I don’t feel like brewing up a pot of insightful, clever commentary this Monday morning, so here are some links to freeze-dried, instant commentary from some of the Northwest’s more caffeinated bloggers.
(un)Sound Politics: Democrats are crazy!
Okay, we all know Stefan at (u)SP is a partisan flame-thrower, and we strongly suspect he’s a little unstable… but I never expected he could be so shamelessly derivative. Only hours after I poke a little fun at his mental health, he’s throwing my rhetoric back at the Democrats. I write that Stefan inhabits “the middle of the lunatic homeland” and he refers to “the Democrats’ lunatic mainstream.” I call Stefan a paranoid delusional, and he calls Paul Berendt a paranoid schizophrenic. If he had actually referenced my slam-piece as a springboard, I suppose this laziness would have been excusable by context, but it appears he’s not only a lying, hate-mongering, nutcase… he’s also a plagiarist.
Also Also: King County complied with all state requirements
TJ has posted Part II of his report on his extensive interview with Assistant Secretary of State Steve Excell, who assured him that a certain paranoid delusional blogger is full of shit. (Though not exactly in those words.) This interview goes a long way towards explaining the certification process, the role of the SoS, and the fact that the Evergreen Freedom Foundation is a bunch of lying, partisan bastards. (Again, not exactly in those words.) I plan to comment in more detail on this later, but I thought it deserved a heads up.
blatherWatch: Dave Ross outs BIAW grifters
It looks like it was Dave Ross who first broke the story about the BIAW defrauding voters of their signatures through a sham housing survey. While the BIAW told the Seattle Times that they had found “about 20” questionable signatures, a BIAW spokesperson told Ross that they found no suspicious signatures among the 120 checks returned. Oh my… could the BIAW have been lying?
Columbian Watch: Land use initiative creates chaos in Oregon
Looking to Oregon’s “Measure 37” as an indicator of things to come in Washington? “If the states are laboratories, then unfortunately Oregon has fallen victim to some mad scientists when it comes to land use. We can’t ever let it happen on this side of the river.” ‘Nuff said.
Pacific Views: Stop the bankruptcy boondoggle
I’ve always appreciated Pacific Views for providing a sober, thoughtful, constructive forum on issues of national importance… freeing me up to spew obscenities and insults from my usual drunken stupor. The credit card industry is in the midst of sliding a cruelly selfish bankruptcy bill through Congress. While the provisions reinstating debtors prison and public floggings were softened in committee, the main thrust of the bill is intact: protecting the banks from the inevitable result of shamelessly pushing credit cards on people they know can’t handle them. Pacific Views provides the details, and asks you to contact your representatives.
Preemptive Karma: Harsh reality television
Carla takes a break from gardening, watches TV, and slaps the tookus of litter-bearing, fertility-treatment couples, for not selectively aborting a few of the backup fetuses. Man, that’s not a politically correct thing write… which is more than enough to deserve a link from me.
WA State Political Report: Don’t piss off Goldy
Carl Ballard points to an amusingly mean-spirited critique of Stefan… by me! (How meta.)
I suppose this laziness would have been excusable by context, but it appears he’s not only a lying, hate-mongering, nutcase… he’s also a plagiarist.
OK. To date I would say its an even split between the blogger sites on their insult ability.
However, ya got to give it to Goldy for the humor component. See above.
The only humor attempts I have seen at SP is imagining a dozen angry guys dressed in Orange. I am not sure that would even fly on Capital Hill in Seattle.
torridjoe–
I read your interview excerpts with Asst. Secretary of State Steve Excell. You used a lot of words and took up a lot of space to say all the Secretary of State does is take the numbers each County reports, make sure they add up, then add up all 39 counties and report the total. Talk about much ado about nothing!
No one is saying the Secretary of State didn’t add up the reported numbers correctly tj. It’s interesting that you lightly touch on the BIG BINDER and pollbook reconciliations. I thought you and GOLDY were adamant that this BIG BINDER would validate what KingCo did and you were going to see it a week or so ago??? So when are you going to review it???
You are right on that the Canvassing BOard Minutes where discrepancies were reported and discussed should be reviewed. Perhaps the SOS doesn’t feel they can even ask for this BIG BINDER and review it????
I have a problem from an appearance of fairness standpoint where Canvassing Board member LOGAN votes to certify based on information provided by Election Official Logan. It deserves a much, much higher level of INDEPENDENT SCRUTINY. Certainly Mr. Excell could have asked for the BIG BINDER and an opportunity to review it with LOGAN (would that be Election Official Logan or Canvassing Board member Logan??) and report to the public. Certainly by now, Logan should have compiled the 2616 Precindt reconciliations into a entire COUNTY summary disclosing COUNTYWIDE discrepancies. That’s what Logan should have done at the Canvassing Board level tj. If he did…where is the information???
