In Lou Guzzo’s latest LouBoob installment, Dino Rossi’s “idea” man decries organic farming: “It’s as much a national hoax as the fantasy over what has been called ‘global warming.'” Guzzo is apparently fond of ingesting petrochemicals. That explains everything.
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I personally like organic food.
I think it must be the legacy of a lifetime’s worth of petrochemical ingestion. His brain is pickled.
If this is where his campaign gets policy advice, the prospect Rossi wants to assemble a cabinet in Olympia is downright terrifying.
Man, this dude is a nutjob. Watch his little piece on the global warming “hoax” for more fun science facts from Lou.
I thought the Ellen Craswell wing of the R party in this state had finally been brought to heel but clearly I was wrong.
If Dino has this guy whispering in his ear he’s an automatic ‘NO’ in my book.
-OM
Oh, and he lied about Cary Grant’s views on LSD, too (speaking of pickling brains).
Hmm… I guess he hasn’t read the recent initial controlled study that has found a connection between autism and pesticides.
What a crackpot!
Wow, that guy is almost a parody of himself.
He’s like the living definition of “cranky old whacko”.
Yeah, I’ve never heard such a load of crap as this. Gregoire’s ideas never inspired me much, and her speeches are difficult to listen to, but I’d campaign for her to keep this kind of crap out of state government.
Re: Lou Guzzo
I am reminded of Groucho Marx’s comment about Harpo’s character in Room Service: “He’s the brains of the organization – which gives you some idea of the organization.”
He lauds Dixie Lee as an internationally-respected scientist, and then cites her as an expert on organic foods. Of course, her background was in zoology, but that little inconvenient fact hardly impacts Lou’s thinking. I think someone needs to file a guardianship proceeding for Lou. He appears incapable of handling his own affairs.
Iduknow…When I go into the grocery store and compare organic apples to other apples, the organics are wimpier, less appealing, and way more expensive. Haven’t heard of anyone dying from a non-organically grown piece of fruit lately…have you?
The Piper
According to Lou Guzzo:
Don’t trust scientists who tell you that Global Warming is a problem. Trust scientists that tell you that pesticides are safe to ingest.
Don’t trust the “self-styled food experts” about the benefits of organic food. Trust the former Governor of Washington on the benefits of food grown with pesticides and chemical fertilizers.
He sites no evidence to back up any of his claims, other than what he remembers the former governor once told him in passing.
He seems to have a problem with entrepreneurial farmers who are trying to satisfy consumer demand with a superior product. He probably hates capitalism.
@12…Sstar…
Hates capitalism? No…I’m sure Ol’ Lou is quite content to let organic farmers be organic farmers and their customers be their customers.
What I suspect he’s not quite as content with, however, is insisting upon a blind faith belief in the mantra, “Only organic farming good, all other farming bad…” which has shades of Animal Farm’s “Four legs good, two legs bad” and “All animals are equal…except some are more equal than others.”
A lot of the pro-organic farming and pro-global warming rhetoric is too reminiscent of the pro-population bomb bombast of the late 60’s. All the dire predictions of death, destruction, doom and gloom made by Paul Ehrlich, et al, turned out to be so much hooey. Could the same be said for today’s equivilent discussions and predictions, a lot of which seems more poltically driven than anything else?
Just asking…
The Piper
Actually, Guzzo needs to know that many people have had their health damaged badly by being near pesticide spraying in their yards, etc. Really nightmarish stuff has happened to people as a result. Even eventual death after horrible suffering. That’s not automatic if you just eat non-organic food, but it ought to be obvious when you know that people have been badly damaged by ‘chemlawn’ that pesticides in your food aren’t a good thing.
otoh, he’s right that it isn’t a given that man is causing global warming. The earth has been even warmer in the early part of last millenium. It was a prosperous time. And their wasn’t a car or jet in sight to release chemicals. But we don’t get told that part by the wild-eyed extremists. But if you’re interested in truth, then it’s something you’ve got to reconcile with.
Now how come you guys on this blog aren’t upset that King county collects a tax from everyone to spray toxic herbicides (cide means to “kill”, ya know)_all over the county in the springtime????
Organic farming will become a hoax as soon as corporate farms find a way to coopt the term for their own use.
Piper: A nanny state that suckles corporate interests and not people’s is not “capitalism” by any stretch.
@18…S-choir…
Then what is?
The Piper
@19
Fascism, you putz. Do you even own a dictionary?
@11
Iduknow…When I go into the grocery store and compare organic apples to other apples, the organics are wimpier, less appealing, and way more expensive. Haven’t heard of anyone dying from a non-organically grown piece of fruit lately…have you?
So this is proof that organic farming is a hoax?
