The King County Canvassing Board voted today to reject over half two-thirds of the voter registration challenges brought by the GOP several days before the election. The rulings only concerned those challenged voters who cast a ballot in the November 8 election.
While the proceedings were still ongoing when I left, a pattern quickly emerged. Dan Satterberg (representing County Prosecuting Attorney Norm Maleng, a Republican) voted to accept all the registration challenges, arguing that mailbox businesses could never be used as a registration address, whereas Elections Director Dean Logan and Democratic Councilman Dow Constantine only accepted those challenges for which “clear and convincing evidence” was provided either by the GOP or the voters themselves, that this was not their actual residence.
This party line split is not like to satisfy either side, for while it establishes a precedent by which challengers must meet a high standard in order to prevail, it does nothing to discourage the GOP from filing similar speculative, poorly researched challenges in the future. And the lack of unanimity will only feed into partisan tensions.
Ironically, the Democrats’ willingness to accept a challenge, even though the challenger failed to meet the statutory requirement of providing evidence of the voter’s actual address, created the odd situation in which those voters who actively defended their ballots were those most likely to be disqualified. Logan and Constantine voted to accept the challenge of those voters whose testimony in person or via affidavit provided an alternate address. For those who did not testify and for which the GOP could not prove another residence, the challenge was rejected.
The philosophical difference between Constantine and Logan on the one side, and Satterberg on the other was best illustrated by the case of David Combs, a homeless man, registered at a UPS mailbox store, who testified that the owner actually gave him a key so that he could sleep inside the store on cold nights and use the facilities.
Constantine cited this as an example that “the challenger’s assertion that certain classes of property could not be used as a residence was not acceptable,” and that the board “cannot conclude as a matter of law” that all such mailbox registrations are invalid. Satterberg nonetheless repeated his interpretation that a mailbox facility could never be a valid residence, regardless of the circumstances.
I’ll provide my thoughts and analysis in a separate post, once the final tally is in.
UPDATE:
Unofficial tally: 57 challenges accepted, 132 challenges rejected.
UPDATE, UPDATE:
WashBlog’s mysterious Anonym has more on today’s hearing, but be sure to link on over to his cross-post at Daily Kos and recommend the diary, so this important local story gets maximum national exposure.
We knew this……….
Big surprise…
It’s the culture of corruption that is conservatism.
The culture of corruption is Seattle. Home of the dead, the felons, the double voters, and the midgets who live in post office boxes!
I’m sorry, I apologize to the midgets! I can see the Republican TV commercials in 2006 already.
Perhaps the GOP will consider having someone with personal knowledge next time and not try to make their own form up.
Brezshnev also had the Party certify his wins….
sgmmac—
SHAME ON YOU!!!!
Those teeny-tiny voters that live in those Teeny-tiny mailboxes are NOT midgets!!!
They are VERTICALLY CHALLENGED!!
Remember, you are on a Blog where these LEFTIST PINHEADS are very sensitive and easily offended!
Vertically Challenged voters who live in teeny mailboxes are real in Dow Constantine and Dean Logan’s world!
Vertically challenged (not midgets!!)
Dow & Dean probably believe in Sasquatch unitl someone proves they don’t exist!
Where is the respect?
It is truly difficult to fathom what “clear & convincing evidence” would consist of for Dow & Dean, isn’t it.
I can just envision these 2 CLOWNS staring at a picture of a 4″X6″ mailbox and quizzing each other….
“Dean….how do we know for sure this voter isn’t actually living in this little slot??”
“We don’t Dow!!…the Republicans failed to knock on the box to confirm no one was at home”.
“Good point Dean!!”
Conclusion….We are not convinced that this voter is not living in the 4″X6″ Mailbox!!!
What would be “clear & convincing” to these CLOWNS???
Dean sez “It’s not CLEAR to me Dow that the voter doesn’t live in that little slot”
Dow sez “I’m certainly not CONVINCED Dean”.
WTF!!
Cynical @13,
The issue, as I am sure you are well aware, is that Logan and Constantine are not convinced that a mailbox address is always and necessarily improper. In the case of Combs, they accepted that as his actual residence.
But you continue with your ridicule and bullshit avoidance of the issue if you want. It will serve you as well in 2006 as it did in 2005.
Homeless citizens can vote unless convicted of a felony
http://www.secstate.wa.gov/ele.....e/faq.aspx
Denying a citizen the right to vote because they do not have a permanent place to live is Unconstitutional and just plain WRONG.
Satterberg can go to hell. If he does not like mail boxes, he g-d damn well better provide an alternative, or shut the hell up.
Now, because they are dedicated to ferreting out every last illegitimate voter, the Republicans will move on and perform the same analysis and challenges in Okanogan, Chelan, Spokane, Yakima, and Benton counties. All of which had a higher change rate per capita during last year’s recounts.
Right?
State law is pretty clear where the homeless are supposed to be registered and it doesn’t include post office boxes. It is also ironic that you say those who are honest and stated another address were thrown out, if that’s what I understand your post to say. Those are the very ones whose address should have been changed and their votes counted. Should they be punished because KCRE hasn’t been following the law? KCRE used to check for this and they stopped. Now all these voters are the ones who are inconvienced. I read that KCRE wouldn’t let the people who live in the Marina register there, so they got the post office box, if you live in the Marina, you need to be registered in the Marina. Who hasn’t watched Sleepless in Seattle and know that there are lots of people living in Houseboats in Seattle?
