It took about two seconds this morning for me to determine that I didn’t want to watch whatever Sunday morning politics show that had John Boehner spewing forth about Nancy Pelosi, demanding an investigation or whatever he was saying. Maybe it was Gingrich who wants an investigation, seeing as the media can’t stop quoting a thoroughly discredited and wildly unpopular former House leader.
The Villagers smell a little bit of theater that allows them to get all worked up raising “serious questions” about Pelosi, which is kind of like raising “serious questions” about the locksmith five years after someone kicked the door down. The whole staged attack on Pelosi is asinine beyond belief.
Because the GOP likely ordered deliberate torture, the logical thing to do is investigate Democrats. You know what, I’d be fine with that, as long as everything and everyone gets investigated. Kind of a new Church Committee.
It should be live on the major networks so Americans can get re-acquainted with basic concepts of law and human rights. Then we can all argue over what to do, like prosecute people, institute reforms, etc. And of course there would need to be evidence presented, unlike the Sunday shows.
I wonder what Dick Cheney thinks of all this?
Evidence? Dick Cheney don’t need no steekin evidence!
Fuck them. Pelosi wasn’t the torturer. They were. End of discussion.
Only in the upside-down Alice-In-Wonderland world of Bush-Cheney could Republicans demand an investigation of Pelosi on the grounds she allegedly knew about their crimes.
Here’s what the Republicans accomplished. If I were a foreigner living peacefully in my own country and saw the Americans coming, knowing what they did to innocent Iraqis, I’d start shooting and ask questions later. There’s no telling how many American soldiers, diplomats, business people, and tourists will end up dead because of what the Republican torturers and their enablers and apologists did. And their response is to blame the people who caught them. That’s like Ted Kascinski blaming his crimes on the brother who turned him in to police! The GOP is a criminal gang of Nazis. What a bunch of stupid, unprincipled, immoral bastards.
Pelosi. Remained. Silent.
Let that sink in, bitches.
what a bunch of fuckin pansies. We poured water on people, the other side saws peoples heads off to watch on video later like porn.
Let’s see, Bush & Cheney wanted to torture, asked lawyers to make it look legal, hired contractors to carry it out and lied about it for years. The White House is required by law to notify the intelligence committees about their intelligence activities. Not the committee leadership, the entire committee.
Odd that former Sen. Bob Graham wasn’t on all the talking head shows today. He was on the committee in 2002 before retiring, and he wasn’t told about torture activities.
The trolls on blogs and on tv will point at Speaker Pelosi, screaming that everyone needs to “look at the shiny object we’re holding up!” Only the morons will listen. The rest of us want the facts.
I for one would welcome full inverstigations, and throw Pelosi in, and we can learn heter they really did choose to tell her that they were shredding the Constitution, destroying American values and leaving a legacy of lawlessness and brutality against INNOCENT prisoners? Go ahead, lets see what they did or did not tell Pelosi- and Bob Graham, too, who already caught the GOPers of the Cheney era of the CIA lying to Congress.
And lets also make sure we put Rummy, Cheney, Feith, Wolfowitz, Addington, Condi, Tenant, Woo, Bybee, and all the rest of the lying sacks of manure under oath and scrutiny and find out what they really did, and who knew what when.
BTW, does it bother anyone else that the poor schmucks Charles whats-his face and Lyndee England, the hapless 21 yr old abusers went to jail, while Bush, Cheney, and Rummy lied through their teeth about their lack of “orders” and claiming they were “rogue” army guards? If they did not have immunity they should be sued for libel and slander. Have they no shame? (That is rhetorical, the answer is obvious.)
This whole Pelosi focus makes me want to puke. Lets see, who ordered the torturing and lies? The Bush admin and Cheney. And why? To create a justification under any circumstance to start the Iraqi invasion, thats why.
When we are done, if we believe in justice, we will let them be tried as criminals if thats where the facts take us. What is that Latin phrase? “Ruat Coelleum…” – Let justice be done though the heavens may fall. Something like that.
I did rather like Jesse Ventura (remember him, former Navy Seal and governor of Minnesota) saying how he had been waterboarded as part of his training and that Dick Cheney would cop to the Manson murders if he had been waterboarded. He said it’s torture.
Don’t care what Nancy Pelosi did or did not do. She is right; she was in no position to do anything about it and the Bush administration and the Reps wouldn’t have listened anyway.
Independent commission, come forward.
But on the other hand, Pelosi and Reid drank plenty of the Bushies’ kool-aid, as did a lot of the older generation of Congressional D’s. All things considered, perhaps they could be….. encouraged to step aside for a newer generation of D leaders. Pelosi’s district is reasonably safe, though replacing Reid could be problematic. Truth be told, there really aren’t a lot credible candidates on either side of the aisle for Reid’s seat. IMHO, the most likely R challengers would be either a carpetbagging Mitt Romney, or an up-and-comer like State Assemblyman Ty Cobb, though Cobb is generally considered to be too far to the right by many R’s here in Nevada. That’s really saying something.
