One of the biggest stories over the past two weeks is the controversy over the newly passed religious freedom law in Indiana. The backlash caught a lot of people by surprise, partly because the purpose and significance of these laws has evolved a bit over the past 20 years since Bill Clinton signed a federal law with the same name in 1993, but also because of how much the political notion of “religious freedom” has changed in recent years. Garrett Epps and German Lopez write about this history and why this particular law is different and causing an uproar.
I also think it’s worth reading both Amanda Marcotte and Jacob Levy on this. Marcotte comes from a more liberal perspective and Levy from a more libertarian one. But I think Marcotte makes the key point for me here:
The backlash is kind of surprising, when you consider that it’s already legal to discriminate against LGBT people in Indiana without having to pull the Jesus card to do it. Pence’s maddening dishonesty might be fueling the rage: Lying plus bigotry is a toxic combination. But there’s another factor that’s helping push this past the tipping point of “another story about conservative bigotry” to national scandal. Liberals are getting fed up with this ridiculous conservative push to redefine “religious liberty” to mean its opposite, using it as a phrase to justify Christian conservatives forcing their religious beliefs on you and depriving you of basic religious freedom.
Marcotte goes on to cite the Hobby Lobby court decision, which defined this narrative more clearly for a lot of people. Hobby Lobby’s desire to keep their employees from having easier access to birth control through their health benefits isn’t a matter of corporate executives exercising their own religious freedom. It was an attempt by a powerful employer to impose their religious beliefs on their employees. The fact that Hobby Lobby won at the Supreme Court certainly has people on edge about how radical ideas of religious freedom could potentially be recognized and become accepted.
In the case of Indiana’s new law, a small business owner refusing to serve gay customers is the same dynamic. If a florist or a baker refused to provide their services for an interracial marriage, we wouldn’t consider that to be someone exercising some valid religious objection, we’d see that as just plain bigotry. It’s hard to understand how doing the same regarding a gay wedding is any different.
This is why we now see the backlash. It isn’t the actual severity of the law, it’s the fact that it’s furthering a particularly cynical notion of religious freedom, one that is clearly rooted in bigotry and bad faith. It’s about the fact that Indiana chose to go in this direction, rather than passing anti-discrimination protections for gays and lesbians. And it’s about making clear the political risks of continuing to pander to those who are in denial about the recent awakening we’ve had as a nation regarding the rights of LGBT people.
More news from the past two weeks…
Supreme Court justices Kennedy and Breyer told a House sub-committee that our mass incarceration policies aren’t working.
John Oliver discusses how we’ve criminalized poverty.
Radley Balko writes about a recent court ruling on drug raids and how it encapsulates the insanity of what the police are allowed to do in order to keep people from smoking pot.
Matt Sledge and Hunter Stuart write about how police body cameras could change police investigations.
Shaun King writes about the record number of exonerated prisoners in 2014.
President Obama has vowed to use his pardon power more often than he has so far in his presidency. This week, he commuted 22 drug sentences.
A bill has been introduced to the U.S. House of Representatives (after a similar bill was introduced in the Senate) to allow for medical marijuana in the medical marijuana states and to provide greater freedom for use of the drug within Veteran’s Affairs.
Marcy Wheeler challenges the recent AP reporting on the history of NSA’s phone record surveillance.
FBI Director James Comey continues to fight against tech companies like Apple for providing encryption to customers in order to better safeguard their privacy.
ACLU is suing to get data on TSA’s absurd effort to use behavior detection specialists in their screening process.
Border Patrol Agents in Arizona are being sued for incinerating a man inside his own car.
How much do you want to bet that the Arizona legislator who suggested mandating church attendance is also terrified of ‘Sharia Law’?
The police in Albuquerque somehow believed that the release of the police body camera footage in the James Boyd shooting would actually help in their efforts to shield the officers from murder charges.
David Graeber writes about the Ferguson report and the lessons we can learn from it.
Dahlia Lithwick writes about the “Slender Man” case in Wisconsin and why we shouldn’t try 12-year-olds as adults.
A Milwaukee police officer who killed a mentally ill black man won’t be getting his job back.
In Illinois, the FBI is convincing disaffected people to join ISIS.
A woman in Indiana was sentenced to 20 years in prison for having a miscarriage.
A black man in Michigan with no criminal record and a long career working at Ford was brutally beaten by police and may have also had drugs planted on him by an officer.
In Atlanta, a military veteran with mental health problems was killed by police. In Smyrna, GA, witnesses to the shooting of a black man dispute the police account of what happened.
Customs at Dulles International Airport will be trying out facial recognition software on arriving passengers.
Baltimore officials are accused of keeping juvenile suspects in solitary confinement for far too long as they await trials.
The large number of police shootings in Philadelphia are starting to get more attention with the release of a critical report by the U.S. Justice Department. Also in Philly, six outrageously corrupt former narcotics officers are about to stand trial.
New Jersey Governor Christie pardoned Shaneen Allen, a single mother from Pennsylvania who mistakenly believed that she could bring her legally registered firearm into New Jersey.
Matt Taibbi writes about the lack of transparency in the Eric Garner case.
Ryan Gallagher writes about the Canadian efforts to hack into computers worldwide as part of intelligence operations.
