, and Boeing is threatening to move out of state …
Sometimes it is simply necessary to compromise.
Richard Pope–
Well said.
But you have to realize the goal of the KLOWNS you have jumped in bed with is to alienate business at every turn…and force bigger government on us.
Isn’t that becoming pretty clear?
Now look at your gal Gregoire’s latest…she is not talking tax increase, she’s talking BORROWING big-time, without a revenue stream and to pass her fiscal irresponsibility on to the next generation. Is that leadership??
It’s the most irresponsible thing a Governor could do…borrow to keep a bloated bureaucracy afloat.
Richard, based on many of your prior comments & positions over the years, I cannot understand how you could support Gregoire & the Progressive bowel movement. It’s destructive.
ArtFart–
Boeing has had Contingency Plans in at least 3 other Right To Work States for the past 20+ years. They have kept those plans updated.
You KLOWNS are so anti-business, you are about to shove out the one business that seperates Washington from a bad economy and a DEPRESSION.
Keep pushing. Boeing will soon have plenty of money to borrow for a relocation.
When they leave, real estate prices will plummet, related Boeing suppliers will also move & unemployment costs will raise rates shoving many other business to relocate or shutdown.
Grown-ups understand this.
Anti-business KLOWNS are incapable as their anger klouds any reasoned judgment. KLOWNS really believe Boeing either cannot move or will not move….and they fail to understand all the major consequences if they do.
That’s why I call ’em KLOWNS….Socialist, Big-Government, Anti-Business PINHEADS.
Are you part of that mob ArtFart??
I would like a ban on the use of ‘um’ in internet posts. I don’t care if it’s unconstitutional.
@6
Your correct Mr. Cynical,
The only Items they will leave the gate with will be Awards from Boeing and a Go union button.
Oh, forgot about them The state since the 70’s Wa. has gained other manufacturing jobs to help offset Boeing leaving, However the shock,lost Taxes through out Wa. high unemployment high going out of business sale including gloom in real estate. Let’s not forget states biggest friend going out of business IAM District 751
Jon, The Times delivered a correct editorial. You are dead wrong on this issue. There is a big billion dollar state deficit and they are worrying over Boeing? The editorial has it dead on: “Ethics was not the reason the bill was killed. It was the excuse. Gov. Christine Gregoire confirmed this later when she said she would have vetoed the bill because of its effect on Boeing.”
“It was the excuse.” As @5 said above, Democrats seem to be anti-business in many of their motives. If they are and drive out Boeing, will Microsoft be next? Turn out the lights and close the door the party is over. Liberals are Scumbags.
When you really nail a point Jon, the HA asshat trolls really, really come unglued.
And you got it right here…pretty much like usual!
Rujax–
You are the King of Anti-business.
Like a little kid, you say & do things based on your anger & jealousy of those more successful than you.
Go ahead & push Boeing out.
1st, related suppliers will go.
2nd, other businesses that rely on Boeing & related suppliers will close.
You think you have a mess now??!
But you tell a little kid not to put their hand on a hot burner…and the stupid ones like you still do. Then you scream when you get burned. At least their are some pre-pubescent teens in the Democratic Party with enough common sense NOT to touch the burner.
The stupid little kids, if there are enough of them, will all touch the burner together.
If I didn’t still have a few rentals, building lots & commercial property…I’d say “Go Ahead and touch the Burner Rujax!”
Fortunately, I have renters not Boeing related…but everyone would be hurt to some extent.
Oh, I forgot, Rujax favors Assisted Suicide.
The problem Rujax is that you would also be murdering a lot of innocent people too.
Given the state budget crisis due to Republican economic mismanagement, I don’t think we can afford to give tax breaks to Republican newspapers right now. In fact, the very idea of a special interest asking for tax favors despite the state’s $9 billion revenue shortfall is downright silly.
@12 Oh, poor poor Boeing! If we don’t pay them more shakedown money, they might leave! Geez, Cynical, do you have any idea how much MONEY it would cost them to pick up and move their runways, plants, and equipment? And haven’t they ALREADY outsourced half of their employment to China? Why should we spend one more day sucking up to Boeing? And why should anyone fly on a Boeing jet? You can find enough info on the internet to make sure your next ride is on an Airbus.