Perhaps Reid could be re-elected in 2010, then encouraged to retire by what will likely be a D governor in Carson City, who’d appoint a younger D to succeed him. Current Nevada gov Jim Gibbons is a real-life William J. LePetomane, with no real chance of surviving a re-election bid given his current tenure (a tenure that includes severe cronyism, big pay raises for said cronies, serial philandering and a very public divorce that his his wife living alone in the Governor’s Mansion, and threats to veto voter-approved tax increases), so maybe a Hillaryite like Jill Derby or Dina Titus will finally win something. Oh waitaminute, Titus did win something last year, NV-3…..
TROLL – SUCKS – DICK
Let that sink in bitches.
Now
BUSH CREATED TORTURE POLICY
BUSH APPROVED TORTURE POLICY
BUSH HIRED PEOPLE TO DO TORTURE
BUSH EXECUTED TORTURE POLICY
BUSH VIOLATED LAW
BUSH DID ALL THIS FOR POLITICAL REASONS
BUSH’S TORTURE POLICY COST AMERICAN LIVES
Suck on that bitches…
and believe me I know a thing or two about dick suckin.
The Troll might want to check out Bob Somerby’s column of yesterday. She did endorse a complaint one year later after a second briefing that accually got into the details of the program.
Amazing anger towards a peripheral target. None at all for the initiators and administration enablers of torture.
Logical fallacy: you can’t prove a negative, e.g. “prove that the CIA didn’t say x, y, and z re; torture”.
Good god this nation is soft.
@5 Because she (a) didn’t know or (b) couldn’t discuss classified information, Sherlock.
@6 Tell us again WHO AUTHORIZED AND COMMITTED THE TORTURE AND LIED ABOUT WHETHER THEY WERE DOING IT, asshole.
@16 I don’t want a soft nation. I want a moral nation. So let’s review: The Republican Party is led by draft dodgers who ducked out of Vietnam, behaved like Nazis when they got into power. Not much of a model for the country as a whole, I would say.
Pelosi DESERVES this.
She has whored herself to these bastards, she has NOT fought them for us bottom 90%, AND now they’re throwing her to the wolves if they can get away with it!
They’re blaming her for their FASCIST bullshit!
ha ha ha.
Dear Dim-O-Crats, reasonable Republican leaders are LONG gone, and mainly dead. The fascists have been running the show since maybe Nixon, definitely RayGun. So, grow up and wake up and STOP SELLING OUT, or
how about just joining them?
nancy DESERVES this, for being so politically incompetent.
rmm.
[Deleted]
@20 You have a point, sorta. Just when we thought both parties were equally bad along came the Gingrich-Bush-Cheney-Rove crowd and proved Republicans can be infinitely worse.
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@21 “I am still a good Christian conservative”
No you’re not. You can be an ex-Christian and a conservative, or a Christian and an ex-conservative, but you can’t be both at the same time.
I believe the Democrats were not exactly profiles in courage in the aftermath of 9/11. They made a political calculation to let it play out and look to win later. They did win later. Had they outed Bush at the time they would have been crucified as unpatriotic.
Politics is nasty business
interesting philosophical dilemma,do you do the “right thing” right now and ensure you will be marginalized and lose the opportunity to make real change later or do you allow evil to continue and win the opportunity to reverse course later.
Fifty years ago, Republicans bragged about being Eagle Scouts. Today, a Republican is someone who can’t recite the Boy Scout Oath with a straight face.
24 “You can be an ex-Christian and a conservative, or a Christian and an ex-conservative, but you can’t be both at the same time.”
Good on ya, Roger. It’s about time someone said that.
The more the GOPers howl about this, the more they resemble somene who tries to kill his neighbor by following him around with a lit stick of dynamite.
Sure…you betcha, assholes. Let’s have an investigation. Let’s find out:
1. Who ordered torture, and when.
2. Who told Pelosi about it, and when.
3. Who had the authority, and used it, to prohibit Pelosi from saying anything about it, and when.
4. Best of all, let’s investigate all the stink that gets raised by public disclosure of the above, in every direction it leads.
By the time that’s done, nobody in the Republican Party who’s held national office in the last decade, nor quite a few from earlier, will be likely to get out of prison for the rest of their miserable lives–if there’s anything left of them to imprison.
Pelosi? She’ll probably get fucked in the process. Anybody really give a rat’s ass?
I’ll bet Pelosi rues the day she took impeachment off the table.
So either Pelosi is lying or the CIA lied to her.
If the CIA lied to her that is illegal and she should bring charges.
If not, she should resign.
And, again, I point out that the “torture” you all claim is so horrific, looks like fraternity hazing or what Roger pays extra for, from the “girls” on craigslist…
Republican logic: It was legal and not torture. It made our country more secure. Nancy Pelosi (the minority leader) was told about something legal that made our country more secure, so she should resign and be investigated.
