Deuteronomy 22:23-24
If a man happens to meet in a town a virgin pledged to be married and he sleeps with her, you shall take both of them to the gate of that town and stone them to death—the young woman because she was in a town and did not scream for help, and the man because he violated another man’s wife. You must purge the evil from among you.
Discuss.
Isn’t that from one of the Torah sections? Then it must be correct!
Nothing new here Goldie, just another admission by the creator of the universe that he screwed up and created man in his own flawed, lustful image, thereby requiring other men to clean up the mess by murdering each other.
Some perfect God, eh? Some perfect universe.
LOL. Kids should be taught this in schools.
Puddy,
OF COURSE! Now you are getting it.
However, the TORAH never claims to be the ONLY source of truth. There is truth in My words here, there is truth in your words here .. even if it is hard to find that truth.
Nor does the Torah claim to be the sole source of truth for all people. Truth has come in the words of Kong Tzu, MLK, the lesson your wife gave you after you spent too much money. Even in My words here.
All of these require that YOU reason. The Torah, for the Jews, has a unique value because it is THEIR story of origin, something as precious as the story revealed by Science. You can choose to be a Jew, if they will have you, just as you can choose to be an American.
As an American, you are expected to accept the teachings of the Declaration and Constitution, tempered by your reason. As a Jew, if you made that choice, you would have to treat My word in the same way.
Where the Torah seems to contradict itself (Thou Shall Not Kill), you must use reason to determine the truth.
Where the Torah seems to contradict science (origin of Cain’s wives, the great flood), you must use reason to determine the truth.
Where the Torah seems to contradict natural law (this passage), you must use reason to determine the truth.
I am that I am.
Uncle Witz
You have limited vision. Have you read the Quran, Kant, Siddartha Gautama, Gandhi?
Each of these has flaws, untruths. It is YOUR job to find the truth.
Only wicked or foolish people blame the Torah or any other source of Truth, for their own misdeeds.
Oh, by the way, there is no “forgiveness” and certainly not the human power to forgive. The best you can do, having done wrong, is t seek what the Jews call Teshuvah.
I am that I am.
Is this passage what those crackers down in Mississippi had in mind when they beat Emmet Till to a bloody pulp? I have a feeling, though, that this particular admonition was not applied symmetrically in that case.
Lib Sci
Note how Puddy, supposedly a committed literalist, avoids commenting on the passage itself.
Puddy, do you believe in stoning adulterers?
God, you fucking piece of shit sockpuppet, Deuteronomy (all of it) is ludicrous nonsense. Anyone who reads this and doesn’t come away at least an agnostic, is beyond reason.
BTW: thanks to Goldy for pulling Horse’s Ass out of the ditch on the sabbath.
Once again we’re here poo flinging over a passage in one people’s ancient cultural artifact.
No God/SJ, this is not the received word of God, because there isn’t any such thing. Is the Torah a poignant cultural heirloom? Sure – celebrate the lineage of the people who call themselves “Jew”.
However, if anything, your first five books, or the whole damn Bible for that matter, is not much more than a series of object lessons on how not to behave. If it is all valuable it is as a lesson on how terrible man can be to each other.
Alas, for far far too many people, the myth that it is somehow “holy” persists and propagates a license for chauvinism and discrimination. A license not to think, because “God” said it, and some holy man interprets it for them. It’s a green light to be insular and close-minded.
Whatever cultural history or feel-good tribal patrimony it represents, however, seems far outweighed by the damage that that book perpetuates.
@7
Really? He’s a literalist? As in 7×24 hour days of the creation story? Eve from Adam’s rib? The flood?
Really?
Does that lead him all the way to the 6000ish year old Earth?
(I’m asking with all earnestness.)
Speaking of Reason, the bible is nothing but contradictions. The rest is sheer bullshit.
Thankfully, Project Reason has catalogued and represented the contradictions graphically:
http://www.project-reason.org/gallery3/image/103/
@11
That’s a great link!!
Lib Sci
Sigghhh.
Boobelah, you seem to misunderstand what the Torah is and is not.
NOWHERE in Jewish history has the Torah been presented as something “holy” to non Jews. THAT is utterly and entirely the invention of the Christians, the same Christians who have repeatedly attempted to wipe out all Jews.
Blaming us for what the Christians have done with OUR Torah is a form of antisemitism.
As for HA God (and whoever you think HA God is >>>I<<< do not speak for Him or Her or It), the views He/She/It states above ARE EXACTLY the views of Torah as it has been taught for over 200 years. Before blaming the Jews for how Christians have misused the Torah, I suggest you read Hillel, Halevi, Maimonides, and Spinoza. Or just go to any synagogue and ask the Rabbi whether he or she thinks nthe Torah tells Jews to stone Bill Clinton and MOnica!
Finally, boobelah, nothing is perfect. Buddha never claimed the perfect, sole path to truth. Nor did Jefferson or MLK OF COURSE Judaism is not perfect. BUT, unlike Christianity it has never made such a claim not ha sit ever attempted to force itself on non Jews.
Be good.
Just had to do that once with my user name – now back to normal!
Goldy–
Do you know the difference between taking something “literally” vs. “metaphorically”?
You go banana’s every time you post something outrageous and folks simply don’t get your intent.
Do you think these may chronicle attempts at law, social control and fear mongering by fledging religious governments desperate at controlling Babylonian impulses the only way they knew how at the time?
The old testament spoke of the Law, the new testament spoke of the fulfillment of the Law.
God-haters, who claim to be intellectuals, seem to enjoy coming at the Bible from the angle of non-belief, cherry-picking and misrepresenting things like this. Not putting them into any perspective but their own.
That’s ok.
There is physical death…we all agree.
I believe there is also Spiritual Death..
God hated sin so much he couldn’t look at any of us which is why Christ was born, lived, died and was Resurrected.
God also gives us individual choice.
I believe.
Most of you confess to be Atheists who do not believe.
Choices, consequences.
If you are right…what have I lost?
If I am right….what have you lost?
Choice—consequences
@10 Lib Sci …
He says so, even in person.
I am not sure how to balance that with other aspects of Puddy. I have, however, seen this sort of dual thinking before in fundamentalists. Francis Collins, the current Director of the NIH, is a bit like Puddy.
Been saying that for years Cynical. When Jesus returns as it says in 1 Thess 4 and His reward is with Him what will the atheists say?
SJ… stoning adulterers… hmmm…?
Not needed anymore. Jesus came to dispense with the Levitical laws and to lift high His Father’s laws, the 10 Commandments.
Why does Puddy have to keep repeating PuddySelf here? Puddy bets 13,000 posts are repeats because leftist have no memory past 24 hours unless they have a “database” to review!
@13 SJ
I’m a boobelah? I’m touched!
(When you wrote “200” you meant “2000”, right? Or did Jewish teaching change 200 years ago? Just to clarify.)
In any case, you strive to draw distinction between your Jewish tribe and that of the various Christian tribes, and other God-worshiping tribes, for that matter.
Perhaps the admonition to use reason to find the truth does temper the blood bath that is your and their bible, but it is still a story of a covenant between humans and a god – THIS IS A FICTION, and a dangerous fiction at that. One that I would assert that humans, if we’re going to survive together and not kill one another and not poison the planet, need to divest ourselves of, and quickly.
Mr Cynical
First of all, “atheism” is a belief too .. but what do YOU mean by atheists?
Were Jefferson and Adams atheists because they did not believe in an anthropomorphic God? I Stephen Haking a Theist because he believes in an ultimate order, albeit one restricted to this universe?