The Harper government is attempting to shut down Vancouver’s safe injection room, in direct defiance of a 2011 Supreme Court ruling. Andrew Jeffrey writes about why this is such a big mistake.
Sandra Der reports from Edmonton on the case of Omar Khadr, a former Guantanamo detainee who is back in his native Canada facing a parole hearing.
A prominent Vancouver architect is fighting drug prohibition because of his own family tragedy.
Phillip Smith writes about the five ways the drug war devastates the developing world, while Rebecca Gordon writes about how the war on drugs has specifically devastated Mexico. And Honduras might even be worse.
Murtaza Hussein writes about longtime Guantanamo Bay prisoner Moath Hamza Ahmed al-Alwi, who has endured years of torture but has yet to be charged with any actual crimes. Joshua Partlow profiles some former detainees who’ve actually been exonerated and sent to live in Uruguay.
The Spanish government has passed a new law against protesting that appears to be aimed primarily at Greenpeace.
A Jewish kindergarden in Belgium has lost its insurance policy due to the high risk of anti-Semitic attacks.
Yavuz Baydar writes about the lack of press freedom in Turkey. Two cartoonists were sentenced to jail for insulting the Turkish president Recep Tayyip Erdoğan.
Saudi Arabia is pushing for an international law against insulting religion, which appears to be mainly a way to deflect valid criticism of their terrible human rights record.
Bahrain officials are not allowing relatives to visit with prisoners after overcrowding led to violent clashes inside the jails where many political prisoners are kept.
Amnesty International put out a report accusing Hamas of war crimes in their indiscriminate firing of rockets in civilian areas of Gaza. They had previously accused Israel of the same over the record numbers of civilians killed in 2014.
The U.S. is continuing to support the authoritarian regime in Egypt that undid the democratic reforms begun in 2011 and has been one of the biggest enemies of press freedom in the world.
Nigerian government forces detained two Al Jazeera journalists covering the upcoming election.
A community in South Africa has attempted to re-implement apartheid era restrictions on black citizens.
Jailed Washington Post reporter Jason Rezaian was denied a furlough request by an Iranian judge, while a woman who’d been jailed for attending a volleyball match has been released after spending five months in Evin prison.
An American soldier recently plead guilty to killing Afghan civilians for sport.
Reuters has been added to long list of news websites blocked in China.
Thailand’s Prime Minister has threatened to kill journalists who don’t report “the truth”.
Australia has refused to give a visa to the child of legally immigrating parents because she has Down’s syndrome.
A 16-year-old in Singapore was arrested for criticizing the recently deceased former Prime Minister, Lee Kuan Yew.
Nauru is looking into allegations of sexual abuse of asylum seekers, including children.
I too knew it would only be a matter of time where main stream people would get fed up with this conservative shit.
Pence wanted to blame the media for the frenzy of the media misinterpreting his holy bill, but the media really had nothing to do with it.
Regular people like, NCAA, MLB, NBA, NASCAR, yeah NASCAR home of the most conservative ordinary people (mostly bigots to say the least but I’ll give them a free pass this time – lucky dog. And I would personally thank them for their position and apologize for ever calling them bigots), Angie’s List, Apple, Charles Barkley, Salesforce, etc, etc… (you know these Gay activists as some would like to miss-characterize to falsely better their cause or position, or to just be in complete denial about), that really were taken a back and stood up for the better cause.
Let’s hope the very conservative are in complete denial, that will only insure their extinction – good fucking riddance.
Thank You Obama!!! – for everything you do and have done. The only person the World can rely on today.
Some progress and positive news.
http://money.cnn.com/2015/04/0.....index.html
After conquering what should be equal rights for all, this has to be the next thing tackled and dealt with.
This is unacceptable and people’s comments are unacceptable. But I do think that the community itself has to take a lot of the responsibility, even if it is a black community. As one person commented, there are plenty of white people or families killing each other. This isn’t just a black community problem, but it is something that they need to accept accountability in. Regardless if there is or isn’t a police problem out there too.
What I find brazen about this is the shooter didn’t even give a shit that a cop was right there. The balls of him. Well, find him or them and string them by their balls.
http://www.nydailynews.com/new.....-1.2172131
This is BULLSHITTIUM at it’s best
Corporate executives? What utter BULLSHITTIUM! Hobby Lobby is a privately held corporation. Write the above swill however you want Lee, but it’s not the truth! HHS and Obummer’s sadministration decided to go for the jugular… AND THEY LOST BIG TIME. From WikiPedia
Obummer and HHS didn’t try and use Clinton’s RFRA law, instead it was all or nothing. HHS admitted they never tried and were summarily kicked in the ASS! And the Kelo decision, which HA DUMMOCRETINS gladly rejoiced when libtard SCOTUS members voted yes and became law. Conservatives Thomas and Scalia wrote be careful what you approve as it will bite your ASSes later was proven true. You HA DUMMOCRETINS still don’t get it. You cooked your own goose with that decision!
Butt keep screaming.. someday it COULD be true. That day hasn’t come yet.
I see all the pundits are saying evil will come from gay marriage. They can’t quit. Don’t they know they are the evil in this world that is destroying this world. Of all the ills in this country and world and their #1 problem is that Gay marriage will destroy the world.
What a bunch of baseless evil fuckheads. They don’t learn to well.