Logan has been a horrible communicator on releasing a clear summary of the BIG BINDER. WHY??? Does he have some sick fetish with being the center of attention?
I hope you will look at the BIG BINDER tj…compile the COUNTYWIDE discrepancies reported using each of the 2616 precindt reconciliation forms. But also, carefully examine those reconciliations AND make sure they tie into the SOURCE DOCUMENTS!!!
Apparently KingCo is stonewalling on this for some reason. Maybe they will share it with you. The truth will set us all free!
Cynical, I am not available to sit at KC and go through the pollbooks. I’m not the one who is suggesting that there is hidden gold within. What I find curious is that, lacking such information, various pundits continue to harp on counts and issues that are irrelevant to the reconciliation process, as if they are indicative of something.
goldy, you’re the one who’s full of shit.
Goldy, why are you surprised that Snark is peddling cheap imported knockoffs? Cynical, the burden of proof is on your side; it’s up to YOU to go through the BIG BINDER and show there’s something there. You do know how to fill out a public records request form, don’t you? You can read and write, can’t you? Or can you???
BM @4,
On the all important shit fullness issue, I never implied that it was mutually exclusive.
Goldy – Being a plagiarist is nothing new for right-wing politicians (or professional gadflys like Stefan)
http://www.elkodaily.com/artic...../news1.txt
“The speech delivered by U.S. Rep. Jim Gibbons, R-Nev., during Friday night’s Lincoln Day Dinner in Elko was largely plagiarized from a copyrighted speech by Alabama State Auditor Beth Chapman.”
But you should be flattered. Isn’t one of the SP-lovers biggest criticisms that you are derivative of SP? Looks like the tables are turning :)
No one is saying the Secretary of State didn’t add up the reported numbers correctly
But lets run a recall campaign on him anyway. because he didn’t follow the Katherine Harris playbook.
Stefan Sharkansky a lieing, hate-mongering nutcase? You need new material Goldilocks–and it appears you are getting lazy, too.
Stefan Sharkansky a lieing, hate-mongering nutcase?
who says you can’t convert part of the minions.
As for calling Goldy Lazy? Well it’s Monday and he is ramping up his Mayorial run. Won’t you be sad when you only have the Greenlake Millionaire to tell you how to think?
Two points came to my attention today.
1. Why didn’t the GOP comb the voter lists for felons and dead voters and challenge these voters BEFORE the election? They slept on their rights and didn’t complain until the horse was out of the barn. Washington election law relies on parties and candidates to some extent for cleaning up the voter lists.
Washington does NOT allow challenges at polling places on Election Day. In states that do, the GOP has used mass challenges as a tactic to disrupt polling places and keep people from voting in Democratic neighborhoods. Another evil of Election Day challenges is they do not allow the challenged voter any time to gather evidence to refute the challenge. But the WSRP had ample time before the election to challenge any voters they believed questionable.
2. I received an e-mail from a lawyer working on election reform saying an analysis has been done of the GOP’s “felon list” and shows the felon voting changed the outcome by only 1 vote. I do not have a copy of the analysis or any further details at this time.
Mayor Goldstein…sounds really good to me..
Perhaps a slogan like ” A Lutefisk in every pot” could carry Ballard for you.
What about “A servant in every kitchen” could carry that Greenlake vote.
Oh I’ve got it. ” Lets bomb Hawaii” that will get the JChater votes out.
I think what amazes me most is that the ones calling the right sore losers are actually sore winners. Why can’t they see that when one vote isn’t safe, NO vote is safe? It’s only a matter of time before the Commissar gets you, too. Maybe she already has and you just don’t know it yet.
