As of 4:50PM, with about 64 percent of the recount in, Rossi has expanded his lead by 55 votes to build an eye-popping 316 vote margin. I haven’t bothered to do the math myself, but according to the OCD people at Sound Politics, this actually represents a net shrinkage in Rossi’s projected margin. Go figure.
While I find their continued implication that a corrupt King County might throw the election to be, well, silly, Sound Politics still gets credit for the obscure vocabulary word of the day: “haruspex“.
Anyway… still waiting for King County to report.
(FYI… I’m just pulling the latest results from the Secretary of State’s web site, whenever I get around to it.)
Barring a miracle the likes of the Virgin Mary Grilled Cheese Sandwich, I am not optimistic. (Back to 25 for Don Rossi)
That’s a good one Aaron. Too bad Mr. Berendt ate his grilled cheese sandwich instead of wearing it around his neck.
Well it is a bit of a ride so far- there are strange swings in Adams, Cowlitz – how are they counting. If Gregoire swings closer, a handcount might answer some of the mystery – by contrast King County is totally on camera with prosecuters on the counting board- and the R;s are just coming unglued. Just read- ” the voters who can’t follow instructions are disenfranchising the rest of us”……
Panic about what King will change. Blame the bad voters- the ones who so foolishly thught circling the name was a betters and clearer way of signaling intent – whew
Look at the “enhanced” ballots in the other major counties- 514 in Pierce, 261 in Spokane- and 167 more ballots in Skagit. Process- or some nefarious plot…
PROCESS!!!
Improvements on the way…hopefully. Sam Reed has to show some leadership the next 2 years and address some of the warts.
We need to make sure all legitimate ballots are counted…now and in the future. We also need some standards. Rudy, that might mean some of your collegues may need to take a moment to understand what is required of them as a voter. How about starting with some proof that they are who they say they are. Actually, let’s go a giant step back and make sure all registered voters are legitimate and meet voter registration requirements. Seems reasonable. Rudy keeps screeching the Leftist mantra. Counting any illegitimate vote has the same negative consequences as not counting a legitimate one. We must have better internal controls and require certain things from registered voters…like ID> How many out-of-staters are registered here and there??? What do we do to prevent that? How many people did vote more than 1 ballot? Shouldn’t we do as much to prevent these illegitimate things from happening and worrying about “intent” of Legitimate voters????
IT’s time to clean up DODGE!!
Whitman has a report at its site- Gregoire lost 10, Rossi lost 5 (net gain for Rossi of 5 on the margin), Bennett lost 1…
Comment by Jim King— 11/23/04 @ 3:57 pm
Well, I don’t smell a rat with ballot enhancement as long as generally accepted procedures are used. That said, I truly want this to be the VERY LAST time it’s done for the idiots who can’t read directions. Especially the morons circling their ballots, using Xs, etcetera. My .02.
Sorry Jim SoundPolitics.com is sliming you. Yuk!
Hope you never get the shakes that bad Joe. And if you did, your friends and neighbors would not despise you and take away your civil rights in such a shrill and petty viscious fashion. Idiots- too mean for me.Like a pack of jackels howling……the new mantra, sure to win elections and serve the public and body politic, oh the fucking idiot voters. Can’t read, can’t follow directions, such lesser beings. Certainly would not make good soliders or parents, must not go to church or have any formal education.
Frankly- keep out of the Democratic party. You make me sick. The compassionate conservative R’s need this as a wedge issue in two years- See how many votes we can disenfranchise, shrink the tent to the real elite.
Never guess your ancestors didn’t speak English.
Comment by rudy— 11/23/04 @ 7:40 pm
SO FOLLOWING DIRECTIONS IS TOO TOUGH FOR YOU? HEY, I saw the pictures of the 22 Nov. Monday Seattle Times story “Judge says no to GOP” of circled ballots and check-marked ballots. That wasn’t the act of a shaky person – just see the pics and report back.