Matt Sledge and Hunter Stuart write about how police body cameras could change police investigations. – Why yes they have Lee. When Taraji Henson claimed her son was racially profiled the police body cameras proved her son to be a racial liar. Where were the standard HA DUMMOCRETIN race baiters to call her out on her lies? http://www.tmz.com/2015/03/27/.....profiling/ Butt as always the apology was a non-apology apology! http://abcnews.go.com/Entertai.....d=29997248
No teabagging gorilla @6,
It’s gays that claim RFRA is the evil in America while Iran plays “Death to America” to the world and we read from State Department “It’s only for internal consumption”. We read that an Iranian general claims leave no doubt, Israel will be wiped off the face of the earth and RFRA is the evil in America! We give the store away and our future civil liberties with the Iran deal and RFRA is the evil in America!
Amnesty International put out a report accusing Hamas of war crimes in their indiscriminate firing of rockets in civilian areas of Gaza. They had previously accused Israel of the same over the record numbers of civilians killed in 2014.
Three Cheers for Lee to put his forth
Here here
Here here
Here here
This is what Puddy wrote about two weeks ago! Hamas started the rocket parade June 13, 2014, almost three weeks before Israel started bombing Gaza! Israel then bombed where Hamas placed the rocket launchers. In neighborhoods, next to hospitals, next to schools, next to mosques!
The U.S. is continuing to support the authoritarian regime in Egypt that undid the democratic reforms begun in 2011 and has been one of the biggest enemies of press freedom in the world.
So Lee you supported the Mohammad Morsi’s Muslim Brotherhood democratic reforms? Can you name these “democratic reforms?” Seems to Puddy the Brotherhood’s unwillingness to undergo a process of political and democratic transformation; either organizational and/or ideological was their main demise with the Egyptian people! That’s why they attacked the Egyptian people later!
Then what happened to Lara Logan was covered up because hey, they were democratically elected so a rape is inconsequential to the party? http://www.laweekly.com/news/l.....on-2395540
The Muslim Brotherhood was for freedom of the press?
You support the ISIS-Muslim Brotherhood alliance? The alliance that wants to destroy Israel from the face of the earth? Really?
So General Al-Sisi who stopped the Muslim Brotherhood massacres and is against ISIS is the enemy? Is that because Egypt Military and the Israeli Mossad are working together against ISIS and Iran?
@8 sorry Puffy it wasn’t the gays, it was NCAA, MLB, NBA, NASCAR, Angie’s List, Charles Barkley that claim RFRA is the evil in America.
Keep worrying about Iran, Immigrants, Gays, Ebola, Benghazi, and the IRS. You are a dumb fuck.
You claim to try to love? You hate Iran, don’t you? You are foolish and should be on medication.
I didn’t read the story but I read the Headline – O’Reily now thinks world war III was avoided. I’m not going to debate you on anything, sometime you just have to leave things to fate. If Iran wants to take over the world and it is fate, then it is fate. Keep your fucking crying about it. Do you care that the world is running out of water? Maybe you should be more worried about that, unless you plan to drink urine samples with BOOB.
@ 4 TB
I dunno what it is, I don’t believe it to be anything but a bizarre notion that somehow “demanding” respect is the same as having earned it. I wonder if this isn’t just partially the result of the whole idea that “everyone gets a trophy” no matter what kind of fuckup they are. My youngest brother has this problem. He’ll be a complete prick and then get seriously pissed off that he isn’t being respected as he feels he deserves to be.
My own anecdote was down at the Central Saloon about 15 years ago. I was out front with some friends and it was around 1 in the morning. There was a disco/dance club thing on the corner back then, the J&M Cafe. Dunno what kind of place it is now but it was the sort of club that attracted the super pretty rich kid types and the guido/jagoff Axe-drenched player kids looking for a hookup.
A group of really fine young ladies were out, they were obviously a bachelorette party group out for that last party before one of them was getting married. They were all somewhat drunk, as was everyone I think. A gaggle of black dudes, maybe five or six, came walking up from the south along the sidewalk, which was really crowded and they were just shoving their way through the crowd and barging between people and generally in a “not give a fuck” mood. They got to the point where the ladies were standing out front of the J&M and one of them started in with the woman who was wearing the veil thing. He said something to her and they went back and forth a couple times and then he grabbed her in the crotch, like hard. One of her girlfriends said something to him and his pals, and one of them just hauled off and punched her in the jaw about as hard as he could and she went down on the sidewalk, while his buddies had the other girls all mixed up and they couldn’t move.
The crotch-grabber then shoved that girl over to one of his other buddies who wrapped her up in his arms and tried to force a kiss, grabbing on her boobs. Someone else hit that guy with her purse (yes, really) and that guy let the first girl go and turned around and pushed that girl out into the street. There was a lot of “Fuck you bitch” and other things being yelled out by these guys at the women, calling them whores and such, and then those guys walked down Washington toward the waterfront, laughing their asses off.
The first girl was sitting on the sidewalk, bleeding like hell out of her mouth and the one who got pushed down in the street had her arm scraped up pretty bad from when she had bounced off the light post on the corner. The girl that had gotten her crotch grabbed had her skirt tore up and was crying and shit.
Guys like that deserve killing, not respect. To me it really was almost too bad that someone didn’t just shoot the fuckers. But dudes like that also go around thinking that “respect” comes out of the barrel of a gun, like Cops do. 50 years ago those guys would have never done that shit. 70 years ago they would have been lynched on the spot. As it was, there were several people, myself included, who were ready to break some heads but those guys got around the corner and split.