I guess the message for Republicans is to change strategy. Rather than trying to find and register legit voters, it is time to start filling out those cards and using any PO or UPS box you can think of. The Dems have no problem with this, so have at it. Better to have lots of illegitimate voters than inconvenience someone by making them prove they are a resident.
Janet, it would work better if a gang of thousands all got post office boxes in Constantine’s district!
Janet:
They already changed strategy. Since the GOP could not find and register legit voters, they simply have tried to intimidate voters by declaring them invalid, despite having any personal knowledge. In extreme cases, they have prevented people from voting provisionally without doing any investigation.
As a partisan, I’m sure you prefer the GOP’s more active fraud to your suggestion of passive fraud.
And, isn’t it funny that to this day, the only actual instances of vote fraud to be proven have been GOP attempts to prevent people from voting. The minnow has spent over a year trying to show some sort of fraud, only to have every attempt thrown out. In the end, the only instance of vote fraud that has ever been reported by the minnow was his own intimidation of a voter.
If it were not so sad, it would make you laugh.
Maleng’s office is up for grabs in ’06. Let’s get it.
Goldy–
I can appreciate that Mr. Combs testified that the owner of the mailbox service allows him to live there on cold nights. I wonder if it is zoned residential and legal to live in that commercial facility??? Seperate issue but curious. That would mean virtually anyone could claim a commercial facility as his residence, wouldn’t it? Did Mr. Combs testify how many nights per year he slept there??? Did the owner validate Combs testimony?? I’m just asking.
It is kind of hard to believe that very many other mailbox services give a key to a homeless person, allow him/her to use bathroom facilities and sleep inside on a regular basis. It would scare the hell out of me to walk in to get my mail and have some guy pop his head out of a sleeping bag….but I suppose it’s POSSIBLE. I checked with a couple Mailbox facilities myself about this….and asked them if they had done it or know anyone else who does. NOPE!
I guess one would have to be convinced that that mailbox facility can legally be a residence under zoning laws and how many nights spent there establish residency. It seems to create some new issues……but it’s possible.
Oh Goldy, do you have the name and address of that mailbox facility handy??
Hey i wonder if that guy has home insurance.
“Constantine cited this as an example that … the board ‘cannot conclude as a matter of law’ that all such mailbox registrations are invalid. Satterberg nonetheless repeated his interpretation that a mailbox facility could never be a valid residence, regardless of the circumstances.”
The key phrase here is “as a matter of law,” and Satterberg — a lawyer who should know better — got it wrong. Logan, a non-lawyer, got it right.
Constantine, who is a lawyer, should sit down with his fellow barrister, Satterberg, and explain what Satterberg apparently slept through in Civil Procedure 100:
A ruling “as a matter of law” forecloses any inquiry into the facts. It renders the facts irrelevant. Obviously a mailbox number and a residential address can physically coincide; therefore, whether a given mailbox number is the voter’s physical residence is a question of fact to be determined by the trier of fact (in this case, the trier of fact is the canvassing board). But Satterberg is saying, in effect, that even if a person physically resides at a mailbox facility it cannot be considered his physical residence — even though state law expressly provides that a park bench, curb, or doorway can be a physical residence for voting purposes. That’s ridiculous.
Maybe we should skip the factual inquiry and conclude, as a matter of law, that Satterberg doesn’t know the law.
Cynical @23,
The point is not whether it is likely that a person may be legitimately registered at a mailbox facility, but whether it is possible. Sotelo simply didn’t conduct a proper challenge. If she had indeed provided the actual address of voters, more of the challenges would have been successful.
You see no problem with disqualifying otherwise eligible voters due to technicalities in their voter registration (and let’s be clear… there is not evidence of a single case of vote fraud here), yet you don’t seem to think it matters that Sotelo should be required to meet the technical requirements of the challenge statute, the purpose of which is to shield against wrongful disqualification.
Reply to 23
You raise valid questions, Cynical. These are the kinds of questions that should be asked in a challenge hearing. That’s why the canvassing board should make findings of fact, instead of determining “as a matter of law” (as Satterberg wants to do) that a commercial facility can’t be a residence for voting purposes regardless of the facts.
@25
People who live on park benches, curbs, and doorways are registered at the county building closet to the bench, curb, and doorway, and people living part time in a post office facility should also be registered at the closet county building.
The owner of the post office facility had better hope that there isn’t any accidents night, he might find his insurance company balking at giving him any payment, although what he is doing is very nice.
Maybe what Satterberg wants is a “chatter test,” i.e., homeless people can vote, but only if their teeth are chattering. If they’re someplace warm and dry, they’re disqualified.
@29
I hope not, there are hundreds registered at one homeless shelter in Seattle and it’s legal. The Republicans know this.
Goldy @ 26
“You see no problem with disqualifying otherwise eligible voters due to technicalities in their voter registration”
This whole process is a CHALLENGE, not a disqualification. GOP Challenged (not disqualified) over 1400 voters, and your 2/3rds rejection rate represents only 189 total votes of the 1400.
What is happening to the other 1200+ Challenged Registrations. Isn’t that what the true “Big Picture” is???
