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Another Market Failure
“Editor, The Times:
“In light of the recent windstorm that was so devastating … it was great to see neighbors helping each other in a time of absolute misery …. Those people should be honored for their generosity and the ability to reach out with a helping hand.
“Now to those who reached out with a greedy hand, a huge Bah, humbug. From the oil companies that jacked the price of gas up anywhere from 10 to 20 cents, the hotels that increased hotel prices by as much as twice the normal amount, and to Waste Management that, knowing many people would have extra bags of trash from getting rid of spoiled food from refrigerators and freezers, still insisted that customers would be charged extra for those bags. …
“It is incredibly sad that these companies couldn’t take a hint from the communities around them …. Here was the perfect opportunity for them to finally do the ‘right thing’ … but they didn’t. All they saw were dollar signs.
“To hear the attorney general’s office say that it wasn’t price gouging, it was just good ol’ capitalism at its best, was nothing short of shameful.
— Barbara Rasaie, Redmond”
Quoted under Fair use; If you want to read the original, give Frank Blethen a hand and buy the fucking paper! Or read it free on the Seattle Times web site.
Roger Rabbit Commentary: It goes without saying that our unhelpful attorney general who thinks this price gouging is simply the free market doing its thing is a REPUBLICAN.
For you wingnuts who are too fucking lazy to look it up yourself and want me to spoon-feed you the link, here it is: http://seattletimes.nwsource.c.....ets31.html
They’re probably too busy looking for the execution video on the internet because they want to see Saddam’s eyeballs pop out of their sockets when he drops.
Hey Roger,
Can you tell me what the basic principals of supply and demand are? Regardless of whether or not these principals are considered to be “Moral” or “Ethical” by you or your comrades, it is what drives our economy. I don’t hear you bitching about the way Toyota is inflating the market for it’s Hybrid cars, by not producing the exact amount that the public wants. I know, I am just a simpleton compared to the almighty rabbit, but I just returned from a Vacation in Europe. Tell you what, when our gas prices are even close to theirs, then I will bitch (3 Euro for a litre).
Oh yeah, it was a pleasure to watch Saddam hang, but I saw it quite a long time ago on Drudge.
Also in the Fish Wrapper, John Moe of Federal Way — after dutifully proclaiming his obligatory love of trees, says trees “do not belong under the power lines!” (Why not? They were here first.) And then argues we should adopt the Canadian model of denuding the land:
“A few years ago during one of the outages, I saw that one of the crews working near our home was from Canada. I asked them if they didn’t have the same problems there from this storm and they said, ‘No, if there are trees on our right of way, we just cut!'”
Moe then argues the law of eminent domain “should give the power company the authority to cut or trim as it sees fit.”
Roger Rabbit Commentary: Why do you hate the small furry creatures who live in and under trees, John? If you hate trees so much, go live in Haiti. They don’t have any trees there.
Dennis Cheasebro of Seattle has an alternative suggestion: ” … underground all power lines (the better to see the trees).”
Robert Rasmussen of Seattle asks, ” … could you tree owners spring for, say, an 8,000-watt generator for me?”
Roger Rabbit Commentary: This guy manages to hate trees and ask for a free generator in only 13 words. He must be a Republican.
A voice of reason, Ian Pierce of Seattle, asks, “And what’s the cost of undergrounding, compared to replacing our overhead power lines in an emergency, bringing in workers from thousands of miles around, feeding them, and overtime? … This is a conversation our community, utility and civic leaders should have.”
On the flip side, a voice of unreason (I’m giving equal time here), Don Vandervelde of Gig Harbor, blames “using monopolies instead of competitive markets. We see it in our inadequate highway and school systems. It inevitably yields poor service and high prices.”
Roger Rabbit Commentary: Just what we need, another ideologue who thinks a free market is the solution to everything. Then we’ll have 3 or 4 sets of utility poles and power lines uglifying our neighborhoods instead of just 1, and the lights will go out not because of stormy weather but because companies run each other into bankruptcy in a business in which nobody can make any money.
Lee Bates of Kirkland says we’ve gone soft, and now the power is back up: “Our remote-control gadgets can once again power our three-car garage doors for families of 2.2 that inhabit 6,000-square-foot McMansions.” Along the same vein, Edna Peak of Des Moines says we should set aside our “bitter complaining” and “lighten up and appreciate what we have in this land of plenty.”
Roger Rabbit Commentary: We’ve lost our connection to our roots. The 21st century American has no idea what it’s like to go outside at 5 a.m. to chop wood for the stove to heat up the house. How many of today’s kids have ever had to get the fire going before their parents get up? Or milk the cow in a cold barn before breakfast? Try living in a fucking rabbit hole sometime — yeah, yeah, I know what you’re gonna say … it’s all well and good for YOU to criticize Mr. Rabbit, sitting down there in your hole with forced air heat, satellite TV, a computer, and heated swimming pool … well what the fuck? That’s what the stock market is for, assholes. Do you expect me to spend my whole life in the cold damp hole I was raised in? But I digress. Lee and Edna are right, you humans have all gone soft. What’re ya gonna do when the oil and gas runs out? ha ha ha Then we rabbits will teach you humans a thing or three about living in holes. HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR HAR
Now I can’t wait until we see America’s war criminals suffer a trial, conviction and hopefully the same fate!
I saw it quite a long time ago on Drudge.
Whenever anyone cites Drudge as a source, it is entirely appropriate to laugh mercilessly at that person.
And “quite a long time ago”?? Are you a mayfly? Perspective, people. Perspective.
@4 I’m merely pointing out that free market mechanisms fail us the worst when we need fair pricing the most. That’s why we need government regulation to prevent price gougers from profiting from misery during emergencies. What’s so unfair about keeping a few greedy jerks from unjustly enriching themselves from the misfortune of the many?
Price is merely one of many methods of rationing. Let’s say flashlight batteries and car chains are in short supply during a storm. The ethical stores didn’t raise prices; they sold what they had, and ordered more. In this case, scarce goods were rationed on a first-come, first-served basis.