They’re lucky the Jokers weren’t there that night. Shit would have gotten really ugly, really fast.
I capitalized BOOB, because I think he is an implant.
Looks like Puffy wants to go by the way of extinction.
Nice Story Vomit – You have to wonder where the American Family Association was at that time, trying to produce better people, looks like they failed. Maybe it is impossible for heterosexuals to produce real families.
12,
Careful Willy, you might get accused of racial profiling.
Good to see Lee cover the scum from the Philly police department, Puddy’s home town.
Sure is amazing when a black police officer shoots a black perp… Doesn’t fit Holder’s racist animus claims so use account for the numbers! Don’t use federal prosecutors. Nosiree!
Philadelphia police one of the most corrupt orgs there is. My 2nd cousin retired as a lieutenant! Ahhh the stories the sad sad stories…
@ 15
So where’d you grow up, schitzo? Kensington? Or are you one of those lunatics from down in Cobbs or Haddington.
No wonder you’re a fucking nutcase.
There’s a rudimentary tenet of ethics involved here which somehow seldom gets mentioned. It has various historical forms (e.g. “Millerian liberty”) but simply stated it’s: your freedoms may be extended just so far as they don’t inhibit someone else’s.
The Clinton adopted freedom of religion act was about allowing some native Americans to smoke peyote without fear of being fired. See how this can’t reasonably be said to inhibit someone else’s freedoms? But if you extend some imagined freedom so that a particular class of fellow human are prevented from doing business then those two freedoms clash and so that’s clearly too far. This is easy to understand and shouldn’t be interpreted politically – but, of course, it will.
sorry Puffy it wasn’t the gays, it was NCAA, MLB, NBA, NASCAR, Angie’s List, Charles Barkley that claim RFRA is the evil in America.
Wrong again teabagging gorilla @11, It was the gays. Then the NCAA, MLB, NBA, NASCAR, Angie’s List, Apple etc. came out because they wanted people to continue to do business with them. They ddn’t want the virulent progressive fascist gay lobby throwing down death threats against them.
Your side is very fast to run up to someone with their microphones to get the latest attack journalism going. Hence the little pizza place in that small Indianan town. The reporter runs to that place? Why? They were known Christians. All the daughter said was they would not do a gay wedding and your side wanted to kill them. Firebomb their store. Such progressive fascism. Shut them up and shut them down!
Yet, when Harry Reid admittedly lies on the senate floor and told a whopper to insure Romney wasn’t elected and then smugly reacts to it on CNN and there are no attack journalism microphones at DUMMOCRETIN Senators’ mouths! That’s the rub! To DUMMOCRETINS the ends always justifies the means!
Obama’s most significant accomplishment will be gracing all 50 states with his Narcissistic presence. What a self-absorbed incompetent fool. Congrats tho on visiting Utah Mr. President. A Big day for you so the leftist press can focus on this rather than all the damage and incompetence you have wreaked on this great country.
Oh Lee, how does comment #16 pass thread scrutiny? Oh wait it’s A-OK to ad hominem attack any conservative at any time on this blog right?
@ The Schizo @ 20
It isn’t about race, you fucktard. Our reaction would have been the same no matter what their skin color was. The reality is, that there are too many people and thousands of YouTube vids of people of all ancestries acting the same way. Just go there and search for “McDonalds fights” and you’ll get an eyefull.
You want respect? Be respectful. Don’t go around throwing food at the poor slobs behind the counter and busting your way to the front of the line demanding “respect”. Because, in such cases, you aren’t going to get it. You get the respect you deserve.
Oh and vomit producer, Lee provided the article. In fact Lee provided three Philadelphia articles. Maybe if you read them you’d learn something.
Wait… read… learn… vomit producer…? Naaaaaah he’d rather throw down Puddyhatred! That’s all he knows.
@20 ohhhh boo hooo hooo. You don’t have to come here now do you…….it’s not like we are refusing to serve you.
Obama still needs to visit South Dakota to fill out his Narcissistic Bingo Card. What a loser
It isn’t about race – Dayum you be really stooooooooooopid vomit producer! The article supplied by Lee made the inference! You don’t think ticket fixing, racist emails etc don’t happen in Philadelphia police department? Then U B really stoooooooooopid!
Puddy doesn’t throw food at the people. It’s libtard DUMMOCRETINS whom do! That’s your kind modus operandi! Look up McDonald Fight Videos. Wow so that’s how you spend your time vomit producer? Oh no I can’t graduate now… http://www.mstarz.com/articles.....7-year.htm And here is the rest of the story… Thanks vomit producer for showing Puddy how all these “people” act. Wonderful parenting eh? http://7online.com/news/final-.....ed/554045/
@18 no they saw evil for what it was and didn’t like it. Water Puffy, Water. How many of those Nuns standing with Punce Head buy the Iphone?
@24 no GWB was already there, he left behind his training wheels.
@25 talk to the American Family Association regarding parents and parenting. Oh I forgot, they lost focus and concentrate on bigotry now. Or was that always there whole purpose?
http://7online.com/news/final-.....ed/554045/
Puddy remembers when leftist Tipper Gore and Conservatives like Rick Santorum, Mike Huckabee, Rick Perry, etc. decried the empty teevee violence, libtards screamed how stupid they were! Go back and review the HA DUMMOCRETIN blog or ask the crazed databaze purveyor for a replay. Now we see black community activists saying the same thing today!