Well, here’s one for you rightys to jump on: Shoddy work by counties in cleaning up registration rolls can trigger a federal lawsuit. Don’t y’all try to call DOJ all at once now, y’all hear? One at a time, or you’ll jam their phone lines!
http://www.boston.com/news/nat.....ng_errors/
“UPDATE: Unofficial tally: 57 challenges accepted, 132 challenges rejected.”
57? Out of 1,944? Does this mean Sotelo is now facing only 1,887 perjury counts?
Yawn,
Ya’ll pretending to feel guilty over homeless, reality is this is a clever way to keep from ever accounting for all the ballots… gee we don’t wanna have to check everyone, count every ballot (including those not cast, but printed)
From your article…
“The fact is the governor got the process started on creation of a centralized voter registration database” when he was secretary of state, Jackson said.
Seems kind of silly to boast about simply complying with federal law…
Clearly, the registrations that are in error should be fixed – the question is do you toss out the votes of people who acted in good faith by registering at what they considered their address even if it did not meet the letter of the statute?
Lets not forget one thing – in all of this there is NO EVIDENCE OF FRAUD!!! Sorry to shout, but the Republican’s games to undermine our electoral system and faith in democracy are getting out of control. If they were interested in helping the system they could have provided these problems ahead of time. They didn’t.
What is happening to the other 1200+ Challenged Registrations. Isn’t that what the true “Big Picture” is???
Well, several hundred were already inactive so there’s not much left to challenge. This ruling only covered people who voted in November. I don’t know what happens next with the registrations of people who didn’t vote.
Adding these to the hundreds the Republicans already had to drop and you have a pretty embarassing error rate.
It is pretty clear that Sotelo and the Republican Party engaged in an illegal conspicracy that violated the law as to the challenge system. Both Sotelo and anyone who consipred with her to violate this law needs to be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.
If you believe in the rule of law – whether you are an independent, Democrat or a Republican – you should support such an inquiry into this situation and the bringing of charges.
If they were interested in helping the system they could have provided these problems ahead of time. They didn’t.
Worth repeating…
Nindid @ 36
You are right, there is no evidence of fraud.
But I do believe that KC Elections did drag their feet in providing the information requested. There is also a law/statute that states a timeframe of Challenging a Voter, and that timeframe is within 30 days of an election (I think).
I also believe if they had done their JOBS in the first place, the GOP would not have gotten this far with the Political Games.
In all fairness, KC Elections doesn’t react well to public scrutiny. The Elections Dept has and will continue to be a whipping post, until an elected auditor is in place.
In Judge Bridges ruling, he himself told the voters of KC to clean up the mess, and that is what the VOTERS of KC should be doing, not the GOP.
I would be proud if my vote was challenged. At least I would know that someone is paying attention. I don’t mind a bit to defend my right to vote. Neither should the 1400+ Challenged Voters.
@35
Sam Reed’s office told me in an email that I received late election night, that he was trying and he got lots of reforms passed the last legislative session, and the most important reform of “his” is the state voter registration database which will start in January. I wonder if he can say HAVA? They also promised that the state will do lots of cross-checks for the felons, the dead, and the double voters. We shall see. The real question is if they will check for post office boxes??????
@34
“is this is a clever way to keep from ever accounting for all the ballots”
No, it’s a straightforward way to protect the rights of those entitled to vote — from people like you who take a cavalier attitude toward our most precious right.
Extra yawn/burp
Roger, my precious right got cancelled out by Logan/Sims having no clue how many votes vs voters were out there.
I’ll bet you the manager of my 7-11 knows the difference between cash in drawer and sales that day….
In other breaking news, Robert Magabe announced that the elections in Zimbabwe were pure as snow!! [hehe]
The Republicans on this list seem to want to make sure that every voter follows the law, but don’t think the law should apply to their own party. The challenges did not meet the legal requirements for a challenge. You are supposed to have personal knowledge that the individual is not living at the registered address and be able to provide the actual address at which the challenged voter resides. The canvassing board should throw out any challenges for which the Republicans did not provide these elements. Ms. Sotelo should be prosecuted for perjury for any challenges for which she did not have personal knowledge that the voter did not live at that address. The Republicans tried a political grandstanding play to embarrass Ron Sims and in the process they broke the law.
Reply to 42
Go do your armadillo a favor.
Aexia @ 39 — OK. If they were interested in helping the system they could have provided these problems ahead of time. They didn’t.
In fact, many of the challenge letters arrived inside the 3-day window, thus preventing many affected citizens (for instance, those who reversed their mailing and physical addresses) from correcting their registrations in time to vote.
If they were interested in helping the system they could have provided these problems ahead of time. They didn’t.
Bryan K-43 ‘..and be able to provide the actual address at which the challenged voter resides.’
How do you find out where someone actually lives if they are not listed in the phone book or some other public resource? It appears that if someone wanted to commit fraud and register at a PO Box in another precinct there is no way to stop it. Is that the intent?
I believe the challenges were turned into Dean Logan on the 26th of October.
The wingnuts will never give up on Rossi. The reason why lies in the close nature of Rossi’s near win. A squeaker of a win means one of two things – the candidate ran a lousy campaign or compromised a narrow constituency the least.
Narrow wins are the most satisfying to a wingnut. A wingnut would absolutely hate a Sam Reed type win by a solid majority – he wouldn’t be very interested in their extremist agenda.