Under the wingnut model of anything-goes pirate capitalism, raising prices is encouraged, and those who get the batteries and chains are selected on the basis of who has the most money. In addition, unconscionable price gouging is dressed up as respectable by re-labeling it as “supply and demand.” We’re supposed to believe that some abstract, impersonal “invisible hand” is picking our pockets, instead of the greedy asshole behind the counter. Fuck that, and fuck you!
The trouble with the wingnut economic model is that it doesn’t make a single additional battery or set of chains available. It simply lifts money from our pockets, which is the objective of all wingnutism — to get money from us without working for it or giving any value in return. More batteries and chains eventually will arrive, but not until they’re not needed anymore.
We’re not talking here about the normal functioning of markets in efficiently allocating resources and producing competitively priced products. We’re talking about price gouging, jerk! We’re talking about selfish bastards taking advantage of the extremity of their neighbors to line their own pockets, like the guys with Jeeps who go out in snowstorms and pull cars out of ditches for $50 a pop. In the Thanksgiving Snowstorm of some years back, I went up on Boeing Hill in Burien and did it free, until the for-profit hyenas showed up and ran me off. I rescued 20 cars that night, and didn’t charge any of them a dime, although several grateful drivers pressed $5 bills into my hand over my protestations — and a couple of stupid ones refused my offer of help because they assumed I wanted money. One jackass refused to let anyone help him move his stalled car even though he was blocking an intersection and had a bus with 40 passengers and two dozen cars backed up behind him. It’s not easy being a Good Samaritan because of the stupid jerks out there. You free-market guys can have those antisocial idiots — and feel free to gouge them all you want, because they’ve got it coming.
As for whether Waste Management should charge people extra for picking up garbage cans overflowing with spoiled food, before I answer that question I would like to know whether Waste Management already has this expense built into their utility commission approved rates. I know they employ damn smart lawyers and accountants, and I doubt very much they missed this on their way through the rate-setting process. I’ll bet if you go back and read the public testimony transcripts, you’ll find the garbage company representatives saying things like “historical experience demonstrates that we can expect X number of storms resulting in Y amount of extra garbage pickup therefore we need to factor in Z number of dollars in our rates to cover this cost.” In which case, they’re charging their customers twice for the same service if they get away with sticking people with these bills. Ditto the power companies; what do you think the chances are that periodic outages and repairs aren’t already factored into the customer bills?
5 Union Fireman says: Oh yeah, it was a pleasure to watch Saddam hang, but I saw it quite a long time ago on Drudge.
12/31/2006 at 10:15 am
How can that be? It happened only yesterday. Oh, I forgot, Drudge fakes news stories and photoshops pictures, like his bullshit about Kerry having an affair with an intern.
Citing Drudge is evidence that a person is insensitive to the credibility/truthfulness of the sources he relies on for the information he uses to form his opinions.
Drudge does sludge, not information. .
I’ll bet if only one gas station in the whole city was open and that guy charged wingnuts $50 a gallon for gas to run their generators, they’d be screaming bloody murder and demanding government intervention.
O O O O AAAAAAAAAAAAHHH!!!! O AAAH OOOO AAAAH! OOOOGA OOOOGA!
Rodent @2:
The irony in you calling someone else lazy is comical to say the least. See anyone else here on this site as much as you are on it doing nothing but sitting behind a computer all day at home in your bathrobe ranting your delusional opinions and spewings? I’d suspect you’d go insane if your internet went down for even an hour. My advice to you is to seek professional help from someone in a white-coat. Good luck finding that life you’re looking for bunny-boy.
When is Bush’s trial to begin?
Treason, lying to congress, corruption, breaking FISA law, dereliction of duty, and the list goes on. How many laws did that judge in Michigan say he broke? Dozens?
I am no Saddam fan, Saddam was an asshole. The problem is he was our asshole. Reagan gave him help acquiring chemical weapons. We never even thanked him for attacking Iran in a proxy war for us. Heck Rummy even shook his hand.
Without the help of our government Saddam would not have made it.
Face it.
When did a judge in Michigan have a trial with President Bush as the defendant?
And he was found guilty of treason, lying to congress, conrruption, breaking laws, etc, ad nauseum………..????
America is NOT responsible for the murderer Saddam, he is responsible for himself.
U.S. Troop Deaths In Iraq Reach 3,000 Mark
As I predicted in a previous thread, the number of U.S. miltiary deaths in Iraq reached 3,000 in 2006. The 3000th fatality was a soldier from Texas killed in Baghdad on Thursday. This figure does not include U.S. civilian deaths.
15 Getting to you, huh Mark? Truth hurts, does it? Good! As for my being lazy, that’s nonsense. It’s hard work to educate you fools.
17 Sorry, Mac, but your rightwing heroes armed him and egged him on. Saddam is another wingnut sideshow gone awry. Once again, the rightwingers miscalculated their ability to control one of their tinpot despots, just as they did with Noriega and Osama. Just because you guys sponsor these thugs doesn’t mean you can control them.
One of the many ironies about the righties is that they trumpet the virtues of unfettered free markets, but what they deliver once they’re in power is sanctioned monopolies and corporate handouts from the public purse. In the context of the present discussion, that means that for FEMA to sponsor emergency preparations is regarded as oh, so horrible, but to shell out tons of cash to Halliburton under no-bid contracts to to a hack job after the fact is perfectly OK.
Hey, “Unionfireman”…if you really are a firefighter, I hope you didn’t choose your career because you like to see dead people.
Sorry Roger,
I’m not buying into it. That’s like saying Smith and Wesson are responsible for everyone killed with one of their guns.
Saddam didn’t need any egging on from anyone – he was one terribly sick and corrupt bastard who controlled everyone’s lives, but his own. He drank liquor, had mistresses (killed one of them with his bare hands in front of her child) and broke every law in Iraq and violated every religious law imaginable.
He delighted in torture, murder and mayhem. Hanging him was too simple and he was so undeserving of any compassion. The Iraqi’s should have made a list of his sins and with him imprisoned – they should have performed every sicko torture of his on HIM – slowly……. until he begged for a merciful death!
23 And that would have accomplished what? It wouldn’t undo any of the atrocities he committed. It just would have dragged everyone else down towards his level of depravity.