I will not let you accuse me of such things as being bigoted for insisting that people follow directions. Besides, ballots can be printed in many native languages. Did you know that?
Rudy is certainly consistent. When people disagree with him they are racist, bigot, homophobs etc. etc. Rudy went out of his way to ram his gayness in everyone’s face. How would any of us even know unless he made it an issue. An angry gay male…get a grip Rudy. The world is passing you by. Seems like no standards Rudy is happy with that…so his ilk can keep counting ballots until they win. The end justifies the means son’t it Rudy. You need some “chill pills” Dude.
If Rudy’s gay, that’s okay. That said, I have serious problems with his attitude. I have no problem with exceptions to rules and have said repeatedly that I want the enforcement of the rules to start with the NEXT election.
If somebody’s got medical problems, then I’m certain that THEY can ask somebody they trust to fill out their ballot for their review before signature. Or should go to the polling place and do a touch screen vote.
No folks I am as mellow a person as you will ever meet. Love myself, great education, some assets, hundreds of contacts and friends, having lived her for years and being very involved.
I did not call voters idiots, you did. Part of my Pledge to my community is to come out in all situations. My process, no apology. Lets ge back to the election.
After King counts 860,000 plus ballots even a minimal break will give Gregoire some gains- if they look like Grant or Cowlitz- wow, could be big time, just from slop. Then add 710 – sorry to tell the tone deaf the the symphony will be playing—
Since I have no inroads to the R party and its august leaders, and the post here seem to really emotional vs thoughtful…..what will Rossi and the Bush agents now in Washington do?
Suggest they will go to the paid hand count- and try to kep bellowing into the cameras. Comments out there from TV folks that Vannie would not like to hear. He is not a media wonder, keep him on stage and bellowing in the Barry Gibb ranges.
By the way, in Seattle geing gay is not ramming anything. Totally OK, of no grat interest since there are tens of thousand of us here in all job, neighborhood and across all classes and communities. Thee is a group of gay Jehovah
Wittness folk and Lesbain swimmers.
THE FAT IS IN THE FIRE AND- LOOK CHRISSEY IS EATING VERY NICE BACON SANDWITCHES-OH, SAVE A FEW FOR THE TRANSITION TEAM CHRISSEY…….GO GO GO, AND FREE TURKEYS FOR ALL DEMOCRATIC VOTERS
Josef… so what’s the problem? This is not fraud or subjective inference of voter intent. This is voters marking their ballots clearly, but in ways that were not machine readable. Why should their votes be thrown out in this election or in the next because they didn’t (or couldn’t) follow directions completely?
The will of the voter is more important than the convenience of the vote counter.
R’s are making a big deal out of nothing on this issue, and perceived voter suppression is stupid PR. Look at it this way… let’s say you were in one of those little precincts in NH we see vote at midnight on the news, with paper ballots counted by hand. The instructions say “mark the box with an X” but you put a single slash through yours… do you think they’ll discard your vote? Of course not.
The only reason this issue of “ballot reproduction” comes up is because we use inflexible, imperfect machines to automate the vote count. Meeting the needs of cranky machines is not reason enough to disenfranchise voters.
Goldy,
Here’s my problem and it goes something like this: I read my directions and I play fair because I want my vote to count. You probably do, too. Now, I’ve said before that I want ALL darn recounts in this farce to accept these ballots. But AFTER that, I want it made crystalline clear: You don’t follow directions, your vote doesn’t count. I’m not asking for must here: Just fill in the circle.
Otherwise, let’s do it your way. Checkmarks, Xs and the like. But just put that in the directions and enhance the darned things BEFORE the recount!!
I hope you see my beef.
Josef
P.S. If I didn’t follow directions in New Hampshire, I’d have my ballot thrown out.
Goldy,
Here’s my problem and it goes something like this: I read my directions and I play fair because I want my vote to count. You probably do, too. Now, I’ve said before that I want ALL darn recounts in this farce to accept these ballots. But AFTER that, I want it made crystalline clear: You don’t follow directions, your vote doesn’t count. I’m not asking for much here: Just fill in the circle.