So the wingnuts will go on and on about Rossi and what might have been. Whine, whine, whine – the one thing they will NEVER do is support a candidate that can get a solid majority of votes.
Dan Satterberg is a snake and nothing that he does would surprise me.
Gentlemen,and Janet S
We are in an untenable position
KC won’t check for illegals, says citizens have to
Citizens try, but don’t have records sufficient to do so
We try, and get “ticketed”
Nice job lefties of constructing the perfect loop of vote system control.
Jim Miller has an unintentionally hilarious post over at SoundPolitics. The punch line: “I don’t mention this old column just to needle Dickie … but to illustrate how partisanship can distort our thinking.”
For the set-up, see
http://www.soundpolitics.com/a.....tml#005367
For all you King County bashers, apparently their practices are in line with much of the state, including several elected, Republican auditors.
But don’t let these facts get in your way.
K @ 51
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/.....ion25.html
forgot the link
Reply to 46
“How do you find out where someone actually lives if they are not listed in the phone book or some other public resource?”
Challenging someone else’s right to vote isn’t supposed to be easy. You’re messing with their most basic right as a citizen. This law is not designed to encourage mass challenges. Let’s say you notice that a next-door neighbor who moved away 10 years ago is still voting in your precinct. You file a challenge. You appear at the canvassing board and say, “this house is right next to mine. Joe Blow moved in 1995, and the Wilsons live there now.” That’s how it’s supposed to work. If you don’t KNOW, from your own knowledge, that a voter registered at a given address doesn’t reside there, you have no business filing a challenge.
@50
Hmmm … Despite the GOP’s contest lawsuit fiasco, Miller still insists Rossi got more “legal” votes than Gregoire. You’re right — that IS hilarious!!!
HEE HOO HAW HA HAR DE HAR HAR HEE HEE HAW HOO HAR HA HA HA HEE HAR HAW HUH HOO HAW HAW HA HEE HAR HA HA HO HO HEE HAR YUCK HAW HAR HOO HA CHUCKLE HAR HAR HO HA HUH SNICKER HOO HAR HA HAW HA HAR HOO HEE HEE HAR HAR HA HA HAW HAR HAR HEE HOO HAR HA HUH HOO HAW HEE HAR HO HO HE HAR HAW HEE HEE HO HO HA HA HOO HAR HA HA
Well said as usual, Mr. Rabbit.
Roger Rabbit-56 ‘That’s how it’s supposed to work.’
Are you saying we have a good loophole for anyone wanting to commit fraud?
TAK TO YOUR HOT SHOR LAWYER FRIEND — IDEA UP FOR GRABS
To help get some clarity in this matter – those who can do – get some hot shot legal folks to lauch a major civil suit for damages against the R’s …
I think a jury would be very sympathetic to the folks who were put in the postion of voter intimidation and trickery for pure partisan reasons.
Discovery would be interesting and the trial great sport – and I think all parties could get a multi million dollar verdict agains the State R. party – who is behind all this chicanery.
Sue – it’s very American. And it brought the old KKK to their knees in Alabama, ie. Morris Dees.
…speaking of rejection and thoroughly OFF TOPIC…
it looks like even the Canadians are getting sick of the liberal ways…
Canadian Liberal Government Defeated in Non-Confidence Vote 171 to 133
Election date to be announced Tuesday
OTTAWA, November 28, 2005 (LifeSiteNews.com) – This evening the Canadian House of Commons passed a non-confidence motion against the Paul Martin led Liberal government. The vote easily passed by a vote of 171 to 133.
The Prime Minister is expected to announce on Tuesday the date of a general election. That date is expected to be January 23 which the Liberal leadership is widely said to consider to be to their political advantage. However, the Prime Minister could call for the vote to take place as early as January 9.
And as i remember, the whiter neo – Nazi church in N. Idaho lost a major suit and was all but wiped out as well. Mr. Buter and his shabby bunch of scum, spent years causing grief in the Northwest. Butler died last year, and N. Idaho is a cleaner place.
And by the way, yes the current R party is Washington State is very close to neo Nazi and Supremist.
Their ultra right wing blather moves them closer every year. Much to my surprise, the so called mainstreamers are totally out in the cold after years of hard right organizing.
For those who say that the I am recommending a situation where no one could be challenged, the exact words from the RCW are below. Voting is a fundamental right. It is the right that allows us to change the course of the government when it takes a direction we disagree with. As such it it intended to be hard to challenge. It is done that way to prevent illegal attempts to sway an election exactly like the one engineered by Ms. Sotelo.
RCW 29A.08.830: The challenger shall file with the county auditor a signed affidavit subject to the penalties of perjury, to the effect that to his or her personal knowledge and belief another registered voter does not actually reside at the address as given on his or her registration record or is otherwise not a qualified voter and that the voter in question is not protected by the provisions of Article VI, section 4, of the Constitution of the state of Washington. The person filing the challenge must furnish the address at which the challenged voter actually resides.
“it looks like even the Canadians are getting sick of the liberal ways…”
No, it means that a coalition of opposition parties managed to table and win a vote of no confidence. Polls suggest that the Liberals currently have a 5 point margin over Conservatives.
But you see, this is one of the beauties of parliamentary democracies: opposition parties actually can have political power.
If the vote last week in the Senate in favor of a planned reduction of troops in Irqaq were held in a parliment, that could have ended the govt.