Are Jews atheists because they do not have a concept of Heaven or devils? Was Buddha an atheist?
As for what you have lost, that depends on whether YOUR concept of God is the correct one. The God does not care whether you believe in Me or not, I just wantt you to do good.
But, what if I am not God. What if God is Hamatsa and Hamatsa is a jealous God, angry at you for worshiping a false God, Jesus?
If you have erred and chosen Jesus over Hamatsa, then YOU have lost bigtime.
Lucky for you,
I am that I am
@15
If “God” hated “sin” so much, why did “He” even allow it to exist?
Moreover, your statement if one of terrible self-loathing, which is a powerful recipe for delusional thinking, which does explain a great deal.
Liberal Scientist,
Since you asked in “all earnestness”, Mr and Mrs SeattleJew know our beliefs. We are creationists. We believe the Bible literally. And when The Creator returns what will you think first and last:
The Top Ten Things Literal Scientist will utter
10 Damn
9 Shucks
8 Puddy was right
7 Man I was duped
6 Some HA curse word
5 Boy was I an idiot
4 Where did I go wrong
3 Now what did the Bible say
2 Oh my that is a bright light
1 Looks like Satan was my best bud after all
BULLSHIT
Atheism is a conclusion based on the FACTS.
The tenets of Judeo-Christianity don’t withstand the merest scrutiny.
Actually the teaching of Torah in this way is about 2300 years old.
As to Torah being “fiction,” that is nonsense. In large part it is a history book. The story of Joseph mirrors the reality of the Hyksos, Abraham reflects the reality of the habiru and origins of monodaltry in Northern Sinai, the entire exercise in law reflects the core contribution of Hammurabi to early civilization ….
As for the revelations part, why do you blame us for the evils of Christianity? Do you think that Rome would have led to something kinder and gentler if Justinian the apostate had triumophed?
For the non Jew, the Torah should be held in the same respect I would hope we all have for all the ancient writings of our shared origins. Would you discard the Mahabharata and Vedas as well? Would you cut them off as the root of Hinduism and Buddhism?
In that same spirit, clearly Jefferson was VERY influenced by the story of Jesus. Would you want to cut the tree of Jefferson off form its roots too?
Literal Scientist
Ever Read Isaiah? Ezekiel? How about Rev 12:7-12
Note that Pudpuller and Klynical eschew loyalty to the truth in favor of irrational fear.
@23 Zotz
Atheism is a fact?
Really?
I do not exist? Hmmm?
Do you exist?
Does Jefferson or Kant’s God exist?
Tell you what God will do for you, I will tell you what does not exist!
Particles that can travel at speeds greater than 300,000 km/sec.
A Deity who is all powerful, all knowing, listens to man, and is as moral as President Obama.
I am that I am
And Zotz, what are those “facts”?
An atheist is the opposite of a theist? Whoop dee doo-doo So which one?
God
Allah
Buddha
Mohammad
Confucius
Lucifer
Thor
Zeus
Jupiter
Apollo
And the beat goes on… the beat goes on…
Irrational fear zotz? Nope you dope. Forward thinking into future events where God makes it all right and His Son Jesus claims His own.
Zotz,
I forgot to add ..
Bullshit is real too?
I am that I am
Puddy,
Beware the Hamatsa!
Hamatza? The spirit of the man-eating giant? Puddy bets zotz would love that. This one looks like zotz ready for mouth action…
You should really refrain from underscoring my point.
But then I recognized long ago that you lack the capacity for embarassment or rational thought.
Keep that thought handy zotz when Jesus returns! Puddy suggests you print #33 and store it in your wallet. When Jesus comes in His clouds of Glory with all His angels with Him, open your wallet and read your sad comedy!
Then you’ll be just like Literal Scientist and will deliver a similar thought
10 Damn
9 Shucks
8 Puddy was right
7 Man I was duped
6 Some HA curse word
5 Boy was I an idiot
4 Where did I go wrong
3 Now what did the Bible say
2 Oh my that is a bright light
1 Looks like Satan was my best bud after all
So where is that “atheist” argument zotz? Puddy won’t wait cuz you have no argument!
You are the best laugh so far in this thread. Butt don’t worry some other leftist will appear and relegate you to second or third before this thread disappears into the archives!
Come on ylb. rujax. proud leftist. michael. steve steve steve. etc. Puddy is pulling for you!
17. Puddybud identifying useless Moonbat!s since 2005 and identifying rujax as an arschloch! spews:
Hey zotz, even your budd in stupidity proud leftist claims to believe in Jesus. So Puddy sees your insipid commentary
fits him to a T.
Great job zotz. How to win friends and influence peeps.
21. Liberal Scientist spews:
Free choice LS.
Ain’t it great!
The problem of is NONE of us a human beings with Free Choice can ever hope to live perfect lives. Enter Jesus Christ.
Either you believe or you don’t.
It’s a watershed issue.
Maybe means don’t.
So what is the meaning of life to you LS?
The Earth and everything you see in this world will eventually be destroyed.
So what purpose do you serve in the long-run?
Do you believe in Eternity?
Do you believe you have a soul?
So many questions we all have to answer.
Good fortune in your journey.
Make good choices.
And most of all…have Faith!
Literal truth, metaphor, or allegory, how could the Bible possibly make any sense to a thinking person?
Y’All
If you want to see how the Torah can really help Jews … try this link!
The Massad kicks ass AND socker balls!
@38 Uncle
“Literal truth, metaphor, or allegory, how could the Bible possibly make any sense to a thinking person?”
try reading:
Spinoza, Jefferson, MLK, Caesar Chavez, Maimonides, Klug, Martin Luther, Aquinas.
Maybe they can help you with your thinking.
Then try reading the Mahabharata.
@40: Did you know?
The colonically challenged Martin Luther reported that his 95 theses came to him in a flood after taking an especially good shit.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3944549.stm
Martin Luther on der juden:
Here: http://unreasonablefaith.com/2.....in-luther/
What has always fascinated me it the effort so-called “Christians” have put into ignoring Jeshua’s words. Much of his philosophical idealism has been edited out of the Bible altogether, and altered to fit the current political mainview of any given period in history since, starting with the day after he was crosstreed.
What was railing against thievery, deception, usury or violence as now become the justification for engaging in those activities. Those who do not are at risk of being labeled as a sinner or worse, a liberal .
In the eyes of modern American “Christians”, Jeshua was white, heavily muscled, predisposed to violence and utterly greedy.
The modern American “Christian” seems to believe that when Jeshua comes back to Earth to punish the unbelievers, he will have blond hair, blue eyes, be a crack shot and will bench press 600 lbs. He will lead armies of violent men to butcher everyone who denies his divinity. He will also be a foreclosure attorney, a banker or an oil magnate.
Noodles almighty, religion makes me sick.
Martin Luther on reason:
“steve steve steve. etc. Puddy is pulling for you!”
My own Christian faith is secure and I don’t need you or anybody else to pull for me. Further, my Christian faith has no resemblence to the perverted faith of a psychotic KLOWN. None whatsoever.
“Not needed anymore. Jesus came to dispense with the Levitical laws and to lift high His Father’s laws, the 10 Commandments.”
I see nothing about gays in the 10 Commandments. So what’s your problem with gays?
In what way do yours and the KLOWN’s posts here reflect well on the 10 Commandments?
Using Lorette C. Luzajic NOTED AGNOSTIC again zotz? You have a plethora of garbage sites!
Tooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Damnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn
Funnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnny
You’re right Steve Steve Steve, nothing about gays. So why are you heterosexual then?
@ 48
God DAMN you ‘baggers are stupid.
Its willful. It’s deliberate.
Were you starved of oxygen during your birth? Is it a product of being raised on Soda pop, twinkies and balongna sandwiches as a kid? Maybe those preachermen you so devoutly worship are just master hypnotists, mesmerizing the rubes while the little fat guy runs around the room with that shiny metal plate.
I cannot for the life of me, wrap my mind around that level of profound stupidity. It’s like you were all lobotomized as children.
SJ @40:
Thanks for the advice.
But I’ve tried most of them and found their logic wanting. Spinoza & Jefferson certainly did not make any heroic efforts to defend it. In fact I seriously doubt either took it seriously. They certainly did not find it infallible.
For the most part, the others started with the premise the Bible is the word of God and therefore must have some grain of truth and wisdom. But they quickly found themselves forced to cherry pick those verses that they could find comforting and quietly ignore the rest.
Martin Luther King’s triumphs were wholly within the realm of human relationships here on earth. His logic did not need the Bible or words from any other deity to support them. His messages stood quite elegantly on their own, and could have been equally well said be an avowed atheist.
Sorry SJ, the Bible doesn’t make any sense, and you know very well it does not make any sense.
So, Puddy, where in the Bible did Jesus dispense with Mosaic Law? Or was it Paul? Who knew Jesus better, his brother James the Just or the man who never met him, Paul?
@15 “Choices, consequences.
If you are right…what have I lost?
If I am right….what have you lost?
Choice—consequences”
Whenever the KLOWN discusses his so-called faith he comes off as a gambler covering his bets.
“You’re right Steve Steve Steve, nothing about gays.”
So why are you so intent on denying them their pursuit of happiness? Are they somehow less American than you?
Uncle Wiki
I think you are being all or none … do you read PZ Meyers’ blog? You, he and Hih=ggind are in one club.
I am more open minded. I am a devout, evangelical atheist because I see the image of God, as all good ad moral impossible and offensive. IF God is good, then what am I? If I were God, with the supposed powers, I would do a better job. If God is not as good as I am, then any super being must be the devil.
I am offended by the worship of evil.
Worshiping a God who takes pleasure in nailing his son to a tree is VERY evil. Worshiping a God who finds it moral to torture my mother withe terminal cancer, that is on a par with worshiping Hamatsa I(a cannibal God).
Frankly, I think there are many sources to learn from … the Torah, the C Bible, the writings of Jefferson and Maiminides, these are all valuable.
Why throw anything we can learn form away? Throwing the bible (or Mao’s little red book) into the pit of your disdain is .. in a sense .. flat earthism. You are denying the value of part of our traditions.
The stories, the history, the legends are as real as the DNA code I read for a living.
@44 Zotz
Yep, yet Luther USED reason to show the fallacies of Roman exegesis!
Jesus, Ball, even I may not be real, but Reason is !
I am that I am.
Deathfrogg
Forgive me but who is this “Jeshua” you refer to? Never heard of him? Another pretender to be Me?
Where in the Bible does Jesus give permission to separate the laws of the Mosaic Covenant?
Puddy ..
You seem confused about Who I am.
I have no name, though I know you Christans have a name for me .. something like Yaha, YoHo, or OyVau?
None of the names you mention have ever been used to describe Me:
God <— not the name of God, just a word.
Allah <— not the name of God, just a word.
Buddha <— not the name of God, just a person.
Mohammad <— not the name of God, just a person.
Confucius <— not the name of God, just a person.
Lucifer <— not the name of God, a match.
Thor <— never a name of THE God, just a god.
Zeus <— never a name of THE God, just a god.
Jupiter <— never a name of THE God, just a god.
Apollo <— never a name of THE God, just a god.
I am that I am.
@58 You left out Odin.
While a kid living in a detention facility, we were forced to attend a Baptist church. A friend and I protested, professing a belief in Odin. It didn’t go over too well and we were still required to attend the Baptist church. That said, it was a lovely little church with a steeple by the river in Preston. The last I saw, it was still there.
@ 56
Jeshua is the literal translation of the original name for the individual commonly called “Jesus” in the modern lexicon.
Jesus is the Spanish mistranslation, likely deliberate, left over from the Inquisitional period starting in the 1490s. One of Christopher Columbus’s missions was to carry the word of the Spanish inquisitional gospel to India, but they ended up in whats now called the Caribbean. The third Columbus expedition was to bring back slaves and gold, and exterminate any recalcitrant natives, as they were heathen and uninitiated into the Christian teachings as espoused by the Spanish Inquisition.
In that extermination, they were entirely successful. Within 100 years most of the gold found in South and
Central America had been confiscated by the Spanish version of the prosperity gospel, which the modern American version is based upon.
Murder, genocide, theft and enslavement are the founding principles of modern Christianity as we see it today.
It is for that reason why the Christian/right-wing/taliban types are so eager to gain access to that big shiny red button in the President briefcase. They will openly say that it is their duty to god to exterminate all non-christians, as defined by people like Pat Robertson or Bryan Fischer.
It’s Baal, God. Please make a note of it.
@ 61
heh, god can’t spell.
He really IS a republican.
@61
Zotz …
I know how YOU spell Baal. The name of my friend, however, is a LOT older than the roman letters you use.
Have you ever hears a the umpire’s opening invocation at a Ball Game?
PLAY BALL!!!
By the way, while I am all that I am, that does not mean there are not gods. I have heard of some success with prayers to Raven, Persephone, Athena, Ahera, Maytra, Guanyin, and esp. Jubbu-jang-sange.
Personally, I have only Me to worship.
I am that I am.
@59
Did I leave out Odin?
Why would I do that?
The list was provided by Puddy.
I am that I am.
@59: He also left me (Zotz) off the list.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camazotz
Imortalized in book and film:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Karig
Ummm Steve Steve Steve, ever heard of sarcasm?
Steve Steve Steve,
Mosaic Law is the 10 Commandments. When did God dispense with that?
SJ AKA “god”,
None of those are your name, Stephen Schwartz AKA SeattleJew AKA SJ.
Now the Creator of the Universe told Moses His name is I AM!
Poor DeathFroggy,
Identifying the multiple fools zotz loves to use as his “references” are laughable and so easy! Too be you can’t deal with facts. Don’t EVER use an agnostic fool to describe a religious figure!
Looks like Unkl Witz just destroyed the DeathToad
Sucks to be DeadToad
No SeattleJew, not confused at all. zotz claimed to be an atheist. Puddy asked what he was an atheist of. zotz hasn’t answered to whom he’s an atheist of YET!
@ 70
And a Protestant/sworn white supremacist blew his head off for it.
You just have to marvel at the utter insanity of it:
Pudpuller talks to himself, makes shit up in his own “mind”, flings it all over the place, and expects people to take him seriously.
@ 60 Deathfrogg
“Jeshua is the literal translation of the
Translation? Into what language? Not Hebrew, Aramaic, Arabic, Greek, or Latin?
Sounds like a sneeze?
I am that I am
Puddy,
Odd .. you think Jesus is Me.
You think SJ is Me too.
BTW, the text you refer to does not say “I am.” nor do I have a name.
Why do you take My name in vain?
I am that I am.
SJ playing “god”, Puddy knows Jesus is the Son of God. You’ll be shocked and amazed when He returns to claim his own.