WOW! Y’all were wrong again!
@18 and how would have the loving Puffy reacted if the reported as them if they liked black people, and their reply was that they didn’t like N**#*##?
How would you deal with that as a loving christian that you are, or whatever you are religiously?
@29 well what are fucking parents doing letting their children watch tv and playing videos.
You are not trying to put the TV and Video Game industry out of bizness are you?
What about alcohol? What do you think it does to kids to see daddy (and Mommy in them Southern Country States) with a beer in their hand before bedtime stories?
There goes the teabagging gorilla @30 (remember that’s what Roger called you) comparing race to gays. There is no comparison.
That’s why you don’t get a lot of traction in the black community. Google “gays claim their struggle like black struggle” and view the truth! http://townhall.com/columnists.....s-n1710528
What about alcohol? What do you think it does to kids to see daddy (and Mommy in them Southern Country States) with a beer in their hand before bedtime stories?
Are these McDonald’s fight videos coming from southern country states teabagging gorilla @31 or are they from mostly DUMMOCRETIN led cities? Another of your insipid strawmen!
You and a Human Being – now there is no comparison. Or you and a Brain.
But we can get closer to some type of comparison if you think of You = Ape.
When all else fails and your attacks are made to look as stupid as the author @34… resort to ad hominem attacks!
I’m no longer sure I want to share this, now that I know that Puffy is interested in Solar – I’d prefer he learn it on his own instead from the experience of someone else adventure. I don’t see Puffy as the person who will take a risk on something financially, and would only do so after it has been vetted out by other more courageous people.
But today I got my rebate back from the Electric Company for the energy that I didn’t use and transmitted back to the utility company. A whopping $35 for 9 months. So maybe the equivalent of $50 for a year’s period, which will happen this year. Not a lot of money, but if you consider that all that I use to spend over a year’s period prior to having solar panels was about $600, this isn’t too bad. And it will pay for about 3 months of distribution service charges that I am charged on a monthly basis.
So not bad – I use to pay about $600 a year on electricity and now I may pay about $150, not for usage but for distribution fees, you know the money that I pay to upkeep the transmission lines and infrastructure, that ALEC says I don’t pay, and advocates for surcharge against Solar Users, Must be a bunch of jealous fuckwads. Anyways, I digress. This is a savings of $500 annually. And I wont get into it but the Solar company has also guaranteed me the production of my system, so maybe I’ll even get a check from them, if I fall short of what was promised. In addition, this year was a pretty bad snowy winter in the east, and my panels were covered with snow the whole month of February and didn’t produce an ounce of a kwh.
In addition I converted my hot water heater to electric, use to be heated by gas furnace. So I was able to shut down the oil furnace from June thru October, because it wasn’t installed until June, but this year, I’ll hopefully turn furnace off by May 1st or sooner. By me turning off the oil furnace I estimate I saved $500 in oil, minimum.
Next week, I am having a ductless mini split system that cools and heats from electricity on a very efficient heat pump system. Only to save more on my oil bill next year.
Now I’m not going to proclaim this is the smartest investments that I have ever made, I’m probably going over board with the ductless mini split system and I felt the cost of the unit was high but I went ahead and did it anyways.
But disregarding the ductless mini system I only spent $7000 on the solar panel lease and the hot water heater change, and I probably saved over $1000 so far. Feels good to be getting free energy even if it cost me $5000, but in 13 years I guess I can consider it to all be free, kind of like of little retirement savings bonus. And that’s really not even considering the cost of energy in 7 years inflated.
correction to above – due to snow no energy was produced from Jan 24th to March 10th. More than just a month.
Puddy spends approximately $100 a month on electricity teabagging gorilla! System Puddy looking at will cost approximately $30,000 teabagging gorilla! Butt, according to the Wabbit, Puddy won’t be getting a tax break! That’s why Puddy don’t listen to early onset senile people masquerading as Wabbits!
@38 as much as we disagree and the fact that we will never see eye to eye, and I no you will not change one once, I am a good guy (not trying to convince you of anything), and only for that reason, I will offer the following:
Not sure what is the best route for you to go, but there are various routes for you to go. You can purchase the system and get the tax credits back that you speak about, but the upfront cost to you will be more expensive, greatly more expensive, so do your research and make sure you know how much tax credit you will be getting back. I don’t know what that figure is, nor did it apply to me.
I took the easier route, but not necessarily the more cost effective route, I leased the panels for 20 years with option to extend the lease 5 years for an additional $300, when the time comes. Therefore I didn’t receive any tax credits back, they were enjoyed by the solar company that I leased with; which BOOB tells me was bad, and fears that my house will catch on fire one day, oh well, if it does, I could get hit by a car next week too, oh well. But again, I digress.
The system that was designed for my house is a 3kW System. With my first year of production designed for 3,559 KWH – 12 panels 39″x 64″. Every year the panels will loose efficiency as they get older and produce less but it isn’t a drastic drop.
The system was base on my usage which was about on average $60 per month, on the hot days, it was more due to AC
Sounds like your needs are a little less than double mine, assuming we pay the same for the amount of kwh.