P.S., speaking of Assisted Suicide, if you’d like to consider seppuku as a way out of the New Liberal Utopia you’ll be living under for the next 50 years, I’ll be happy to hold the knife while you throw yourself on it.*
* Hey just kidding Cyn! Wingnut humor cracks me up!
Last time I checked, I’ve made $1250 in the stock market so far this morning. Sure beats getting paid $9 an hour to sit on a folding metal chair listening to some HR guy rant against unions. They’d be wasting their time because I’d vote for the union anyway.
Employers lecturing workers about what’s good for them is like Ted Bundy giving seminars on sorority house security.
@9 Low wages and no wages drive more stores out of business than union wages ever did.
In the weird world of Wingnut Whack-O-Nomics the prevailing theory is that destroying consumer buying power by cutting wages and outsourcing jobs is the best way to boost sales and increase profits.
14. Roger Rabbit spews:
Rog, drink another cup of coffee and try again.
When you add up both the Direct and Indirect benefits of Boeing to our Economy, Local & State Government….it would be devastating if they left. Devastating.
And keep deluding yourself that they could never afford to leave.
They have had 3 Contingency Plans (Texas, Mississippi and Alabama) for over 2 decades Rog.
Go ahead and call their bluff.
They are holding an Aces High Fullhouse…and you ain’t got shit.
They ain’t bluffing.
@19 What benefit is there for taxpayers in paying $3 billion of extortion to a company that doesn’t pay any taxes?
@19 (continued) I’ll be more than happy to call Boeing’s bluff, Cynical. All it takes is some legislators with a little spine and a sense of right and wrong. Boeing has been bleeding this community for years. We bled for them and they moved their headquarters and outsourced jobs anyway. What makes you think they wouldn’t be gone in a flash if they could make another dollar of profit by moving? The only reason they’re still here is because it’s too expensive to move — there’s no profit in it. But if they pull up stakes, make no mistake, I’ll be more than glad to see Washington State’s greediest corporate freeloader gone. Oh, and by the way, when I have to travel, I make a point of booking my flights on Airbus planes. Viva La Frogs! Viva French Fries!
Mr. Klynical has a lock on the goat this week.
Really, does Boeing pay any freaking taxes?
@19 (ad naus.) “They are holding an Aces High Fullhouse”
Really? Then why is their stock in the toilet? Down from 88 to 37.50; and their P/E ratio is NMF because they lost $56 million in MRQ. And you think they’ve got spare cash kicking around to pick up and move a gigantic manufacturing plant out of pique with state legislators who think they shouldn’t be allowed to harangue their workers about unions?
There’s too much employer bullshit in this world. I think everyone should just quit working and live like Republicans.
Maybe we should hold a ritual burning of Boeing stock certificates. The stuff’s only toilet paper anyway. Do you know what’s going to happen to Boeing? They’ve outsourced their technology and jobs to China, and now China is in the process of setting up their own aircraft manufacturing, and they’ll put Boeing out of business. That’s how dumb the Boeing execs are. Of all the stupid things that Boeing management has done over the years, teaching the Chinese how to build airplanes is the one that will burn down the ranch.
I don’t put up with employer bullshit. I don’t work. I live like a Republican now. I get paid for not working, and I get tax breaks on my income from economically useless stock-flipping.
Rog & YLB–
Your constant mindless “chest-thumping” is curiously similiar to Barney Fag’s.
I watched them question Geithner this AM and for the 1st time…NO CHEST THUMPING.
Someone obviously told Barney & his merry band of PINHEADS to knock it off…they are spooking investors.
Consequently, the market went from +20 to +80.
See how it works KLOWNS??
Chest-thumping===Investors hide.
Reasonable Discussion===Investors come out of the closet.
Your anti-Boeing, anti-Business Chest-thumping is something Governor Gregoire must really, truly have grown to HATE. It is counter-productive but common of the Atheist Progressive Krowd.
Idea:
Grow up.
Wise up.