Strange SeattleJew, Puddy knows you know better. Chapter 3 of Sefer Sh’mot, the Book of Exodus it sez
So again Puddy asks whats wrong “god” fakir?
zotz,
It was you who claimed front and center to be an atheist. So what are you an atheist of? Seems to Puddy you can’t answer the simple question. You said
You still haven’t presented any facts. And you claim Puddy makes stuff up in Puddy’s mind. You’re certifiably atheistic crazy, mindless and strange!
Another Stuck on Stupid moron!
Silence from our conservatives about enforcing this part of the bible, but that part about gays, THAT must be enforced. Why the double standard?
@ 78
Cause Gays wanna take your guns and make you share your toys.
Puddy
You seem unusually confused tonight.
If I am God, then who wrote the writings of Paul? It was not me?
One other thing, this fantasy of your about me, why fantasize? Has Jesus told you to?
The Bible, not even the Old Testament, says not a word about abortion. Miscarriages are mentioned in a handful of places, but simply as part of a narrative. No rending of garments nor funerals follow such miscarriages. Wouldn’t you think if life began at conception that the Bible would give some clue that such is so? Tell me I’m wrong, Puddy or Cynny. Not about your interpretation of the Bible, but about biblical references to miscarriages and the lack of any reference to abortion. Yet, you folks treat abortion (and hatred of gays) as the foremost values of Christianity. You fucks are political first; your religion follows your politics.
@ 74
Not being a scholar by any means, but the Greeks translated his hebrew name as Yshua, “J” being the old greek letter for “Y”.
Jesus would have been an anti-war protester in the 60’s. He would have marched with Martin Luther King. He would have stood in the face of the Corporate/Nationalist threat and agitated for the hungry and poor and sick.
“The most preposterous notion that Homo Sapiens has ever dreamed up is that the Lord God of Creation, Shaper and Ruler of all the Universes, wants the saccharine adoration of His creatures, can be swayed by their prayers, and becomes petulant if He does not receive this flattery.
Yet this absurd fantasy, without a shred of evidence to bolster it, pays all the expenses of the oldest, largest, and least productive industry in all history.”
Robert Heinline
“When I feed the poor, they call me a saint, but when I ask why the poor are hungry, they call me a communist.”
Dom Helder Camara
I can’t be an atheist anymore.
There has to be a God.
Dino Rossi is a three time loser.
Carly Fiorina was denied the purchase of a Senate Seat.
Meg Whitman was denied the purchase of the Governorship of California. 140 million bucks couldn’t buy it. And Jerry Brown is Governor yet again – that’s twice in my lifetime.
Joe Miller has been defeated and is making an ass of himself by not conceding.
Christine O’Donnell (I am EWE) was trounced and has now taken her proper place as an embarrassing footnote in the history of American politics.
Sarah Palin continues to make an unbelievable ass of herself yet still yearns to be President. If she gets the Republican nomination in 2012 – there’s got to be a God – because the Republicans despite their unhinged hatred for Obama must really want him re-elected.
And for every God there has to be an anti-God – a devil if you wish.
Evidence of the devil:
Mitch McConnell, John Boner.
Rick Scott
Marco Rubio
The Koch Brothers.
The 8th CD of WA State who continues to send the incredible brain-shrinking man to the Congress every two years warming the seat for Raygun “the Manchurian Candidate” Dunn.
And Sarah Palin of course.
I can go on and on – you get the idea.
I hope you’re right stupid.
Eternity is a long time to spend in someone’s company.
If you and that miserable KLOWN are going one place to have endless confabs over heavenly surf and turf – I want to go SOMEWHERE ELSE!
@ 83
Don’t forget Bryan Fischer.
Americas purest Christian.
Proud Leftist asks a basic question…
For a person who has a minister father you really don’t surprise Puddy with your lack of Biblical knowledge…
Since the Hebrew word for children is banim and banim is used here, the unborn child inference is clear. Also, if life didn’t begin at conception, then why did the prophets tell the Israelite kings to kill all the pregnant women?
NEXT
SJ,
There is absolutely no confusion. Your BS over this “god” thing is stupid. Everyone knows you are masquerading as one you can’t even box with. Your arms are too short to box with God!
Oh my ylb finally appeared…
Called good people devils. Well it does take one to think they “know” one.
88 – Good people can’t recognize evil it seems.
No wonder you spend so much time here stupid.
And you still can’t read. Never said they were devils.
Said they were EVIDENCE of the devil.
No wonder you’re so fucked up in the head.
82. Deathfrogg spews:
@ 74
If Jesus existed, his name would have been Yoh shuah or, in sort form, Yashka.
You must have a different Jesus in mind. The one in the Roman Bible, was an accommodationist to the Roman occupation, that is te reason for the story of the Centurion and the “give unto Caesar speech.” In an era of great discontent with the occupation, Jesus comes across as accepting it or even celebrating it.
Not so oddly, the resistance movement, the Pharisees are painted as bad guys and Pilate is given wiggle room by blaming a Crucifixion on the Pharisees.
I do not see ANY evidence in the HRB (Holy Roman Bible) of a Jesus willing to stand up to authority. .
On this I agree. Isn’t this part of the message of HA God? Actually, the Puddies go further even then your notion. They thank God for crucifying his son.
I will one up on Camara…
When >I< pull wings off a fly, others accuse me of sadism. When they drink blood and meet of their God, they call that worship.
Puddy,
I’d ask, “are you serious,” but that would be pointless. Where in the hell does the Scripture you quoted suggest that life begins at conception? Pregnancy, Pud, is a nine month process. And, by the way, Pud, I have consulted my father on this question, a guy who reads ancient Greek and Latin, languages in which Scripture first appeared. Do you, Pud? He’s the one, upon my questioning, who said that in fact miscarriages referenced in Scripture don’t matter much. He knew where I was going when I asked him–he is anti-choice, after all. But, he is far to my left on many issues. He recognizes that the abortion issue is not that important compared to a government that launches wars, authorizes capital punishment, and doesn’t care about the poor. If you want to call yourself “pro-life,” then be on the right side of those issues. Puddy, you don’t believe in the social Gospel. If you met Christ, you’d call him a socialist, turn your back, and go watch Glenn Beck.
re: p’dumbski and his hilarious “literalism”…
…I thought “lostinhisownasshole” had his head up his ass…p’dumbski makes “lost” look like Fulton Sheen.
Fred Phelps got nuthin’ on the p’dumbski.
Just for ylb!
Ahhh proud leftist trying to twist the Biblical words.
God tells Rebekah she has two nations within her and this fool has the unmitigated gall to ask this stupid question…
Man you need to pray to your maker if you can’t understand Genesis!
Puddy,
You get an F for failure to read.
If I had wanted to say that life begins when the male substance encounters an egg, I would have said that.
If I had wanted to make conception = life, I would not have burdened women with the frequency of miscarriages.
If I had wanted the zygote somehow be a unique life, what you call a soul, I would not have given you millions of cells that retain all the ability of that stem cell to become another you.
Reading the words of any bible while ignoring the plain truths of science is to take My name in vain.
I am that I am.
re 95: Go with the crazy, Mr. Bud.
Look upon this altered state of consciousness you experience and view it as a JOURNEY OF SELF-DISCOVERY.
If you are diligent, you will come out of the other end of this ordeal as a wiser, saner, and more patient human being.
God bless, brave traveller of the inner universe!
@ 97
Spuddy’s “ordeal” needs an enema. Too much cheese.
Altered state of consciousness? Nope you DOPE! Ain’t cheese either. Jesus is the Son of God. Soon enough y’all learn that the hard way.