Here is something for you to chew on–likely it will be dismissed out of hand and I will be a “right wing nutcase” or some such tired phrase, but it needs to be said, even if it is only my own opinion (I think I am still entitled to that). Here goes: For the first time I know of in state history, a sitting governor changes the method of voting in the primaries. He does it with out the benefit of telling the public, let alone having a referendum and ASKING for their permission. Later he then “allows” us to vote to see if we wish to keep that method and everyone is supposed to be happy and not question such a strange act. Adding to this hostility and disdain for the common man, we must ask ourselves who was to benefit from this? I cannot help but wonder if it was engineered to telegraph the approximate number of fraudulent votes that would be needed to “win” the election for the Democrats. After all, one recount was too close to be sure. Two recounts was too close to be sure. John Kerry threw in 1/4 million dollars just to be sure and voila! The first time in history that 1 out of 3 was enough. And doesn’t it seem strange that with each “recount” there were more ballots found from under rocks, behind zippers or wherever else they could manufac…I mean, find them? 300 in one batch bore the same handwriting according to a state licensed analyst, but the Democrats think this is okay–because they “won”. No other reason. No question of cheating, because they “won”. No worry that thousands were disenfranchised, because they “won”. And no worry that Comrade Gregoire will be thrown out of office (if we just get her in there fast enough to beat the objections and the investigation) because state law says she cannot be recalled unless she does something wrong while in office. Well, I think ‘accessory after the fact’ may be doing something wrong while in office and I for one cannot wait to be there when the cuffs are put on her and our rights are returned. I only hope Comrade Locke has a room next to hers, so they can swap stories–coulda, woulda, shoulda.
Q. What doe they call it when a Democrat majority Senate and House are in session?
A. An orgy–everyone gets screwed.
The 2 out of 3 gets pretty damn tiresome…I went to a Mariner game, and they only won 1 out of 9…they scored 4 runs in the last inning. would you say the other team got screwed because they won 8 counts prior? No…because the counts are done when the game is over. not half way through. If you are so concerned about voter fraud (none proved), go read the Conyers report to see what is provable.
To danw: Seems strange that all this flack is flying over these terrible “millionaires”, but we never hear another word from you about Michael Moore. Why is that? He lives in a million dollar mansion on Lake Michigan. He dresses like a bum to throw you off–do your homework and you will see I am right. Also, strange that even Hollyweird has nothing more to say about him. Maybe they are still in Moore-ning over the loss of their fuhrer?
“This is ‘See B.S.’ and I’m Dan Blather. This just in: Carl Rove today released reports that John Kerry is a space alien in drag and has been known to wear hotdogs protruding from every bodily orifice. I have my handwriting experts working to verify this even as we speak. In the event that the documents cannot be verified—I still believe it and will not be fired.”
steve O’Dell–
That’s a good one!
Goldy, torridjoe et al–
Now wait just a minute! It was YOU ALL that brought up the BIG BINDER. It was YOU ALL that claimed it would validate that KingCo ran an accountable election and followed all the laws regarding reconciliation. It was YOU ALL that said you were going to get a private audience with the BIG BINDER. Now it is YOU ALL who are sprinting away from the BIG BINDER like it has STD’s and a Viagra Boner!
I understand it is not up to the Dems to review the BIG BINDER…it’s just that you clowns were so gleeful when you found out that it existed BEFORE you found out what it shows.
Now you are sprinting away from it. Hmmmmmm?
tj–you are correct. This BIG BINDER will be quite an issue in the Election Contest.
There is an old axiom that you LEFTY’s ought to follow:
Be silent and be thought an idiot…
Or open your mouth and remove all doubt!!
There is another quote for you to consider too—
“There is nothing worse than aggressive stupidity”.
—Johann Wolfgang Von Goethe
Just a little political humor, Goldy—no offense meant. None taken?
O’Dell @ 14
Back through the Faux News wormhole from Planet Limbaugh?
First you offer us your conspiracy theory about Kerry and then it’s on to Moore.
300 hundred signatures by the same person? Do you mind telling us where you dug up this nugget? Nah, that would be too embarrassing. Would it be Newsmax, WND, Freeperland?
Don @ 11–
WOW..What a scoop.
An Anonymous Attorney tells you with no supporting data that the felons changed the election by 1 vote. WOW!!!!!
The LEFTY’s always try to float BS out and hope someone grabs ahold of it…just another example of something that defies all logic.
I await the details Don with baited breath!!!!
steve@16–
Be careful with humor and these LEFTY WingNuts.
There Achilles Heel is they are oh so serious and oh so self-righteous.
Now Goldy has gotten a couple chuckles out of me in the past few months…but no guffaws!!!! And certainly no hardy-har-har’s!
I think his BIG BINDER THEORY GONE BUST is like egg on his face.
Steve @ 14
You seem to paint us as non captialist, which is just not true. Where we differ is, those who make it, Kerry, Moore, Hollywood, Gates, Buffet, Soros, whomever. try to give back to soceity and try to make America a better place for ALL not just the rich. Where as the Cynicals of the world, want all the benefits of a free soceity, but don’t want to pay for it. (Why should I pay for armor for the troops?) You don’t hear us bitching about taxes. when we easily could about a war we don’t believe in. most of all our taxes are going there anyway.