67 Senators voted for it, a wide margin.
Merck to cut 7,000 jobs, close or sell five plants
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By The Associated Press
Monday, November 28, 2005
Go Democrat Trail Lawyers!! Put the drug companies, and the tobacco companies, and the auto companies out of business because they are evil!! [hehe…Atlas has Shrugged!!] TRENTON, N.J. (AP) – Embattled drugmaker Merck & Co. said Monday it will cut 7,000 jobs –11 percent of its work force — and close or sell five manufacturing plants in the first phase of a reorganization meant to save up to $4 billion by the end of the decade. Its shares dropped 4 percent in late morning trading.
@ 57
What Jim Miller is probably thinking is “give me a million dollars to prove Distributed Vote Fraud. Don’t give it to Davis, Wright, Tremaine. I’m cheap! 50% off. Choose me!”
However, if you’re feeling generous we can start the Jim Miller Center for the study of Distributed Vote Fraud. Just a couple million to get it started. Walton, Bush crime families – heeeee’s ready!
Blacks in Harare, the Sudan, and Philly should be able to vote Democrat in King County. Anyone who disagrees is racist!!! [Democrats: third world parasites!]
If Democrat New York Jews can vote in NYC and Palm Beach [Gore 2000], shouldn’t they be allowed to vote in King County as well?
Ass @61 – I suppose someday I will stop being amazed at how people love to crow about their own ignorance.
Just a FYI for introduction into your discussion on voter reg. and the Rovecan ploy to deny voters their rights. Down here in the “land of fruits and nuts” (California) we have a small community that has NO addresses. The people even voted to deny the USPS demand of addresses. They all have PO Boxes, and their never has been a major voter challenge. This little berg is Carmel-by-the-Sea. A center of wealth that is offscale. (No kidding you cannot buy a 1bedroom cottage for under a million bucks.)
I can just imagine some Republican weenie coming up to ex-mayor Cliint Eastwood and challenging his registration: “Go ahead PUNK! make my day.”
One thing for certain is that the Republicans have no respect for American’s right to vote. They are as cynical ,visa vis to our voting laws, as they are about the rest of the Constitution. No matter Ohio, Florida, or your great State, they are driven by the modern day Macheivelli, Karl Rove. Except Machiavelli was probably more moral. So it doesn’t matter what the consequences, rules or ethics are, they will do anything with no regard to fairness in order to win.
Glad you people don’t; have to deal with Ahneee to deal with. He is such a dick.
OT but important: Everyone should read this.
Iraq is such a fucking failure. It’s over. End of story..
Wow I guess Mr. JCH really has been brain washed well. (probably a small load-short cycle with no rinse) Let us all blame the faults of the money driven corporations on the Trial Lawyers, similar to the “Trail Lawyers”he cited. they produce chemicals that they heavily advertise to do one thing without caring about the side effects. This ruins several thousand lives and people like JCH say “So?” But what the hell this has to do with voter reg. only his pathetically narrow mind knows. Probably lost some money on the Market today and is feeling put upon.
A little off subject but important:
To all the caring conservatives out there please consider adopting a soldier. This will give our fighting men and women access to what they really want to listen too instead of all the public radio BS the armed force radio has to serve them. This is a great gift.
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/ho.....guest.html
OT but important: Everyone should read this.
Iraq is such a fucking failure. It’s over. End of story.. -Comment by For the Clueless— 11/28/05 @ 8:15 pm
I’ll see your specialist and raise you 3 terrorists
Don’t let the fact that their former comrades want to see you dead… preferrably with you head in another county… color your views, aptly-named-clueless
filter caught…again…but look for it aptly-named-clueless
Very generous of Rush to take your $49.95. It costs Rush $.09 postage for the monthly newsletter and bupkis for the radio program.
I liked Rush’s claim about Ohio state representative Danny Bubp, “a United States Marine… on the ground in Iraq — had the guts to get a message to the Democrats in the House of Representatives. “Cowards cut and run, Marines never do.”
Bubp is a JAG lawyer who has never served in Iraq. It was chicken of him to call decorated, twice-wounded combat vet Jack Murtha a coward. It was chicken of Rush to repeat the smear… and pitiful of him to try and promote Bubp to the war zone.
Hadn’t seen a post by my dimwitted detractor, HCYBProud, so glad to notice his posting. Proof you needn’t be of average intelligence to access the Internet. He should really thank Al Gore for the gift.
Very generous of Rush to take your $49.95. It costs Rush $.09 postage for the monthly newsletter and bupkis for the radio program.
Well my wife wanted to donate $50.00 to donks coming…. I mean Americans coming together but being the conservative head of the household I took matter into my own hands. I didn’t want the money to go to a complete waste. At least a soldier will appreciate it.
BOEING BOB
Why dont you go buck a rivet like a good little boy.
@63 RCW 29A.08.830 covers how to challenge someone who you think lives somewhere other than the legally registered residence on their voter registration. I think the actual claim here is that the challenged voter never legally registered because they failed to provide the minimum requirements for registration, namely a residential address (mandatory) and a postal address (optional).
YO
Why dont you go do your armadillo a favor.
ASS: I link to PBS you link to WND (WingNutDaily).
You’re a bankrupt, withered, wretched hater – it’s all you’ve got left.