It would have accomplished him feeling the same pain that he inflicted on thousands. It is called justice – an eye for a eye. If you can inflict pain – you’d better be able to take pain back. School yard bullies are real tough – until they get THEIR asses kicked. Once they feel the pain themselves – they learn not to inflict it. If there was more of it in today’s world, we wouldn’t have the crime that we do currently.
Why persist in the nonsense of being nice to him – he doesn’t deserve it – he didn’t earn it. You say it would just drag everyone else down to his level, there is time for everything in this world. Not everyone needs to be reformed, helped and otherwise bribed into being nice to the rest of society. Some people are so wicked – they are beyond helping. They are the ones that society owes them them the same hell that they inflicted.
23 “Saddam … drank liquor, had mistresses … and broke every law … and violated every religious law imaginable. He delighted in torture, murder and mayhem. …”
In other words, he was just like a typical Republican.
25 Who said anything about being nice to him?
@26 Roger,
Leave it to you to make me laugh!
@27,
Darryl and ArtFart want to be nice to him…. Skagit is also crying over Saddam having his neck snapped and is upset at the Iraqi’s in Everett highlighted on the TV news as celebrating. Life in prison indeed!
Union Fireman @ #4 – If you’re so in favor of “price gauging” because it meets the criteria of “supply and demand”, why would you state that you would “bitch” only if the cost exceeded what is paid in Europe? Based on your comment you should be happy with any price, so long as it falls under “supply and demand” criteria, regardless of the cost to you. And by the way, why was the cost of gas so cheap just before the election, if it’s all about “supply and demand”? “Supply and demand” is a hoax.
Heathen – There’s one for mycollection:
“Supply and demand” is a hoax.”
Thanks…
Actually Roger, the hanging happened the Day BEFORE yesterday. There is this thing called time zones.
As for Price Gouging, I don’t hear you complaining about the Union Workers who benefit from storms like this. After all, their wages go up, after having worked 40 hours, they usually get Overtime. Then, many get weekend pay, travel pay, per diem, height pay (for linemen that have to climb the towers) can’t forget about those who get more pay because they work “X” amount of days without a 2 day holiday. Your hypocrisy is, as always, evident.
As far as you helping those poor stranded motorists, good for you. The question I would ask, is why were they stranded? Maybe driving in conditions that they shouldn’t be? Maybe inexperience in driving on the ice or snow? You look at it as a good deed. From a public Safety stand point, you are barely above them. Why? Well, they are already stuck or spun out. Traffic is really bad and accidents are happening all over. Rather than staying at home, the mighty Rabbit decides to save the day and put yet another car on the road. Increasing the likelihood of yet another accident. In my profession we call those that were out driving when they shouldn’t be… Job Security. Thanks.
Redneck – since you’ve taken my word so litterally, maybe you should explain why the price of gas sunk like a rock in water just before the electioin (only less than 2 months ago) and now all of a sudden there is a supply and demand problem and that’s why the price is going up. Maybe you should start a collection of your own stupidity, start by taking a picture of yourself and put it into a scrap book.
Heather,
Primarily because the cost of gasoline in Europe is so high due to taxes. Rather than let the economy rule, they have all of these wonderful social welfare programs, paid for by exorbitantly high taxes. Oh yeah, and the unemployment rate is so much higher over there too. So why would I bitch once the price of Gas got that high? Because it would most likely be due to an increase in taxes, rather than a decrease in supply. And if supply and demand is such a hoax, then why is it still taught in economics classes?
Oh yeah and Heather, they grown ups are talking, please, go sit at the kiddie table.
My reference to supply and demand was in reference to the subject matter at hand. When I stated that supply and demand is a hoax, it was in reference to price gauging of gasoline, not universally to the economics as a whole….you still haven’t explained the big drop in price right before the election and now the increase. You grown ups get back to what you were doing – crying about taxes….who pays your salary – the TAXMAN.
Smeg:He delighted in torture, murder and mayhem.
Sounds like Bush doesn’t it? Shall we hang him?
This new year I am extremely grateful for the leadership of George Bush and all of our troops in Iraq for bringing Saddam (Yes one of the biggest Terrorists who killed or had killed millions in his own country and terrorized the rest) to his rightful end. It could not have happened to a more deserving individual.
A Very happy New Year for Iraq and the USA!
Uhh… gas prices went down because supply went up.
As you may recall, there was a big wind in the gulf of Mesko the previous summer. I think it was called “Katrina”. It destroyed dozens of oil rigs and damanged some onshore refineries…
Some men in plaid shirts and boots put the rigs back together and started pumping oil again. More men in plaid shirts and boots fixed the refineries.
More oil + more refinery capacity = lower prices.
Understand?
Mark the Worm-
And the reason they jumped up after the election?
Also, you never replied from an earlier post about my choices. Did it make your poor misogynistic head explode considering that a happy marriage between two liberals could experience financial and personal success?
Pig.
And now the increase in price is due to what? Warmer weather and the need for less home heating oil? Or did taxes go up as Mr. Fireman likes to speculate about. Keep believing that it’s all about supply and demand (in this case with gasoline) – you’ll be fine.
Redneck #38 – One more thing – refinery capacity did not change because of Katrina.
SgmMac: I agree with you. Furball missed the earlier posts where the CIA in 1963 and 1968 placed Saddam in power. But then again Furball is a dumb schmuck!
http://www.fantompowa.net/Flame/cia_iraq.htm
Of course Furball only believes in selective URL, cuz facts hurt the libtard mind!
Now that the turd covered cotton tail needs washing, NEXT?
Furball @26:
Mel I like them Young Girls Reynolds
Ted I leave them DEAD Kennedy
are Republicans?
Union Fireman says: Actually Roger, the hanging happened the Day BEFORE yesterday. There is this thing called time zones.
Union Fireman: You have to forgive Furball. He is an IDIOT. It was Friday at 7:00 PM our time when Saddam died. But the “rabbit” is so fucking dumb not to understand GMT!
Makes one wonder how this IDIOT became a lawyer!