PS tell the truth, you’ve never even seen a Moore Movie, you just repeat the Mantra.
Steve @ 12
Steve, I’m having a hard time following your logic. We all prefer perfect elections, but perfection isn’t attainable in this imperfect world. The flaws are material ONLY if they change the result and that certainly hasn’t been proved so you have no basis (other than conjecture) to claim that Rossi “won” the election. Gregoire got more votes in the only tally that legally counts; now the burden of proof is on the GOP to show that Rossi got more legal votes, and they will have an opportunity to do that in court.
I assume you know that Washington didn’t have the option to keep its blanket primary, which was declared unconstitutional by the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals, whose hands were tied by a U.S. Supreme Court decision in 2000 that invalidated California’s blanket primary. When the nation’s highest court declares something is unconstitutional, you can’t do it anymore, so our state had to come up with a new primary system.
The legislature enacted a “top two” system under which you can end up with two Democratic candidates and no GOP candidate, or vice versa. Is that really the system you want? I don’t. That’s not much of a democracy. Governor Locke did us all (including you) a favor by vetoing that part of the legislative bill, in my opinion, which may be unconstitutional in addition to being bad policy.
Cynical @ 18
I await the details, and until then, I reserve judgment.
In your case, I don’t expect you to believe anything except what you WANT to hear. And if it’s what you want to hear, we can count on you to rush to judgment without any critical evaluation of the evidence.
Don @ 21
I think IRV is a great idea. If the two Democrats (or Republicans) are most popular, why is that bad, necessarily?
Why didn’t the GOP comb the voter lists for felons and dead voters and challenge these voters BEFORE the election?
Because they thought it would get a bigger splash to oversell.
Then when the list was reduced down they hoped that either it would not get much coverage or that they could just say that anyone who attacked the list were lyers.
In any event, they seem to have lots of press agents and fax machines at Lane’s place but not too many investigative types (unless the signature deceptive is called investigation).
Erik @ 1
“…a dozen angry guys dressed in Orange. I am not sure that would even fly on Capital Hill in Seattle.”
What an OUTRAGE! They’re going to yank your DNC membership card for your intolerance. What you said is just… just… Geo-normative! Fashion-normative! Color-normative!
Goldy,
“[…]freeing me up to spew obscenities and insults from my usual drunken stupor.”
After reading that, I apologize for feeding your vices, not that I consider any of those ‘vices’… ;)
And Mondays do suck. So we agree on something fundamental…
Dudes–
Stefan requested the BIG BINDER 9 business days ago.
Not available.
Goldy or tj or both specifically said it was available for anyone to look at. YOU ARE WRONG BOYS!
This is not good–
The reconciliation was supposed to be done BEFORE certification at each of the 3 counts. The results of the reconciliation (i.e. reporting of pollbook discrepancies) was supposed to go to the Canvassing Board along with what was done to try and identify these discrepancies.
tj–you are correct. The tape of the canvassing board meeting is very important (HOPEFULLY they taped that meeting) to show exactly what Election Official Logan reported to Canvassing Board member Logan and his sidekick Larry Phillips. They taped the meeting in my County for obvious reasons….if they didn’t tape KingCo that’s scandalous.
tj—
If this BIG BINDER pollbook reconciliation had to be done BEFORE certifying….why wouldn’t it be available 2-1/2 months later??
And if KingCo followed the law and timetable…why are they holding these key documents back??
Don–you asked me about a Public Records Request?? It was done 9 days ago and no response.
I ask you Don, the same thing I asked tj…
If the BIG BINDER Pollbook Reconciliation had to be done BEFORE certifying, why is it not available to the public 2-1/2 months later?????
TJ @ 23
Because it disenfranchizes voters of the other party. Let’s not lose sight of the fact a primary is not a general election. It has only one purpose, to nominate the party candidates. How can it fulfill that purpose if the type of primary used keeps a party from having ANY candidates on the general election ballot? The top-two system also eliminates third parties from participation in the political process. Let’s NOT turn our primaries into general elections, and turn our general elections into runoff elections!
cYNICAL @ 27
I didn’t ask you for anything. I suggested you go look at the BIG BINDER yourself. Where does it say in the law that this reconciliation has to be done? What don’t you understand about Logan’s explanation of the “front loaded” process?
GOLDY & tj–
I hope you have nightmares about that BIG BINDER attacking you as you sleep just like that Chimpanzee attacked his owner and chewed off his face and genitals!!