As for DOOFUS, yes it’s very appreciated and worthwhile to send a care package to a soldier serving in this utterly obscene and worthless engagement in Iraq but please DON’T DO IT THROUGH LIMBAUGH.
I don’t care if Limbaugh doesn’t get a cent – he whoring for PR after years of lying, hating and shilling for Republicans on the radio and DOOFUS is his running lackey. I understanding people are finally tuning him out and his ratings are down in many markets.
Start here instead.
Hey, how’s your virtuous hero from California Cunningham? He’s only the tip of the iceberg DOOFUS.
RCW 29A.04.151
Residence
Residence” for the purpose of registering and voting means a person’s permanent address where he or she physically resides and maintains his or her abode. However, no person gains residence by reason of his or her presence or loses his or her residence by reason of his or her absence:
(1) While employed in the civil or military service of the state or of the United States;
(2) While engaged in the navigation of the waters of this state or the United States or the high seas;
(3) While a student at any institution of learning;
(4) While confined in any public prison.
Absence from the state on business shall not affect the question of residence of any person unless the right to vote has been claimed or exercised elsewhere.
BUSH’S WAR TAX
I paid Bush’s war tax tonight. Not intentionally — I merely went grocery shopping, and didn’t know I paid a war tax until I got home.
Among the items I unloaded from my cart at the checkout stand was a half gallon of Dreyer’s ice cream for Mrs. Rabbit. When I got home, Mrs. R. eyed the ice cream suspiciously, then said, “Does this package look smaller to you?” I checked — and sure enough, the half gallon had shrunk to 1.75 quarts.
The same thing happened 35 years ago, when LBJ and Nixon put the Vietnam War on a credit card: The food packages got smaller. It’s a sneaky way of raising the price without consumers noticing until they get home with the groceries.
You see, there’s no such thing as a free lunch. Wars have to be paid for, and if we don’t pay for them on our Form 1040s, we pay for them with an inflation tax.
Inflation is not an act of God. It is not caused by weather, sunspots, or other natural events. Inflation is entirely a man-made phenomenon. It occurs when you have more money in circulation chasing the same goods and services, or any time the money supply increases faster than the supply of goods and services. That’s exactly what Bush did when he increased spending to fight a war and cut taxes for the rich.
I figure 1/8th quart of the missing ice cream was blown up on Iraq’s battlefields, and the other eighth-quart was divided between rich (90%) and middle-class (10%) taxpayers.
You know the country is in a war if the food packages are gettig smaller.
You forget this section, Rufus:
RCW 29A.08.112
Nontraditional address.
No person registering to vote, who meets all the qualifications of a registered voter in the state of Washington, shall be disqualified because of a nontraditional address being used as a residence address. Voters using such an address will be registered and assigned to a precinct based on the location provided. Voters without a traditional address will be registered at the county courthouse, city hall, or other public building near the area that the voter considers his or her residence. Registering at a nontraditional address will not disqualify a voter from requesting ongoing absentee voter status if the voter designates a valid mailing address.
For the purposes of this section, “nontraditional address” includes shelters, parks, or other identifiable locations that the voter deems to be his or her residence.
And this:
ARTICLE VI
ELECTIONS AND ELECTIVE RIGHTS
SECTION 1 QUALIFICATIONS OF ELECTORS.
All persons of the age of eighteen years or over who are citizens of the United States and who have lived in the state, county, and precinct thirty days immediately preceding the election at which they offer to vote, except those disqualified by Article VI, Section 3 of this Constitution, shall be entitled to vote at all elections.
Now tell me donks… do you see anything in the definition of a residence as to included dead people? Is a grave a legal residence?
Observer-71 ‘They all have PO Boxes, and their never has been a major voter challenge.’
Perfect. How many out-of-towners with an in-town PO box would it take to sway the politics in the area? Just enough to approve a Wal-Mart or something?
Roger Rabbit-56 ‘That’s how it’s supposed to work.’
Are you saying we have a good loophole for anyone wanting to commit fraud?
Challenging someone else’s right to vote isn’t supposed to be easy. You’re messing with their most basic right as a citizen.
I am in favor as making the right to vote just as easy as your right to purchase and bear arms. Can I get an amen brother!!!
89
The right to vote goes to the guy with the most guns. Or so says the Ethiopian exchange student I spoke with yesterday.
91
Rufus, I’d like to make it easier for everyone to own guns, and also easier for you to read books with big words. :)
Reply to 88
That depends. If Sotelo isn’t prosecuted, I’d say yes.
89
Amen!
Let’s register people to vote at gun shows!
90
“The right to vote goes to the guy with the most guns. Or so says the Ethiopian exchange student I spoke with yesterday.”
That’s why liberals must arm.
Rufus, I’d like to make it easier for everyone to own guns, and also easier for you to read books with big words.
Wow – you are a voucher supporter. Well welcome to HA.
Liberals with guns… whooo what a thought. What are you going to do with them. Shoot policmen who profile.
gun ownership is not an issue there is a liberal consensus on.
Doofus, what do you think of shooting people who destroy property? http://www.komotv.com/news/story.asp?ID=32534
@99
Only if you shoot people who tear down homeowner’s flags!
sgmmmac, did they tear down the flag and then spray paint “Bush 2004” on the house?
Shoot the anti-American scum.