Funny how Steve Steve Steve and proud leftist skirt around this issue.
SJ you get a quarter grade failure for trying to act like God when you don’t even measure up to a demi-god.
Sin entered the world when Eve ate and gave Adam the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. God has to allow things to play out so the whole universe can see how zotz best bud Satan lied about God and His benevolence. Otherwise Satan charge of God being authoritarian would have been true.
@100
Yes, and rain is what happens when Jesus cries, and thunder is the sound of angels bowling.
Quoting your rather simplistic mythology, especially with your obvious glee that we non-believers are all going to suffer horror and pain when your god arrives in fiery majesty, is not the most effective mode of argument.
As one of my leftist compatriots pointed out above, Cynical’s position seems to be an appropriately cynical hedging of bets – essentially, if Cyn is wrong, so what; if an atheist is wrong, he’s fucked.
This logic seems to lead him to an enforced ‘piety’ of his fundamentalist Christianity, much like Pud seems to embrace. (Again, the infantile view that they do what they’re told to avoid the punishment of eternal hellfire and damnation, rather than doing good because it is right.)
However, I think that Cyn’s wager may be construed incorrectly. He seems to be saying that he has embraced a belief system that has parallel and deep connections with both culture and politics – the fundamentalist American Protestant culture. This is a culture that embraces the death penalty, embraces horrific war and the lies that lead to horrific war – costing the lives of hundreds of thousands of innocents, and the enormous opportunity costs. This is a culture that abandons the most vulnerable among us – the mentally ill, the homeless, the young and old without means. This is a culture that loudly gathers in 18th century costume on village greens around the country and loudly demands the repeal of ‘death taxes’. This is a culture that seems to have abandoned the notion that we’re all in this together, for a viewpoint of “I got mine, bar the door!”
I therefore think that they may have actually acted against the dictates of the wager. For if the anthropomorphic ‘god’ that they worship does indeed hold them to the rules that it laid down (“DO NOT KILL” prominent among them, and his ‘son’ made some strong statements (Biblical accuracy notwithstanding) about wealth and poverty) then they seem to be working against their interests. How can they defend their support of war and poverty and ill-education and homelessness and the general abandonment of the least of our brothers when they sit in the vaunted judgment seat that they like to threaten me with?
@ 102
Even the devil can quote scripture to his own ends.
What fascinates me about that quote, is the glaringly obvious notion somehow, (given the argument that heaven and hell do in fact exist, along with their respective landlords) That Satan would somehow be obvious in his apparence, that he would present himself to be exactly who he obviously is. That is, evil incarnate, the worst most despicable type of person you can imagine.
If I was Satan. I wouldn’t be going after the non-believer or the atheist. I would think, given the constant battle between good and evil the evilangelicals are so fond of reminding us about, that it would be of greater accomplishment to seduce the good, pious, believing folks away from that scripture, using it against them.
So it begs the question; Is the devil a violently sadistic and ugly manifestation with horns and warts and pointy teeth, or is he that slick used car salesman with the easy smile, nice hair, gold Rolex watch and quick simple answers to all questions?
Who would people believe? That smooth talking, well-dressed pretty boy with all the right words in his mouth, or that unshaven, shoeless little hippie with bad teeth and little in the way of personal accoutrement or simplified ideals?
Puddy–
I think we should delay any discussion of predestination with these folks. They seem to be struggling mightily with the basics of the Gospel.
Predestination discussions would simply blow their minds.
104. Mr. Cynical spews:
So THAT’S why MISTER Cynical-ASS-Klown is such an asshole!!!
Liberal Scientist @102 spews–
You’ve got it wrong LS.
I believe in the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
ALL humans are sinners. We all fall short of the Glory of God. That’s why God sent his only son Jesus Christ….to pay the price for our sins so God can look at us and see his Son IF and ONLY IF we accept the free gift of grace.
I accept. You reject.
steve, steve, steve claims to be a Christian.
This is something so fundamental, we must agree. Same with other Christians from the political left.
Liberal Scientist and other Athiests who openly reject Christ and mock him & his followers…good luck with that. I believe you are wrong and their are consequences…especially when the Gospel has been shared with you and you reject.
Spend a few hours contemplating Eternity.
It’s an enormous undertaking, isn’t it?
But if you definitely believe there is no God created you and the entire world, why bother.
If you have doubts…that’s good. Doubts, but an open mind and open heart. Good starting point. If God loved us so much to have created us, given us a conscience and given us choices…isn’t it possible that He would send his Son to save us from bad choices? Isn’t it possible God would provide us a roadmap to living our lives here on Earth…and a roadmap to Salvation?
Smarter folks than all of us combined have pondered those questions. Don’t let your mind be constrained only by what you see, feel and your own understanding. Seems like Atheists are bound by 80 years and what they see, feel & can comprehend…putting themselves at the top.
Isn’t it possible there is One who is greater than all of us…who Created us, who guides us & loves us…and gives us Eternal Hope??
No wonder you Atheists are so angry all the time. You are bound by your 80 years here and your own limited faculties.
@95 “God tells Rebekah she has two nations within her and this fool has the unmitigated gall to ask this stupid question…”
When ensoulment occurs has been debated by theologians for millinia, and yet Puddy comes here with the answer. In fact, it is “stupid” to even so much as question his interpretation of Scripture. And with that, he would make abortion illegal, imposing his interpretation of Scripture on all American women. In Puddy’s vision of America, we would no longer have freedom of religion. We must believe as he believes or suffer the consequences. The consequences for Dr. Tiller was death. For it is for Puddy to cast judgement, not God.
“predestination”
Horseshit.
So Steve….
It really SEEMS that p’dumbski was “predestined” to be an idiot and MISTER Cynical-ASS-Klown was “predestined” to be a…well…AN…assklown, does it not? LOLOL
@109 The KLOWN was “predestined” to fuck goats, so it’s alright. But women “predestined” to abort zygotes and blastocysts are murderers along with their doctors. A zygote has a soul, you know, cuz Puddy says so. You’re not only “stupid” if you don’t agree with him, you might be subject to being murdered. You see, it was a good thing that Dr. Tiller was murdered. It was “predestined”, so no big deal. It’s even “predestined” that liberal women have their heads stomped by teabagging men. It’s all good, you know. God’s will be done.
@ 106
No, we’re angry because there is so much flat out lying, obfuscation and openly criminal behavior on the part of the “believers” in this country, and there is no way for an educated, intelligent and informed person to cut through the bullshit. We don’t have the financial backing of corporate megachurches, we don’t have billions of dollars to manipulate information through the mass media. We don’t have the ability to counter your lies with the truth.
You speak with the loudest voice you can muster, you imply a threat of violence if people won’t listen to you, then you use that voice to denigrate those who would seek a greater level of information and exercise a little more caution and careful thought into making decisions where people might die or be hurt by the actions you present as the solution.
There is a direct correlation between religious belief systems, and lower intelligence levels. The lower the basic self awareness and what they call the “State of Arousal”, the higher the level of unfounded and uninformed faith.
The intelligent early humans eliminated the threats of the Saber-Tooth tiger and the Cave Bear. Then you “believers” replaced them with bankers, used car salesmen, ministers and insurance agents.
You worship prestige and the hoarding of material wealth above all other things, including your phony “god”, you sneer at education, knowledge, altruism and scholarship and threaten violence when your fucked up belief system is ever questioned.
Religionists are the greatest threat to human civilization that humans have ever created for themselves.
I’d posit that Puddy and Cynny are not very effective spokesmen for Christianity.