Sleep tight!
Don–
Pollbook reconciliations ARE required before certification.
That is what is in the BIG BINDER.
What don’t you understand about that?
It’s what tj has repeated over & over ad infinitum.
Are you all mouth and no ears?
Since this is a BLOG, I guess it would be all fingers and no eyes….and certainly no mind!
Don–you repeatedly asked me to do a Public Records Request and ridiculed me about it. Well dude, it was done. And no response in 9 business days. WHY??? The reconciliation was REQUIRED to be done before certification 2-1/2 months ago.
tj–everything I say Don spins and twists. Perhaps you can set him straight. Listen up Don———-
I didn’t ask you for anything. I suggested you go look at the BIG BINDER yourself.
Ok. This big binder stuff is drivign me nutty.
The questions are :
Were is the binder?
Has anyone ever seen it?
Can one copy it? If not, how about just a page of it showing what the title is.
Don @ 30
My sincere apologies. I thought you were talking about GENERAL IRVs, not primaries. I agree with you on that one, sorry.
Cynical @ seemingly everywhere
You appear to be confusing the PRECINCT-BASED reconciliation, with a SUMMARY reconciliation. The binder is the repository for over 2600 different forms, along with all of the notes and ancillary documentation for each of those precincts. THAT is what needed to be completed on pollnight–the individual sheets.
What were are talking about now, is a SUMMARY or abstract of all 2600+ precinct sheets, aggregated to arrive at a county-wide assessment of discrepancy. That is a post-certification exercise, and it’s not even clear to me that it’s required under the WAC to submit any such document for public review.
tj–
I’m talking about the PRECINDT-BASED reconciliation.
That is what has been requested.
The FORMS are required pollnight (from the back of the pollbooks).
HOWEVER, as part of Canvassing, Logan’s staff reviews those pollbook reconciliations and attempts to explain discrepancies. It’s my understanding that the BIG BINDER includes STAFF reconciliation attempts AFTER election night BUT required before certification and required to be reported to the Canvassing BOard.
A SUMMARY of all PRECINDT sheets is not required, but practically speaking, is of interest to many….to determine an “ERROR RATE”. Merely a SUMMARY total of all 2616 Precindt discrepancies. If they have the precindt sheets, how hard would it be to set up a spreadsheet summarizing this data????
Not that hard.
Why aren’t they doing it??
tj–
You and Goldy both said the BIG BINDER was down at KingCo Elections and available. It is not.
Why would something that was REQUIRED before certification not be available 2-1/2 months later for public inspection???
They could have made copies of it for the public at any time.
Unacceptable.
Let’s see the BIG BINDER!!
Don@11. Well put. Challenges could have be made in writing and then an Auditor or whomever (their are varibles who does what from county to county) reviews them, calls a hearing if person(s) in question, after being properly notified by the officer in charge of said challenge(s), wants to dispute their right to vote. Bet there is not a challenge one on file. How to challenge prior is not new to the Repulican Party.
A public agency is not obligated to “make copies of it for public inspection,” and considering how much KC Elections have on their plate, I doubt they’ve had time or inclination for optional tasks lately.
On the other hand, RCW 42.17.250 et seq. imposes specific duties on public agencies to make public records available for public inspection, and to provide copies on request for a reasonable copying fee. RCW 42.17.320 requires the agency to respond to your request within 5 business days and gives you rights that you can enforce in the courts if they fail to do so.
If you have not heard from KC Elections after 9 days, a followup letter definitely is in order.
Mr Cyncial@36. The BIG BINDER maybe the KEY evidance in the upcoming trial as Goldy says. Could it be it is SEALED for now.
Mr Cynical. Do everyone a favor. Go to KC hall of records, read the Big Binder at the desk and report back. Like Don said, filling out a FOI form may be too complex.
Otherwise kwichyerbellyachen.
Chee @ 40, Don @ 41
Not that I am thrilled by the prospect of defending one of Mr. C’s posts, but from everything I’ve read here and on SP, the Magical Mystical Big Binder is NOT available for anyone to read. But as I ponder this, a possible explanation comes to mind…
One day, an elections official is charged with creating the finest binder of elections documents known to man. But the official knows that no such information exists. Being a crafty politico, the official tells his bosses and sympathetic bloggers that he has created a Big Binder so splendid that only the Truly Righteous can see it. When curious County Council members and conservative bloggers sought the Binder, they were unable to see it. This made the bosses and sympathetic bloggers feel really good about themselves and they began to shout from the rooftops, “the Big Binder is Truth!”