Also, you can’t die from a single cigarette either, but if you consume them your entire life, you put yourself at greater risk for a number of things that can kill you.
My god, are you allergic to logic?
When I go the the grocery store, I find that the visual appeal of foods is not a good indicator. I have found that most of the organic fruits and vegetables I purchase have a heartier and more pleasant flavor, and thus work better in recipes as well, than the relatively tasteless though visually more perfect “regular” foods.
@20…Lee…
I asked S-choir what is his definition of “capitalism.” What has that to do with fascism??? Or do you equate the two?
Your smoking analogy fails. There are decades of research establishing a link between tobacco and any number of respiratory diseases. Not so non-organically grown food and anything other than more of it being grown to feed the world.
The hoax of organic farming, to me, is that somehow it’s morally superior. It’s like Tom’s of Maine products and Ben and Jerry Ice Cream, neither of which are demonstrably superior or even equivalent to other products in the marketplace, yet they’ve both craftily developed successful marketing strategies touting their progressive credentials.
Tom’s frequent mention of the fact that their toothpaste comes in packaging that’s both recyclable and made from recyled paper is a good example. I know for a fact that EVERY toothpaste brand uses pretty much the same type of packaging, but the average Crest or Colgate customer isn’t persuaded to use either product by that claim; Tom’s customers are, and Tom’s knows it.
Now, that’s an example of capitalism at work.
Still…whenever I go into the grocery store, organic produce is consistently smaller, more mealy looking and considerably more expensive than non-organic produce.
I have no kick with those who wish to buy and consume only organically grown products, nor the farmers who grow them to supply that demand. It is a free country, after all. What I don’t like are the efforts made to make me feel as though I’m somehow less of a person or immoral if I don’t go exlusively organic.
As an aside…I grow a lot of my own vegetables – us suburbanites with houses on 1/3 of an acre lots can do that, you know – and I’m a firm believer in chemicals. Triazanon and Miracle Grow all the way, baby!
The Piper
Now that I think of it…the fact that I grow much of my own produce probably qualifies me as being more progressive than those of you who don’t. After all, I’m living off the land, decreasing my carbon footprint by less trips to the store, and implicitly refusing to participate in an oppressive, corporate-farm-dominated economic system.
Maybe I should become a real progressive, like Ghandi, and start spinning my own thread and yarn, weaving my own cloth, and making my own clothes? Then again maybe not…Me in a dhoti wouldn’t be a pleasent sight.
The Piper
@22
I asked S-choir what is his definition of “capitalism.” What has that to do with fascism??? Or do you equate the two?
Ah, I misread your question (added the word “it”). I am the putz. Fascism is when the government is controlled by corporations. Capitalism is a system where financial capital is allowed to drive markets. You move from capitalism to fascism when you start to believe that government has no justification for establishing rules in the capitalist system. After that happens, it’s not long before corporations run the government.
Your smoking analogy fails. There are decades of research establishing a link between tobacco and any number of respiratory diseases. Not so non-organically grown food and anything other than more of it being grown to feed the world.
That’s true, but it has nothing to do with what you said. You made a ridiculous comparison and I pointed it out. The most compelling reasons for consuming organic foods isn’t the nutritional value, but the environmental impact.
The hoax of organic farming, to me, is that somehow it’s morally superior. It’s like Tom’s of Maine products and Ben and Jerry Ice Cream, neither of which are demonstrably superior or even equivalent to other products in the marketplace, yet they’ve both craftily developed successful marketing strategies touting their progressive credentials.
Not using pesticides clearly has environmental advantages. Whether or not you consider that morally superior is a personal judgment.
Still…whenever I go into the grocery store, organic produce is consistently smaller, more mealy looking and considerably more expensive than non-organic produce.
Yet Daddy Love is far from the only person who finds that they taste better. In fact, I hear that a lot about organic foods. Are they all just saying that because they want to believe it? It’s possible, I guess.
I have no kick with those who wish to buy and consume only organically grown products, nor the farmers who grow them to supply that demand. It is a free country, after all. What I don’t like are the efforts made to make me feel as though I’m somehow less of a person or immoral if I don’t go exlusively organic.
Maybe I missed the comment where someone tried to do that. I don’t eat organic foods myself and I’ve never once been chastised for it.
As an aside…I grow a lot of my own vegetables – us suburbanites with houses on 1/3 of an acre lots can do that, you know – and I’m a firm believer in chemicals. Triazanon and Miracle Grow all the way, baby!
More power to you. I actually have enough room in my city yard to do that, but I just don’t care. I can walk to a supermarket.
Guzzo is a gift to us liberal bloggers; he gives us so much great material. Maybe he should start the church of Dixieology; he seems to worship her so much. As I recall her popularity dropped like a rock once she took office and she was defeated in the primary when she ran for re-election.