So my system cost a little more than $5000 installed, labor, materials, warranty, insurance. So if you leased you could be looking at maybe $10,000 versus the $30,000. Are you going to get back $20,000 in tax credits. Ask OBAMA?
In addition, it really hasn’t paid off yet, but as part of being there customer, if I refer someone to them and they invest in solar, then I will get a commission of $1000. All I have to do is sell to 5 people and I’ve paid for my system. Now, I didn’t do this to be a salesman for them, I have a good job, other than seeing why people wouldn’t choose solar, and an advocate of it, I even told friends and family that I would give them my commission and they could apply it to their purchase.
The one last thing to mention is that when you lease, you don’t have to put any money down. You can choose how much to pay for the system, anywhere from 0 to 100%. I choose 100%. If you don’t choose to put down 100% you will then have a monthly payment to the solar company to pay off your lease, and they add financing charges on that, just like if you leased a car. And you savings is diminished by the amount of the financing costs. But even if you were to put down 0% you are guaranteed a savings, even if it might be only $10 a month.
My friend and coworker who did this before I did, decided to not put anything down, partly because he felt it was a no brainer, no cost to him and maybe a $10-$30 reduction monthly in his monthly bill that would not be subjective to inflation, assuming the designed system was meeting 100% demand of his usage. He had to purchase a system 2-3 times the size and cost of mine to meet his demand, and he wasn’t going to put down $15,000 – $20,000. But you can opt to put 50% down or 75% down, or again 0%. I put 100%.
Good Luck. Oh, don’t let the house burn down!
oh one last comment or something to consider is, how old is your roof? Assuming they are going on your roof. If you have an old roof, you should replace it first, otherwise consider removing the panels and system when the time comes to having to re-roof your roof, if it doesn’t burn down first. :)
It’s absolutely clear the Indiana law was designed and intended to legalize discrimination against gays, that Gov. Pence and GOP legislators pandered to so-called “social conservatives” in their party’s base by enacting it, they deliberately mischaracterized its intent and effect, and they backed down only because of the public uproar that followed when everyone from local newspaper editors to corporate CEOs saw through their ineptly veiled efforts to camouflage what this law really was, why it was enacted, and what it was for.
And, like children who play with firecrackers, they got their fingers blown off. Whatever presidential aspirations Gov. Pence had are over. Indiana now has a law on the books protecting gays from discrimination — the reverse of what the promoters of this bill were trying to achieve. The state has egg on its face, and some of the damage to its image and economy may be irreversible and long-lasting. And, finally, efforts to enact similar laws in other states have been stopped in their tracks.
This is a major defeat for homophobic bigots everywhere, and a significant blow to the Republican Party’s 2016 election chances.
If you don’t want to serve gays, one of your options is to break the law and suffer the consequences, but maybe a better option is to put this sign in your shop window:
http://handbill.us/?p=48623
Some lawyer might argue this violates anti-discrimination laws, but where’s the violation? The sign says you’ll serve them. It promises not to discriminate. It pledges you’ll obey the law. You’ve done everything that’s required.
It’s not illegal to be a bigot, or tell everyone you’re a bigot; only discriminatory behavior is proscribed, and no one will be prosecuted for having a bad attitude. You break no laws by telling people you don’t like them. If they don’t want to do business with you, that’s their choice.
@41 Mischaracterize = Lie.
The only defense they have is to lie. They are on the road to being extinct. Not sure how they can be so stupid. The only thing they might be able to win or save them is a civil war, and it is clearly the route they are deciding to go, it might be there only option, they know it. ISIS would be proud.
Rev. Heath’s Religious Liberty Quiz
1. My religious liberty is at risk because:
A) I am not allowed to go to a religious service of my own choosing.
B) Others are allowed to go to religious services of their own choosing.
2. My religious liberty is at risk because:
A) I am not allowed to marry the person I love legally, even though my religious community blesses my marriage.
B) Some states refuse to enforce my own particular religious beliefs on marriage on those two guys in line down at the courthouse.
3. My religious liberty is at risk because:
A) I am being forced to use birth control.
B) I am unable to force others to not use birth control.
4. My religious liberty is at risk because:
A) I am not allowed to pray privately.
B) I am not allowed to force others to pray the prayers of my faith publicly.
5. My religious liberty is at risk because:
A) Being a member of my faith means that I can be bullied without legal recourse.
B) I am no longer allowed to use my faith to bully gay kids with impunity.
6. My religious liberty is at risk because:
A) I am not allowed to purchase, read or possess religious books or material.
B) Others are allowed to have access to books, movies and websites that I do not like.
7. My religious liberty is at risk because:
A) My religious group is not allowed equal protection under the establishment clause.
B) My religious group is not allowed to use public funds, buildings and resources as we would like, for whatever purposes we might like.
8. My religious liberty is at risk because:
A) Another religious group has been declared the official faith of my country.
B) My own religious group is not given status as the official faith of my country.
9. My religious liberty is at risk because:
A) My religious community is not allowed to build a house of worship in my community.
B) A religious community I do not like wants to build a house of worship in my community.
10. My religious liberty is at risk because:
A) I am not allowed to teach my children the creation stories of our faith at home.
B) Public school science classes are teaching science.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....45413.html
“Matt Sledge and Hunter Stuart write about how police body cameras could change police investigations.”