Perhaps the solution is to have a small, innocent child go to the KC Elections offices and ask to see the Big Binder.
mark @ 42
No one is disputing the existence of the binder, are they? Not even Stefan is that paranoid.
Cynical @ 36
I never said the binder was available. You are confused.
When you say the precinct-based reconciliation has been requested–which precinct(s)?
You also continue to say that a summary rendition of all precincts was a requirement for certification. It is not. You are engaging in pure speculation as to how hard it would be to go through all of the pages for each precinct, and describe the discrepancies, if any.
TJ @ 43
My point is that I haven’t heard of anyone who has actually seen the Big Binder. Goldy had an invite to see it, but declined. Stefan & (allegedly) some County Council member have TRIED to see it, but are given the runaround. Makes me wonder if the Big Binder really exists or does merely the IDEA of a Big Binder exist?
No one is disputing the existence of the binder, are they? Not even Stefan is that paranoid.
Ahhhhh. The binder. Let’s recap:
Here’s what KC says about the binder:
Additionally, a notebook is maintained that tracks the count of signatures in the poll books, number of provisional ballots cast/submitted, number of absentee ballots returned at the polls, etc.
I certainly believe Stefen either believes a) the binder does not exist, or b) the binder’s contents mean nothing.
Still, this binder and the poll books are sitting down there at KC Elections for anybody to inspect. And so I asked Egan if anybody – Rossi’s attorneys, the BIAW, know-it-all right-wing bloggers – had actually asked to see this binder, and she answered yes… a single Seattle reporter.
Still. If the binders going to be able to destroy SP’s conspiracy theories in a single bound, someone is going to have to get some information from it and view it. Otherwise we are going to keep seeing the reconcilation chore info keep raising its head.
erik @ 45
Stefan said on Carlson’s show with Goldy, that he believes the binder exists, IIRC.
Erik @ 45
“Here’s what KC says about the binder:” [emphasis mine]
That’s my point. KingCo SAYS there is a binder, but there hasn’t been a single non-KingCo person that has posted on a blog or written a news article (or even been quoted in either) saying that they’ve actually put their hands on the Big Binder.
“Still, this binder and the poll books are sitting down there at KC Elections for anybody to inspect.”
According to who? Please cite who said this (I presume Goldy) and if they themselves have actually seen the Big Binder or if they’re just taking KC’s word for it.
Still. If the binders going to be able to destroy SP’s conspiracy theories in a single bound, someone is going to have to get some information from it and view it.
I believe that is what everyone to the right of Teddy K is asking for.
Another thought, could it be that it is ‘held’ as evidence for the Rossi Soap Opera in Chelan?
Public Records 101: If it doesn’t exist, KC doesn’t have to let anyone see it or make copies upon request.
Stefan said on Carlson’s show with Goldy, that he believes the binder exists, IIRC.
Oh. Thanks. Must have missed it. Hmm.
Then I guess the binder must be Stefan’s worst nightmare.
What did Stefan say about the binder on Carlson’s show?
Something like:
I had that Goldy John. Now I must concede that Goldy has had me on the run with his discovery of the binder. Without it, Rossi was as good as in the governor’s office and I was King of Washington blogging.
But Damn the binder from Hell…sitting there…looking at me with all three rings looking so content…and here I am with the cursed housekeeping reconcilation data…but..I do have my spreadsheets…adding up numbers one way and then yes, quite another.
But I digress.
Don @ 49
If a Big Binder slams shut in the Wenatchee National Forest and nobody is able to hear it, does it make a sound?
Ahhh, THE BIG BINDER!!!!!
Don says “if it doesn’t exist, KingCo doesn’t have to make a copy”.
Well Mr. Attorney Don….why didn’t they just tell Stefan that?? They have 5 days to respond to the records request. If it doesn’t exist, they still must respond and say it doesn’t exist.
C’mon Don…No wonder our State is in such bad shape if you are the “best and brightest” guv’ment lawyer!!
The BIG BINDER cometh and the BIG BINDER goeth.
tj–
How about the “tapes” of the Canvassing Board meetings???
GOLDY–
You clearly put a lot of credence in this BIG BINDER without ever seeing it. I hope you’ve learnt yer lesson son!
how about them?
how about them?
You mean with the mandatory all caps, exclamation marks and a generous use of the repeat button?
The problem with FOF request for the big binder is that you need to indentify the documents in it, not the big binder by name.