Act like adults.
Solve real problems.
26. Roger Rabbit spews:
Rog, you repeatedly told us you do not flip stocks. You rode stocks like IBM and NOV down the tubes you goofball. You have never, ever posted a single SALE of a stock or even mentioned selling anything.
Another fantasy??
PS–
You don’t get any tax break “flipping stocks”. Long-term Capital Gains is for stocks held over 1 year…hardly flipping.
Whatsthemattawhichya??
Seems like you are fantasizing at a growing rate.
@27 Gee, Cynical, is my behaving like a Republican getting on your nerves?
But more to the point under discussion, how about telling Boeing’s management to grow up and act like adults? You know who I mean: The little boys who keep telling Seattle, “pay us to kick you around or we’ll take our ball and go away!” Does it shock you that some of us wish they would?
News item: The girl beaten up by the deputy in that infamous videotape was arrested again yesterday at Southcenter on a new charge of felony harassment for verbally threatening to shoot another teenager. Her latest arrest comes only 1 day after the sweet little car thief was banned from the mall for a year for some other undisclosed misconduct. Hey, I’m not saying the cops should beat the crap out of her, I’m only suggesting a juvenile court judge should lock her up and throw the key in a dumpster.
No Rog…I’m not surprised you want Boeing to leave. I also don’t think you have a klue about the konsequences….which is the result of your anger problem and anti-business, Big Nanny Government ideology.
Good luck with that.
Thank God you don’t represent the majority.
Support your local daily newspaper:
I’ve got my gripes with the Times editorial board myself, but I want them to succeed as a paper. Having no competition is bad, but having no major daily in Seattle would be a lot worse.
If you subscribed to the PI, please consider taking the Times. They have serious circulation issues right now, and ad revenues are completely in the tank.
I don’t want my sports page to go away!
If the times wasn’t always insulting my politics I would subscribe to them. If I wanted to pay money to get insulted I’d donate money to Republican political campaigns.
News item: Former Poulsbo mayor Richard Mitchusson, 70, has been arrested for stalking 3 women.
@34, Is this ex-mayor a (D) or (R)? Again, you make it sound like this ex-mayor is an (R) like you made me think the drug prosecutor in Kitsap County was an (R).
@34, Is this the way you present all your arguments on this blog?
How is it that Boeing can’t co-exist with labor unions in the State of Washington? They have made money, based the reputation as the world’s finest manufacturer of airplanes on the labor of those highly skilled, proficient, and dedicaded union members for decades. How is it that Boeing can complain about a lack of an educated pool of potential employees but wants tax cuts from the legislature in Olympia while those legislators are grappling with a way to pay for K-12 and higher education in our state? If you don’t pay for the education how you can expect to have it? Union members work hard for the wages they earn and those wages are large enough so they can buy tickets to fly with airlines who buy those Boeing planes, going on vacations with their friends and families. Cut their wages, cut their benefits they end up with less money to spend on those trips, fewer people flying, less of a need for those Boeing planes. Why do businesses like Boeing continue to cut their noses off to spite their faces? They’re not looking at the long term, just the short term bottom line impacts, but the ROI on the wages they pay their employees is HUGE!! The ROI on the taxes that they pay in Washington State is HUGE, especially when it comes to education and transportation. There are no free lunches. The choices right now are between peanut butter sandwiches or meat/cheese sandwiches, pop or milk? The Times has been directing election and legislative outcomes for years. Instead of reporting the news or the facts, they create/write the news and develop the facts as they perceive them to be. The Seattle Times’ perception is not necessarily the reality that we’re all facing, working with and living.
Roger,
Let me get this straight. On a national level, the economy is in the dumps. Republicans have been in charge. Ergo, it’s the Repubs’ fault.
On a state level, the economy is in the dumps. Democrats have been in charge. Ergo, it’s the Repubs’ fault.
Makes perfect sense.
Zoomer–
Your one-sided diatribe against Boeing is representative of the problem.
Why not turn it around and question why your Union can’t get along with Boeing and why they insist on heavy-handed costly Legislation making it harder for Boeing to compete in a highly competitive environment??