Mark bring me a boy paige Foley
Ted I hate fags, oh but I am one. My wife’s a whore Hagard
Richard I’m not a criminal Nixon
Jack is the President available
Heathen Sinner says: Redneck – since you’ve taken my word so litterally, maybe you should explain why the price of gas sunk like a rock in water just before the electioin (only less than 2 months ago) and now all of a sudden there is a supply and demand problem and that’s why the price is going up. Maybe you should start a collection of your own stupidity, start by taking a picture of yourself and put it into a scrap book.
From Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O.....4_and_2005
“Late summer 2006 decreases
Oil prices began to decrease at the end of the summer of 2006, closing below US$66/barrel on September 11.[16] The U.S. national average gas price dropped to US$2.70/gallon in early September, down US$0.11 from the previous week. Some cities were seeing average prices below US$2.40/gallon.[17]
As of September, prices continue to fall, and the average cost of gasoline per gallon (U.S. nationwide) is below US$2.50. On September 19, crude oil fell US$2.14 to a 6-month low of US$61.66. The recent significant fall in the price of crude oil has led some to speculate that price of gasoline may fall to as low as $1.15/gallon[18] By October 3, the price closed at US$58.68, its lowest close since mid-February. [19] Reasons for the recent price decreases have included easing tensions with Iran, ample supply and the lack of hurricane activity in oil-producing regions of the Gulf of Mexico[citation needed].
After news of North Korea’s successful nuclear test on October 9, 2006, oil prices rose past $60 a barrel, but fell back the next day. Also, for several days in early October, oil prices bounced around the $60 mark on possible news that some OPEC countries would cut oil production by 1,000,000 barrels a day. OPEC had not cut its production since December 2004. However, the oil market has lately seemed to shrug that news off, especially considering that Saudi Arabia said that no such agreement exists (to cut production).
On October 11, oil prices fell below US$58 for the first time since February. Days later, on October 20, a barrel of crude oil closed at US$56.82 per barrel. The same day, OPEC declared that they would cut production by 1.2 million barrels per day in order to arrest the sliding price, the first drop since December 2004.[20]”
Ever heard of a production cut? Prices go up.
Either you live in a bubble or you truly live in Sheol!
Looks like Goldie is blocking Wikipedia links, so:
“Late summer 2006 decreases
Oil prices began to decrease at the end of the summer of 2006, closing below US$66/barrel on September 11.[16] The U.S. national average gas price dropped to US$2.70/gallon in early September, down US$0.11 from the previous week. Some cities were seeing average prices below US$2.40/gallon.[17]
As of September, prices continue to fall, and the average cost of gasoline per gallon (U.S. nationwide) is below US$2.50. On September 19, crude oil fell US$2.14 to a 6-month low of US$61.66. The recent significant fall in the price of crude oil has led some to speculate that price of gasoline may fall to as low as $1.15/gallon[18] By October 3, the price closed at US$58.68, its lowest close since mid-February. [19] Reasons for the recent price decreases have included easing tensions with Iran, ample supply and the lack of hurricane activity in oil-producing regions of the Gulf of Mexico[citation needed].
After news of North Korea’s successful nuclear test on October 9, 2006, oil prices rose past $60 a barrel, but fell back the next day. Also, for several days in early October, oil prices bounced around the $60 mark on possible news that some OPEC countries would cut oil production by 1,000,000 barrels a day. OPEC had not cut its production since December 2004. However, the oil market has lately seemed to shrug that news off, especially considering that Saudi Arabia said that no such agreement exists (to cut production).
On October 11, oil prices fell below US$58 for the first time since February. Days later, on October 20, a barrel of crude oil closed at US$56.82 per barrel. The same day, OPEC declared that they would cut production by 1.2 million barrels per day in order to arrest the sliding price, the first drop since December 2004.[20]”
Oil production is cut just before the election and the effect occurs after the election. They cut 1.2 million barrels which raised the price.
Of course Moonbat!s can’t figure out supply and demand because they receive their economic theory from Michael Moore and other morons!
Clueless/YLB is Wikipedia a right wing site or ones written by many Moonbat!s?
Heathen Sinner: Since Goldie is blocking posts linking to W-i-k-i-p-e-d-i-a, Oil_price_increases_of_2004_and_2005 and visit the Late summer 2006 decreases section!
****Newsflash*******
Next drop in the price of gasoline – November 2008 – Record low prices!
I can’t believe some people actually fell for it….even George is sitting in his rocking chair at the Texas Ranch, asking Laura if it was obvious.
For the Moonbat!s here: Did you forget OPEC did a 1.2 Million barrel a day production cut? This occurred just before the election. The price was around $55 a barrel. They wanted it to stabilize at $60+ a barrel. But then again facts hurt the libtard main as they forget the facts antithetical to their puny arguments.
should be hurt the libtard mind!
37 ” … who killed or had killed millions in his own country …”
Uh, that’s a bit exaggerated. This guy was evil, but not in the same league as Stalin, Hitler, or Pol Pot. He was roughly as noxious as Idi Amin or Slobodan Milosevics.
38 Last time I checked gas prices were back up to around $2.75 (give or take a few pennies) in this area. Did they have another big wind in the Gulf, or are you breaking wind again?
When Bush took office, gas was about a buck. Now it’s $2.75. I guess that’s progress. Sort of. Where the fuck is all this cheap gas you pubbies were gonna steal from Iraq??
42 Democrats are stupid, but not stupid enough to give nerve gas ingredients to someone like Saddam. That kind of stupidity requires a Republican.
44 No, it happened yesterday our time. So how did you see the video on Friday? You got a time warp machine? I know you got a warped brain.
46 Mike Webb SUCKS says: … Since Goldie is blocking posts linking to W-i-k-i-p-e-d-i-a … 12/31/2006 at 4:17 pm
I haven’t had any problem with linking to Wikipedia. Must be operator error on your end.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W.....olitics%29
See? Works fine.
You just need to stop trying to link to non-existent Wikipedia sites in your quixotic effort to validate wingnut conspiracy theories.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O.....4_and_2005
Okay Goldie what word in the post did Eccentric Software filter?
Furball: STUUUUUUUUUUUUUUPIIIIIIIIIIIIIID Moonbat!