Naw, It was on Kiro or Komo and one of the commentator’s highlighted it too. He had a Army 101st Airborne flag (Screaming Eagles), an American Flag and other patriotic stuff too. They’ve destroyed the flags several times, I think I remember they wrote something on the side of his house.
RUFUS @ 86
“Now tell me donks… do you see anything in the definition of a residence as to included dead people? Is a grave a legal residence?”
Have you lost your marbles or something? Nobody disputes that the dead are not eligible to vote. We all just have to wonder why most of the votes cast on behalf of dead people were done so by GOP in 2004.
yearight @ 90
“Are you saying we have a good loophole for anyone wanting to commit fraud?”
Get some help about your fraud obsession, dude. Really!
@87 ARTICLE VI
ELECTIONS AND ELECTIVE RIGHTS
Irrelavent. The first step in exercising “elective rights” is legally registering.
@86 RCW 29A.08.112
Nontraditional address.
…
For the purposes of this section, “nontraditional address” includes shelters, parks, or other identifiable locations that the voter deems to be his or her residence.
Are you trying to say that some voters deem a 3″ by 3″ slot to be their residence? Because I’m going to have to say that is not physically possible.
MICHAEL – GET ON THE CLUE BUS
Many mllions of Americans do not have the little house with fence, or the nice Apt # 305 – they travel, the are on the road, they live in big trucks, motor homes, they camp across the country, they are on short term jobs, some are really homeless, others in temp living, week by week. Sudents in dorms, soliders, deck hands, a very long list.
You stupid nut wings have the IQ of your leader.
Residence is a metaphor for citizenship. Nothing more.
Someone need to sue the R’s. Millions to be had from the fascist coffers.
@88
“Now tell me donks… do you see anything in the definition of a residence as to included dead people? Is a grave a legal residence?”
If you’re dead, you can’t have “lived” in the precinct for thirty days, can you! It’s hard to believe ANYONE could be as stupid as Rufus the Doofus, but there you have it — another failure of our private school system.
Another child left behind, as it were.
@107
And here’s another contender for Idiot of the Year! Ummm, no, Michael, Article VI isn’t “irrelevant.” It’s where you find the requirements for voting in our state. All of them. I.e., you can’t add more requirements by statute, WAC rule, or altering a challenge form.
That’s TWO children left behind …
Watch for more talk about the partition of Iraq. Mentioned on one of the talk show over the weekend.
Some old colonial boundry, who gives a shit.
@110 And here’s another contender for Idiot of the Year! Ummm, no, Michael, Article VI isn’t “irrelevant.” It’s where you find the requirements for voting in our state. All of them. I.e., you can’t add more requirements by statute, WAC rule, or altering a challenge form.
What you posted was:
ARTICLE VI
ELECTIONS AND ELECTIVE RIGHTS
SECTION 1 QUALIFICATIONS OF ELECTORS.
All persons of the age of eighteen years or over who are citizens of the United States and who have lived in the state, county, and precinct thirty days immediately preceding the election at which they offer to vote, except those disqualified by Article VI, Section 3 of this Constitution, shall be entitled to vote at all elections.
To be more specific, the portion of Article VI that you posted is irrelavent. The part that you conveniently left out is indeed relavent.
SECTION 7 REGISTRATION.
The legislature shall enact a registration law, and shall require a compliance with such law before any elector shall be allowed to vote
The legislature requires, among other things, that you provide a residentail address, which you must comply with before you can be allowed to vote. There is a specific section on nontraditional addresses for those of us who don’t live in a normal house, however, it does not include a 3″ x 3″ slot, in which a person could not reside due to the laws of physics. If you have not provided such a residential address, you are not in compliance and may not vote.
The other section that you conveniently forgot is Section 3, which prior to being ammended read “All idiots, insane persons…are excluded from the elective franchise.” Hits a little too close to home, huh?
@110 And here’s another contender for Idiot of the Year! Ummm, no, Michael, Article VI isn’t “irrelevant.” It’s where you find the requirements for voting in our state. All of them. I.e., you can’t add more requirements by statute, WAC rule, or altering a challenge form.
What you posted was:
[Filtered]
SECTION 7 REGISTRATION.
The legislature shall enact a registration law, and shall require a compliance with such law before any elector shall be allowed to vote
The legislature requires, among other things, that you provide a residentail address, which you must comply with before you can be allowed to vote. There is a specific section on nontraditional addresses for those of us who don’t live in a normal house, however, it does not include a 3″ x 3″ slot, in which a person could not reside due to the laws of physics. If you have not provided such a residential address, you are not in compliance and may not vote.
The other section that you conveniently forgot is Section 3, which prior to being ammended read “All idiots, insane persons…are excluded from the elective franchise.” Hits a little too close to home, huh?
You posted @87
ARTICLE VI
ELECTIONS AND ELECTIVE RIGHTS
SECTION 1 QUALIFICATIONS OF ELECTORS.
All persons of the age of eighteen years or over who are citizens of the United States and who have lived in the state, county, and precinct thirty days immediately preceding the election at which they offer to vote, except those disqualified by Article VI, Section 3 of this Constitution, shall be entitled to vote at all elections.
Stupid filter. Anyway, you know what you posted @87. Article VI is not irrelavent, but if you leave out Section 7 which mandates that you be in compliance with registration law and then proceed to make an argument about who is allowed to vote, the portion that you have posted is indeed irrelavent.
dj-106 ‘Get some help about your fraud obsession, dude.’