Try to answer the questions from Boeings viewpoint.
I see a lot of posts blaming the union for impeding Boeing’s competativeness, and legitimizing their assertion that they would be harmed by the Worker Privacy Act. If their workforce is already unionized, prohibiting forced attendance meetings about unionizing doesn’t impact them, does it? I guess they are mostly concerned with having the right to brow beat their employees about any topic. You can’t have it both ways. The bottom line is that this bill does not; in any way, shape, or form; have an effect on Boeing or it’s bottom line. Period.
Secondly, Boeing threatened to leave and held the legislature hostage in 2003 with the UI “reform” bill and got massive tax breaks in the process. And what did they do? Three days after UI “reform” bill passed they laid off 700 workers. Since they screw us if we give in to their demands, perhaps they wouldn’t if we stood up to them. Cowtowing doesn’t seem to be working.
It’s not Boeing themselves who contributes to our economy, it’s the workers who live here and spend their money. Screw them and you screw the economy. Complain about IAM 751 all you want but those members are the ONLY reason Boeing is still here.
The Worker Privacy Act wouldn’t cost Boeing or any other company in this state a cent.
Everywhere Mr. Cynical writes “compete in a highly competitive environment,” substitute the words, “pay their employees less money.”
I subscribed to the Seattle P-I for 15 years and cancelled my subscription rather than take The Seattle Times, for the same reasons I don’t shop at Wal-Mart. When I can take a simple step to avoid having my money support corporate thugs, I’ll take it.
When the corporate thugs who hijacked The Boeing Co. after the McDonnell Douglas purchase finally succeed in busting all of the unions (as they gradually have since that time), I will make every effort to fly Airbus, too. But it won’t be the loss of patronage from the likes of me that will lead to the demise of that company, it will be their own short-sighted decision to race to the bottom in terms of labor costs that will kill the company.
But then again, like AIG, Boeing may be Too Big To Fail. So I guess I WILL have to pay eventually, huh?
@39
Boeing responds to Wall Street as does any other company. If Wall Street makes a negative call on Boeing stock and it drops, any and every stockholder will complain what Boeing is doing and why is the stock dropping? If the economy isn’t going well, Boeing has to jettison extra workers or Wall Street will ask what is Boeing doing to enhance the bottom line.
Boeing union workers want American companies to buy Boeing over Airbus. It is strange the person called Roger Rabbit would recommend taking an Airbus plane when this means some company decided to buy Airbus over Boeing and another delivery lost to Europe. I guess the person called Roger Rabbit really doesn’t care about union people as he claims.
Conservatives are a funny bunch. Not funny HaHa, but funny “WFT are you thinking, or not thinking as is generally the case.”
Why is it that making money a good thing as long as you’re the guy at the top?
Why is it when the auto industry is in trouble American workers on the assembly line having to sacrifice their income. But, when AIG exec’s are getting multi-million dollar bonuses it’s necessary in order to retain “top talent?”
When did earning a living wage so you can buy a home, support your family, send your kids to college, and maybe retire become a bad thing?
Ultimately, this demonstrates a fundamental lack of knowledge that our Founding Fathers understood: you must have prosperity for the Commons in order to truly have a free and stable society.
For the few of you yum-yum conservatives who can read AND comprehend, please pass on the lesson of the French Revolution and how we can learn a lesson from history. Even if it’s not ours.
Geez, Jon, I couldn’t help but notice that your retarded tirade ignored the substance of what was discussed in the editorial and went off on some strange tangent.
I guess you’re not happy with the MSM being 95% in the bag for the left. That 5% really grates on you, doesn’t it?
re 2: Many non-union shops have closed. I blame it on the fact that there was no union.