It already has, although in this case, we’re talking about a dash-cam not a body camera.
For a while, a sheriff’s deputy named Lee Dove preyed on motorists traveling on Interstate 80 in northern Nevada by pulling them over for pretext traffic infractions in order to make seizures of cash under the rubric of asset forfeiture laws.
In this case, Dove cited the driver for not using his turn signal when he pulled into the passing lane. But Dove’s own dash-cam clearly shows the driver’s turn signal is blinking. Legally, that makes the pullover invalid, and Dove’s subsequent search of the vehicle and its occupants illegal.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/21/us/asset-seizures/
In this case, the travelers were two professional poker players who had $100,000 cash on their possession. Dove took it. In another case, Dove seized $50,000 from a man who said he won the money in a casino.
After Dove lost two lawsuits in federal court, authorities in Humboldt County, where he worked, responded to the court orders requiring the sheriff’s department to return the seized cash to the individuals by ramping up the county’s cash seizure campaign. The local D.A. filed 22 seizures in a month.
Things have changed in Humboldt County. Concerned citizens confronted the sheriff in a public meeting. It’s my understanding the county has a new sheriff now. Deputy Dove is no longer patrolling I-80; the sheriff’s department put him on administrative leave for unstated reasons in January, and he was arrested two weeks ago for pulling a gun on someone at a convenience store. He’s currently out of jail on bail while awaiting trial on assault charges, and there’s a good chance he’s not going to work as a cop again.
But the abuse of asset forfeiture laws by local police agencies is extremely widespread across the country. More than $2 billion was taken from citizens who were never charged with a crime in 2014. It’s called “policing for profit.” Virtually everyone is at risk, but the risk is elevated in certain areas, such as heavily used travel corridors in southern Florida.
Here are a couple of facts you should know about police asset seizures:
1. There is a private company that gets paid to train police officers how to legally take your money and property under forfeiture laws.
2. Approximately 90% of the cash circulating in the United States has detectable traces of cocaine on it. Virtually the only way you can be assured of having cocaine-free money in your possession is by obtaining fresh uncirculated bills from a bank.
3. Attorney General Eric Holder’s announcement in February that the federal government would no longer share proceeds of seizures under federal forfeiture laws with local police in response to abusive seizures is empty window-dressing because it affects only 1% of forfeitures under the federal-state cooperation program, and 99% of that program remains intact and still operating.
4. The problem is nationwide, and is extremely difficult to solve, because corrupt police who exploit forfeiture laws operate under a patchwork of federal and state laws. Congress is considering reforming federal forfeiture laws, but it’s not a done deal. To solve the problem at the state level, you have to get 50 separate legislatures to address the issue.
5. Many legislators are reluctant to eliminate or restrict the asset seizure authority on the books because police and prosecutors argue it’s an effective law enforcement tool in the “war on drugs.”
6. When police seize money, vehicles, houses, and other property, they do it by claiming these assets are fruits or instruments of drug trafficking. Forfeiture laws also are aimed at organized crime and racketeering activities, but when individual citizens encounter them, it’s almost always in the name of enforcing drug laws.
7. Legally, a forfeiture is initiated by accusing the property of being fruits of, or used for, commission of crime. Thus, the property, not its owner, is the defendant. Unlike when a person is charged with a crime, the property is presumed guilty and its must prove its innocence. Due process is minimal; cases often are heard and decided by a police official or a prosecutor, not a judge. Despite this, it’s possible to get back seized money and property, and many people have done so by hiring a lawyer and suing for its return in federal courts under federal civil rights statutes. In the case of the two gamblers above, they negotiated a settlement under which the sheriff returned $90,000 of their $100,000.
My advice would be, first, if you plan to travel in unfamiliar territory, it’s a good idea to do some internet research ahead of time to find out whether predator cops are operating on your travel route. In the internet age, speed traps and forfeiture hotspots quickly become notorious, and the internet is widely used to warn citizens about them.
Second, don’t carry a lot of cash on the road, so if you do get pulled over by a cop trolling for cash, you won’t be a target. They’re not after $40. They’re looking for the traveling carrying thousands of dollars in cash. (There are legitimate reasons for doing that, such as buying a car, or conducting a business transaction, but predator cops don’t care about your legitimate explanations and will automatically assume it’s drug money.)
Third, if you do get pulled over on the open highway, cooperate with the cop insofar as accepting a traffic citation goes, but stop your cooperation there. Don’t consent to a search of your vehicle, even if the cop threatens to detain you and get a search warrant. Don’t trust the police to be honest; a predator cop trolling for cash is likely to be perfectly willing to falsify his police report, erase or destroy his dash-cam video of the incident, plant drugs in your vehicle, and file phony criminal charges against you as leverage to force you to sign over your money to him.
Fourth, and this one requires some tough decision-making on your part, predator cops are only after your money and almost always will let you go if you let them take it — and threaten to arrest you and charge you with a serious crime if you don’t. Here’s where you face a tough choice. Do you hand over your money and sign a waiver to extricate yourself from a bad and potentially dangerous situation (don’t forget he has a gun, and do consider the possibility he may shoot you), and then get a lawyer and sue later; or do you refuse, undergo arrest and booking into jail, and face trumped up drug charges that will be hard to beat in court? (Remember the bit about planting drugs in your car? And falsifying arrest reports, and lying in court?) I think the best and safest course is don’t resist anything the cop does, but don’t agree to anything or waive any rights, either. You don’t have to consent to search, you don’t have to answer questions, you don’t have to agree to anything. You do have to sign the traffic ticket and you should do that, and I strongly recommend being polite and not losing your cool, but that should be the beginning and end of your cooperation.