Erik,
Accrding to Logan: “….a notebook is maintained that tracks the count of signatures in the poll books, number of provisional ballots cast/submitted, number of absentee ballots returned at the polls, etc.”
According to KC Elections Communications Specialist Bobbie Egan via Goldy 2/21/05: “in addition to the poll books, there is a “big binder” down at the office that contains all the reconciliation data Logan cited above, for all 2616 precincts.”
ASSUMING that Sharkansky’s records request was as specific as the above, is there any legal reason for the County to not deliver “the goods”?
KC government at work: they cite the BIG BINDER when it suits them to deflect criticism, then can’t or won’t respond on a timely (or legal) basis to a public records request.
Zip @55,
Believe it or not, KC Elections has some other things to do other than cater to Stefan. In offering to show me the binder, Bobbie Egan made it clear that we would have to arrange a time when somebody with some expertise on the data it contained could sit down and explain it to me. I don’t really blame them for not letting somebody walk in off the street and page through it unattended.
The precinct reconciliations were performed, nobody is disputing that. What Sharkansky is implying, is that since they haven’t compiled and published the data, they are obviously covering something up. The fact is, the data simply isn’t normally compiled, so I’m not sure what it is that can give Stefan, and I’m not sure how useful the binder would be on its own, without somebody to explain.
If I were KC, I would be very wary about releasing data haphazardly after how the voter-credit data was blown out of proportion (and context.)
Goldy @ 56
My impression is that Stefan simply wants to see the raw, legally-required reconciliation sheets. There shouldn’t be any “processing” to do besides three-hole punching the pages for the binder.
Also, while they may have “other things to do” rather than “cater to Stefan,” they are legally required to respond to his document requests in a timely manner — something they have allegedly not done. [Please note my use of the word allegedly. I take what both of you say with more than a grain of salt.]
Top Ten Explanations for the Missing Big Binder:
#10. Being used as a wedge to keep Dean Logan’s door open for quick escapes.
#9. Shredded for confetti at Gregoire’s inaugural ball.
#8. Huennekens and Egan using pages for a paper airplane war in office hallways.
#7. Currently out for re-binding. KingCo employee fired because black binder cover was ethnically insensitive.
#6. Sent to Olympia where pages will be used as wallpaper in governor’s mansion.
#5. Binder in KingCo jail. GOP alleges it was used in two different states’ elections.
#4. “So what if it’s lost. We only lose .02% of all binders in King County — a record any bank would be proud of!”
#3. Locked away in safe next to WA Dems’ undisclosed campaign funds.
#2. Paul Berendt used the pages as tissues during his last crying jag.
AND THE #1 EXPLANATION FOR THE MISSING BIG BINDER…
Currently being “processed” by Logan’s new secretary, Fawn Hall!
Sombody has a very VERY bad case of BIG BINDER envy.
And let me tell you, for good reason!
Hugs and kisses!
ASSUMING that Sharkansky’s records request was as specific as the above, is there any legal reason for the County to not deliver “the goods”?
The deal though is with a record request is that you have to indentify the records themselves, not the container that holds the information.
With all of the dozens, if not hundreds of records requests to KC, I suspect all of the information in the binder has already been sent out multiple times. Whether it has been assembled in a manner that KC has is another question.
From what I understand though the contents in the binder are not going to be much of a smoking gun one way or another and would likely lead to another round of speadsheeting with everyone trying to spin the data into what it means and doesn’t mean. In any event, Rossi’s team doesn’t seem too interested in it.
Erik @ 60
A PDF of Sharkansky’s request can be found here:
http://www.soundpolitics.com/D.....050222.pdf
See #’s 5,6, and 8.
Mark @57,
I have no idea what Sharkansky actually requested, so I have no idea about KC’s ability to comply. But if he wants to see the polling place reconciliation worksheets, they are on the inside cover of the poll books. We know that KC has shared access to the poll books… the Dems are going through them to check the accuracy of the R’s felons list.
But here’s the thing with the binder… it’s not a spreadsheet-like accounting, like Stefan implies it should be. The purpose of reconciliation is to explain discrepancies, not necessarily eliminate them (thought they sometimes do that too.) So you can’t really come up with a compiled county-wide number that portrays an accurate picture of what went on. You need to look at it precinct by precinct… which is how the process is performed.
I go back to the example of the voter from Precinct A who gets handed a ballot from Precinct B. Those two precincts will never reconcile, and by Stefan’s logic, that is a two-vote discrepancy (an extra ballot here, an extra voter there.) But to the canvassers, both discrepancies are adequately explained.