I have seen Boeing get the ‘necessary tax incentives and cuts in costs’ to stay in Washington State. And every year since then, it gets harder and harder to find the money necessary to pay for the education and transportation, the public safety needed in this state. Every year Boeing and other businesses circle the wagons and cry foul about the lack of a quality education in this state undermining their ability to stay in this state, and at the same time ask to pay less and get more. Unions are not the downfall of business. People forget it was labor unions that got us a forty hour work week, the weekend, health and dental insurances, vacations. And if you think they’ve outlived their usefullness, guess again. As union density has decreased, people are working fewer hours so they can’t meet their expenses, working weekends, losing healthcare, vacations to mention just a few of those things. When people can’t make a wage that provides for some discretionary level of spending lots of businesses go out of business or lose a big chunk of their business, like the Boeing Company who is seeing some of their orders being cancelled already due to a decrease in air travel. I’m not anti-Boeing or anti-business, but I am pro-worker, pro-family and it’s in the best interests of both sides to work together for the benefit of each other. Henry Ford knew that he had to pay wages large enough so his employees could afford to buy the products they made. Until corporations go back to this fundamental of business, they’ll continue to fumble and fail.
re 27: “I watched them question Geithner this AM and for the 1st time…NO CHEST THUMPING.
Someone obviously told Barney & his merry band of PINHEADS to knock it off…they are spooking investors.
Consequently, the market went from +20 to +80.”
The brave investors on Wall Street can be spooked by a gay congressman? You make it sound as if the road to heaven is to keep Wall Street happy.
By the way, I ate mashed potatoes that day. That’s why the market went down. It had nothing to do with Barney Frank.
Congruent events don’t imply causation. Or, do they? Maybe Wall Streets irresponsibility made Barney Frank angry.
re 43: Except for The Nation and The New Yorker magazines, there is not an ounce of truth to your statement.
“Liberals are Scumbags” ??????
Do they do things like get out of military service because their daddy is rich or they’ve got a boil on their ass?
Maybe this editorial was the Times’ way to welcome (piss off) their new exP-I readers.
In general, much as the cheap-labor afficionados might deny it (and as much as the latest crop of Boeing brass might be unaware of it) designing and building modern airplanes requires people with some pretty fancy skills. Moving to some other place and trying to do it with retreaded garment workers might not work out all that well.
That being said, with the “Dreamliner”, the Lazy B is transitioning to a whole new type of product that nobody knows how to build, including them. If they have to retrain the rivet-gun jockeys they have now anyway, starting over might be a more attractive option than it was a decade or two ago.
At the same time, they should be ashamed of themselves for demanding an out from having to pay for with the social and infrastructure problems their presence creates. None other than John Carlson pointed out right here that the burden for services increases with population, and in fact the increase is exponential. So, if you want to see it become possible for the state to get by spending a lot less money without everything going to hell, let one of our major industries bail out and take all those people and their cars and their garbage and their poop and their kids someplace else.
Maybe Emmett Watson was right after all.
ArtFart-
There is a HUGE difference between NEED and DESIRES for services. Certainly we have plenty of desires…they are called Discretionary Expenditures….ones you cut in a recession.
>>Henry Ford knew that he had to pay wages large enough so his employees could afford to buy the products they made. Until corporations go back to this fundamental of business, they’ll continue to fumble and fail.
Continuing to repeat this doesn’t make it true. It’s not the 1920s any longer. Boeing can’t base their wage structure on ensuring .001% of its potential customers can afford its product. What happens when its competitors feel no such compulsion? Boeing goes out of business. Paying a wage that allows your employees to afford your product is and should be in close to last place on a company’s priority list.
Here’s the problem with the bloggers and commenters here, from today’s Wall Street Journal: “The current version of the party has largely broken free of any understanding whatsoever of the private sector-how it works or what it needs to function.”
Many of comments here betray a mind-numbing ignorance of basic economic principles. Your simplistic solutions to complex problems almost always have consequences you haven’t considered. And, more disturbingly, they’re stated with almost absolute certainty, and I don’t see much evidence that anyone wants to educate themselves. They’d rather feel good railing against the “rich” and “evil corporations”.
52 You’re right, it’s not the 1920’s any more. In fact, it’s looking more and more like the 1930’s. We’ve been maintaining an illusion of prosperity because so many people and institutions (including the government, and for crying out loud, the banks) have been living far beyond their means. What finally happened is that the accumulated debt piled so high it became impossible to conceal.