Do consider hiring a lawyer and contacting the news media. In many areas where these abuses exist, local TV stations have been eager to air these stories, and media exposure has been one of the most powerful tools available for reining in predator cops and police agencies. Bad publicity works wonders, because travelers and visitors will shy away from places where they know the cops prey on people, and that severely damages local economies and businesses, so the people living there won’t put up with it for very long once it starts having a negative impact on them. Trouble is, whenever a speed trap or forfeiture troll gets shut down, another one pops up somewhere else, so the need for vigilance is eternal.
“Taraji Henson claimed her son was racially profiled the police body cameras proved her son to be a racial liar.”
Is there anything Puddy, a black man, relishes more than putting out the most awful spin possible about blacks, trying to make them out to be the real racists, and worse, much worse? Little wonder Bob, the Toonerville Racist, lives his life trembling in fear, believing the black horde will soon be coming to Whidbey Island to get his white ass.
@1 The amazing thing this time is the smackdown of the conservative bigots and the Republican politicians who pander to them came from mainstream media, companies, and celebrities. America, in a single voice, rose up and roared, “NO!” And the cowardly politicians did what cowardly politicians do, they ran for cover. This could turn out to be a gift from heaven if it taints Republican candidates in 2016. Let’s hope it comes back to haunt them in spectacular fashion.
Mike Pence is a lawyer, and is either a very stupid lawyer, or certainly knew his assertion this bill was identical to the 1992 federal law was a baldfaced lie.
@47 yeah, they either got the message or didn’t. You know, kind of like the loon from Minnesota said, Michelle Batshitwoman, “the people have spoken”. You know because she is such the great listener, when they speak.
If they didn’t get the message they are on their way to extinction.
You know I’d like to think there is some type of compromise, but every time I think about it, it is still discrimination, but maybe it’s would make them a little happy. And I’m sure they would want the whole cake and it eat it too.
But I really wouldn’t be against a specific, real specific, carved out exemption related to only marriage ceremonies. And the person would have to be a very small business, almost like a hobby. And if they were truly devote religious people and can’t be mature enough to bake a cake for a gay wedding then ok, you don’t have to do it. Personally i wouldn’t want you baking my gay cake if you couldn’t handle it. But the exemption has to be very specific to something related to a marriage ceremony and marriage ceremony at all. And you have to be a small private business without a storefront, like you bake the cake in your home, and you can’t have more than one other employee that helps you. And you can’t ever have or ever receive any public funds, grants or loans paid for by the taxpayer. And you you have to have a symbol on any advertisement that you advertise as a religious carved out exemption, like maybe a picture of jesus christ on the cross. It has to be specifically carved out and limited to people that run a small business as a hobby. If you are a business any bigger you should be mature enough to handle everyone’s business or then get out of business if you can’t handle. But this can’t lead to, I’m the dog catcher for the town and I’m not giving a dog license to the gay couple because they are married, or i’m not letting them dine in my business because I don’t believe in their marriage.
And this exemption should be written so that it isn’t just gay related, like is should be written so that the person baking could legally discriminate against inter racial marriage or someone on their 5th marriage, or someone know to be an adulter, or any type of sinner.
I still see this as discrimination but I think it could be an acceptable alternate, but it can’t go any further than a business owner not wanting to participate in a marriage ceremony that they see isn’t according to their religion.
But it can’t be the bus boy who goes to work to find out he’s working for a gay wedding reception. Too bad, either call in sick when it happens or quit your job if you can’t handle it.
What if my employer does something that is objectionable to me on the grounds of my religious beliefs, I don’t stand a chance telling my employer I don’t approve. I either quit or get fired for not doing my job.
But bigots want more, this is where you know it’s not about religion, it is about bigotry, homophobia, and stupidity, and vindictiveness.
Stupid Solution Steve proves once again its signature solution should not be imbibed early in the morning…
Most awful spin Stupid Solution Steve… Some of those were minority policemen you jackASS. Also when police are falsely accused the wolf syndrome happens. The next time someone screams police brutality and it’s false what happens when the next time it’s true?
Henson tried to use her actress fame and name to make noise for her son based on his commentary. His commentary was wrong and the police said they didn’t so anything wrong. The video proved it. She non-apologized apologized.
U R weally weally a stoooooooooooopid man Stupid Solution Steve.
You know I’d like to think there is some type of compromise, but every time I think about it, it is still discrimination
Yeah teabigging gorilla, you really demonstrated compromise with Brendan Eich didn’t you? You love his invented and patented technology and use it to excoriate those whom you hate.
Hypocrite!
teabagger @40,
I will replace the roof with 50 year Presidential TL and 1/2 in plywood under layment. Then looking at the solar panel layout. I have a very large southern exposure and western exposure on the house. My bud will look at the overall layout and generation values soon! I am thinking about new car maybe an all electric one like a Tesla so looking to charge it from the roof. Went for a ride in one and DAYUM dat car is fast!