@36
Gidget,
I am sorry you lost your buddy Saddam, but honestly there are many other sadistic bastards that you can replace him on your heros list with. Bush isn’t one of them though. President Bush hasn’t tortured or murdered anyone yet. And don’t you fucking dare talk about Abu Ghraib as torture. That stuff is a stroll in the park compared to the unspeakable things that Saddam did.
Furball: Did you like that CIA URL where Kennedy and Johnson approved Saddam coups? Did you like those facts hurting your libtard mind?
Roger,
Okay, one more time for the kiddies.
http://kgmb9.com/kgmb/display......8;sid=1183
http://cbs2chicago.com/topstor.....74438.html
http://www.americanpolitics.com/20061230Koop.html
http://www.komotv.com/news/5037731.html
What do all of these have in common? The date and hour when Saddam was executed. And guess what, not a single one says he was yesterday, our time. It’s okay rabbit, your a liberal, so we will excuse your arrogance and unwillingness to admit that you are wrong.
“Hussein was hanged on the first day of Eid ul-Adha, December 30, 2006 at approximately 06:00 local time (03:00 UTC), and died within a few minutes of the trapdoor’s release. The execution was carried out at “Camp Justice,” an Iraqi army base in Kazimain, a neighbourhood of northeast Baghdad.[41][42]
Hussein was buried at his birthplace of Al-Awja in Tikrit, Iraq, 3 km (2 mi) from his sons Uday and Qusay Hussein, on 31 December 2006 at 04:00 local time (01:00 UTC).[43]”
From Wikepedia. Today is the 31st, yesterday is the 30th, the day before is the 29th. Tell me again how he died on the 30th our time if he died on the 30th Iraq time?
Goldie: Why did you FORGET TO ADMIT Rumsfeld was a civilian when he went to Iraq in 1983?
Another purposeful admission?
MWS, There are two good reasons goldie would ‘forget to admit’ that, depending on your definition of the word civilian. The first would be that he completed his active military duty in 1957 and thus has been a civilian ever since. (secdef is not IN the military, it controls the military). The second is that in 1983, Rumsfeld was acting on behalf of Reagan in the capacity as Special envoy to the middle east in that photo.
I am assuming you meant ommision rather than admission there.
@19 Rodent:
Getting to me? HAR-HAR-HAR as your little brain likes to say. Not on your little bunny life. Your insane rantings are hardly worth a passing glance let alone consideration. I don’t tend to listen to those with below average IQ’s. When you offer any genuine ideas or suggestions of your own, then I might listen. But, you do nothing but blame and bash without offering any contrasting ideas as to how to solve things. Bitter angry little Rodent, it’l be OK. You live in Twatshington, Quenn Crissy will be sure to protect your undeserved benefits- rest assured.
Smeg, so you’re now the expert on torture and Abu Ghraib?
You must be one of Bush’s primary advisors . . . considering the way he’s conducting the war. BTW, is your expertise on torture based on your own use of it?
It is almost ridiculous to talk to someone so uninformed and ignorant as you.
BTW, if I were looking for another sadist bastard, I’d look no further than you and Bush. . . in fact, there are plenty of sadistic bastards to be had on the right.
Bill: He was a civilian. That’s all Goldie had to say.
Furball: Nothing to say on your 1960s Donkocraptic Party led CIA and Saddam?
Funny how that works Furball. Facts DO hurt the libtard mind.
Skagit invited me to call him at his place of work when he posted the following:
skagit says:
“…You truly need my help. Call me . . . 253-850-3371
12/24/2006 at 3:30 pm
I googled the phone number and found it was for the Education Station on Kent’s East Hill. http://www.edukstation.com/home.html The owner of the schools is someone named Emilie Bonney. Skagit may be Ms. Bonney or perhaps is an employee.
From the Education Station website,they have this mission statement:
Emilie Bonney’s mission with Education Station is to bring success, ease, and joy to her students. Students of all ages learn effective skills and strategies to apply to their work, school, recreation, and lives. By realizing their gifts and (for some) dissolving their learning and doing blocks, they become increasingly confident and happy.
In response to a post I made, skagit responded:
Ah, Mark, your testosterone is showing again. I can only hope you get a really big case of cancer, your kidneys go, and and it metastizes to the brain . . . you use us all your health account, you can’t work and you lose you income, and your kids and wife (as if anyone would even consider becoming your spouse) become homeless.
Yes, I find it very easy to wish that upon a misanthrope like you. You deserve it.
How many of you think skagit has “effective skills and strategies to apply to his work and life”? Is wishing sickness, death, poverty, and homelessness on others one of those skills?
How many of you think that skagit has a “doing block”?
I need you moonbats to weigh in on this: How many of you would send your kids to the Education Station on Kent’s East hill when one of the staff members there is so narrow minded that he can’t even discuss viewpoints that disagree with his. How many of you would want your kids to be taught be someone who wishes sickness, death, and poverty on those with whom he disagrees.
Are people like skagit who we want teaching our kids?
MWS, how and why is that significant, everyone in the administration is a civilian. In fact everyone in the executive branch of the government must be a civilian.
If you meant he was not a member of the government, it would be untrue, someone named special envoy is an ambassador and thus is part of the administration and a representative of our government.
Moonbat!s:
In 2007 Moonbat!s better perform their fact checking, especially you Furball. I will be watching!
redneck, I agree that someone “. . so narrow minded that he can’t even discuss viewpoints that disagree with his” should not be teaching. Meaning you really shouldn’t be allowed within 10 miles of kids, ever.
bill – pick a topic. any topic. debate me…
Herewith MTRs list of great moonbat philosophy: Enjoy ! ! !
…vaginas do indeed make us men.
Comment by Donnageddon— 12/29/05 @ 5:55 pm
…how big a capacitator do we need to shoot MTR into orbit with a flashlight battery?
Commentby Roger Rabbit— 3/12/06@ 3:42 pm
Government exists to make private wealth possible.
Commentby Belltowner— 3/12/06@ 4:15 pm
I like Castro’s system better. He confiscates the employer’s property, shoots the employer, and the workers get quality health care for free. We need something like that in America.