Proud Elitist @ 112
It’s hard to be effective when discussing things like this with Atheists who have closed their minds & eyes to possibilities.
You are a Christian, right?
Care to take a shot?
@112 They certainly don’t speak for my Christian faith. But I’m sure their retort will be that I’m not a Christian, that I only “claim” to be a Christian. But Puddy could go one step further. He could inform the KLOWN that, since he isn’t a member of the one true church – the Seventh Day Adventists – he isn’t going to heaven either. But Puddy won’t. He won’t because wingnut troll alliances are far more important to him than his faith in any God. God for him is only a means to sort out left from right.
We can play that game. Here’s my take for this morning. We know Puddy and the KLOWN from their acts. Their acts tell us that their real God is right-wing political power. The salvation they seek comes in the form of a tax cut.
@110…
…so much for “intelligent design” huh…
Steve, Steve, STEVE….
…NOTHING says “Christian” like boosting taxes on the POOR!
What’s wrong with you.
(LMAO…)
re 99: Jesus loves me — except if I don’t believe. Then he will punish me.
That’s absurd. If you can believe that, you can believe that the Republicans are fiscal conservatives.
re 13: ‘Elitist’ — that floppy old fly swatter is due for retirement — but I know you want to up the age for that.
Did your daddy circle jerk with his own MWS fool?
Liberal Scientist farts…
Did you forget your hatred for Christians you espoused a few weeks ago? Calling them modern day Nazis? Did you think Puddy would forget?
Such a fool!
Steve Steve Steve speaks more BULLSHIT!
Prove it moronic twit!
Steve Steve Steve speaks more BULLSHIT!
Prove it moronic twit!
Proud Leftist speaks more BULLSHIT!
For a preacher’s son you are an EPIC FAILURE! You have to rely on Daddy to interpret scripture!
The latest rujax smackdown
There is nothing intelligent in you rujax!
Truth hurts huh ylb?
Spudd, dude.
You know you’re not supposed to take the blue ones at night.
Stupid ignorant fuck.
DeathToad
You should lay off the drugs, Stupid ignorant fuck!
125 – Heh. I pay no mind to your fearful superstitions fool.
125 cont. – Your silly superstitions remind me of the insanity of Jack Chick tracts – that same paranoid mentality.
Very weird and disturbing but entertaining at times.
@124…
p’dumbski’s off the meds AGAIN.
Jeezusss!!!!
Enough said.
Oh, I forgot,
“Father forgive them, for they know not what You said.”
I am that I am.
These discussions devolve into hysteria.
I would love a discussion of the role of religion in society – how it evolved, how it shapes our institutions, how it shapes values, and also of legitimate criticism of religion. Of religion and its artifacts as shapers and foundation of society, and the implications for same. (I don’t deny that religion has been profoundly influential on the nature of our society/culture – on the contrary – I just want to critique it openly and as objectively as possible).
I would like the right wing Christians to defend the very potent tendency for them, and like-minded believers, to embrace public policies that lead to war, exacerbation of poverty and transfer of wealth to the already wealthy, denigration of many of ‘god’s children’ and other seemingly (to me) glaring inconsistencies between political/social policy and their professed faith.
I would also love to see some of the compassion that my religious upbringing taught me was supposed to be a part of religious faith displayed here. If I am as lost as Pud and Cyn say, for example, is the appropriate response from someone ‘born again in the faith of Jesus’ sneering condemnation and unseemly gleeful anticipation of judgment day and the prospect of eternal hellfire?
For me, the attraction of these Biblical discussions derives in part from the fact that the Bible is an enormously influential cultural artifact in our society. A society that in many ways is deeply flawed.
I would say that our self awareness and intelligence and ability to act altruistically as humans drives us to try to improve our society. Other might say that God gave us intelligence and moral capacity and that with those come responsibility – either way, we have to work to perfect ourselves and our relations with each other – our society. Part of that involves critically examining assumptions and foundations – including religion and anything taken on ‘faith’.
These Biblical passages all seem to contain glaring contradiction to the rather Pollyanna-ish view that we (as Americans in particular) have of ourselves. We’re fed this pablum about how great and exceptional we are, about “goodness” and “God-blessed” and “greatest” this that and the other. These passages highlight how brutal and unjust and violent our forebears were – and how such unsavory characteristics are our patrimony. It is our responsibility – in aspiration to be better, or as some would say, to grow closer to God – to examine these foundations and the history the reflect and prune away what leads to violence and ignorance and poverty and war – to darkness.
Speaking to these conversations devolving into crapola… just read the comments from you liberals each week when Goldy places a Biblical verse on this blog. Then you answered your silly question!
Why Liberal Scientist? If you wanted to have a legitimate discussion on religious matters then why did you refer to Christians as Nazis? You already identified your viewpoint so having any conversation with you is a worthless attempt at pixel placement.
And why is it you liberal progressives think government is the answer. Where is the atheist charity from the heart? Where were you when Katrina hit? How about the other disasters live Galveston? Or Florida? Or Carolinas? How about the Tsumani in Banda Aceh or Phuket? Or how about Haiti? Did you contribute?
Why do you liberal progressives whip out the tried and tired argument of class warfare? If you want to make it equal, whip out a flat tax. Then Warren Buffet and Charles Munger will pay at lest $25 Million in taxes and they can’t claim their finance committee shenanigans as tax deductions. That should make ylb happy. Instead of creating a dependent class of peeps who would rather have a hand out than a hand up, why not stop those crazy actions and look at how to improve their lot in life? You have the poverty pimps Al and Jesse eating out of your hand and they are TOO STUPID to realize it.
Why do you liberals progresives think like Matthew Modine asking to meet with Osama Bin laden to “discuss” your differences? He wants to kill you and your progressive way of live. Yet you and your ilk support Sha’ria law coming to America.
Why is it atheists demonstrate such hatred for anything Christian and love everything of other religions? It’s you progressives who took Christ out of Christmas calling it holiday season. No it’s Christmas season. Why do liberal progressives give gifts to their children this time of the year? Don’t you know you are emulating Christ who gave up His life in heaven to give the gift of eternal life back to the human race? So you have to stop giving gifts to your children because you are emulating Jesus and you can’t have that!
Regarding our goodness as Americans… we give the most of any country per capita in charitable giving, stingy liberal progressive included. Remember it was the Salvation Army who said the conservatives in South Dakota gave more per capita than the liberals in San Francisco. Ask ylb for the links. Puddy has placed it here six times.
134 – What an idiot. If a flat tax was such a good idea then Raygun would have pushed it in the 86 “reform”. Back in those days the flat tax was known as “Treasury II”. Reducing the top rate to 28 percent was more than good enough for the greedheads.
A flat tax doesn’t work idiot. It means the rich pay a lot less and the middle class and the poor pay MUCH MUCH MORE – all so the Pentagon can continue to buy their fancy toys and build their empires abroad and greedheads can enrich themselves like they did in the 20’s and the Robber Baron days. Raygun had already raised taxes on the middle class and poor enough. A flat tax would have been WORSE!
No one has ever asked me for such links fool. And they never will. Because you should provide your own stupid backup.
Why do you repeat yourself like a stuck record?
I’ll answer that – you’re an idiot.
Speaking of links – you link to right wing bullshit sites and shrug because you link to MSM more. Well I can trace a lot of those links to where you got them in the first place – right wing bullshit sites.
It’s too funny to see you have a right wing idiot eruption, post a MSM link that takes a half dozen leaps of “logic” to support that reality break and then trace the link through a search for sites that use that link – and see the same idiot madness!