Stefan’s thesis is that if this were not a stolen election, King County would have already provided the evidence proving their innocence. But I don’t think this binder, by its very subjective nature, could ever really prove that.
Goldy @ 62
To view Sharkansky’s request, see my post @ 61.
If, as you say, the polling place reconciliation worksheets are in the individual polling books, then what is in the Big Binder?
You said on 2/21/2005: “According to… Bobbie Egan, in addition to the poll books, there is a ‘big binder’ down at the office that contains all the reconciliation data Logan cited above, for all 2616 precincts.”
Whether it is a “spreadsheet-like accounting” or a loose collection of Burger King napkins with crayon notes, that Big Binder has apparently not been seen by anyone posting here or SP. The binder may have nothing of probative value in it, but if that is the case, what is the hold-up?
The fact remains that the law requires them explain what did or MIGHT have happened to any discrepancies. One would really hope that we’re not going to find 2,000 entries of, “uhhh… I dunno.”
Goldy @ 56–
You said the BIG BINDER was available to anyone. Your selective memory is amusing a$$wipe.
I’ve warned you repeatedly that Prozac combined with heavy pot-smoking has been proven to lead to early-Alzheimers!!!!
You lied GOLDY!!!
Now you are making it worse.
May the BIG BINDER attack you in your sleep and eat your face & genitals like that Chimpanzee did to it’s former owner!!!!
Mrs. C @ 59
Dammit woman…..you promised in our wedding vows NEVER to discuss the dreaded “Cynical family curse”.
Since you broke our vows, I feel free to tell folks that I have to roll you in flour before we….you know honey.
And then there was that time I forgot to put down the toilet seat and you sat down with such force the suction stuck you on the pot. We had to call 911 and a plumber to unbolt the toilet, take you to the Emergency Room with the toilet stuck to your fat ass and have it surgically removed. Post-surgery, you were chapped for 2 months. REMEMBER??!!
BIG BINDER makes Top Ten Wanted list.
LOL @ Chee….Mr CynicalIdiot has been praying for a big binder for the past 32.3 years according to Shark’s latest excell spread sheets……affirmed by Mrs. Cynical…(she desperately wants him to find it)
LOL @ Chee….Mr CynicalIdiot has been praying for a big binder for the past 32.3 years according to Shark’s latest excell spread sheets……affirmed by Mrs. Cynical…(she desperately wants him to find it)
LOL @ Chee….Mr CynicalIdiot has been praying for a big binder for the past 32.3 years according to Shark’s latest excell spread sheets……affirmed by Mrs. Cynical…(she desperately wants him to find it)
Supposedly, liberals are sooooo enlightened, tolerant high-minded and whatnot. Yet when they attack Cynical, the big joke is about his sexuality. Seems as though liberals are just like the pedo priests — preach one thing and do the opposite.
I personally couldn’t care less about the “jokes” themselves and Cynical can defend himself. It is the hypocrisy that is offensive.
Goldy:
To be fair…I wasn’t smacking the couple for not selectively aborting per se. That isn’t my point.
My problem with these couples who seek fertility treatments and find themselves with multiple fetuses is that they’re told in advance that this is a likelihood. For a couple that is barely scratching out a living….it is an irresponsible and immoral decision to have that many children at once.
To deliberately bring people into the world that you can’t care for is wrong. Worse…the television show I watched Sunday night was glorifying it as some great sacrifice.
Carla @ 71
“My problem with these couples who seek fertility treatments and find themselves with multiple fetuses is that they’re told in advance that this is a likelihood. For a couple that is barely scratching out a living… it is an irresponsible and immoral decision to have that many children at once.”
Are you actually advocating personal responsibility? Do you know that they’ll revoke your DNC membership card for that?
A PDF of Sharkansky’s request can be found here:
Thanks.
jpgee@67,68,69. :-)…At last, the BIG BINDER has been located. The Seattle Stranger just revealed Nancy Drew copped it and has it in her New York Tower. Superman Rossi is leaping tall buildings at a single bound to find it for Ms. Lane. That means Mr. Cyncial is just shit out of luck.
mark@72: There you go getting sensible again, wanting people to take responsibility for their own actions.
Mark @ 72:
I’ve always advocated for personal responsibility. That’s why I’ve never voted Republican.
carla@76. Good one!
Mark @72
Whew, what can one say when attacked by the really radical left? Take it as a badge of honor. The right-of-center can illustrate such ridiculous sentiments for what it actually is – intolerance.
carla,
You never voted Republican? I am so shocked…I have voted Democrat before.
Close your mouth, you could catch flies…
…