Commentby Roger Rabbit— 3/19/06@ 3:42 pm
Don’t talk to me about “core beliefs…”
Commentby headless lucy— 3/25/06@ 7:07 pm
…the oil industry is a zero sum game ( like checkers )
Commentby headless lucy— 4/9/06@ 2:56 pm
“…higher PRODUCTIVITY means fewer jobs…”
Commentby Donnageddon— 4/9/06@ 4:06 pm
“Most wealthy people inherited their wealth and haven’t worked a day in their lives…”
Commentby headless lucy— 4/13/06@ 5:14 pm
*For our illiterate trollfucks who are adverse to reading, Roi Ubu is…
Commentby Dr. E— 8/14/06@ 7:32 pm
“Black people can be stressful to be around 24/7. Believe me , I know.” Commentby headless lucy— 9/16/05@ 10:12 pm
Thanks Cynical though for your help with the Negro problem.
Commentby headless lucy— 9/17/05@ 7:47 am
The better path is electrons straight into batteries and capacitors.
Commentby For the Clueless— 8/18/06@ 6:12 pm
I don’t care if some rich bitch pays a little more in taxes…
Commentby headless lucy— 10/24/06@ 7:37 pm
Roger Rabbit says:
Technical problems are man-made phenomena, not acts of nature, and as such can be prevented with adequate inspection/regulation.
12/01/2006 at 12:55 pm
Heathen Sinner says:
“… “Supply and demand” is a hoax….”
12/31/2006 at 2:55 pm
I have many times, you never finish without resorting to namecalling. In fact over the years, I have noticed that anytime anyone proves you wrong you have a strong tendency to start cussing and name calling.
Before you start pulling out disagreement to that, remember the archives are fully available and I have no qualms gathering examples.
12/26/2006 Mark The Redneck KENNEDY says:
what’s your fucking point bill. Do you have one?
I NEVER said I owned a small bidness. Never even implied it. You got me confused with somebody else.
Dumfuckinass…
12/26/2006 at 11:42 pm
Redneck, you mean last December in “Open thread 12-23-05? when you said: “people from around the world contact me personally for consulation and advice on a variety of complex technical topics. “, you weren’t implying that?
And we come back to the capacitor. Still havent looked up the phrase ‘railgun’ huh? Go find a real engineer and have them explain the concept.
You gonna ask what ‘ineptitude’ means again?
Funny Bill, but Washingtonpost.com. December 30, 2002 and the Times Online. December 31, 2002 wrote Rumfeld was a civilian, and NOT part of the cabinet.
Significance: Goldie likes to spin shit. He loves to post that picture of Rumsfeld shaking Saddam’s hand. He was a private citizen!
Cnn wrote: In the mid-1980s, the Reagan administration sent then-private citizen Donald Rumsfeld as a special envoy to improve relations. Rumsfeld is now the U.S. secretary of defense.
I find no where on the Internet where Congress voted in Rumsfeld as a cabinet member. So he was an envoy to IMPROVE RELATIONS.
So Bill, are you another DICKHEAD like Goldie?
Nope, he wasnt a cabinet member, and noone claimed he was. However ambassadors are members and representatives of the government. The phrase special envoy means ambassador. You really need to learn something about how our government work.
bill 82 – like I said yesteday dumfuckingass… ya got me… employees of MNCs are NEVER contacted by customers and suppliers..
Shit, yer too smart for me…
You can deny it all you want, its obvious to anyone what you were trying to implying there.
And by the way dumshit… when the fucking have I EVER resorted to name calling. Give me one example you stoopid lazy fuck.
And right to namecalling. I think thats a record even for you. As I said, I dont think you are even capable of debate.
Post 87. duh.
hey bill – again… yer too fucking smart fer me… ‘splain the capacitor charged rail gun…
hey bill… how do you drive a moron crazy…
see next post
hey bill… how do you drive a moron crazy…
see previous post
Thinking about it, your post at 89 is going on the quotes list, its actually funny, lets see it again in an instant replay:
# Mark The Redneck KENNEDY says:
And by the way dumshit… when the fucking have I EVER resorted to name calling. Give me one example you stoopid lazy fuck.
12/31/2006 at 7:08 pm
Is that your idea of irony or did you not even look at what you wrote as you wrote it?
hey bill
try this: google the term “picofarad”…
tell me whacha learn… how many leading zeros in “pico”? Convert that to a word. Also express in grown up language called “scientific notation”. Explain the negative sign on the exponent..
dumshit…
Billy Bob:
Read this exchange when General was selected as an envoy. No where is he mentioned as an ambassador. http://www.state.gov/p/eur/rls/rm/71664.htm
Rumsfeld was NOT approved by Congress as an ambassador. I agree he worked for the Government, but the libtard MSM admits he was working to improve relations. Look it up Moonbat! You are stretching!
redneck, you are funnier than anything on tv these days. Thanks for demonstrating the ““. . so narrow minded that he can’t even discuss viewpoints that disagree with his” , you make my points for me so well.
Billy Bob:
Read this exchange when General was selected as an envoy. No where is he mentioned as an ambassador. ht-tp:-/-/w-ww.st-ate.go-v/p-/eur-/rls-/rm/71664.ht-m
Sorry for the dashes, but you need to read this as Goldie blocked it in the open thread. I guess State Department stuff is bad for Goldie.
Rumsfeld was NOT approved by Congress as an ambassador. I agree he worked for the Government, but the libtard MSM admits he was working to improve relations. Look it up Moonbat! You are stretching!
Billy Bob:
Read the exchange when General Ralston was selected as an envoy. No where is he mentioned as an ambassador. Go to the State Department web site as Goldie’s filter is blocking it. I guess State Department stuff is bad for Goldie.
Rumsfeld was NOT approved by Congress as an ambassador. I agree he worked for the Government, but the libtard MSM admits he was working to improve relations. Look it up Moonbat! You are stretching!
Bill: I wish I could answer you about Rumsfeld but Goldie is blocking my posts. Special Envoy’s are not Ambassadors. You need to visit the SoS web site!
And you need to look up the word envoy
Hey Bill I went to the SoS web site. Now using your definition; an envoy is a person delegated to represent one government in its dealings with another. Or one who ranks between an ambassador and a minister resident.