134 – You ask many idiot questions that have been answered many times before.
Only makes you look like what you are – an idiot.
I don’t care to know about your religion and I’m sure you don’t care to know my opinions. Everyone minds their own business and stays out of each other’s way then everyone is ok – most of the time anyway.
You don’t like the way the government spends its money then send the idiots who best represent your views that I don’t care much for to the legislatures and I’ll do the same for my views on my end.
Then they’ll all hash it out peaceably to everyone’s satisfaction/dissatisfaction or die trying. It’s the American way. Wouldn’t have it different.
Heh – the very first link Puddybud posted here I traced to a Soundpolitics comment thread.
The madness continues.
Check out this little girl telling the story of Jonah. Even if you are an Atheist, you’ve got to admit she is precious!
http://vimeo.com/16404771
I’ll answer some of these questions, simply because it has already been spelled out for you many times, and I need to amuse myself for a little while.
Adolph Hitler took most if not all his diatribes and policies about Judaism straight from the teachings of John Calvin and Martin Luther, both quite openly outspoken anti-semites, who blamed Jews for everything from plagues to demonic possessions and economic hardships and specifically called for their extermination from the face of the Earth.
Current neochristian/fascist ideology in The United States, Germany, Russia, the Netherlands and Austria as well as other smaller countries quote from their writings as specific proof of their own purported philosophy. When one visits the teabagger/fascist American neochristian “Gun and Knife” shows that pop up every few weeks, you will find on many of the display tables, next to the guns and knives and such, copies of Mein Kampf, The Turner Diaries and The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, as well as swastika flags and other Nazi memorabilia. The KKK and Aryan Nations are also very prominently represented.
Government MUST be part of the solution. A Government by the People, for the People, and OF the People, must represent people who petition the Government for redress of their particular grievance. Meaning, if a business is criminal or corrupt, it must be held to account and prosecutions must occur. If those criminalities are a continuing aspect of their business model, then that must be dealt with by the rule of law. Thats what those regulations you teabaggers all seem to hate so much are.
You cannot sue someone for something that is not against the law. No law, no grievance to petition. Those laws must exist for the purpose of the Peoples right for redress. The Government has the sole authority to enforce the law, for a very good reason. The People asked for those laws to be written, and therefore enforced by the Government. One shouldn’t always have to hire an expensive attorney at their own expense, to have the law enforced.
As for the charity issue, it doesn’t matter who gives more or less, it is the purpose of Government to mitigate domestic disasters like the damage done by earthquakes and hurricanes and giant fires and such. The people have the right to be secure in their persons, effects and property. That concept goes to the basic protections from criminals, to the availability for the whole country, through the Peoples Government to mitigate such disasters as much as humanly possible. Nobody else has the resources or the clout to make such efforts occur.
When you leave such mitigation to “charities” most of those so-called “charities” chisel off as much as they can for themselves before any money or disaster relief occurs. It isn’t unusual, in the face of a totally deregulated market, to see “charities” take 99% of all funds received and the principals just pocket the money. Thats why they are regulated, and thats why the Government must take final responsibility for disaster relief and rebuilding. Private interests cannot be trusted, period. The Haiti disaster is a prime example. Most of that donated money has vanished, disappeared without a trace, and the residents of Port-au-Prince are still living in the same makeshift tents they were the day after the earthquakes hit, and haven’t seen a penny of that relief effort. They were slammed by a major hurricane just a few weeks ago that just gilded that lily.
Now there is a Cholera outbreak, and those same “charities” are now begging for more money, with no mention of the almost $200 million that was already donated in the period after the earthquakes being made. That money has just vanished.
Heh, typical neofascist. Blame the poor for their own plight. Flat tax you say, well, if that flat tax starts at $100,000 and goes up from there, it would make sense. A scaled taxation system was first proposed by the men who wrote the US Constitution. That the wealthiest should pay the bulk of funds for the support of Government and Law Enforcement and Defense. The wealthy have the most to lose, and the most to gain from a strong and equally applied rule of law. Equal protection under the law means everyone. Those with the most, should pay the most.
That equal protection costs money. Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness are the peoples responsibility. It is only for the Government to ensure that liberty continues to exist, through the will of the People who elect the Representatives and instruct the Law.
Corporations and other such business entities are NOT PEOPLE. Such entities should never have been allowed that permission, their self-interest often conflicts with the rule of law, and the rights of the people.
Two examples:
It is in the self-interest of a chemical company to dump their poisonous waste into the nearest body of water, but if that body of water is the water supply for people, that company MUST be prevented from doing so. It is within the rights of the people to prevent themselves from being harmed by the actions of others, be they businesses, individuals or foreign Governments.
It is in the self-interest of a Drug manufacturer to create chemicals that alter human physiology, but if those chemicals do harm in any way, shape or form, their products must removed from the market or prevented from ever reaching it. You do not have the right to market poison. You do not have the right to falsify medicines. Again, it is the sole duty and responsibility of the Government to enforce the Law.
Nobody has ever said, with the possible exceptions of a few radical and frankly, very crazy Imams, that Sharia law should ever become part of the Rule of Law in the U.S.
The only other people making such threats, are you dumbass teabaggers with your demand for laws that would put gay folks, philanderers or dissidents in prison or have them executed. I cannot see any difference whatsoever, between Sharia law and Christian law. They are exactly the same thing.
I am an Athiest. I celebrate christmas, I give gifts to my nephews and my parents and a few of my friends. I get a tree every year and I decorate it. I listen to Mozart and Beethoven and Vivaldi. I watch the Charlie Brown special. I like Christmas. Just because I don’t sit around clutching one version or another of your Bible and shivering in abject terror of some manufactured “god” doesn’t mean anything. Christmas isn’t about your religion, its about being with your family, celebrating the passage of another year, and sharing in ones personal success by giving toys to the kids. Religion doesn’t come into it at all for me. But I still celebrate it.
As I stated above, most, if not all of that money, handled through private organizations, has vanished without a trace, and those organizations are now begging for more, while their leadership drives around in Rolls Royces and Bentleys and turbocharged Porsches and live in 20,000 square foot houses.
All the whole moaning about the horrible burden of that measly %15 tax rate they have to pay on their income.
Goddammit, I forgot to close an italic tag somewhere. There really needs to be a preview before post feature on here.
140 – Another great comment DF – totally lost on the unhinged fool Puddybud.
Someone’s got to do it I guess. Thanks.
@140
DF, I am in awe of your opus – it was masterful. Thank you.
@140: WOW. That was really amazing… a keeper.
From now on, instead of repeating ourselves ad nauseum and wasting electrons, I think we can just reference this and tell them to STFU. Like this:
Pud, Government IS US. Why do conservatives, who claim to love this country, hate the government? Does it have to do with the fact that we all get an equal say (at least in theory)?
Why do you seem to revere the “Founding Fathers” but revile what they founded?
@145 I chalk it up to self-loathing. These guys reek of it.
You know DeadToad you continue to forget what “Lee” once wrote… paraphrasing… Don’t judge others by the actions of one or a few. You love to do that Toady. The rest of the scream is useless commentary.
Puddy has no problem with the government being part of the solution. Your head progressives make government THE ONLY SOLUTION! The rest of the scream is useless commentary.
BULLSHIT fool! Where did Puddy blame them for their plight. Puddy and Mrs Puddy came from a long line of peeps who NEVER ATTENDED COLLEGE/UNIVERSITY. Puddy and Mrs Puddy rose from our plight to go to school and get and education. The rest of the scream is useless commentary.