In 1975, the Ol’ Piper was a business agent for the then-Tacoma local of the Service Employees International Union.
I will now pause while many of you regain consciousness…
Then Secretary-Treasurer of the Pierce County Central Labor Council, Pete Peterson, brought Dixie Lee Ray to every office on the building and introduced her as labor’s candidate for governor in 1976. On election night, I remember him (he was a huge moose of a man) right behind her with his hands on her hips as she led a bunny hop dance line in celebration of her victory.
Dixie defeated John Spellman in the 1976 governor’s race, but her term was highly controversial since she, herself, was highly controversial. If you liked Harry Truman’s outspokeness, you would have loved Dixie.
She was defeated in the 1980 primary by, of all people, Jim McDermott who went on to have his head handed to him statewide by John Spellman in his second attempt at the office.
Mt. St. Helens erupted during her term, and it serves as an effective metaphor for her political style.
BTW…she wasn’t a zoologist although she taught it at the UW; she had a PhD in marine biology from Stanford University.
Democrats of her era and thinking include someone like Henry Jackson, but she bears little, if any, resemblance to the Democrats of today. Then again, neither does Scoop Jackson.
The Piper
First of all, it is Dixy Lee Ray, not Dixie. Second, Guzzo talks about honest science? Ray was a scientist, and she was chuckablock full of opinions, but she was no more an expert in agriculture than I am. She had a garden on Fox Island? Dixy was honest enough that I doubt she would make the claim that Guzzo makes for her. As for her popularity, she was elected the same year as Jimmy Carter, another outsider in the first election after Watergate. She was remembered around here as the director of the Pacific Science Center, an institution that held and still holds a warm place in the heart of lots of folks. Her tenure as head of the Atomic Energy Commission was less well known, but this was all pre-WPPSS and nuclear power was held in higher regard than now. Once elected, her popularity plummeted because she treated the Olympia press with disdain and the legislature with contempt and couldn’t get anything accompished.
@27…RL…
Dixy, not Dixie…correct…My bad.
Elected the same year as Carter, governed like Carter, who pissed off the press and Democrats in Congress, and tossed out of office like Carter.
Who can forget the scene at the 1980 Democratic National Convention of Jimmy Carter, having secured re-nomination, chasing Teddy Kennedy, who hated him and ran against him for the nomination, in order to shake his hand with Teddy running even harder – quite a feet for him even in those days – to avoid the encounter.
Dixy was very pro-nuclear power. Yet, while she wasn’t an agricultural scientist or an agronomist, she was well versed in the scientific method and probably able to spot a scientific fraud when she saw one.
BTW…don’t many “scientists” on the left express opinions on matters well beyond their areas of primary expertise?
The Piper
#22 — Organic fertilizer is not oil based, Piper. If you cannot see the advantage in that, then I feel sorry for you.
And I was simply telling you that YOUR concept of Capitalism is faulty. Lee was telling you that the corporatist/statist economy (that you seem to favor) that nowadays masquerades as free market capitalism, more closely resembles fascism than capitalism.
Why are you so dense?
If you want a good description of what post modern capitalism is and , in addition, what it could be, read: ‘The Soul of Capitalism’, by William Greider. Or, read some old John Bircher pamphlet you’ve got lying around the house. Whatever invisible hand blows your skirt up.
IMPEACH EARL WARREN!!!! Right , Piper?
11: Piper, to see really good organic produce, you’ve got to go to a place like PCC, where it’s always super fresh and lookin’ and tastin’ goood. You’re probably seeing organics at places like Safeway, where the effort to stock such is half-hearted and it sits for a long time because people seeking organic don’t go to Safeway for it. They already know places like PCC is where it’s at for awesome freshness and good stuff. It IS more expensive because it’s more labor-intensive, but honestly the best store produce I’ve eaten comes from the organic section at PCC. Really, really good stuff.
And let’s not forget farmer’s markets either. My wife and I hit farmer’s markets whenever possible. And as for good organic stuff, I ususally ask those farmers that advertise their wares as organic if they’re certified by Oregon Tilth. Those that are, well, we become loyal customers of theirs. Oregon Tilth-certification is prety much the organic equivalent of being declared ‘kosher’.
And as for organics not looking as pretty as regular store-bought produce, you have to remember that store-bought stuff is deisgned to look good and survive long trips to market more than taste good. And besides, to borrow the words of Alton Brown of the Food Network, that ugly, lumpy tomato at the farmer’s stand, PCC or Whole Paycheck…er, Whole Foods will probably be the best tasting one you’ve ever had.
Oh, and Lou Guzzo can still go fuck himself. He still has the offical permission of the State of Nevada to go do as such.