Tell me again Bill?
delegated to represent one government in its dealings with another hence, a representative of the government.
The US only had envoys until the late 19th century
Bill: I agree he was representative. But he was a PRIVATE CITIZEN representative. Even the libtard MSM agrees with me! That’s all I was saying!
Hwy, Mark, everybody’s too fucking smart for you.
Choo choo, choo choo . . .having fun, Mark? Got your engineer’s hat straight and tall . . . watch that bridge, Mark, gotta slow down that Lionel when you get to turns. Having fun, Mark?
To quote wikipedia
You seriously think he did all that as a private citizen?
Yes, because the Washington Post, The New York Times and CNN would have said otherwise. They are the head libtard MSM. We know these bozoz hate Bush. Look up Eason Jordan if you need help remembering.
In this case Bill I’ll take the libtard MSM over Bill!
When you consider that Rumsfeld was one of the organizers of the Project for the New American Century which was one of the prime orgainizers of the second gulf war, you gotta realize that Rumsfeld did not act on his own as a special envoy. He was acting in the name of and in what he was told was the best interest of the US. Which means, that whether he was a private citizen or not, Rumsfeld was acting on the behalf of the US with the US’s full knowlege and consent. Ergo, whether he was a ‘civilian’ at the time of that photo or not is irrelevant.
You know, acting in the capacity for the US speaks a whole lot more in his favor than if he was overreaching as a private citizen. If he was working for Reagan at the time, he did what he was told to and then did what he could to turn back from it under a different presidency. If he was a private citizen, then he pulled the entire US into a war by feeding that monster in the first place. You tell me which.
answer in filter, will show later.
Gidget,
I have never tortured anyone, yet, I will keep you in mind as a prime candidate should I get the urge to start.
This isn’t about President Bush, but I understand your child-like obsession with blaming him for everything under the sun. Grow up and accept responsibility! Everything wrong in the world isn’t Bush’s fault or a Republican’s fault……………..
Remember Moonbat!s, even the incoming libtards in Congress admitted it was an Iraqi Court manned by Iraqi people with Iraqis passing judgment that condemned Saddam.
Where has Bush:
Gassed US Citizens on US soil?
Bombed US Citizens on US Soil?
Helicopter strafed US Citizens on US Soil?
Executed US Citizens on US Soil?
Tortured US Citizens on US Soil?
Raped US Citizens on US Soil?
Poisoned US Citizens on US Soil?
Saddam did all of these in Iraq on Iraqi soil?
STUUUUUUUUUUUPIIIIIIIIIIIIID Moonbat!s
When Bush does this I’ll be there looking for his impeachment too. He hasn’t so Moonbat!s go poind SALT!
Darn it pound salt. Was watching the ball drop in NYC!
Forgot, Where has Bush:
Buried alive his enemies US Citizens on US Soil?
Buried in mass graves US Citizens on US Soil?
Maimed US Citizens on US Soil?
I love these comparison junkies called GoldieAsses. They love to call for the same thing to happen to Bush and Bush has done none of these Moonbat!s
You know MWS and sgmmac for that matter, your arguement is similar to saying that you shouldnt object to me robbing you because that bastard Ted Bundy is SOOO much worse. Since Ted Bundy is such a bastard, you are both OK with me robbing you?
Bill: There is no comparison and your comment makes no sense. Your side claims Bush is equal to Saddam. I ask if Bush is equal, prove that Bush did all these things to US Citizens!
No, “my side” (do I have a side now) does not say they are equal, I say that Bush has done wrong things, some in my opinion criminal. Just because saddam did worse does not excuse these actions.
Well, smeg, when you run out of honest rebuttals (well, at least more honest than this one), we resort to playground behavior.
How can a war started by Bush not be about Bush? Or did Hussein start this war against himself . . .
You’ve never tortured anyone? Oh. Here I thought you were the expert . . . Oh, I see. You delegated it.
Sort of like Bush and Rumsfeld.
Now I get it. You aren’t any better than either of them.
And do your grandkids say “heil” everytime they see you?
I am Republican – A proud liar, cheat and thief when I am not being a family man (fat whore) or a crying hypocrit.
Heathen Sinner, did you figure out why the oil prices are increasing?
Heh Heh.. that is a funny video, heh heh.
I sure hope they get a new rope for Rummy, Shooter and me.
Heh heh
Sucks @100,
For the umpteenth time, I don’t even bother to read the vast majority of my comments, let alone take the time to block them. Since upgrading to WP 2.0, I’ve been using the Akismet spam filtering service, which has managed to block all but a handful of the hundreds of spam comments HA is targeted with each day. In the process, it occasionally blocks legitimate comments (if you can characterize your comments as “legitimate”,) and I clear them out of the filter when I see them.
If that’s just too damn inconvenient for you, then leave.
A friend called to ask me if I’d watched the Hussein hanging video yet. I said no.
She then said; “Gee, the video sucked, you couldn’t really see anything. Hopefully they will do better next time.”
I believe in the death penalty in certain situations, but I’m not really a “Let’s pack a picnic lunch and go watch the hangings!” type of guy.
Maybe I would change my mind if it were Osama bin Laden, but I doubt it.
.. I would plan a picnic. And carry a Hi-Def camera.
I have spring 2009 tickets to The Hague for Bush and Cheney.
I don’t even try to hope that Paul Wolfowitz and Bill Kristol will get the hanging they deserve, but I will supply the buffet if they get their just deserts.
One can dream.
Union Fireman @#66 – Although you profess to be a grown up, you quibble over when Saddam was hung…and your still haven’t made much sense and I believe are still wrong. The Saturday referenced in the news reports of the links that you provide our in reference to December 30, Iraqi time…. which was the same time as Friday, December 29th @ 10:00 PM Eastern Time Zone (United States) give or take a few minutes!
Heather,
Where am I wrong? I corrected Roger, and he fails to admit that he was wrong. He tried to correct me, and in return found himself lacking in the intelligence department. But hey, that’s okay he is very entertaining anyways. Oh yeah, and 10:00pm Eastern is what time Pacific? I ask, because when I said I had already seen the video, I was told that would be impossible because the hanging had taken place just a little while before my post. Try reading the entire post, and not just focusing on the parts you comprehend (that means you understand).