What? Do you need to see come Googled commentary from some of your great leftist peeps? You better revisit that one!
Christ is the reason for Christmas. He came down to give His life. Then you should call your celebration Atheistmas because you reject what Christ has done!
Oh really. Look up the administrative costs of ADRA. They are only one of two State Department sanctioned relief agencies to go around the world. Try again!
Who are these agencies?
“Don’t judge others by the actions of one or a few.”
You shouldn’t give advice that you repeatedly ignore yourself.
“Do you need to see come Googled commentary from some of your great leftist peeps?”
And you would tar us with some anonymous internet comment? Refer to the above, you hypocrite. heh- Hypocricy in the name of Christ, no doubt.
Wrong again useless biomasses. Read the above comment and then actually think for a change.
Uh Steve Steve Steve, you are as guilty as sin for guilt by association so pot meet kettle!
And you dont’ Steve Steve Steve?
You know Froggy…Steve…ylb…if the p’dumbski wasn’t such a closed minded hater of America and Americans there might have ben a real interesting discussion here. But with the p’dumbski…not so much.
As usual – Puddybud’s response is another ad hominem yawner.
There’s life beyond the insane rants of Puddybud folks.
Happy Thanksgiving.
Puddy still wonders why rujax hates Americans as much as ylb does. Must be they have the same liberalism is a mental disorder disease.
Where fool? Where did Puddy ad hominem DeadToad moron?
Puddy is still waiting for DeadToad to describe how he personally helps the downtrodden. Puddy noticed DeadToad never answered the question!
Keep wondering your silly mind fool. You love chasing that monkey on your back.
Got better things to do this weekend.
@ 156
Okay spudds, I’ll bite.
I don’t do shit. in 25 years of carving metals into useful things, I’ve never seen $40 thou in a year, gross. Rent, bills, insurance on the jeep, takes every penny I made.
What I do, is I pull dumbasses out of ditches when they spin out on an inch of snow, cause they’re too stupid to slow down when the weather gets cold and icy.
I stood ground in front of a young woman with a broken nose and eyes so swollen and full of blood she couldn’t see her hand in front of her face, while her teabagger/ex marine devout christian husband stomped back and forth in the parking lot ranting that he was gonna kill everyone he saw. When the cops finally showed up, they told me flat out, that I should have just shot the motherfucker.
I stood ground in a lockarm ring around the Seattle convention Center, while the bankers and their lickspittles in our Government made attempts to resolve how deep they were going to dig that hole they were planning to bury us in, and I disarmed a dumbass anarchist kid and handed his chunk of 1″ rebar to the cops standing guard in front of the Neiman Marcus while breathing capsicum and mace.
I spent four fucked up days in a little concrete room with a couple of drunks and some pissy little bitch of a Stanford Student who’d been busted for cocaine, after kicking the motherlovin shit out of a man who’d pulled a knife on a friend of mine at a kegger party, over a little fucking bud the size of your thumbnail. Charges dropped.
Charities? I don’t give shit. I make my own.
Thanks for playing Dead Toad.
Good discussion over your road skills. How do you know this…?
Was he wearing I am a Christian Tea Bagger sign?
Poorpoorpoor little p’dumbski just can’t get it can he?
I’m having a sad for poor p’dumbski.
One thing that the p’dumbski is reallyreallyreallyreally good at is…
Puddy brings up – again – the issue of charitable giving.
While his highlighting this is good, in a way – we can all do more – your point serves to obfuscate, which I suppose is expected.
Deathfrogg’s response is, yet again, highly illuminating. You see, as he points out, he acts out of charity and goodness in a multitude of situations, though he does not have sufficient dollars to make charitable donations as you do (and point out so prominently on multiple occasions).
If we move to a society where fewer and fewer people have more and more of the aggregate wealth (as we seem to be doing – feudalism 2.0), only the wealthy will be in a position to give in a way that seems to satisfy your definition of charity. And the wealthy will give to charities that align with their interests, or put their names on buildings, or otherwise stroke their egos for the depthless generosity they show to (insert charity here).
When government solves social problems we are acting no less charitably, and perhaps more so. When we act collectively through our shared governmental institutions, we all take responsibility and control of how these problems get solved – regardless of how many $$$ we gave. Once again, it seems that you advocate for a system where a very few people, in this case donors, have a disproportionate say in how society behaves – an inherently undemocratic viewpoint.
If we devolve the responsibility for solving social ills to private charities, the decisions as to how those issues will be addressed will be in the hands of those charities – or rather the biggest donors to those charities – and I doubt that the interests of that particular set of people will faithfully reflect the interests of us as a whole.
Though I took your statements at face value for the response above, this statement calls into question your veracity.
Is giving to the SA the only form of charitable giving? It is a rather odd, Christian and quasi-militariesque organization that does not really represent the sine qua none of charity. Moreover, do you include tithing to churches in your aggregate of giving? If your statistics showing the superior generosity of those in the fabled “heartland” to the Babylon of SF is based on the people of South Dakota or Wyoming giving to the church that they attend, I think that is a different animal from giving to an organization from which no direct benefit is derived by the giver.
(Oh, and before you impugn my character based on your judgment of my giving, I make a lot and I give a lot, and the specifics are none of your business.)
Liberal Scientist is hallucinating as always
So let’s review the evidence
dumbasses – reference to a judgment by DeadToad. A person performs deeds of kindness without regard to the situation they land in. This is why the story of the Good Samaritan in the Bible is very illuminating. The person beat up and robbed may have been on the road at the wrong time of the day. The Samaritan didn’t care about the guy’s circumstances, just that he felt compassion to help them. When Puddy helped out in Katrina, Puddy and family met some real racists there. We felt really sad that they missed the blessing of real strangers coming on their own dime to help out. We didn’t judge them like DeadToad did above which was lost on Liberal Scientist, we just kept on helping out and let our actions speak loudly.
Still waiting for DeadToad to describe how he came to this conclusion and judgment. Again Liberal Scientist missed this “judgment” in his ad nauseum argument.
Again, DeadToad is delivering judgment something front and center about you progressives. Since it seems DeadToad doesn’t know much about Stanford University… it’s one of those liberal domains full of liberal professors like SeattleJew and Darryl. You attend Stanford and you’ll be inundated in liberalism
and multiculturalism
… Wait a minute… German Chancellor Angela Merkel on October 17, 2010 said multiculturalism “utterly failed”.
Regarding charities… WHEN DID PUDDY EVER SAY EVERY CHARITY IS GOOD? You have ylb’s DATABAZE at your disposal. Ask him to look it up. Butt since you need help, Puddy will save you the trouble being a simpleton lazy ASSed liberal…go here to rate charities. PUDDY NEVER SAID IT. Personal giving is part of what Christ said to the rich young ruler. BTW here are some great scriptures on your personal need to help the poor.
1 Sam 2:8
Lev 19:18
Psa 82:3
Prov 28:27
Prov 22:9
Prov 21:13
Prov 19:17
Prov 14:31
Isa 58:6
Matt. 5:43-45
Matt. 19:19
Matt. 22:39
Matt. 25:34-46
Mark 12:31-33
Luke 3:9
Luke 6:38
Luke 10:27
Luke 12:30
Rom 13:9
2 Cor. 9:7-15
Gal. 5:14
Eph 2:8
1 Tim 6:17
James 1:27
James 2:8
James 2:14-24
1 John 3:17-19
“Having the title is fine, but not having the money is sobering.”