Look at what everyone (including Obama) is talking about to “rescue” the economy…just making it possible for corporations and individuals to borrow more money. Hey, why even bother to try and create new jobs? Just have the gubmint fill the banks’ vaults with more money, so they can lend it to everyone, package the all the bad-debts-in-the-making into a few trillion dollars’ worth of new derivatives, and go back to trading them back and forth as if it really mattered?
Who cares if the airlines will still be losing money hand over fist? They’ll just borrow more! They’ll keep filling their seats with passengers who hocked their great-great-great-great-great grandchildrens’ last paycheck to buy their tickets, but who cares? The gravy train can go on forever….can’t it?
re 52: “The current version of the party has largely broken free of any understanding whatsoever of the private sector-how it works or what it needs to function.”
Bullshit. That’s the same as when the punditocracy states that the public will not stand for banks that are not privately owned. Who did the survey? Are they sure that the current incarnation of Democrats understand what private bankers need?
They must — because the bankers don’t.
That is the oldest BS debating trick in the book: If you don’t agree with me, that means you don’t understand.
So, the present is not like the past, huh? Then I guess the wingnut proposition that Hoover’s protective tariffs made the depression deeper and therefore we shoudn’t do it again now doesn’t hold water because it’s not the 1930’s anymore.
You just don’t understand.
Boy, we “really don’t know”, do we? Guess what? We know quite a lot, and that includes what the right-wing crooks and liars have taught us over the last thirty years doesn’t work.
Too bad they didn’t learn anything themselves.
headlice–
As a public employee working for the Edmonds School District, you really ought to have a more balanced view of the private sector.
Do it for the children.
re 56: As a former teacher and successful business owner of 15 years, I can attest to the fact that a good education will get you somewhere.
I’m a lot more rigorous both physically and mentally than you would care to know. If you believe that I work for a public school district, I will take that as a compliment.
The biggest proof that education doesn’t work would be the fact that you still exist.
I guess that mom, unlike her son, just could’t say no.
headless,
I have read many posts about you until now.
Your a real nasty bitch.
You need to look in the mirror every morning to see who you will be today. I pity the children that had contact with you.
58 “I pity the children that had contact with you.”
Don’t bother. You’re the one deserving of pity. You have to live with yourself.
@14
“Support your union brothers and fly Airbus.???”
Your a angry liberal
A few months ago it was Support Boeing refueling tanker not Airbus.
You must see first which way the wind blows, Also it takes loser 3 days to interpret what his adviser told him you suffer from the same condition.
In the last 8 months I never seen any posts from you telling us how much money you lost in the Stock market today it’s winning.
As a foolish little rabbit running in circles you have some major issues .
@ 52
Many of comments here betray a mind-numbing ignorance of basic economic principles.
While that might well be true, I don’t see you elevating the level of discourse.
I don’t know anyone who can execute a successful business plan that doesn’t include customers. Who are those customers? Ultimately, if we’re to truly understand Say’s Law, those customers are, by and large, employees.
Your oblique reference to competition is as simplistic and short-sighted as the comments about which you complain. Boeing made just under 4 billion (with a “b”) dollars (before taxes) last year. That was a down year. Excluding executive, financial and HR functions, Boeing has about 150 thousand employees (total employment is approx. 163 thousand employees). Boeing could have paid each of those 150 thousand employees an additional $10,000 over the course of the year, and still made nearly 2.5 billion (with a “b”) dollars before taxes. That’s a far cry from going out of business regardless of what Boeing’s competitors do to compensate their employees.
Do unions eat into corporate profits? Yes. That’s the general idea. Do unions cause firms to go out of business? One might be able to find an isolated instance or two, but employees are not so stupid as to think it’s a good idea to bargain for a wage that would put their employers out of business.
.54
I don’t recall saying that everything that worked in the ’20s wouldn’t work today, or vice versa.
Nice strawman though.
re 52 & 62: “Continuing to repeat this doesn’t make it true. It’s not the 1920s any longer.”
Wipe the drool from your chin, Pinhead.
63 – you really are a piece of work, aren’t you? Is this the elevated level of discourse some of you aspire to?