Once again, where am I wrong? Am I wrong on the time frame that Saddam was hung? You are the person who believes that the Concept of Supply and Demand is a hoax. Like I said Ms. Sinner, the kiddie table is to the left.
Union Fireman – My apologies for my misinterpretation of the many logged comments, but you obviously did not get the point to my comment – the fact that your quibbling regarding this is very childish in itself. And for someone who holds themselve as a grown up, you do a lot of name calling like a child – typical of a your kind. If you need to know what time 10:00 PM Eastern time is in Pacific time, that is childish too, go look it up yourself. Furthermore, you take what I said regarding supply and demand out of context to the conversation at hand, again being childish. FU. Did you comprehend that?
Heather,
I haven’t called anyone a name. I have merely told you to sit at the appropriate table, because your argument is beyond anything that could be construed as logical.
By the way, I know that my salary is paid by the tax man. I also know that Washington State has the 2nd worse Pension system for firefighters and police officers in the nation. A system created by democrats. I also know that around 1000 firefighters and police state wide are not eligible for Medicare, due to that wonderful system that the democrats set up for us. I also know that most improvements we have tried to make, have been either shot down or drastically cut, by those same democrats. And finally, I know that supply and demand is real, even in the current market.
It is cold. When it is cold, there is usually an increase in fuel consumption therefore a rise in fuel prices. The reason why fuel prices started to drop prior to the election? Simple, the demand was lower. During September and October, the weather is generally mild. Most families are not traveling, due to school. Again decreasing the demand for fuel. Now, come December, travel is going up, people are getting cold and storms like the last one are increasing the need for fuel (Think about who the largest users of fuel in the State of Washington are…. the Government). The State has to pay for more trucks on the road, more line trucks to be dispatched, and more emergency responses due to rabbits driving when they shouldn’t. Add all of that to the increase in winter travel, the types of recreational activities that are prevalent during the winter, and of course the heating. What happens? The demand goes up (Are you keeping up, because I am trying to explain this at a very simplistic level). Conspiracy theories are for kiddies. Maybe next year we can talk about a Jolly old man that comes down your chimney at night.
Union Fireman – You would know about that Jolly Old Man that comes down your chimney at night – you commonly refer to him as your good ole pal George and his tax refunds.
It’s Cold – In your fairy tales.
It’s Cold? – In your fairy tales it is.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WEATHE.....index.html
Union Fireman and the Dickwad the keeps famous quotes – Supply and Demand (with respect to gasoline prices) put to the test.
Based on the information presented in this article I would think that we should be seeing a leveling off or even a drop in gasoline prices in the near future. I’ll be waiting for you to say “I told you so”
http://money.cnn.com/2007/01/0.....2007010415
The news article:
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) — Oil prices sank for a second straight day Thursday, leaving its two-day loss at nearly 9 percent, as gasoline inventories rose and the Northeast basked in unusually mild winter weather.
U.S. light crude for February delivery slid $2.73, or nearly 5 percent, to settle at $55.59 a barrel on the New York Mercantile Exchange.
The drop was the same amount that oil lost Wednesday, which was the biggest one-day decline in more than a year.
The two-day decline means oil prices have tumbled almost 30 percent from their July highs and leaves the front-month contract at its lowest since mid-November. Prices have been seesawing between $55 and $65 for the last several months.
U.S. crude has lost 8.5 percent since its closing on Dec. 29. The NYMEX was closed over the weekend, as well as Monday for New Year and Tuesday for former President Ford’s funeral.
In its weekly inventory report, the Energy Information Administration said crude stocks fell 1.3 million barrels last week. Analysts were looking for a decline of 800,000 barrels, according to Reuters.
But distillates, used to make heating oil and diesel fuel, rose by 2 million barrels while gasoline supplies jumped by 5.6 million barrels. Analysts were looking for a 900,000 million drop in distillates supplies and a 1.5 million build in gasoline stockpiles.
One analyst said given the recent OPEC production cuts, the drop in crude supplies could have been much bigger, and the rise in distillate stockpiles confirmed the effects of warm Northeast weather.
“It’s reflective of the abject lack of winter demand,” said John Kilduff, an energy analyst at Fimat in New York.
OPEC agreed to cut production by 1.2 million barrels a day Nov. 1, and has agreed to another 500,000 barrel cut slated to begin Feb. 1.
Warm weather was the main driver behind the recent selloff.
On Wednesday the National Weather Service forecast temperatures will remain above normal in the Northeast, the world’s biggest heating oil market, for the next six to 10 days.
Looking for Iraq’s oil windfall
Other forecasts have temperatures in New York City 10 to 25 degrees above normal over the next 10 days.
Temperatures in the U.S. Northeast have been well above normal all winter, with many experts blaming the El Nino weather phenomenon that formed in the Pacific Ocean in the fall of 2006.
Stocks of big oil companies such as BP (Charts), ExxonMobil (Charts), ConocoPhillips (Charts), Chevron (Charts) and Royal Dutch Shell (Charts) stopped mirroring the drop in crude prices in mid-September and rebounded as traders sought deals in a sector some saw as undervalued.
But recently, they’ve been tracking closer to crude prices again. Most of the big oil producers’ stocks fell Thursday.
I know the article mentions a cut of 500,000 barrels starting in February 1st, but you would think that with the current low demand and abundant supply, that the effects of the production cut would be minimal to small. If gasoline continues to increase dramatically I’m sure you will be able to intelligently explain it.
With now snow yet this Winter in the Northeast and Mid-atlantic and Midwest – think of all those municipalities, towns and cities that haven’t been depleting the supply of gasoline for use of snowplows and sand trucks. I haven’t yet seen one snowflake!
One more thing you can explain to me – we heard alot about the supply and demand problem being alot about the fact that we do not have enough refineries to meet refining capacity….so I would think that it somewhat wouldn’t matter if OPEC cuts production, if you don’t have the capacity to refine it. With the US being the 3rd largest producer of crude oil, I bet we control the market too, not just the Arabs (OPEC).