The Republican party is essentially a Saturday morning wild and whacky cartoon. Duck!, here comes an anvil.
@32: Again, I point out you are full of sh*t (Delbert).
The torture was eggregious. Standing for hours in uncomfortable positions, dogs, waterboarding, cold temperatures and on and on.
these specific techiniques are outlawed by the military and the Geneva convention. We have no done them to abide by the treaty and to help protect out military personel:
Specific techniques described as prohibited in the intelligence collection manual include:
Forcing the detainee to be naked, perform sexual acts, or pose in a sexual manner.
Placing hoods or sacks over the head of a detainee; using duct tape over the eyes.
Applying beatings, electric shock, burns, or other forms of physical pain.
Waterboarding
Using military working dogs.
Inducing hypothermia or heat injury.
Conducting mock executions.
Depriving the detainee of necessary food, water, or medical care.[12]
If Delbert wants to submit to these acts to “prove” they are just like fraternity “hazings”, then I will be willing to bust his weak ass.
Until then Delbert, shut your wimpy mouth up. You are real brave hiding behind a screen, but you will be wimpering for the torture to stop if you had to go through it – typical chickenhawk. Torture is fine for other people.
Wating to hear your reply Delbertwimp.
@ 32 – OK Mr. Big-Round-Balls, if it’s “fraternity hazing”, let’s do it to you. Right now. Where can we meet so I can simulate drowning you 183 times? Or put dogs on you? Or slam your head into a wall repeatedly? Come on now, don’t be shy. I think it’s time for you sick pieces of fucking garbage to put up or shut up. Hello? Crickets…
Lot of pussies in here, vichy much? You dont fight crazed stateless Islamic Facsists with back rubs and spa treatments.
delbert@32
So Delbert, you willing to undergo a little “fraternity hazing” to prove it is not so bad?
Is any other troll out there willing to undergo a little “fraternity hazing” to prove it is not so bad?
Its harsh interrogation for a reason you limp wristed pukes, we aren’t supposed to be tickling them with feathers.
@39 So you do support an investigation and the resignation of Nancy Pelosi, right?
All you libs are so fucking tough and bad ass I would think a little waterboard would just be warm up for you bad boys of the left. My sides are aching. Pelosi is a lying cunt traitor and should be brought up on charges.
What was that song that former Atty. Genl. Ashcroft sang? The Flight of the Conservative Chickenhawks???
@34 et al
(l) attention grasp, (2) walling, (3) facial hold, (4) facial slap (insult slap), (5) cramped confinement, (6) wall standing, (7) stress positions, (8) sleep deprivation, (9) insects placed in a confinement box, and (10) the waterboard.
Yeah, Fraternity hazing. Pussies.
No electric shock, no bolt cutters, no drugs, no beatings, no knives, no whips, no rapes, no family members brought in to be killed in front of you and no beheadings.
And we have had 7 American POWs survive captivity, all of them in one incident. Every single other American captured has been killed.
@ 43 – you can use all the Orwellian euphemisms you want, it’s still torture. And, again, when can we meet so you can be repeatedly waterboarded?
Also, you think the fact that we don’t use “electric shock, bolt cutters, et al.” is something to BRAG about? You are completely fucked up. I really can’t imagine what kind of grotesque, twisted sociopath you are. On second thought, I can – Jesus. I pity your family. You’re a monster, dude.
Just to clarify, when I said “On second thought I can – Jesus” above, I wasn’t saying Jesus tortured people. It was emotional punctuation, so to speak. Like, “Wow, you’re a pice of shit – Jesus”. That’s it~
‘Also, you think the fact that we don’t use “electric shock, bolt cutters, et al.”’
At least, not confirmed as of yet.
We do know a significant number of prisoners have perished at Gitmo, Abu Ghraib and sever other rendition “destinations”. Somehow I doubt they died from being tickled.
@44 & 45
The second list were the Hussein family favorites for dissident Iraqis.
@46
Vague suggestions without evidence, typical soft headed lefty reactionist dreck and so worthless. Come back when you have proof.
@ 47 – Uh-huh. What the fuck does that have to do with anything? And, frankly, the US supported Iraq for decades, while Saddam & his disgusting sons were using bolt-cutters (and chemical weapons, for God’s sake) on dissidents, so not only is your point grotesque, but it’s stupid, too. You’re just a fucking savage.
Apparently you’re not going to volunteer for the water-boarding. You – the big pussy. You can dish out what you have no intention of taking. Typical Republican.
What a group of limp-wristed San Fransicko types.
@ 49 which is infinitely preferrable to a bunch of psychotic Texas-mafia types, like yourself. At least all the fags in SF aren’t creating a generation of terrorists like your torture regime has. Nice try, though, fuckwad.