Otherwise, let’s do it your way. Checkmarks, Xs and the like. But just put that in the directions and enhance the darned things BEFORE the recount!!
I hope you see my beef.
Josef
P.S. If I didn’t follow directions in New Hampshire, I’d have my ballot thrown out.
Comment by Josef— 11/24/04 @ 8:55 am
No Josef, I don’t see your beef.
The instructions are there to help make the count go as smoothly as possible, not trip up voters with ADD or Parkinsons. This is a user interface problem, and no UI is going to be 100% intuitive to 100% of the people.
Furthermore, I fail to see the harm in manually discerning the voter intent of a ballot where the little circle was not completely filled in. What problem, exactly, are you trying to solve here?
And yes, if you put a slash through the box instead of an X, I’m pretty sure your neighbors in Dixville Notch NH would still count your vote.
MY problem is that King County now knows EXACTLY how many Gregoire votes they have to “find.” Perhaps it would be more fair to withhold recount totals statewide and announce them only when the recount is complete. Let’s face it: the King County Elections Department is not known for how efficient it is.
Also, with all those “surgically” enhanced ballots, should a hand recount be requested, there is no longer any way to re-assess what the voter intended. The voter’s intent has now been decided by a committee and that committee’s decision now becomes fact, which may or may not be what the voter originally intended.
There is absolutely no argument for counting ballots that contain errors due to voter mistakes. As the US and Washington State Constitutions read (and our founding forefather’s intent is clear):
“Any voter who through willful intent, negligence, incapability or incompetence does not follow the precise instructions as set forth by the local voting procedures, regardless of any perceived or obvious intent, shall forfeit his right to vote and his right to representation.”
Clearly, we should have a voting test (or maybe tolls), just like they did in the South (and still allow in the case of some very backwards Red states.)
“Any voter who through willful intent, negligence, incapability or incometence doe snot follow the precise instructions on
Aaron–That a boy!!! Nothing like the facts, Law and Constitution to screw up the Leftists “end justifies any means” approach to just about everything.
Goldy, as I’ve written before, I’m not alleging organized corruption. I do have concerns about what appears to be a sloppy process that lacks controls and permits individuals to break the rules more easily than it should. Also, the “enhanced” ballot business seems to allow more personal discretion to divine the intent of the voter than appropriate.
As far as making fun of me for being better at math than you are, well, I thought it was the Bush voters who were supposed to be the anti-intellectual morons.
Oh Stefan… I wasn’t making fun of your ability to do the math… I was making fun of you for doing it. It just seemed a little obsessive, in the way that some baseball fans get about statistics. That said, I respected your work enough to report it and credit you (if with a backhanded compliment.)
Maybe not. But you are clearly implying it with your comments of “surgically enhanced” ballots and a “haruspex” on the canvassing board. (Again, great word.)
When people hear about “enhanced” ballots, or “ballot replication” it sounds shady. But it is really an artifact of an imperfect technology that is used to automate the counting process. If all ballots were counted by hand, like they once were, all ballots would be subject to discretion.
Whoa there, Cynic-la-di-da… are you only cynical of people who disagree with you? You’re just willing to believe Aaron somehow caught me on “the facts” because he puts something in quotation marks, but doesn’t bother to cite the reference?
Perhaps that’s in a constitution somewhere, but it certainly ain’t in the US or WA constitutions.
I think Aaron may have been putting that forth as how he believes the intent of the founding fathers should be divined. But I really wish those founding fathers had been a bit more precise….
I don’t know if anyone is still reading this thread, but, WHOA! hold your horses, that was SARCASM! Are founding fathers would not write anything so ridiculous. It is amazing to me that conservatives thought that
a. I was serious.
b. That it was a good idea.
Man, we’re screwed.
Aaron,
A) Sarcasm can be difficult to discern online, and
B) Truth is, your comments didn’t even come close to some of the really stupid things posted here, so who’s to know?