Thanks for not answering the question. If only the repubs could drop their scruples enough to match the lefties methods of count-every-vote, legal or otherwise. If that were to happen it might be profitable to buy stock in mail box companies expanding into lefty districts.
On second thought, it would be much better to clean the voter rolls, even with the obvious resistance from the left.
Yearight @ 114
Seriously…get some help. There is no evidence of fraud associated with the “mailbox registrants.” There is no evidence that the people so registered were not fully entitled to vote (as specified in the State Constitution). The issue is whether their registration from was filled out proper or not.
Turning this into an issue of “fraud” betrays either ignorance or a mental health issue.
ASS: I link to PBS you link to WND (WingNutDaily).
You’re a bankrupt, withered, wretched hater – it’s all you’ve got left. -Comment by For the Clueless— 11/28/05 @ 9:54 pm
Lovely.
And such a succint and uplifting positive message from the “elite intellectuals”
Only a complete idiot discounts the message because he hates the messenger.
How’s that IQ aptly namedclueless… somewhat equal to your age or have you aged beyond it??
ASS: Just calling a spade a spade.
Only a complete idiot discounts the message because he hates the messenger.
This applies to you. WND is an extremist propaganda organ of the far right. It is hardly “mainstream”. The pbs link is just a simple interview of an interrogation specialist who was actually in Iraq and recounted his experience. It is a tragedy that meaningless shredding of lives that happened in Vietnam is being repeated in Iraq. It is apparent we haven’t learned from history so we are repeating it.
and what do you have to say about that? Stay the course?
Bankrupt indeed.
all I can say, is if you are ignorant enough that you can believe that a mailbox is really a residential address, then you desreve the corruption you get.
I dont care about partisan bullshit, I care about integrity in the process. Surely some of those people are republicans too unless you claim only democrats are stupid or dishonest enough to do it.
Hey rabbit
see you are still in a bad mood.as i told you before you need to get laid. but then again who wants to fuck an old rabbit.
Re: YR101. My God! When did the Roveublicans get scruples? Was it a extra gift with the $49.95 donation to Rushbaby’s scam? As you Rovites sit with DeLay, Cunningham, Cheney, Frist etal wrapped around your engorged necks, maybe you should pray that Barnum was right, and there will be a Republican born in the next minute who has never read history.
Dear idiot, (yes, cluless that’s YOU) – the bottom line, idiot, whether or not you like/believe the source reporting it, is that there ARE 3 former terrorist, who ARE speaking at Princeton On Dec 8 – that’s called an objective FACT – it can be proven
You’re problem, idiot,is that you cannot distinguish FACT from editorializing. You ASSume that since it’s reported at WND that it has to be a commentary against whatever little you hold dear.
Grow up…. and learn the difference between FACT and OPINION.
I know it’s hard when you believe as FACT the OPINIONS of such esteemed journalists as George Soros, Mary Mapes, and Kos… really you take being a Michael Mooron to a whole new level…. the question on all our minds is… how low can you go?
Proud ASS:
Got that foreign debt thingy figured out yet?
My mom used to get tired of my brother and I making up words when we played “Boggle”, so she made up a new rule where, if you guessed at a word, hoping that it was real, you had to pay for your antics by losing points.
How about this — anyone can file a voter reg challenge, free of charge — if they’re right, groovy-o — but everyone who files an undefendable voter reg challenge is held financially liable to pay the cost of any investigation, hearing, and remunerate the falsely-challenged voter for any out of pocket expenses it creates for them if the challenge is found undefendable?
That oughta take a bite out of crime.
CS-126 ‘..who files an undefendable voter reg challenge is held financially liable to pay..’
Is this support for a general “user pays” process for all lawsuits and criminal prosecutions? Or, would this have to specifically be where illegal voters might be exposed?
Would not “undefendable” refer to the challenged voters position? Maybe you are saying that if the voter is not able to defend their registration, they too would be liable for the costs of investigation, etc. I think I like that idea….
If you’re dead, you can’t have “lived” in the precinct for thirty days, can you! It’s hard to believe ANYONE could be as stupid as Rufus the Doofus, but there you have it – another failure of our private school system.
Comment by Roger Rabbit— 11/29/05 @ 12:52 am
What, stupid?- I thought that I made a good atempt to explain why the democratic candidate gets the dead vote. I cant explain it any other way. Well maybe this is what a lefty means when they say they believe in life after death.
Actually, yearright —
(“Maybe you are saying that if the voter is not able to defend their registration, they too would be liable for the costs of investigation, etc.”) — knowingly providing false registration info is already a class C felony, punishable by up to 5 years in prison, or a fine of $10G in Washington State — RCW 29A.08.230.
So I guess that’s already kind of covered.
However, Ms. Soleto can present a pile of challenges, claiming “personal knowledge” of falsified information, cost the taxpayers lots of money, and walk away saying “ooops!”.
I’m wondering when the day will come that I hear a Republican stand at the microphone and simply say: “I screwed up. I did it, I did it for bad reasons, and it was wrong for me to do it.”?
CS-129 ‘..knowingly providing false registration info is already a class C felony..’
Not lately. It appears that it is only a problem if the person admits to committing a felony. What a system.
Interesting that only 2 of the challenged voters actually had their votes not counted because of the challenges.